Muzzle brake on a single action?

[yondering]

OK, right from the start, I know this is heresy and sacreligious too. I'm looking for pictures and/or comments from anyone with experience with a muzzle brake on a single action big bore revolver. What did you use, how'd it look, how well did it work?

I'm considering this on a 45 Colt Bisley Blackhawk; a friend has been experimenting with a few brake designs and this gun could use one. I know it won't be as effective for the light loads, but I do shoot a fair amount of heavy loads through this gun too.

Seems like I read about someone here using one, 44man maybe?

[crabo]

If you are going to do it, at least go Magnaport so you don't ruin the looks of the gun.

[Bullshop Junior]

I see no need for a muzzle brake on a Ruger 45 colt. I have a Blackhawk that I use with FULL POWER 350gr loads and I have no problem with recoil. The bisley has a longer grip, so it will shoot nicer with HOT loads, and I doubt you are shooting them as hot as I do.
The only thing I see with a muzzle brake is that it makes the gun more noisy and puts more money in the gun.

[HeavyMetal]

+1 on the Magna port if you have to reduce recoil.

Can't see it on standard 45 Colt loads but move into 454 territory and yes I can see it!

[DanWalker]

I see no need for a muzzle brake on a Ruger 45 colt. I have a Blackhawk that I use with FULL POWER 350gr loads and I have no problem with recoil. The bisley has a longer grip, so it will shoot nicer with HOT loads, and I doubt you are shooting them as hot as I do.
Maybe he aint as stout as you are Daniel. Not many of us can twist open a can of beans like it was a jar of peanut butter......

[windrider919]

In 1982 I accidentally had my Ruger Super Blackhawk .44M Magnaported after shooting it for 8 months. [Misunderstanding with gunsmith, dropped off for trigger hone and said "Someday I would like to try that Magnaport on a pistol" and he thought I wanted it on THAT one and sent it off. Got it back in 5!!!!! days, real service!]

What I immediately noticed is that muzzle flip WAS much reduced. No change in accuracy but feel in hand WAS better.

HOWEVER: I was shooting at Pearland Sportsman Club back then which has a metal roof over the firing line. Back then the .44 Mag was still the biggest common round most shooters encountered, the day of the super/hyper/extra/max rounds was still to come. The other shooters on the line complained about the increased muzzle blast and at the next club monthly meeting they voted to ban my 'too loud' pistol if anyone else was shooting.

The only drawback I personally experienced was when shooting cast bullets I could occasionally feel impacts on my face from 'something' coming from the ports. And several times it even drew a tiny spec of blood. People beside me complained that they were being 'peppered' at each shot (cast B, not J-B).

After a couple of months I traded it even for a .357 Automag which I still have and consider one of my favorite pistols.

[redneckdan]

A bisley would look mighty sexy with one of these hanging off its shnozz....


http://media.midwayusa.com/ProductImages/Medium/106546.jpg


:kidding::kidding:

[jh45gun]

A bisley would look mighty sexy with one of these hanging off its shnozz....


http://media.midwayusa.com/ProductImages/Medium/106546.jpg


:kidding::kidding:

lol lol

[Bullshop]

Long ago for a time I had the pleasure of owning a Linbaugh conversion on a Ruger Bisley to 500 Linbaugh.
This gun was gorgeous and came in a cased set with tools and accoutrements.
It had a removable break so could be used with or without the break.
The break was about 2.5" long so when in place added that much length to the barrel.
That caused a little problem with holstering because a holster was needed for both modes. The W/O mode was a 5" barrel and carried quite nicely from a hip holster which I am most comfortable with.
The real big problem was that loads sighted for the W/O mode would hit about 4' that's 4 feet low with the break on. I had to re sight for each mode, too confusing!!!
That gun got traded and now my regular carry gun is, well if I said you wouldn't believe me so suffice to say is somewhat smaller and has no need of a break.
BIC/BS

[Bucks Owin]

OK, right from the start, I know this is heresy and sacreligious too. I'm looking for pictures and/or comments from anyone with experience with a muzzle brake on a single action big bore revolver. What did you use, how'd it look, how well did it work?

I'm considering this on a 45 Colt Bisley Blackhawk; a friend has been experimenting with a few brake designs and this gun could use one. I know it won't be as effective for the light loads, but I do shoot a fair amount of heavy loads through this gun too.

Seems like I read about someone here using one, 44man maybe?I'm not keen on them, they're kinda unsightly IMO, spout flame, and are LOUD! That said, I can see their use for rounds like the .454 Casull, .475 & .500 Linebaugh etc. Can't see needing one on a Bisley gripped .45 LC, even shooting barn burners.....JMO though, Dennis
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a356/BucksOwin/john_linebaugh_blast.jpg

[44man]

I don't use them because I hunt with mine and I don't want the noise.
I thought about it when I first shot at deer with my .475. Pounds of hair from the top of three deer! :coffeecom
I decided it was just me being too relaxed because I did not shoot high on the range. I just took control and have not missed any since, even to just over 100 yards. So I saved money and noise.
One is sure not needed on a .45 with any load the gun can take.

[yondering]

OK, I'll clarify a little bit here: I don't feel that I need a brake on this gun. I do shoot hot loads in it, and I do shoot it a lot. It's just an idea I've been considering. Recoil isn't terrible, but if I can make it shoot easier, why not?

Bullshop Junior, my best hot load is the Lyman 457122 330gr HP sized down to .452 over 24gr H110 and a Win LP primer. If any of you are shooting heavier loads than that in a 6-shot Blackhawk with good success and no damage to the gun, I'd like to hear about it.

I know brakes aren't for everyone, but they don't bother me. With hot loads this thing is pretty loud anyway, I don't shoot it without ear protection, so a little noise isn't going to make a difference one way or another. I also don't shoot indoors, and don't shoot with other people very much.

I currently have a really good muzzle brake on my 35 Whelen rifle, which I really like, and have owned a couple handguns with muzzle brakes (Raging Bull and a brake I designed for my Glock .40); but I've never tried or even seen one on a single action revolver.

So, now that we've discussed why I don't need a muzzle brake, :roll: do any of you have pictures of threaded brakes on revolvers or comments on different brake designs?

FWIW, Magna-porting isn't the same as a muzzle brake. I'm not interested in porting, as I shoot lots of plain base boolits and don't want to deal with gas cutting as the base passes the ports.

[44man]

OK, I'll clarify a little bit here: I don't feel that I need a brake on this gun. I do shoot hot loads in it, and I do shoot it a lot. It's just an idea I've been considering. Recoil isn't terrible, but if I can make it shoot easier, why not?

Bullshop Junior, my best hot load is the Lyman 457122 330gr HP sized down to .452 over 24gr H110 and a Win LP primer. If any of you are shooting heavier loads than that in a 6-shot Blackhawk with good success and no damage to the gun, I'd like to hear about it.

I know brakes aren't for everyone, but they don't bother me. With hot loads this thing is pretty loud anyway, I don't shoot it without ear protection, so a little noise isn't going to make a difference one way or another. I also don't shoot indoors, and don't shoot with other people very much.

I currently have a really good muzzle brake on my 35 Whelen rifle, which I really like, and have owned a couple handguns with muzzle brakes (Raging Bull and a brake I designed for my Glock .40); but I've never tried or even seen one on a single action revolver.

So, now that we've discussed why I don't need a muzzle brake, :roll: do any of you have pictures of threaded brakes on revolvers or comments on different brake designs?

FWIW, Magna-porting isn't the same as a muzzle brake. I'm not interested in porting, as I shoot lots of plain base boolits and don't want to deal with gas cutting as the base passes the ports.
That load sounds like it is way beyond the accuracy point in the .45. 24 IS TOO MUCH. Try 21.5 gr of 296. Work to 22 with H110.
Are you looking for pure velocity or just recoil to impress friends?
I never seen any animal that knows the difference in velocity. If you just shoot groups, you are past the point.
If that load is your best, show what it does at 50 yards, then I will show what a .45 can do.

[yondering]

That load sounds like it is way beyond the accuracy point in the .45. 24 IS TOO MUCH. Try 21.5 gr of 296. Work to 22 with H110.
Are you looking for pure velocity or just recoil to impress friends?
I never seen any animal that knows the difference in velocity. If you just shoot groups, you are past the point.
If that load is your best, show what it does at 50 yards, then I will show what a .45 can do.

44man, I'm not sure why, but 21.5gr H110 gives pretty low velocity in my gun, and poor accuracy. Went back and tried a few more yesterday at that load. 300gr Lee GC and a 350gr NEI. The Lee gave ~975 fps, the NEI ~1050. For some reason it's not building up enough pressure. I do seat them out to the second crimp groove. Boolits are sized .453", throats are .453", bore is .452". Cylinder gap is within normal range. 24gr H110 does give me better accuracy and about 1200 fps (5" barrel). Only thing I can think of is the chambers are pretty large, fired brass from this one won't fit in other 45 Colts I have access to. Brass seems to have plenty of neck tension, it takes a few pretty hard whacks to pull the boolits with one of those inertia hammers. I'm open to suggestions though.

Edit: I also neck size my brass. Loaded ammo for this gun won't quite chamber in most other guns.

The reason I'm interested in a brake is because guns that kick less are easier to shoot accurately. I have other guns that kick less for that purpose, so this is just an idea at this point.

[jdgabbard]

A bisley would look mighty sexy with one of these hanging off its shnozz....


http://media.midwayusa.com/ProductImages/Medium/106546.jpg


:kidding::kidding:

I actually think it would be pretty darn sexy... In a Tacticool way of course :holysheep

[Bullshop Junior]

ok, i'll clarify a little bit here: I don't feel that i need a brake on this gun. I do shoot hot loads in it, and i do shoot it a lot. It's just an idea i've been considering. Recoil isn't terrible, but if i can make it shoot easier, why not?

Bullshop junior, my best hot load is the lyman 457122 330gr hp sized down to .452 over 24gr h110 and a win lp primer. If any of you are shooting heavier loads than that in a 6-shot blackhawk with good success and no damage to the gun, i'd like to hear about it.

I know brakes aren't for everyone, but they don't bother me. With hot loads this thing is pretty loud anyway, i don't shoot it without ear protection, so a little noise isn't going to make a difference one way or another. I also don't shoot indoors, and don't shoot with other people very much.

I currently have a really good muzzle brake on my 35 whelen rifle, which i really like, and have owned a couple handguns with muzzle brakes (raging bull and a brake i designed for my glock .40); but i've never tried or even seen one on a single action revolver.

So, now that we've discussed why i don't need a muzzle brake, :roll: Do any of you have pictures of threaded brakes on revolvers or comments on different brake designs?

Fwiw, magna-porting isn't the same as a muzzle brake. I'm not interested in porting, as i shoot lots of plain base boolits and don't want to deal with gas cutting as the base passes the ports.

Hey! Thats my load!

Only I am not using 2400, But I am shooting the same boolit.
How fast are you shooting it? I am shooting mine at slightly over 1300 FPS

[Bullshop Junior]

That load sounds like it is way beyond the accuracy point in the .45. 24 IS TOO MUCH. Try 21.5 gr of 296. Work to 22 with H110.
Are you looking for pure velocity or just recoil to impress friends?
I never seen any animal that knows the difference in velocity. If you just shoot groups, you are past the point.
If that load is your best, show what it does at 50 yards, then I will show what a .45 can do.


With my gun and the same boolit he is shooting I am shooting it at slightly over. 1300 FPS. I am not using 2400. At 100 yards off of a sand bag I can keep them at about 3" with the iron sights.

The reason I shoot it is because we have big mean animals here.

[HammerMTB]

You ain't gettin' much help here, are ya yondering?
Let's just go ahead and do this, and see what happens!
We can worry about what it looks like later.....

[Frank]

yondering said
21.5gr H110 gives pretty low velocity in my gun, and poor accuracy. Went back and tried a few more yesterday at that load. 300gr Lee GC and a 350gr NEI. The Lee gave ~975 fps, the NEI ~1050. For some reason it's not building up enough pressure. I do seat them out to the second crimp groove.
Have you tried seating them to the first groove? Of course you have to add more powder the way you are seating them.

[yondering]

Hey! Thats my load!

Only I am not using 2400, But I am shooting the same boolit.
How fast are you shooting it? I am shooting mine at slightly over 1300 FPS

I'm not using 2400 either, not sure where that came from?

23gr H110 gets me ~1190 fps, 24gr is ~1225 fps. I'm seating to crimp in the forward lube groove (only lubing the 2 rear grooves, with speed green). How deep are you seating them?

My target velocity is about 1200 fps with any of the heavy 45's, but I'd take 1300 if I could get it without too much pressure. My gun has a 5" barrel (shortened from the original 7.5". What is the barrel length on yours Daniel? (I'm a Daniel too but go by Dan)

I checked the Hodgdon load data a little while ago, and while they don't list this exact boolit, they do list 24gr H110 with a 335gr LBT boolit, so this load isn't above published specs.

Hammer, I may do it. The only downside is that I'll have to set the front sight back to do it, which involves locating the front sight pin just right. Same aquaintance of ours that's doing the brakes can probably handle it though. We're currently experimenting with some different brake designs for the 30-06.

[yondering]

yondering said
Have you tried seating them to the first groove? Of course you have to add more powder the way you are seating them.

With other boolits, yes, but not the Lee boolit. Never tried light loads with this boolit, and found it's always better to seat as long as possible for heavy loads.

Seating the boolit out farther, for more case capacity, allows the target velocity to be reached with lower pressure, although a little more powder; or, of course, higher velocity for a given pressure limit. It also starts the boolit into the throat before it's fired.

[44man]

44man, I'm not sure why, but 21.5gr H110 gives pretty low velocity in my gun, and poor accuracy. Went back and tried a few more yesterday at that load. 300gr Lee GC and a 350gr NEI. The Lee gave ~975 fps, the NEI ~1050. For some reason it's not building up enough pressure. I do seat them out to the second crimp groove. Boolits are sized .453", throats are .453", bore is .452". Cylinder gap is within normal range. 24gr H110 does give me better accuracy and about 1200 fps (5" barrel). Only thing I can think of is the chambers are pretty large, fired brass from this one won't fit in other 45 Colts I have access to. Brass seems to have plenty of neck tension, it takes a few pretty hard whacks to pull the boolits with one of those inertia hammers. I'm open to suggestions though.

Edit: I also neck size my brass. Loaded ammo for this gun won't quite chamber in most other guns.

The reason I'm interested in a brake is because guns that kick less are easier to shoot accurately. I have other guns that kick less for that purpose, so this is just an idea at this point.
That IS slow, are you sure the chrono is right? My 7-1/2" Vaquero is getting 1160 with a 335 gr LBT and the Lyman at 347 gr is getting 1167 fps. I never clocked the Lee. All with 21.5 gr and a Fed 150 primer.

[Bullshop Junior]

I'm not using 2400 either, not sure where that came from?

23gr H110 gets me ~1190 fps, 24gr is ~1225 fps. I'm seating to crimp in the forward lube groove (only lubing the 2 rear grooves, with speed green). How deep are you seating them?

My target velocity is about 1200 fps with any of the heavy 45's, but I'd take 1300 if I could get it without too much pressure. My gun has a 5" barrel (shortened from the original 7.5". What is the barrel length on yours Daniel? (I'm a Daniel too but go by Dan)

I checked the Hodgdon load data a little while ago, and while they don't list this exact boolit, they do list 24gr H110 with a 335gr LBT boolit, so this load isn't above published specs.

Hammer, I may do it. The only downside is that I'll have to set the front sight back to do it, which involves locating the front sight pin just right. Same aquaintance of ours that's doing the brakes can probably handle it though. We're currently experimenting with some different brake designs for the 30-06.

I have two loads for that boolit.
16.0gr steel
and 19.0gr 4227
(These are not the loads that I got 1300 FPS with. I had it wrote down but can not find the paper right now[smilie=b: It seems to me that it might have been 24.5gn of H110 but dont go try that cuzz I am not sure))
I am seating them up past the third lube groove, amd I am aslo using speed green. :p
I have a 7.5" barrel. It used to have a 4" but we sent it in and had the 7.5 put on it.

[yondering]

That IS slow, are you sure the chrono is right? My 7-1/2" Vaquero is getting 1160 with a 335 gr LBT and the Lyman at 347 gr is getting 1167 fps. I never clocked the Lee. All with 21.5 gr and a Fed 150 primer.

Pretty sure the chrono is fine. It reads ~1050 fps for a 260gr cast boolit and 10gr Unique.

I may have a slow lot of powder; I'm almost out of it so I'll be double-checking the next batch. I also want to try some similar loads with the Lee boolit and Lil'Gun and 2400. This should tell me if it's my gun that's slow, or just that powder.

Yesterday, out of curiosity, I did try 21.5gr H110 with a Win large rifle primer (3 shots, single loaded) to see if better ignition would help. That read 1080 fps. Better, but still slow. I also tried sizing to .454, to see if the extra resistance of sizing the boolit down in the cylinder throat would help, but that didn't change anything significantly.

Are you seating the Lee boolit to the front or rear crimp groove? If you are seating to the rear, that could explain the difference.

Can you clock that Lee boolit and report back? I'd be interested to hear what velocity you get with that boolit and other powders.

Anyway, guess this shows that 21.5 gr H110 isn't a magic accuracy load for all 45 Colts. Too many variables at play.

[yondering]

I have two loads for that boolit.
16.0gr steel
and 19.0gr 4227
(These are not the loads that I got 1300 FPS with. I had it wrote down but can not find the paper right now[smilie=b: It seems to me that it might have been 24.5gn of H110 but dont go try that cuzz I am not sure))
I am seating them up past the third lube groove, amd I am aslo using speed green. :p
I have a 7.5" barrel. It used to have a 4" but we sent it in and had the 7.5 put on it.

What is the overall length on your load? Got a picture? Sounds like you're seating a little deeper than I am.

[44man]

Pretty sure the chrono is fine. It reads ~1050 fps for a 260gr cast boolit and 10gr Unique.

I may have a slow lot of powder; I'm almost out of it so I'll be double-checking the next batch. I also want to try some similar loads with the Lee boolit and Lil'Gun and 2400. This should tell me if it's my gun that's slow, or just that powder.

Yesterday, out of curiosity, I did try 21.5gr H110 with a Win large rifle primer (3 shots, single loaded) to see if better ignition would help. That read 1080 fps. Better, but still slow. I also tried sizing to .454, to see if the extra resistance of sizing the boolit down in the cylinder throat would help, but that didn't change anything significantly.

Are you seating the Lee boolit to the front or rear crimp groove? If you are seating to the rear, that could explain the difference.

Can you clock that Lee boolit and report back? I'd be interested to hear what velocity you get with that boolit and other powders.

Anyway, guess this shows that 21.5 gr H110 isn't a magic accuracy load for all 45 Colts. Too many variables at play.
I don't remember where I seated to, have to see if I have any loaded. If I remember it was the lower crimp groove, just never wrote it down for some reason.
Been too busy because the wife has a ruptured disk pressing on her sciatic nerve so I am way behind. Had a few hours to shoot today but we shot a friends guns.
I don't even know how I will hunt this season let alone butcher too. I will have to take her 3 times a week to get stretched on a rack. Have to leave shortly again for an MRI.