Cast in glock

[hornady]

Sorry if this has been run in the ground. I picked up a great deal over the weekend on a Glock A Sig, and a S&W. My question, I have read in post that its not a good idea to shoot cast Bullets in the Glock. With a Factory barrel. I cast all my own bullets, but have never owned a Glock or Sig. I would imagine once I slug the Barrel on the Sig it would be OK to shoot cast. But not so sure on the Glock.

[Shiloh]

There have been countless stories of Glocks KaBoomed with cast. I did it twice with Glock 22's. My buddy says it is because I used AA#5. I respectfully disagree. I think it is a combination of the polygonal rifling and unsupported Glock chamber in the factory barrel. Since I changed to an aftermarket barrel, no issues at all.

There are others who have used cast in Glocks without problems. My buddy is one of them. He says one needs to use a slower powder. Maybe so. I'll use my LEE 175 gr. TLSWC with the bevel base removed. It weighs 158 gr. Put that on top of 6.3 gr. of AA#5 in the Glock 22 with the aftermarket barrel, and shoot the black out of 50' NRA slowfire bullseye targets!! Sure wish there were some decent sights on the Glock:smile: Any suggestions on Glock sights?? Heine? Others??

Just my two cents.

Shiloh

[Philngruvy]

Hornady, you did not say what model Glock. All of the bad kaboom stories I have ever heard involved the .40 cal Glock. I have a Glock 19 which is 9mm and though I have not shot thousands of rounds of cast through, I have had good success with it. I am using the Lee TL358-124-2R sized to .356, tumble lubed with LLA, with 4.6 grains of Bullseye.

[GooseGestapo]

It depends.....

Most of the K-booms are not k-booms in the stricktest sense. Most are case-head blow outs. I've experienced them with the Glock with both cast and jacketed bullets.

It's primarily due to the case head design of the .40S&W case (short 'head' section ahead of the web, resulting in exposure of the thinner case walls), and the exposed case wall due to the design of the feed ramp on the earlier Glocks.

However, I had three out of five of the first reloads I ever shot through an early M20 Glock in 10mm back in mid '92 blow out at the case head. It took the 3rd blow-out to cause the magazine to be blown out, and the slide release to be bent. I then picked up and examined the brass and saw the peeled lips and gaping hole in the base of the cases. The ammo was a maximum (both published and worked up) for the 10mm in a S&W M1006 using Acc#7 and a 200gr Hornady XTP. The then published max of 11.2 gr has subsequently been watered down to 10.7, but personally, I'd limit it to 10.0 with the M20. I was getting a chrono'd 1,200+fps, and had killed several deer with the pistol and that load. If youv'e got an "enclosed" feed ramp pistol such as the S&W or the M1911, you can still use that load, and it closely duplicates the original Norma loads. They too have been reduced due to the limitations of some of the newer striker fired "10's" on the market.

Back to the .40....
Don't use any bullets over 180gr with the .40. And, don't try to "hot-rod" it. Secondly, don't try to use lead bullet data with jacketed bullets.

Finally, and this is the key to shooting cast bullets in the .40.
1. You must have sufficient neck tension to prevent the bullets from being pushed back into the cases on feeding. This drammatically increased chamber pressures, and WILL lead to case head blow-outs. This means with the Glock using a bullet of .401" or larger. However, see #3 that follows regarding oversized bullets and feeding....

2. Keep the bore free from excessive lead build-ups. As a previous poster mentioned, he uses a Lee bullet with the bevel removed. I however, have an older Lyman mould that casts a 175gr SWC that was intended for the old Herter's .401 PowerMag. It casts to .404-.405". I size it to .402" and lube with either 50/50alox, or SPG. This load bullet wil take heavy doses of #5, BlueDot, 800X, LongShot or Unique without issues. I also use a Lee 180gr TCFN-BB but it casts to .402". I tumble lube it and load as-is over 4.3gr of Bullseye. This is a superlative target load and I won several NRA-PPC service gun matches with it, as well as numerous "Glock" matches, much to the consternation of some "nay-sayers" about Glocks and "boolits"..... But, I remove the barrel and brush out the lead every 50 of so rounds; however, this is just a "precaution". I've never got excessive leading when using a bullet of ~16bhn hardness and a "larger" sizing than the common .400 or .401" sizing.

3. Finally, there's the issue of the "Glock smiley-face" on the case heads, and proper feeding and seating. The bullets MUST feed easily. Cases with the "smiley" buldge should be tossed. I also recommend taper-crimping with a moderate-heavy crimp to further aid feeding. Also, cases should be adequately flared to prevent lead shaving. This perhaps more than anything will contribute to a firing-out-of-battery which is a guaranteed K-boom with the Glock. And, it WILL fire out of battery.........
BTW; Glock also dosent' recommend shooting ANY reloads in their pistols, and waive warranty coverage if it does k-boom with ANY reloads, regardless of whether they were lead, plated or jacketed. This included factory remfg. ammo such as GeorgiaArms.
YMMV.

[hornady]

This is my first glock it’s a Model 35 in 40 S&W. I use all Lyman Molds. In 9, 357 and 45. As this would be My first 40. I would have to Get. The mould but It sounds like it may be a better Idea to spend the Mold money on Jacketed Bullets for the Glock.

[Shiloh]

Brass fired in a factory Glock .40 cal. barrel, has a prominent bulge in it from the unsupported, exposed base of the cartridge. When sized with conventional sizing dies, there is a remaining ridge akin to the metal on belted magnum rifle cartridges. This is a weak point that causes a shear line.

These cases should be roll sized, or run through a LEE carbide crimp die to eliminate the shear line from the cartridge web area.

Fully supported aftermarket barrel chambers eliminate the bulge in fired brass.

Shiloh

[Oldtimer]

I've shot thousands of cast rounds through a Glock 30. (.45) I have just started to load cast in my Glock 23 (.40). I do plan to get a Storm Lake barrel because of the support issue for the 23. I have, so far, not had any problems with either gun. Both of them are stock, with all stock springs. I started out with both guns with a very minimum amount of powder. Both guns, when fired would not cycle. I upped the amount by a tenth until they would cycle. I stopped there. I clean the barrels every time they are fired. Have never had a leading problem. I hardly ever shoot more than 100-150 rounds per session. Usually less. I think the key is low power loads, and a shiny clean barrel. Bob

[mpmarty]

I had a first model G21 in 45acp and all it ever shot was cast 200gr semi wad cutters over 5gr of red dot. Never a problem of any kind in several years of IPSC use. I finally got tired of the "Perfection" and dumped all three of my Glocks, a 21 23 and a 30. I now have a better Glock aka XD as well as three Tanfoglio 10mm pistols in good old solid steel. I found a cast boolit that the XD45 actually likes and functions with so my 200gr semi wad cutters are relegated to a couple of 1911s and the XD eats 230gr truncated cone tumble lube boolits over 4.7gr of Red Dot. I never bought an after market barrel for the Glocks but understand that they are an improvement on "Perfection"[smilie=s:

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

Take two minutes from your busy schedule and call Glock. Better yet, give them the serial number of your Glock and tell them you've been shooting your own cast boolits in it.

Rich

[hornady]

Thanks for all the info on the Glock guys. I own several hand guns that I shoot cast out of. But just to be on the safe side. I think with the price of the Glock. And the fact this will be my primary carry gun. I will stick to the Jacketed stuff. I can buy a lot of Jacketed bullets and brass. for the price of a Lyman mold , seizer die, and top punch. And then an after market barrel. Just not cost effective. With the amount of Ammo I will be putting threw it.

[MtGun44]

A friend blew up his G22 .40S&W shooting lead. He replaced the bbl with an aftermarket bbl and
has had thousands of lead loads work through the gun since.

Bill

[dudel]

This is my first glock it’s a Model 35 in 40 S&W. I use all Lyman Molds. In 9, 357 and 45. As this would be My first 40. I would have to Get. The mould but It sounds like it may be a better Idea to spend the Mold money on Jacketed Bullets for the Glock.

What I did was to get a Lone Wolf barrel for the Glock. It's a traditional rifled barrel with a better supported chamber. It's a drop-in with no extra work needed. I got mine from Dillon. Shoots great and for $100 it lets me use lead without any qualms.

HTH

[sleeper1428]

A friend blew up his G22 .40S&W shooting lead. He replaced the bbl with an aftermarket bbl and
has had thousands of lead loads work through the gun since.

Bill

Gosh, I sure wish I'd known about all the problems inherent with shooting cast boolits in Glocks BEFORE I shot several thousand of them through my two Glocks, a Model 20 (10mm) and a Model 22 (40S&W)! Obviously, I'm being facetious but I must tell you that both handguns were purchased in the late 1980s to early 1990s period and neither has had more than a few hundred rounds of jacketed to the present time while both have had many thousand cast rounds run through them without a single problem. My guess is that the Kboom problem is due to one of two things or a combination of the two. The first is trying to 'push the envelope' as far as loads are concerned, driving pressures to a level where the unsupported case in the ramp area bulges and/or blows out. And the second is inadequate cleaning when shooting cast boolits. Personally, I clean the barrel after each 200 rounds fired or at the end of each shooting session, which ever comes first. I do this religiously regardless of the fact that I've never had a problem of leading in either of my Glocks when shooting my own cast boolits. As you might imagine, the combination of a badly leaded barrel and near maximum loads is asking for a disaster to happen.

As others have mentioned, Glock warns against using ANY reloaded ammo in their handguns. Now as we all know, this is a matter of the company 'covering their collective butts' so they can disavow responsibility for any problems that may arise from reloaded ammo. But I can tell you from personal experience that if you use new brass (either 10mm or 40S&W) and you load your cartridges to maximum levels, you will see Glock 'smiley faces' on a large percentage of your ejected cases. That's another reason that Glock warns against using reloads because they know that full power loads will cause bulging of the cases in the area of the unsupported ramp. But since this bulging will rarely progress to a blow out in a new case, the company warns against using reloads because on a second firing, that previously slightly bulged area has a greater likelihood of blowing out. Now, if you simply keep your cast loads at a reasonable level, it's unlikely that you'll ever have any problems with the stock Glock barrel, providing that you also keep the barrel clean.

Having said all of this, I must say that I've also purchased aftermarket Lone Wolf barrels for both my Glocks, basically so that I will have the option to use maximum loads without the worry about having an area of unsupported case bulge or blow out on me under pressure. But even though I have these new barrels, when I'm shooting my less than maximum loads I don't worry about using the stock Glock barrel in either weapon.

I know that others will disagree with what I've said and they may well point out that both the 10mm and the 40S&W were meant to be loaded to maximum or near maximum in order to gain the benefits of using these calibers but personally I will continue to use reduced loads so that I don't have to worry about Kbooms in my Glocks.

sleeper1428

[Chris]

I wish I could shoot cast out of the LW barrel in my G20, they are just a hair oversize and don't want to chamber. I'm going to have to size them. They seem to come out at .399 and jacketed rounds are at .397 and below. I think the chmaber in the LW barrel is just too tight.
For those using 10mm, I highly recommend the Redding gr-X die to remove the "Glock smile" It works very well.

[Marlin Hunter]

A friend of mine had a round blow out the brass in his 9mm. It was 125 gr Full Metal Jacket. The 9mm has no support by the feed ramp.

[RollerCam]

http://picturehosting.com/images/koolhed/upportedandnonsupportedchambers_1.jpg

[sleeper1428]

I wish I could shoot cast out of the LW barrel in my G20, they are just a hair oversize and don't want to chamber. I'm going to have to size them. They seem to come out at .399 and jacketed rounds are at .397 and below. I think the chmaber in the LW barrel is just too tight.
For those using 10mm, I highly recommend the Redding gr-X die to remove the "Glock smile" It works very well.

That's very interesting - and quite common with LW barrels. I also had some trouble getting loaded ammo (cast boolits, of course) to chamber completely in my G20 but after a bit of investigation, it turned out that the problem was that there is virtually no leade in the LW barrel. Several other people on this forum found the same thing happening with their LW barrels but as it turns out, this is very easily remedied. Just call LW, explain the problem and they'll have you send in your barrel along with a couple of cartridges (dummy loads, of course) with your cast boolits seated to the depth that will give you the OAL that you desire. LW will throat your barrel so that your cast boolits will seat properly and will allow the slide to go into full battery.

The fact that your boolits have a diameter of .399 and yet you can't get your loaded rounds to chamber completely is further confirmation of the fact that the LW barrel has virtually no leade and will need to be throated in order to allow your cartridges to chamber completely. I size all my boolits for both my G20 and G22 to .401 and after LW throated my barrels my loaded rounds now chamber fully, allowing the slide to go completely into battery.

As a side note, I had this same thing happen with my ParaOrdance single stack 745 (45ACP). It appears that the factory expects you to use only commercial hardball ammo (jacketed RN) because just as in the LW barrels, there is essentially no leade in the Para's rifling. And just as with the LW barrels, I took my Para in and had one of our local gunsmiths throat the barrel so that I can now use TC and SWC as well as RN cast boolits.

Do a search on LW barrels and you'll probably turn up the posts related to the problem you're having and the solution that I've described.

sleeper1428

[dudel]

I wish I could shoot cast out of the LW barrel in my G20, they are just a hair oversize and don't want to chamber. I'm going to have to size them. They seem to come out at .399 and jacketed rounds are at .397 and below. I think the chmaber in the LW barrel is just too tight.
For those using 10mm, I highly recommend the Redding gr-X die to remove the "Glock smile" It works very well.

LW chamber is advertised as being tighter than the stock Glock barrel. If you send the barrel and a few of your rounds (dummies) to LW, they have been known to recut the chamber to fit your loads. A call to them first would be wise.