Expedient Ammo....

[HABCAN]

More on ‘EXPEDIENT AMMO’.

Here in Kanuckistan jacketed bullets are priced outta sight. Here in Kanuckistan there are no gas checks at any price, and none are expected to be imported, I’m told. Having already made the move from jacketed to cast ‘boolits’, now what? Boolits designed to use them don’t shoot well without their gas checks! Thanks to the resident genii here we have an answer…………..Paper Patching! “Yeah sure, the technology of the old buffalo hunters of the1880’s!” Well……not exactly! The method is identical, but would you believe………..adequate accuracy at modern velocities from modern rifles? Believe it!!

I found a thread on that forum where a shooter claimed good accuracy at hunting velocities, and some chimed in to claim even higher results, and then a whole slew of them piled on saying they’d never buy another jacketed bullet as they were achieving identical results from their paper-patched loads. Well, this sounded like it was a trend I should check out for myself! And I could envision some Threepers crouched over a campfire doing the Mel Gibson/’Patriot’ thing with inadequate supplies and equipment. So I PP’d two bare cast boolits and finger-loaded them into fired and unsized cases on top of my goto load (I decapped with a hammer and punch, and primed the cases as usual using the LEE hand tool. Powder charge was dippered.)

As a control, I fired two shots from my #5 using my goto lubed and gas-checked boolit load., and cleaned the rifle. Then I single-loaded the PP’d ones and fired another target. The results are gratifying! Here’s a pic of the PP’d cartridges, and then one with the Control target on the left, PP’d on the right. Nice clean round holes! Not bad for no dies at all, just a mold and some copy paper to go with the usual primer and powder!

Try this out with your firestick whilst yet ye may, just in case……………….!

[Buckshot]

...............Now ya need to try them at 50 yards. Load 6 of'em. Three as your first PP'd slugs and then 3 with a card wad under the boolit, all else being the same.

................Buckshot

[HABCAN]

Agreed, and much larger numbers at much longer ranges, but need a 'chela' to run the targets and get me to the firing line with my stuff.................OLD is HELL! Data is there if anyone else wants to use it................??

[pdawg_shooter]

I have managed to get 3000fps with a 300RUM and MOA accuracy. There is a post here about how I did it. In my 30.06 using a Lyman 311284 sized to .3015 and patched up to .310 I can get 2530fps with accuracy BETTER than I can with jacketed. Makes a fine hunting load. This is a gas checked design without a check. It is amazing what a little scrap of paper will do for you!

[HABCAN]

Thanks for chiming in, pdawg, that's exactly the possibility I'm trying to point out to folks over at my other forums. If more of them come over here and learn, I'll have accomplished a goal.

[45 2.1]

PPing boolits will get you there, but a GC maker set up for aluminum flashing material will let you shoot your normal loads also. Just another option for the componentless places in the world.

[HABCAN]

Very true Sir, but you need such a tool, AND a heavy press in which to use it.

[45 2.1]

Very true Sir, but you need such a tool, AND a heavy press in which to use it.

Half true, there are several types used to make aluminum GCs. Some of them are hand dies which require a soft hammer and wood block, not a heavy press. Finding someone to make one of those is the problem.

[pdawg_shooter]

Thanks for chiming in, pdawg, that's exactly the possibility I'm trying to point out to folks over at my other forums. If more of them come over here and learn, I'll have accomplished a goal.

You are welcome to copy my post and use in on any other forum you wish. Here it is again.

Back in November I decided to develop a sub-MOA, 3000fps load for a 30 caliber rifle. It took awhile, but I believe I have “got er done.”
The Rifle.
In order to get the velocity I wanted with this weight bullet I chose a 300RUM in a Savage model 116. It is stainless with a laminated stock. It came from the factory with pillar bedding, and I added glass behind the recoil lug, and under the front receiver ring and tang. I topped it with a Weaver T15 for this test. This rifle will group ¾ to 7/8 with good jacketed bullet loads.
The Bullet.
The most consistently accurate 30cal bullet I cast is the Lyman 311284 so this is the one I worked with. The alloy is a mix of WW and Linotype. I added lino. until an air cooled bullet tested 16.0 BHN on my Lee tester. The bullet was then sized .3015 with a push through die. This gave me full length bearing surface. The bullet was then patched with 16# green bar printer paper and allowed to dry overnight. I then clipped the tail, lubed with White Label BAC and run through a .310 push through die. This left the bullet .311 and ready to load. The finish weight, with patch, was 202gr.
The Brass.
I used new Remington brass. I full length sized them and sorted by weight allowing no more than +/- 1%. It was then trimmed to length, outside neck turned to .012 thickness, the primer pocket reamed to a uniform depth, flash holes drilled uniform and deburred. I then loaded with a 180gr. Core Lock and H4831 to fireform. The test load was then loaded in UNSIZED brass. I tried H1000, Retumbo, and finally settled on reloader25. The starting load was 88.0 and I worked up to 93.0. This gave me 3069 with no signs of excess pressure. Oh yes, the primer was a Federal 215. The bullets were seated about ¼ inch into the case and finished seating when the bolt was closed. This gave me an OAL of 3.670.
The Test.
Testing was done over 2 days. Shots were fired over a bench rest with a windage and elevation adjustable front rest and “bunny ear” rear rest. Twenty 3 shot groups were fired allowing the barrel to cool completely. The smallest group measured .760 and the largest was 1.140. The overall average figured out to .992. Mission accomplished, but just barely. So what good is this load? Not much unless you like poking holes in paper. Next step will be to neck size, seat to correct OAL and see how they shoot. Might make a good hunting load that way.
I do load some jacketed 180, 200, and 220 grain bullets for this one. It now wears a Simmons 3.5x10 scope. Maybe some day I can go elk hunting.

[jonk]

6 yards? I can shoot a group size like that with a slingshot at 6 yards.

I am interested in your efforts as I too am working on a similar project right now, but start at 25 yards at least.

You say the bullet was a Lee 185 gr unsized. I presume you mean their C 312 185? Printer paper usually adds about .002 per side per wrap- or .008 for a double wrap. The mold, unsized, drops from 311 to 313 I've heard; mine is 313. That could be UP TO a .321 bullet!

Did you use a ballistic filler? If not you are lucky that your cases were 'just right' to allow hand seating withouth the bullet falling into the case.

In my tests using 42 gr of 4350 or 36 gr of 4895 with an unsized bullet (I used a lee 309 200) results were pretty useless and the patch was utterly shredded- methinks I was too fat at .317"

I'd like to hear some more details. Thanks!

[Crash_Corrigan]

I have had similiar success with the 311284 cast boolit. My alloy is straight ww including the glue on strips. They are water quenched and sized thru a Lee .308 sizer with dawn and hot water for a lube.

Washed clean and allowed dry I then wet patch with computer paper and a cigarette roller. Allowed to dry overnight I clip off the tails and lube with a dab of JPW and run thru a SAECO .314 sizer.

I end up with a completed boolit of .315 to .316 which I seat into neck sized only and the bell the case mouth with a Lee expander die .303 case. I then gently use a Lee FCD in .303 to hold it all together.

I have been having good success with "the load" from CE Harris of 12 gr of Red Dot with a bit of dacron stuffing over the powder.

The tiny bits of shredded pp I find after firing and the clean bore attest to the job the PP is doing. Out of my SMLE No4 Mk I the velocity has been around 1700 FPS and I am getting decent accuracy at 50 yds. If I try for 100 I need to elevate the rear sight but I am happy with 2 1/2" at 100.

I suspect that the sporterizing done by the previous owner of this Milsurp has messed up the up-pressure on the barrel as the forend has been removed along with the top hand guard.

The chamber on my rifle was cerrosafed and I found the chamber to be in excess of .316 just ahead of the end of the boolit. I probably could upsize the completed round to a full .316 but why mess with success.

[longbow]

I know this will stir the pot but another option is to use filler under a plain cast bullet.

I know this is the Paper Patching forum but HABCAN is looking for options for when he can't get "stuff". I feel his pain as I live in a small town in BC Canada and we don't even have a sporting good store here that carries guns much less reloading supplies. In the past I have been making a pilgramage to Colville Washington to shop for reloading supplies but the BATF has some rules in place that make it illegal to non US citizens to be in possession of ammunition or reloading supplies while in the States.

In any case, I make do where I have to and paper patching is one option I have used. Filler is another. So far I have been getting good success using COW under a Lyman 314299 lapped out to 0.315" with no gas check. Groups sizes are about the same as for a gas check boolit with gas check.

Paper patching definitely has some advantages but for general shooting I find it too time consuming so use the filler when I don't have (or don't want to pay for) gas checks.

Longbow

[HABCAN]

To ALL who have chimed in, THANK YOU! (Jonk, see again post #3.) I am very limited as to what I can do alone, and shoot these trials in the dugout earth basement. The intent was to publish my limited results so someone else more capable could carry on and make info available whilst yet we may to those who may need it, vis. those who read the fora I have linked in my signature line.

I am working with both the C312-185 and the CTL-165, no fillers yet..............and please all, note that this is 'Expedient Ammo', NOT what you would be making at home in the peace of your well-equipped loading room? As in, I used fired cases, NO dies, and my note on the target that crimp was achieved with adjustable pliers.

Y'all might want to go here also:
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/

III

[TAWILDCATT]

I know what you have in mind.BUT I have a 1903 with low numbers.I dont shoot any thing but light loads.I use lyman 311291 and Lees 312-160 TL with 13.5 gr RED DOT at 1680. and they shoot in 1 inch at 100 yds.yes I have gas checks on them.I am going to try a Modern Bond plain base next.I believe this load is good enuf to bring down deer.I have the sights set for 300 yds.for a 100 yd zero.
:coffeecom