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View Full Version : 30-115 gr Paper patched perfection



randyrat
10-28-2009, 09:39 PM
I had paper patched a C30-115 RN (RCBS mold) sized to .308 PP with two wraps of TOP Cig paper then sized to .309.. No gas check, no lube, just a little spit. Loaded over 24 grains of IMR3031 and shot them out of my OL 336 30-30. WOW talk about accuracy...I shot 15 of these at 25 yds the whole group can be covered by a quarter, many of them were in the same hole.
I'm not sure if you all would call this success, but i do.
I think this litttle bullet Paper Patched would make a nice little coyote bullet. (two shot, one chambered and one in the tube)

I did have one thought; Are cig papers abrasive? I know my barrel sure was clean when i finished.

303Guy
10-29-2009, 12:24 AM
... my barrel sure was clean ...I had that with cig paper too. Difference was my results sucked!:sad: (I wasn't expecting good results so I put up a very large target!)

However, I take pleasure in your success!:drinks:

I would guess that cig paper would be less abrasive than most, considering its intended purpose.

Keep us posted on your longer range results.

Buckshot
10-29-2009, 02:41 AM
[QUOTE=randyrat;703298]I had paper patched a C30-115 RN (RCBS mold) sized to .308 PP with two wraps of TOP Cig paper then sized to .309. WOW talk about accuracy...I shot 15 of these at 25 yds the whole group can be covered by a quarter, many of them were in the same hole.
I'm not sure if you all would call this success, but i do.
I think this litttle bullet Paper Patched would make a nice little coyote bullet. (two shot, one chambered and one in the tube)[QUOTE]

..........Randy, at 25 yards you could use a bayonet :-) See what those little dudes will do at 50 and 100 yards. I know the Lee Soup Can will hold a scant inch at 100, so those should do the same, ya think?

...............Buckshot

randyrat
10-29-2009, 06:37 AM
Yeh, 25 yds is pea shooter distance. I'll see what they will do at 100 yds. Hopefully they will hold up to more distance.

longbow
10-29-2009, 11:12 AM
I tried a PP 110 gr. from a home made mould in my .303. Same paper, wrapping and size as for 180 gr. which shoot well.

I was expecting decent results from the little 110 gr. but didn't get it. At 50 yards the group was something like 12" but oddly, all holes were clean and round. At first I thought maybe they were tumbling but no. I figured they were just too short and the jump to rifling was the problem.

I was going to try some more at about 130 gr. so see how they do but haven't got ot it yet.

Your success has me interested again! I will be interested to see how yours do at longer range.

Longbow

Hubertus
10-29-2009, 11:28 AM
Hey randyrat,
I like your results and I am really looking forward to your 50 and 100 yard targets.:Fire:
You know 303Guy, longbow and some others including me are trying or at some point did try to get the PP with Cig paper to shoot with different results. Actually I have one question: did you recover your patches? What did they look like? I have used cig paper in my 45-70 and only had tiny little shreds as leftovers in front of the muzzle. Did you have leading?

Regards,
Hubertus

leftiye
10-29-2009, 01:34 PM
Randy - Caliber (cartridge)? Velocity? I'm working on a soupcan load for my .327 and .30 Carbine. Similar boolit.

303Guy
10-29-2009, 02:40 PM
I was going to try some more at about 130 gr. so see how they do but haven't got ot it yet.

Your success has me interested again!Yup. Me too. I still have my fired prototype 120gr right here by my keyboard. I should make up a mold and cast a batch!

randyrat
10-29-2009, 09:39 PM
Hey randyrat,
I like your results and I am really looking forward to your 50 and 100 yard targets.:Fire:
You know 303Guy, longbow and some others including me are trying or at some point did try to get the PP with Cig paper to shoot with different results. Actually I have one question: did you recover your patches? What did they look like? I have used cig paper in my 45-70 and only had tiny little shreds as leftovers in front of the muzzle. Did you have leading?

Regards,
Hubertus Heck no! i was so excited about hitting paper even at 25 yds
it never crossed my mind to look for paper.
I had loaded these up about 6 months ago and i finally brought them to the range. Lucky i logged everything about this load down so i can copy it. I recall being very carefull to seat these with a good Bell and no crimp , only smoothed out. Also i used spit to wet the paper and rolled them between two virgin maiden buttocks. GOTCHYA.
On a serious note, i did wet them down good and rolled them on a hard surface and let dry good before loading them.
Very carefull to NOT rip them. I did notice ( in my notes) i use a very small amount of olive oil and beswax as a final .309 sizing lube.

randyrat
10-29-2009, 09:48 PM
Randy - Caliber (cartridge)? Velocity? I'm working on a soupcan load for my .327 and .30 Carbine. Similar boolit. Velocity? - 30-30.....I think there is room to go higher on the velocity, but that would be needless, I was looking for a small bullet, cheap(no gas check), very accurate, low velocity, low recoil, coyote killin, bullseye bustin round. Yet to be tested at 100 yds. I do have a good feeling that it will work at 100 yds. No flyers 15 rds@ 25 yds
I'm loading 20 rds of these next and going to shoot them at 100 yds. Range report due soon.

Buckshot
10-30-2009, 02:59 AM
.............My comment about the Soup Can, "I know the Lee Soup Can will hold a scant inch at 100, .........." is because my shooting buddy did it with a scoped M94 Winchester LEVER action, and at 2100 FPS no less:-) They weren't paper patched but the fact remains that they ARE capable little boolits. His load was 21 or 23 grains of H4198, and I forget which it was now.

http://www.fototime.com/9DDC9AF2291A561/standard.jpg

8.0grs of Red Dot, Lee C309-113F. 1903 Sporter Springfield. Iron sights, 50 yards. The design Randyrat used should certainly be capable of the same thing. The basic difference is the Lyman is a RN and the Lee is a FN.

...............Buckshot

randyrat
10-30-2009, 07:28 AM
Buckshot, Mine is an RCBS mold i think the # on it is 30-115....

That is sooooo cool, a soupcan 1" at a 100 yds.

I also use a scope on my marlin 30-30 or i wouldn't be shooting like i am. I forgot what it is like to have perfect eyes. I still don't wear glasses and i don't need them, only for reading once in a while, but i gave up trying to shoot 1" groups without a scope, at any distance.

barrabruce
10-30-2009, 09:02 AM
Cig papers apparently are nitrated of phosphated or some such. that keeps the burning rate down.
Supposed to be mildly abrasive
The bullets I tried made my barrell shine too.
Think they are more abrasive than other paper.

Could be wrong but it was something like that.

cheers

Hmm 110-130s wizzing flat out in a 30-30 soft lead pp could expand dramatically for soft small framed critters!! If not a holllow point woulf be devestating!!! :)

Barra

303Guy
10-30-2009, 03:50 PM
... Actually I have one question: did you recover your patches? What did they look like?
Hubertus, I did actually recover some cig paper patches. Those were fired in my 'test tube'.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-863F-1.jpg
This was a low velocity load.

randyrat
11-01-2009, 12:56 AM
Can you tell me what story does that picture tell? Good,Bad,ugly? Is it good?

I PPed 20 more bullets yesterday and today they were ready. Well 19, i dropped one on the floor and couldn't find it. Crawled all over the floor with my reading glasses on and couldn't find it. So, i ended up cleaning and sweeping the floor, still couldn't find it. 19 I hate loading an odd number and i being overtaken/beatin by one bullet. I wasted so much time looking and cleaning, i never got them loaded up. Tomorrow is a new day. They/ 18 will be loaded tomorrow morning.

My wife said since i quit smoking i've had signs of obsessive behavior. I said i would take that under advisement.

I'm going to find that one dang bullet.

303Guy
11-01-2009, 02:18 AM
Did you check your pants pockets? Trouser upturn? I bet that boolit is not on the floor!:razz:

I'm not sure what that pics tells but it does say the cig paper patch comes off at the muzzle in equal segments at low velocity and it does show that the patch holds together through the bore. That must be good, surely?

longbow
11-01-2009, 01:40 PM
Now I am getting all worked up again!

I still have a few of the 100 gr. that I patched so I guess I better load some more to see if a change of powder/charge helps.

If not I will move up in weight/body length to 120 or maybe 130 gr. to see if that helps.

I will double check patched diameter but it should be just barely under the throat diameter. I figured the long jump for the short boolit in the throat was likely my problem.

Any advice?

Thnaks,
Longbow

longbow
11-07-2009, 11:29 PM
Well, I got to the the range with a few more of the little guys (100 gr.) patched and loaded. Same results as last time ~ poor.

I am still thinking the boolit is so short there is too much jump through the throat to get to rifling.

I will try a little heavier (longer) boolit seated out as far as I can and give that a try.

Longbow

docone31
11-07-2009, 11:40 PM
I have just not gotten any accuracy with the smaller castings. I tried the Lee spire point 165 gn mold. Miserable.
Perhaps, the weight is a factor.