6.5 carcano Dies [Archive]

semtav

10-26-2009, 11:56 PM

Got my 6.5 rcbs dies today and reloaded a couple shells using manleyjt's bullets.
Since I haven't got my sizing die and just loaded them as cast. (measured betrween .269 and .270.
the problem I have, is the neck on the bullet seating die must be a tad smaller than that because they aren't going in, instead the base of the neck is actually doing the seating.
I need to get my small hole guages and check, but has anyone else run into this problem using the larger dia bullets?

Boz330

10-27-2009, 08:47 AM

Yep, I have the Lee dies and the Cruise Missile is to big to go through the area that does the crimp. I'm having the same problem with oversize boolits in my 303 dies as well. Can't get even take the flair out of the case without forcing the boolit deeper in the case.

Bob

Nate1778

10-27-2009, 09:58 AM

Guys, Lee just released the .268 expanding pin with its dies. Mine came with two, one .264 and one .268. I have no problem seating the Hornady .268 bullet with it. I do beleive that Lee is the only manufacturer that has that pin. It might work with your RCBS but more than likely you'll need to buy at least the Lee sizing die. Trying to push .270 lead through a .264 hole is futile.

If you were unaware, the Carcano came in a .264 bullet. Unfortunately the rifling in most of them was .268. So some manufacturers have started making dies and bullets for the correct size. That said some of them were bored at .264. Do not try to shoot a .270 bullet down a .264 barrel. Slug your barrel to find out what you have and cast, and size accordingly. All dies manufactured for that round with exception of the new Lee dies is set to .264, hence your issue. If you were aware I apologize for the explanation.

scrapcan

10-27-2009, 10:32 AM

semtav,

I wish I had thrown in some that were sized and checked at 268. Hindsight is 20/20. If you don't see you sizing die in the near future holler. Buckshot made me both a lyman/rcbs and a push thru.

The other option you have is to make an expander that is closer to size and then lap out hte neck on the seater die. You might end up going that way.

The other thing you could look at is a set of hornady new dimension neck sizer and dead length bullet seater, Not sure if they make a short 6.5 set. That is what I use on a 7mm-06 ackley improved and had toopen the seater a bit. It becomes a neck size only proposition with the hornady dies but it works and is cheaper tan custom dies.

jonk

10-27-2009, 10:42 AM

For me it isn't just an issue of the expansion of the neck- the seater die is just too narrow in the neck, whatever seater plug is installed- and the bullet seizes and sticks in the die.

My solution thus far has been to either use a seater from a larger die (an 8mm for 303, no suggestions offhand for the 6.5). Or to back the die out and live with the idea that it won't remove the flare, and just use the die body to do the seating, with a bit of hot glue filling the seater plug and hole. It works ok, you just have to make sure your flare is JUST enough to allow easy seating, as it will be removed by bolt closing only- and a heavy flare won't close.

Nate1778

10-27-2009, 11:02 AM

madsenshooter

10-27-2009, 12:50 PM

Some of you are missing the point here, the seating die won't allow the neck of the case with a .268 boolit up in it, your only recourse is to either turn the necks, or have the die opened up. I have the same problem with a CH 6.5 jap die. .264-.266, anything larger has to have the neck turned, depending of course upon case thickness.

scrapcan

10-27-2009, 02:25 PM

Madsenshooter is correct.

The other thing being missed is he already has the rcbs dies. I am sure he wants to fire this rifle and not wait two weeks for another set of dies.

Semtav is contemplating a match in mid november so time is of the essence. If he can make his current set of dies work with what is on hand he is in good shape.

Semtav I might be able to help on the neck expander/bell for an rcbs or lyman m-die depending on what your espander stem looks like. Buckshot also made me an expander button/tip for both lyman and rcbs stem. The seater die body I cannot help with other than to say you can most likley spend a few minutes with a split rod and emery cloth to open it a little. You could also use some of the slugs I sent and impregnated them with lappiing powder/compound and push through teh neck section. Both methods will likely take out the crimp section at top of die.

Boz330

10-27-2009, 03:07 PM

The Lee Die set Expands to both .264 and .268 and seat both bullets with ease including crimp and there cheap. They have worked well for me.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=691635

Nate, you aren't comprehending the problem. You are thinking of the expander ball and we are talking about the bullet seating die. With the 270 boolits they are oversize and the driving bands that are outside of the case won't pass through the case crimping section. The boolit is just driven deeper in the case and if you stop short the flare for the cast boolit is left and causes hard chambering.

Bob

Nate1778

10-27-2009, 04:00 PM

Bob, I do understand, I am guessing that since Lee is including the larger ball they have also adapted their seating die for the larger bullet. I can say the Hornady bullet mics out at .267-.268 and the die seats fine with no hangups or bullet pushing. The question would be can it handle the extra .002 of the lead projectile. I would guess yes but have no proof to back that up. When I first started reloading for the caliber they had just released the dies including the .268, I e-mailed them with the very question as I had read on several Carcano sites that even if you could open the neck the seating die would hang on the bullet. Lee's response was they have adapted for the larger size. What that means I have no idea. Someone send me a lead projectile and I'll try it with the seating die. I don't shoot it enough to justify casting for it yet.

I just got done reloading about 50 rounds last week and will say with the .268 ball in it the bullet seats very easily and the crimp essentially holds the bullet in place. I would imagine although a bit tighter the .270 would fit with a good taper on the neck.

DanM

10-27-2009, 05:07 PM

I have run into this problem with several seater dies. Solution was to lap out the neck area of the seater die so it would pass the fatter cast bullet. (what Manleyjt said) It is a quick and easy fix that works like it should.

StarMetal

10-27-2009, 05:31 PM

On the seater dies that also crimp the bullet, you will lose that function if you polish out the neck portion. Myself I use Lee collet crimpers.

Joe

Nora

10-27-2009, 07:14 PM

My norm is to go green with my dies. At the beginning of the year when I bought a set for my Carcano I bought Hornady. At that time they were the only dies that were set up to size them correctly to except the .268 bullet, which was also only offered from Hornady. All others sized for the .264 which we all know shoots like doo doo threw any flavor of Carcano.

Nora

semtav

10-27-2009, 07:37 PM

Boz has it right concerning my problem. The seating die isn't letting the bullet up in it to where I have the die adjusted. My case isn't getting anywhere close to hitting anything. I was able to run the seat all the way down and then manually control the depth.

I was using Norma factory rounds that I removed the bullets from, so I haven't even begun to find out about the resizing problems.

I did get five loaded and got a 4 " group at 50 yds using Unique, so at least I have a place to start.

I just measured the hole and it is .267 so anything over that won't work properly until its reamed out.
then I'll have a little slop in the seating rod so I may have to turn down a 270 seating rod to make it fit right.
I'm thinking a .270 hole would about right.

While I'm still rambling here, I just tried my 270 die and it seat's those long bullets just fine. Not sure how bad the runout at the tip is tho.

I just measured the hole in a 6.5 X 53R Dutch RCBS seating die that I have and it is .268 and it allowed the top part of the bullet at least to the first land up in it, and with proper adjustment, it will work perfectly for my short term needs

Now to resize a few cases and see what problems I have there.

Boz330

10-28-2009, 09:38 AM

The Cruise Missile mould that I have is throwing a .2715 boolit and I can seat it by running the stem way down but can't get rid of the case flare. And like Joe said if you polish it out you loose the crimping function. I don't think that Lee makes a factory crimp die for the 6.5 Carcano. I think that the 270 might be perfect but I don't have anything in 270. I don't think that the jacketed bullets will be a problem but I don't want to shoot them in this rifle.

Bob

semtav

10-28-2009, 09:52 AM

StarMetal

10-28-2009, 11:25 AM

Boz330

10-28-2009, 04:01 PM

Boz
maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see why you will loose the crimp function if you only increase the hole .002". Outside of the neck is still around
.290 which should leave plenty of meat to crimp the neck.
semtav

To be honest I haven't looked at it that close yet. Just got around to loading for it Sunday morning and was in a hurry to shoot on a beautiful day, not work in a dark basement. There has been damn little sunshine around here lately and I wanted to take advantage of it.
Joe that is a good idea but one of the 6.5s that they make might be close enough without having to do that. If all else fails I could pull the decapping pin and use the size die backed off. I hate changing things after I have them set though.

Bob

semtav

10-31-2009, 09:36 AM

Just got a notice from Midsouth that my backorder is on the way. (Only thing I have on backorder is the cruise missile) and optics planet shipped my sizer Wednesday, so everything ought to get here at once.
Now if BaBore gets his molds done, I'll have way too much on my plate to get done this year.

TAWILDCATT

11-06-2009, 09:10 PM

Semtav:join the crowd,I have about 15 projects going also,and at my age I cant work as fast as I need to.oh well its fun tho.

semtav

11-09-2009, 11:13 PM

Does anyone carry individual RCBS die parts. I'm looking for an expander /decapper pin for the end of the 270 win die.

I want to reduce it to .269 to use in the Carcano.

My Carcano bullets are dropping at .2715 exactly like Boz's and I'm going to have to shoot them as cast since my bore at the muzzle is .271 (groove)