Griz hikeing stick

[jbunny]

has anybody else built a hikeing stick. mine uses a shortened 20 gauge shell filled
with 4f black powder. the idea behind this is like the car air bag. u poke this in something and when it gets to the big washer , it cocks and fires. i have not had to use
it yet. i have showed it to the rcmp up here and as long as it can't fire a projectile,
it's leagel.
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q273/MOUICH/grizhikeingstick2.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q273/MOUICH/grizhikeingstick.jpg

[barrabruce]

So you sort of "Blow" things up with compressed air sort of.!!! :) :)

HOw would it fare against a pig or a bear or such critter.
Damage wise!!! any reports etc???
Or do the critters float away like a let go ballon after you take out the prong and hard to get out of the trees??

:)
Cool
Barra

[Bert2368]

There are similar weapons for divers- The idea being whatever you unload into will become too bouyant to remain at your depth and keep bothering you, as well as suffering whatever damage the rapid decompression may cause during your target's quick trip to the surface.

My gut reaction is that device fired out of the water would greatly irritate a grizzly, while not removing it's ability to express that emotion on your hide. I would rather carry a can of bear mace.

[waksupi]

I'm betting a griz wouldn't let you poke it. I remember about the guy who had a pet griz, and one of their games was, the guy would try to poke the bear with a pitch fork. He never got the job done, as the bear easily swatted away the thrusts.

[Geraldo]

Should you ever have to use it on a Griz I hope it works. If it fails that looks like it will be mighty painful when the bear sticks it in your bunghole.

[jbunny]

welllllllllll, theres lots of ways to look at this. personaly i would rather have this
than bear spray. u don't have much of a chance with just your bare hands. i know of i fellow that use to be a customer of mine that had been attacked by bears 6 times.
every sq inch of his body was scars. he did kill 2 of them with his hunting knife.
i have not had to use this yet and i hope i never have to, but it's like haveing an
insurance policy. if your going to die, might as well die fighting. all that pressure
has to come out the mouth and nose and hopefully it will be enough pressure to
on the brain to knock it out. we hace had a tremendous increase in the deer
and bear population as well as cougers and coyotes. again i hope that i never have
to use it. i built this for where u can not carry a firearm, eg parks. a reg 20 gauge
shell will not fit in this stick so thats why it's leagal here.
cheers
jb

[Triggerhappy]

Ditto on the bunghole remark. Doubt you'd have much luck getting a good stick, and if you did, would probably inflate mostly under the skin making for an even more pizzed off griz.

I've seen advertisements for a knife that uses a CO2 canister to squirt CO2 gas into someone or something if it's stabbed. Don't know how well that would work. I know the boom sticks we used when diving were designed to put a huge amount of gasses into a shark which would do incredible internal damage. It didn't just inflate them to move them in the dive column, it ruined their day.

Seems that if you could get the gasses deeper into the chest cavity it could work. A griz would need a fairly long probe to get that far though, and you'd have to go through the ribs. Might be hard to do on a charging bear. Better than a stick I suppose. Certainly not knocking the idea, just a lot of ifs.

I've seen pictures of wounds caused by contact shootings and the damage is many times more than if the barrel was held a little farther away allowing the gasses to escape and not enter the body. Gasses can do strange and horrible things to a body. It's why beano was invented...

TH

[peter nap]

The one for sharks is called a bang stick and work pretty well. I have a thing that divers fill with compressed air and works the ame way. It's called a shark dart. Causes a giant embolism.

Yours wouldn't be my weapon of choice, but I'd sure rather have it than a knife.

[jbunny]

this stick has to go in 6 inches to cock and fire. this should be plenty for most animals
on this continent. the overall lenght is 5 ft 3 in, so its' a realy close range stick.
like the shark banngers, u have to be a cool dude in a do or die situation.
anyhoooowwww i like playing with things that go BANG. hehehehe
jb

[leftiye]

You could wear an explosive vest. You know, like them there raghead sewerside bummers wear.

[jbunny]

yeaaa u see the cartoon where this terorist is all wraped up with explosives
and he is the instructor. he says now pay attention, i will just show u this once.
jb

[rbuck351]

Just where in the front of a griz are you going to stick this thing that it will penetrate 6"

[jbunny]

u know the old indian saying, the best time to shoot a moose
is when u see him. i called this griz hikeing stick but i pact it down the street
for dogs, cougars and black bears around here. i need a volenteer to go try this out.
i have watch a vedio of a griz attack on a CO that had just released a traped griz.
the griz chomped down on the first thing , i should say the nearest thing to him
and that was the CO's camera hanging from his neck. that gave the CO time to draw
his 357 mag and punped 6 shots into it. he never missed once. LOL. i probaly
would sacrafice my left arm as bait and dart him at the same time in the left side
with my right hand. i have to tell u that a few months ago i had a big black bear
encounter in my own yard. i walk out of my shop with a piece of scrap steel to the scrap pile. i walk across my drive way diagnaly to the scrap pile about 40 yds. when i turned to come back , theres blacky about 25 yds comeing at me. no i did not **** myself. but my heart skipped a beat. he was walking at a fast walk and no time
to even think. i instanttanious through my arms in the air, yelled AAARRRGGGHHHH
as loud as i could and ran towards him, on my second step forward he adjusted
his course in overdrive. those suckers can move. never try to outrun one.
i have spanked a few with those rubber batton boolits and talk about the sod
comeback at u. besides bear spray, lets hear what other people have for plans to
repell a dangerous animal
regards
jb

[peter nap]

. besides bear spray, lets hear what other people have for plans to
repell a dangerous animal
regards
jb

Well,here are my favorites

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa57/peternap/DSCN0269.jpg

[jbunny]

very nice. that would be my first choice too. however we are not allowed to
pack those around up here. me thinks your days are #, if momambo gets his
ways. enjoy while u can. then u will be like me and think out of the box.:bigsmyl2:
jb

[Geraldo]

lets hear what other people have for plans to
repell a dangerous animal


Eight 3" magnum slugs in a Benelli M1 Super 90.


i probaly
would sacrafice my left arm as bait and dart him at the same time in the left side
with my right hand.

Good thing Canada has universal health care.

[peter nap]

very nice. that would be my first choice too. however we are not allowed to
pack those around up here. me thinks your days are #, if momambo gets his
ways. enjoy while u can. then u will be like me and think out of the box.:bigsmyl2:
jb

Not going to Happen In Virginia. Maybe California and such places, but not here. We take our freedom seriously. The gun lobby is the single most influential group in Va politics.

Have a look at what we just finished doing to the Republican party because they chose an anti gun place to have the Republican Roundup.

Lot of pictures.
Also notice that every adult in this event was armed. The Secret Service was very tight lipped about being surrounded by hundreds of legally armed men and women.

http://news.oldva.org/blogroll/gunowners-tell-cantor-no-roundup-for-them/

[Gerry N.]

A little thing everyone seems to have overlooked about the bangsticks for sharks. They are immersed in WATER and WATER is not compressable causing any shock waves to be much more effective.

Griz are surrounded by AIR which is very compressable minimizing the effect.

I'd think that one might do well to try a poke or two into a goat or hog carcass to see what tissue damage occurs Giving this thing it's maiden flight by poking it at or into a [edit] off grizzly would almost certainly end much worse for the poker than the pokee, at least in the short run. It may well be lethal to the griz but most likely several minutes to hours (days?) after he has completed massive and lethal reconfigutation of the pokist.

Just sayin' is all.

Another question. Where exactly do cast boolits figure into this whole thing?

Gerry N

[thxmrgarand]

I hunt ducks where brown bears aka grizzlies live. I carry slugs when hunting ducks. At one place there is a lone spruce in a salt marsh that has a brass plague. The plague says a hunter's 14 year-old lab saved him from a brown bear but didn't survive the fight. Going in there in the dark for the shoot at first light always spooks me.

Sometimes seals pay too much interest in my dog and slugs can also work for that. When walking my dog in places where bears live I usually wear my S&W 29 with 320 grn hard cast. I hope I never need to test them. I prefer a 12 GA with slugs for picking berries but sometimes wear the .44 instead.

Canadians should move to the US at least until basic rights are guarantied to Canadians in a constitutions. Canadians are sure welcome here in Alaska. Anyone who can legally carry a gun in Alaska can carry one concealed (Alaskan or not). And open carry doesn't seem to attract any interest.

If that fellow comes for guns he may eventually get them but they will be hot and empty when he does. And the fracas won't necessarily take place at the law-abiding gunowners' houses but maybe at the homes of the henchmen sent to get the guns. The more I fear losing my guns the more money I send to the NRA as I would rather win in the political process. ' Hope this doesn't offend anyone as it is not meant to do so.

[montana_charlie]

i know of i fellow that use to be a customer of mine that had been attacked by bears 6 times.
Slow learner, huh?

Your Griz stick might be useful as a last ditch tool when all other options are gone.

Are you familiar with how the Zulus (or one of those African tribes) kill lions with a spear? I think it's usually a 'manhood rite' when it's employed.

The spear isn't very long, but it has a long blade...long and wide enough to kill a lion.
As the cat charges, the 'hunter' sets the butt in the ground and lets the oncoming cat impale himself on the point. I don't believe it can be done without getting torn up some.

A similar move with your Griz stick might be possible, since the bear is coming to the stick...instead of warding off pokes that you initiate.

You'd have to be crouching with the stick braced, and guide the tip to it's target.

But, he would have to be seriously coming down on you, and you would have to pray that the charge would incapacitate him enough for you to get out from under him.

Again, I doubt it can be done without getting torn up some.

CM

[rbuck351]

My griz stick is a puma 92 in 454Casull with 10 of the lee 310+gr cast boolits. Even with that I would expect to get torn up some on a close range charge. The griz is not a blackie and is fast, mean, and tough. Just plain nasty and doesn't quit until dead or broken to the point he can't move. And, it takes them way to long to realize they are dead. I hope you never have to test that thing on a brown bear. Oh, and trying to scare one off will either work or make it attack. Hard to say which.

[Linstrum]

I know you are more interested in non-firearms type bear medicine ideas, but my bear medicine stick for the nasty big black bears that live around here in central southern New Mexico is a Springfield Armory, Inc. M1A with a 20 round clip loaded with 165 grain soft points - I also use it along with a few other pistols, rifles, and a 30" very sharp scimitar-type sword as the medicine for the two-legged-type nasty critters.


rl661

[Ernest]

I hope that you will never have to use your bang stick. My opinion though is that if you stab anything with that and release the gas from that much 4f BP it is going to cause and incredible concussion and a wound area the size of a basket ball. I'm positive that will change any animals channel right then and there.

[Linstrum]

Hey, jbunny, just a few more thoughts, have you fired your Griz Stick yet?

I have a little experience with designing rocket engines, and the thought occured to me that you might have your stick launch back at you when it fires, although the kick wouldn't be any worse than a heavy shotgun load but it could surprise you if you weren't expecting it. The specific impulse of something like that isn't to terribly much, although the British Congreve military rockets of 200 years ago used black powder quite successfully. I used to participate in office chair races where we sat in swivel chairs and propelled ourselves backwards with CO2 fire extinguishers, it was a lot of fun! The fire extinguisher refilling company loved us, too.

[Jim]

What I know about grizzlies will fit in a thimble and still leave room for coffee. I just gotta believe that if you and Mr. Griz get close enough to shake hands, that thing ain't gonna be of much use.

[stubshaft]

A little thing everyone seems to have overlooked about the bangsticks for sharks. They are immersed in WATER and WATER is not compressable causing any shock waves to be much more effective.

Griz are surrounded by AIR which is very compressable minimizing the effect.



Gerry N

Having used a variety of bangsticks in calibers from 44 mag, 410, 12ga, 357mag. I can say that the incompressability of water would have minimal involvement in the use of them. The major differences are:

A - They all fire a projectile.

B - The gas expelled by the charge will enter the body or extremity.

C - It will produce a debilitating contact wound.

The original shark dart used a CO2 cartridge and resembled a screwdriver with a washer near the front of the handle. This was the initiator. The problem was that in the water because of the added resistance the diver might not have enough force to cause the early models to pierce the CO2 cartridge.

A bangstick uses a regular loaded round and is usually mounted on a sling spear that varies in length ( usually 6'). It didn't/doesn't take much effort to set the primer off.

The concept of the griz stick is sound but the ability to get a hit in the body cavity may be difficult to manage as (from what I've seen) bears charge head down. Granted a charge of black will send a large amount of heated gas into the wound. It is still limited to the amont of damage it will cause in and of itself.

Good idea, but I hope you never have to use it.