Bullet lube quantity question

[rockrat]

Have a Pedersoli Sharps clone in 50cal that I have just started shooting. Using a boolit that I designed for the 50bmg minus the gas check area , so it is a PB. Carries enough lube for smokeless, but concerned about enough to use with BP.

A real newbie at the BP shooting, so I was wondering if the boolit doesn't carry enough lube, then is it time to use a "lube cookie" to keep the fouling soft? Would I have to melt some spg to coat the boolit nose to have enough lube?

Thanks

[SharpsShooter]

A grease cookie is a fairly common method to solve the inadequate lube capacity of some boolit designs. First off, give it a try as is and see if you get both a good lube star on the muzzle and reasonable fouling control. If you do, you will be fine. If not, then a lube cookie is in order. I make mine simply by lining a pie pan with freezer paper, heat the lube anmd pour to a depth of .200". When it cools, lift it out and peel the paper off. After charging the case and compressing the powder / wad, push the case mouth through the lube cake and apply your top wad. Sometimes air gets trapped under the lube, so be sure your loaded ammo doesn't "grow". Normally that is not a problem, but it does happen.

Or you could just use the right bullet

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r255/SharpsShooter_photos/50cal646gr.jpg


SS

[Bullshop]

Nice boolit that will surely carry enough lube. I have one very much like it having the Luverin type body accept that mine has a Keith style nose. Its goes 635gn in pure lead. It has turned in some amazingly accurate groups. It was a special request from a customer that had been using our boolit in the same design but in 45 cal. When he got a 50/90 he wanted the same boolit. No problem for the on line design at Mt. Molds.
I even size it down to .504" for the Guys shooting the White ML and it has been equally accurate for them.
If your shooting one of the big cases like 50/90 or 50/140 especially with a long barrel there are better lubes than the one you mention. No offence to Mike or Steve but thats the truth. That lube ushered us into the dark ages but there have been other developments since then ours being only one. If you have not yet tried our NASA lube for BP I will offer to send you a sample. I would be happy if you would compair the two and let us know of your results.
You should be able to find some info here if you do a search for Nasa lube with space stuff. Best to try all thats available then decide for yourself if any one is better than another.
BIC/BS

[August]

The trade off between aerodynamic efficiency and carrying enough lube is the nexus of frustration (not to be confused with the axis of evil) in BP shooting.

I shot some PJ Money bullets last year and they were fabulous! However, two shots in a row was a dicey risk in terms of the amount of fouling that results with the tiny lube grooves.

I shot a side match two weeks ago and went ten for ten with no wiping or blowing using a Mathews bore rider that carries a more generous amount of lube. The distance was only 300 yards, however.

So, the issue, for me, has become specific to the situation where the bullet will be used. If I was going to shoot at 1000 yards, I'd start with the Money Bullet and clean the gun after every shot.

But, for cowboy competition, my goal is to make ten shots (on the clock) without patching or blowing -- there is not time for such fiddling.

I'm interested in the new mould being offered by Buffalo Arms that have the NASA nose of the Money design but which also have more standard grease grooves. I'd like to get 500 yard performance and still be able to go ten shots without cleaning.

Still searching after all these years....

[montana_charlie]

But, for cowboy competition, my goal is to make ten shots (on the clock) without patching or blowing -- there is not time for such fiddling.
I got a large charge out inviting two of my neighbors over last spring, to shoot my Sharps 45/90. Both of them were aware I had it, and had expressed interest, but it's tough to find a day when all of us are 'idle' at the same time...and the weather is decent enough for 'newbys' to have a fair chance at success.

The ammo was a bagful of stuff I got from a guy over in Missoula. Financial difficulties made him sell his rifle, and he had no use for the 200 rounds he had on hand.
Having so much, I thought asking the neighbors for 'help' in burning it up was a fine idea.

The target was a disk from a plow which is about twenty inches wide. We shot from 100, 200, and 300 yards...taking turns at each location.

I fired five at a paper target shortly after their arrival, just to make sure the ammunition would shoot well enough to be effective.
While shooting those five, I was blow tubing and everything (just like I was shooting for score) while doing the 'show & tell' on aiming aperture sights, watching the spirit level, and using set triggers.

They ate up the 'shooting skills', but obviously didn't care for the blow tubing idea. You could tell that they were getting the idea that this black powder stuff was entirely too primitive for their serious consideration.

When I turned the rifle over to the first one to fire a couple at the gong, he had the empty out and the next one loaded before I could even find the blow tube.
So, I just let him whack away. We each fired five without wiping or tubing...then moved to 200 yards.

I fired three on paper to adjust the sight, then we all threw five at the gong...and moved back to 300.

At that range (the first time I had tried from there) we discovered the portable bench had to be up in the pickup bed to be high enough to see the gong.
After five to get the sight set, we all shot another sting of five at the steel.

If you go back and count 'em up, you'll find we fired 53 rounds with no blow tubing or wiping.
I think there were only three misses during the whole sequence, and both guys were very impressed at how well a guy can shoot with 'peep sights'.
I was amazed that we never 'fouled out'.

After they left, I ran a wet patch and a dry through the bore, but I was mainly just looking to see if any lead would appear. A few flakes was all that showed.
I had probably fired another ten (without tubing) when my 'other neighbor' came driving by. I invited him to have a try, and he did pretty well after some problems with the low sun (behind us) washing out the front globe. He was so impressed with his performance, he bought a Sharps.

So, about 70 rounds with a single wiping break...and the bore stayed able to shoot 'predictably' even though no 'groups' were examined.

I still have some of that ammo, and (someday) I will break a couple down to see what 'the details' are. I only know the bullet is the 540 grain Paul Jones Creedmoor in 30-1, the lube is SPG, and the powder is 87 grains of Goex Express 2F.
What I don't know is bullet diameter, wad type & thickness, case dimensions, and neck size (as in 'neck tension' amount).

While I always do all the 'fouling control' when I shoot my own loads (so I can't really know how it would work out), somehow I doubt they would prove as 'durable' as this orphan stuff.

CM

[Bullshop]

Forgot to mention that the guy shooting the 50/90 with the big Keith boolit was only shooting 200 yards so the long parilel sides and blunt nose didnt make much differance.
BIC/BS

[Lead pot]

This subject comes up now and then.

With the lube a 4 groove bullet holds you just don't run out of lube.
I cut two long card board tubes carpet comes rolled on and cut it in half and taped it back together I used my 718 grain .50 caliber cast bullet that holds 3.9 grains of my favorite lube and shot it through the tube. Yes the bullet stayed in the tube all the way through [smilie=w:
I cut the tape holding this split tube together and looked at the lube that spun off the bullet and in 23 feet of tube just about all the lube was off with in and stuck on the side wall or laying on the bottom of the tube 14 feet and only found three spots in fresh snow that had some lube. I collected the lube I found on top of the snow and scrapped all off the tube sidewalls and weight this lube and I only lost 6/10 of a grain of that lube and I think what I lost is still on the tube sidewall I couldn't get off or it was out in the snow some place.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
Not that lube on a boolit is alll that expensive.... I figure IF I want to be as economic as possible (beeswax is getting more costly & olive oil has to be bought) I first look for the evidence of lube at the muzzle . A normal Lyman (Ideal) stye boolit always has enough lube. Those Lee styes seem to lack a bit out my 34" cal.45 barrel on my roller so they are shot only with smokeless or in my shorter barreled lever guns .
If there is a healthy lube "star" at the muzzle I lube one groove less (5 boolits) and fire for effect. Most boolits I fire seem to have sufficient lube with just 3 grooves filled... unless it is HOT and a rare low humidity day here in central Illinois area. I tried lubing just two grooves on some and it was just near impossible to see any evidence of lube on the 34"barrel so I stay at 3 grooves lubed for that rifle.
My 38-55's seem to be near the same. My browning has the longest barrel and 3 grooves seen sufficient in the Lyman types.
I guess the experimenting factor is why I enjoy the rifles. No twoare the same and if I pay close attention to the smallest detail long enough I can get some descent accuracy.... far better than I would ever need to chest hit a Buff at 300 yds....

[JSnover]

Lead Pot, what kind of lube was that? Got a picture of the boolit? There was a pretty good thread a while ago about lubes and groove shapes, whether or not they sling it off at the muzzle, etc.

[John Boy]

I shot some PJ Money bullets last year and they were fabulous! However, two shots in a row was a dicey risk in terms of the amount of fouling that results with the tiny lube grooves.
August, the Dan Theodore Mini Groove (aka Money Bullet) IS my 1000yd bullet for accuracy. Due to the thin GG's and being a tapered bullet, I pan lube them with Bullshop's NASA lube and blow tube only. I like the results

[Lead pot]

JS-------The Hollow point on the left. Lube is my hard Deer tallow or mutton tallow lube. Not sure what I used that day.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b302/940Leadpot/IMG_1070.jpg

[chuebner]

I shot a side match two weeks ago and went ten for ten with no wiping or blowing using a Mathews bore rider that carries a more generous amount of lube.

I'm interested in the new mould being offered by Buffalo Arms that have the NASA nose of the Money design but which also have more standard grease grooves. I'd like to get 500 yard performance and still be able to go ten shots without cleaning.


Would you mind posting the mold numbers you have mentioned here? I'm guessing the Matthews bullet is the Lyman 457677.

charlie

[JSnover]

Thanks LP. The cardboard tube test was clever. Gives me a pretty good idea what my lube (modified Emmert's) is doing.
Some mighty nice boolits ya got there.