357 gold dot vs cast for deer

[stillwell]

i am considering hunting deer with 158gr rn cast this year previsly i have been using speer gold dot reloads. but now that i am casting i thought it would be nice to use my cast loads. any body have any thoughts on an alloy or any info on preformance of cast

[Blammer]

I have used 357 caliber gold dots on deer and cast boolits on deer.

They both worked well for me.

If you feel comfortable with your cast boolits, use them for deer, should do just fine.

I used WW alloy air cooled.

The bigger the meplat the better.

[dsmjon]

Shoot it through the heart and/or lungs... or through the head.. and it won't matter. Practice your aim and shoot cast, use the savings to buy a bigger freezer! :D

[stillwell]

i have a lee 358-150-1R 6 cavity mould is there a good way to make some into hollow pionts?

[Beerd]

you might want to look into getting a second mould that casts semi-wadcutters or flat point boolits.
..

[SilverBow]

i have a lee 358-150-1R 6 cavity mould is there a good way to make some into hollow pionts?

What about filing the round nose off to make a meplat? I believe I've read about Paco Kelly doing this. I think the KISS principle applies to a hunting round, so I'd be more inclined to buy an FP mould or do the filing rather than HPing.

[Glen]

I would avoid using round-nosed bullets for hunting. I have had very poor experience with them, they tend to kill very slowly, even on small critters like cotton-tailed rabbits. A good flat-pointed bullet (like the 358156 or the LBT WFN) does a MUCH better job than a RN bullet.

I like to hunt with cast hollow-point bullets, but I have never shot a deer with a .357 cast HP (.41s, .44s, .45s, etc. yes, just not a .357). For HPs, I prefer to shoot behind the shoulder to get into the lungs as quickly as possible, and this has worked quite well for me. For the solid flat-point bullets, I prefer to shoot through the shoulder.

[dsmjon]

This thread reminds me of the movie "My Cousin Vinny" when Marissa's character goes off on Vinny going on the deer hunt... LOL. You think that de-ah is going to give a **** what bullet ripped his head off?? LOL

[Blammer]

you will definitely want a FP or a HP, sorry I'm no help on the HP idea.

I use FP's.

I'd use the gold dot until you can find or make a suitable HP or FP.

The Lee 358-158-RF is a good one, you may want to give a try with.

[MT Gianni]

What about filing the round nose off to make a meplat? I believe I've read about Paco Kelly doing this. I think the KISS principle applies to a hunting round, so I'd be more inclined to buy an FP mould or do the filing rather than HPing.

I bought a trim die for a flat base to use trimming 311413's to a flat point. Accuracy was inconsistent to say the least. I turned the bullet when trimming and filed from 8 directions. I would get a mold and leave pointed boolits pointed IME.

[stillwell]

sounds like i might be sticking with the god dot for now thanks for the help

[Beerd]

How about "bumping" a flat onto those roundnose boolits with the nose punch in his sizing die? Has anyone tried this?
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[Blammer]

That may work.

[thenaaks]

not sure how you feel about tumble lubing, but i've been casting and shooting the lee TL358-158-SWC with great results. the nose is big and flat. loading 5gr of titegroup, hodgdon says it's good for 1108fps.

[stillwell]

i was thinking about puting some in a lathe collet and center drilling them

[KCSO]

Well this probably won't help you much but for expirimenting I use a collet holder in my mill and set a stop on the quill. Then I just drop a bullet in the collet, lock it and drilll it with a center drill. Quick cheap and effective if you don't count the cost of the tools!!!! If it were a 1 or 2 cavity mould it could be altered for a HP pin, I would just pick up a Lee 158 RNFP 2 cavity mould and you would have just what you need. That bulllet from wheel weights will do the deed on deer at about 1800 fps from a rilfe or 1250 from a handgun.

[Larry Gibson]

Forster HP tool for use with the case trimmer works great.

Larry Gibson

[runfiverun]

you might be able to drop a g/c into your mold to flatten the nose. [smilie=1:

[stillwell]

Any thoughts on a 148gr hb wadcutter???

[runfiverun]

flipped around it would act like a soft hollow point but the accuracy/velocity would drop off pretty quick after about 75 yds.

[stillwell]

does anyone have any experance with hbwc laoded backwards. maybe a 30 yd accuracy, usefullness on game??

[45 2.1]

Paco Kelley wrote quite a bit on this, heavy load and works quite well, but no better than othe HP loads. Hard on lighter frame 38 specials.

[DanWalker]

I shot HBWC's loaded over light charges of RED Dot in my 35 whelen. Sounded like a pellet gun and you could see them flying. Once crawled into a prairie dog town with a bunch of those loads, and shot a P' dog in the face with one at about 25 yards. It made a mess.

[Larry Gibson]

does anyone have any experance with hbwc laoded backwards. maybe a 30 yd accuracy, usefullness on game??

Decent accuracy can be had out to about 15 yards with backwards loaded HBWCs. They can not be driven very hard though. I would not consider them the accuracy good for small game. The WC loaded correctly is a very deadly small game load in a .38 and in .35 rifles as Dan mentions.

Larry Gibson

[Larry Gibson]

Paco Kelley wrote quite a bit on this, heavy load and works quite well, but no better than othe HP loads. Hard on lighter frame 38 specials.

+1 on 45 2.1's remarks.

Larry Gibson

[StarMetal]

I think the HBWC as is loaded normal is plenty good enough for small game. Heck, being very soft, loaded backwards, my God!...what would that do to a squirrel? Especially if you wanted to eat some of it.

Joe

[Larry Gibson]

Joe

Most of use who plan on eating the squirrel head shoot them. There's not much worth eatin' there but that's those of use that get "decent" accuracy. I imagine you must spook them and have to take "Texas heart shots" is is why you need the AR and lot's of velocity with long heavy bullets;-)

Larry Gibson

[StarMetal]

Joe

Most of use who plan on eating the squirrel head shoot them. There's not much worth eatin' there but that's those of use that get "decent" accuracy. I imagine you must spook them and have to take "Texas heart shots" is is why you need the AR and lot's of velocity with long heavy bullets;-)

Larry Gibson


Larry,

I remember in OK I was squirrel hunting with my 22 rifle. I thought I'd give the then new Remington Yellow Jackets a try. Hyper-velocity 22 LR. Geesh! Even a head shot hydro shocked them to where they weren't edible.

I was just using that size animal as a reference to a reversed HBWC.

Actually I don't like flinging larger bore rifle cast bullet skyward at squirrel. Interesting...this past week I just started squirrel hunting again with my same old trusty 22 rifle and Federal 22 hollowpoints. Got six in the freezer, going to make some stew.

Joe

[Larry Gibson]

Since I do a bit of squirrel shooting with a .22LR I guess i'll let ya slide with that feeble excuse:-) I have one of Paco Kelly's .22 Accuriser's. It really works as I redo CCI Blazers and put a medium size "nasty nose" on them. Out of my Remington M504 they then shoot every bit as well as Fed and CCI Match, about .6-.7" at 50 yards with 10 shot groups. They really thump squirrels as good as HPs. However, they still aren't as effective as a .32 WC at 800 fps but with a head shot both are deadly. Out of the M30 S&W or out of .30 and .31 cal rifles the Lee TL314-90-SWC or it's commercial twin, the Hornady swaged 90 gr .32 cal bullet, a body shot to rabbits, grouse or squirels damages little meat and is quite deadly. As you mention though the HBWC loaded backwards to 800 fps and used at close range is very destructive on small critters.

Larry Gibson

[StarMetal]

Since I do a bit of squirrel shooting with a .22LR I guess i'll let ya slide with that feeble excuse:-) I have one of Paco Kelly's .22 Accuriser's. It really works as I redo CCI Blazers and put a medium size "nasty nose" on them. Out of my Remington M504 they then shoot every bit as well as Fed and CCI Match, about .6-.7" at 50 yards with 10 shot groups. They really thump squirrels as good as HPs. However, they still aren't as effective as a .32 WC at 800 fps but with a head shot both are deadly. Out of the M30 S&W or out of .30 and .31 cal rifles the Lee TL314-90-SWC or it's commercial twin, the Hornady swaged 90 gr .32 cal bullet, a body shot to rabbits, grouse or squirels damages little meat and is quite deadly. As you mention though the HBWC loaded backwards to 800 fps and used at close range is very destructive on small critters.

Larry Gibson

45 2.1 is trying to talk me into one of those Paco jobs. My 22 rifle is a Remington 541-S custom sporter. Supposedly a sporter match rifle. It does engrave the nose of a 22 LR into the rifling, has tight chamber, and darn good trigger on a 22. It will shoot better then that .5 at 50 yards with economy 22 ammo. You can shoot the staples out of a target at 100 yards easy if you can hold it steady. Of course Bob is holding me to challenge. Basically what I'm saying is this rifle and the regular ammo is more then accurate enough for my squirrel hunting. My son and will sit on the patio sometimes in the fall and shoot walnuts out of trees on a hillside more then 100 yards away. I measured to my fence line and the tree is further so I know the distance is accurate and just not stepped off. This isn't off a bench either. What more of a 22 do I need to hunt squirrels? The best state I've lived in for squirrel hunting is OK. That's where I bought the rifle and particularly to hunt squirrels. I head shot just about everyone of them there.

Joe

[Thumbcocker]

Size "O" buck shot rolled in liquid alox over 3 grns of red dot in .30-30 is a good squirrel load. As a bonus they will not carry as far as a .22 lr. FWIW

[Larry Gibson]

Joe

As close as you are to Camp Perry you should really go shoot HP with your ARs using cast bullets. What a boon it would be to us to have the National Champ, a cast bullet shooter, out shoot all the others with those lousy MKs! You might want to consider a small bore match while your there, with that M541-S and ceap old Wallyworld bulk ammo you could win that also. Wow, staples at 100 yards! As always I am duly impressed;-)

BTW: You should pay attention to 45 2.1 about Paco's .22 Accurizer, they do good things to el cheapo .22LR ammo. Some of us need it but , as usual, you don't.

Larry Gibson