die steel?

[yondering]

What steel would be best to use for a set of swaging dies for .223 bullets from 22LR brass? I'm considering O-1, but don't know if there is another steel that is easier to machine, but also easy to harden? I have some limited capability to do my own heat treating at home, and have done heat treat and temper with 1095 for knifemaking, but don't want to use a steel that requires complicated heat treatment, or high temperatures for more than a few minutes.
I'll be making the dies from 1" (or 7/8" if available) round bar stock.

[Buckshot]

...............I'd certainly think O-1 would be fine, and is probably the least expensive to boot.

............Buckshot

[Houndog]

I use Airdie for the simple reason it heat treats easily, hardly any scaleing in the heat treat process, and it holds it's demensions during heat treatment better than anything else I've tried. O1 will also work as well as some others, but they take a little more work in final finish in my opinion.

[yondering]

Thanks for the replies.

That Airdie steel sounds like good stuff. Where do you get it? A google search didn't turn up anything, does it go by a different name or spelling?

[Red River Rick]

Yondering:

A2 Tool Steel, usually goes by the trade names of, "AIR KOOL", "CHROMOLOY", there are others brand names as well, a very good air hardening tool steel. I make all my tooling and swaging dies out of A2. Alot tougher to work with (carbide tooling works best) but in the end, well worth the effort.

I'm making some dies for my Corbin Hydro-Press right now. I'll try to post some picture before I send everything out for heat treating.

RRR

[bigdog454]

I like W-1, good machinability and easy to harden. W-1 is water hardening similar to O-1, it seems flexiable to the heating part, (I dont like to use the heat treat furnace, every time I want to harden something, it's electric and $$$), I just use a torch then water quench.

[303Guy]

Is stainless steel any good? The stuff I can get bits of is non-magnetic - 304 I think (or maybe 314?)

[1874Sharps]

Gentlemen,

I know who would know the answers to these questions. BOHICA2XO is a tool and die maker and metallurgist. You could PM him and I bet he would be most helpful.

[grumpy one]

If your stainless steel is non-magnetic it means it is austenitic, which means it cannot be hardened by heat-treatment.

[Cheshire Dave]

Grafmo grafitic tool steel. Don't know if the spelling is right but is very easy to machine and to heat treat.

[teddyblu]

graph mo steel also known by 06 steel
this is the steel that ted smith recommended for die making.

[gjemba]

I have been reading the posts from all of you experienced guys and also reading about the various steels on the speciality producer's sites. To heat treat by the manufacturer's specifications sounds very challenging, time consuming and costly.

Is there an easy, satisfactory way to heat treat steel like GraphMO Aire and have it be 'good enough' for sizing dies for jacket resizing? In other words, can I use a torch and heat it and let is cool in teh comfort of my basement?

I bought Lee sizing dies and bored them to what I need for reducing 3/8" pipe, in 3 steps, to 9mm but I want to make dies for my old Herters swaging press and will need to make those from scratch. I may be able to use standard mild steel if I only have low pressure applications such as core forming.

I use CH-4D .357 dies and run the finished produce through my Lee 9mm sizer for the end product.

Thoughts??

Thanks

[bearcove]

Does anyone know a good book on heat treating. I have a knife oven, small heat treat oven, but need a good book on heat treating and tempering. I can heat to 2300 f and program 5 steps.

[bohica2xo]

Gjemba:

"Good enough" can be dangerous with high force applications. Brittle tool steel can send projectiles through soft tissue very well. There is plenty of internet lore about heating by color, etc. - some of it not very safe.

I would use a known steel, something tough with good hardening. O1, W1, D2 A2 - any of that will work. The important step is tempering, but if you have a lead pot, you have what you need. Read the steel manufacturers specs, and set your lead pot for a tempering temperature in the middle of the range. Make sure the lead pot is hot before you start heating the part.

Heat the parts to a temperature high enough for quenching by color. Best to do a trial run on some scrap first. Quench the part, then immediately temper it by immersing it in the lead pot (dry it off first if you water quenched!). It can stay in the lead pot for as long as it needs without worry. an hour per inch of thickness is good. Let it cool after removing it from the lead pot, and you should be ready to finish the part.

To see if you were close on the heating before quench, heat & quench a small test piece. Let it cool & test it with a file before tempering - the file should skid off without cutting (this is hard on files).

Tool steels should be tempered as soon as they are quenched, and a second temper at or above the temperature of the first temper can be done a few days later to improve dimensional stability.


BearCove:

A copy of "Machinerys Handbook" will have all the general heat treating info you should need. Every steel manufacturer provides specfic times & temperatures for the products they offer.

B.

[elk hunter]

Does anyone know a good book on heat treating. I have a knife oven, small heat treat oven, but need a good book on heat treating and tempering. I can heat to 2300 f and program 5 steps.

The best I've seen is "Heat Treatment, Selection, And Application of Tool Steels" by Bill Bryson, published by Modern Machine Shop publications. I think I ordered mine from Brownells.

[bigdog454]

Here's some info on heat treating

http://www7.taosnet.com/ebear/metal/heattreat0.html#case

BD

[gjemba]

Thanks for the input. I found a kiln on ebay that will go to 2300 deg. F. I got it for a reasonable cost. This should be fine for my needs. I looks like it has upper an lower element circuits so I can block off the lower half with fire brick to save having the whole thing running full blast. After your cautions and suggestions, I thougt it would be wise to get better educated.

Thanks again.