A new mould in.323, looking at Lyman 323470

[Griffin]

hi there,
My Lee mould is producing bullets that are rotational asymmetric along the bulletś travelling axis (couldnt find the right words so it became a explanation as i physics...) single cavity doesnt make a lot of bullets either...

The wight of ~170 gr makes the rifle (8x57IS mauser) a dream to shoot and i am looking at a new mould.
i have very good experience with Lyman from a 311291 mould and are thinking of a new Lyman.
how is the Guy Loverin design compared to the traditional 2 grease tracks at the bullet.
Lyman says in the homepage its designed for 8mm mauser which sounds good.
what are your experiences, is there other suggestions among you which is better?
feel free to discuss in the thread ;-)
/Karl

[Maven]

Karl, You don't say what your bore diameter is, and not knowing that, it's hard to recommend a particular bullet mold. The Lyman #323470, for example, is supposed to drop bullets @ .323" using Lyman #2 alloy. Your bore may require something larger: Mine does and the #323470 I had didn't cast large enough to fit it, resulting in only mediocre accuracy. As for the Lee bullet mold, does it cast large enough to fit your rifle 's bore even though it is out of round? If you can size it to fit, you'll remove most of the problem. The other options are to "beagle" the mold (search the archives for this term) or even return it to Lee Precision.

[Griffin]

Karl, You don't say what your bore diameter is, and not knowing that, it's hard to recommend a particular bullet mold. The Lyman #323470, for example, is supposed to drop bullets @ .323" using Lyman #2 alloy. Your bore may require something larger: Mine does and the #323470 I had didn't cast large enough to fit it, resulting in only mediocre accuracy. As for the Lee bullet mold, does it cast large enough to fit your rifle 's bore even though it is out of round? If you can size it to fit, you'll remove most of the problem. The other options are to "beagle" the mold (search the archives for this term) or even return it to Lee Precision.

too a look at the bore yesterday with a friend and we found out that its typical german combination. it is a true IS rifle but has a .321 bore so the bullet has to be .323.
.323 is working at the moment when i size it in the Lee sizer which is .323 (checked that).
the bullet is still not symmetrical after sizing so the mould is not a good one. i have bad experience with Lee warranty so i am looking after a new one. I like to work with good tools so i prefer the "iron moulds".
I prefer not to discuss Lee tools, because i know a lot of people really like theirs and i dont want to step on any toes.
I have looked at the beagle-ing and that might work. but i still would like a new one. so how did the bullets from the mould run?
/Karl

[Maven]

Karl, Since the Lyman mold was too small for my rifle's bore, I sold it several years ago. I purchased the Lee 8 x 57mm mold after reading so many positive responses about it on this site. Out-of-roundness isn't a problem with the one I have, but the short nose section is a bit smaller than it should be. Fortunately that hasn't affected accuracy much. You may want to look at my post, Maven's Day at the Range.... on p. 2 of the Cast Bullets section for more information. Btw, I think I'd send the mold back to Lee along with a few bullets and a letter requesting a replacement: You paid good money for it and there's no reason to accept Lee's shoddy workmanship or poor quality control.

[Blammer]

he's in Sweden, the cost of shipping he may as well buy a new one.

maybe Lee-menting may solve the out of round problem and make it a bit bigger too. May be worth a shot.

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

I actually have a Lyman 323470, but it was made at least 40 years ago (if not more).

I have not cast anything with it myself yet, as it was my Dads', and I chose to put his 8mm rifle up for auction to benefit my Mom rather than taking on yet another caliber.

The Lyman #45 reloading handbook (vintage 1970) indicates that the Lyman 323470 casts a Loverin-design gas-check 165 gr boolit that has a normal cast diameter of 0.321

My Dad left me about 80 cast samples that he'd GC'd, lubed and sized sometime in the 60's or 70's using his Lyman 45 lube/sizer. They all measure 0.323", but they were cast of soft lead, and the Lyman 45 sizer may have mashed them somewhat larger in diameter while the GC's were being crimped in.

The only rifle I have to fire them in is an 1893 Marlin chambered in .32-40, which requires me sizing them down to 0.321", and giving them a flat meplat (flat nose) so that the noses can't poke the primer of the cartridge ahead of them in the tubular magazine, and possibly cause a catastrophe.

[Griffin]

maven, i know that what you are suggesting is the right thing. because i am in sweden they are going to make me work for it, and i will make more money spending the time at work for sure.
Do you perhaps know of more designs that i should take a look at? The 323470 will have visible lube grooves when the bullet is seated. this will work at the range but not in the woods i think.
i have the ambition of huntung with it later on since i like the loads and more forgiving pressures it produces.
SierraWhiskeyMC,
do you have the possibility to drop a few bullets to see the dimensions coming out of it?
/Karl

[Calamity Jake]

"The 323470 will have visible lube grooves when the bullet is seated. this will work at the range but not in the woods i think."

You do not have to fill all the grooves with lube, the area just above the GC and 2-3 grooves is all that is needed and maybe not even that much depending on the quality of your lube.
Expermentation will till.

I have this mold and never fill more than 4 total grooves including above GC.

Take a look at the Saeco 8MM, it's a bore rider about 190 gr

[largom]

I have the Lyman 323470 mold and it drops boolits at .3235 with my alloy. I only lube the bottom 4 lube grooves and this boolit shoots exceptionally well in my Yugo mauser. I also have the Lee mold but have'nt tried it yet simply because the Lyman shoots so good. I plan on taking a deer or 2 with this gun this fall.

Larry

[WILCO]

I prefer not to discuss Lee tools, because i know a lot of people really like theirs and i dont want to step on any toes.

Don't worry Dude, those who like their LEE products won't be swayed by any thought you could type on the subject.
LEE products are just that good!!! :shock: [smilie=s:

[runfiverun]

with a bore size of 321 you could easily use a 32 special old or a 32-40 mold.
i use a 32-40 mold in my 8 mauser with actual 323 bore it's the remington version.
so i actually have a harder time finding molds with a proper sized nose instead of over sized.
however your mold does not have to be oversized to your bbl a "slip fit" boolit will actually shoot as well as an oversized one.
i shoot a 358 in my 358 a 323 in my 323,and a 224 in my 224.for some reason thesy also are some of my more accurate higher velocity rifles too.

[Larry Gibson]

Griffin

I've been using Lyman's Lovern 323470 for numerous years. Mine drops bullets at .325 and that is what I size and lube them at. They just fit the throat of most every M98 I have tried them in. They also are most often a perfect fit in the case neck, throat and leade with the base of the GC at the base of the cartridge neck and the front driving band just engraving the leade. There is little nose to give unwanted obturation at high velocity. I have had excellent accuracy results with this bullet from 1200 fps up through 2400 fps. It is one with which you can push the RPM threshold with in the 8x57.

Larry Gibson

[Griffin]

Dear all,
i have to thank you for all information and views which, as always gives me ideas and thoughts.
The answers have given me the viewpoint that all who have a mould of this type and a 8x57 mauser is very satisfied with it. thats very good. i have been given suggestions of other moulds that needs to be investigated for sure. i will ask around in sweden and see if its possible to buy a lyman here but i wouldnt recon with it.
After your reply:s chances a slim that somebody would like to sell theirs :sad:
thanks a lot!
Karl

[Maven]

Karl, I was able to measure one of the Lee 8mm bullets that I left in the mold after a recent casting session. The nose measures .3145" and the body .3245". My Lee sizing die, which I lapped to .3245" doesn't alter the dimensions at all. As for mold suggestions, while I think very highly of Lyman molds, I am concerned with their dimensions, which are often too small for my rifles. That's true of both the #323470 and #-471 that I had as well as quite a few others, e.g., #311332, #311284, #311644. If you're looking for an accurate bullet that will fit your rifle's bore, take a look at Veral Smith's offerings: www.lbtmolds.com and possibly Jim Allison's Cast Bullet Engineering (Australia): www.castbulletengineering.com

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

(snip)
SierraWhiskeyMC,
do you have the possibility to drop a few bullets to see the dimensions coming out of it?
/Karl
Karl,
Yes, I suppose I could throw a few next time I fire up the pot.
I'm not certain how well that will correlate to what today's Lyman molds will drop, as I've seen other people here mention that Lyman's quality control is not what it used to be.

As I have a rifle that is able to use these boolits, and particularly because the mold was my Dads, I would be very reluctant to part with it.

[leadhead]

Lyman doesn't offer that mold anymore, and if they did,
it would probably be undersize.
Denny

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

OK, I was just out in the boolit room (garage) and discovered a box of Lyman #323470 boolits that my Dad must've cast from wheel weights perhaps 15 to 25 years ago. They were frosty, which indicates he was getting the alloy pretty warm.

The lower bands measured .323" to .324"; the upper bands a bit smaller.

[adrians]

i'm reading this cos i just bid on one on ebay hope i win it now having read your random revues on the mold ,,,hell i might even up my bid just to be on the safe side ,,,oh well time will tell ,,,
have a good night ,,,adrians:castmine:

[Buckshot]

................My 323470 is marked Lyman but is of ealier vintage and drops it's slugs at .325" (Give or take and alloy). It shoots very well from a Turk M88/35, M38, M38/46, a German M88/14 lend-leased to the Turks, and in a 32-40 Scheutzen rifle. They're usually sized in a .325" die for the 8x57's and sent up through a .323" push through die for the 32-40.

You ought see if Mihec can be broke loose from his "Pistol Boolit Mania" to see if he'd cut an 8mm boolit mould. At least he's on the same continent as you :-)

...............Buckshot

[stephen perry]

I also have the 323470 that I use in Turkish Mausers, works fine. I have the LEE offering for .338 works fine too. Shoot more Cast more.

Stephen Perry
Angeles BR

[JeffinNZ]

My old 323470 used to drop at .325 also but given Lyman's current reputation for undersized moulds I would look elsewhere.

[Hang Fire]

I have the Lee C324-175-1R and it throws WW boolits at .325".