Um, I hope I didn't goof up...........

[tjndaltx]

Hi guys,

Although not new to weapons, etc., I am relatively new to reloading although I've been amassing equipment for several years for when I started reloading in earnest.

Well, I'm retired now and I'm really starting the reloading.

I'm reloading right now for the Winchester 308. I"m wondering if I have goofed up.

The maximum length of the brass case is supposed to be 2.015 according to the Lyman book.

Somewhere along the line I failed to measure the cases I'm reloading. I've done about 150 - 175.

I'm now finding out that the cases themselves are longer than the called for maximum length.l

The longest case I've found is 2.030.

I am using 40 grains if IMR 4895 - this is the minimum load in the Lyman book.

These bullets are FMJ, 147 grain.

The cartridges will chamber in my M1A and my Rem 700.

I have used the Lee Factory Crimp Die.

The overall length is less than the maximum called for in the Lyman book.

Am I asking for trouble shooting these cartridges due to the case length being longer than is called for?

Duh......................................

[docone31]

Nah, that length calls for maximum.
You will do fine. That load will also produce for you.
A nice light full power load.

[tjndaltx]

Nah, that length calls for maximum.
You will do fine. That load will also produce for you.
A nice light full power load.

Thanks, Do. I was dreading taking apart almost 200 cartridges.........whew!!!!!

Everything I load right now is minimum loads. Because as an inexperienced reloader I want to minimize everything I can that might lead to a disaster. So I'm TRYING to be extra careful.

[docone31]

No worries.
I spend most of my time on minimum loads. They have proven to be the most accurate in my rifles. When I use MilSurp bullets, I did crimp.
To date, I have almost never trimmed my brass. Some got fairly long, but they seemed to chamber. I did not compete with them though.
I went from MilSurp bullets, to paper patched boolitts in the same results, with the same load. I got better accuracy, shiney bore, and they were cheap! I made em myself.
Hang in there, you will get the touch.

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

That'll depend on your actual chamber dimensions, throat and headspace. Have you made chamber casts of those rifles?

Don't forget that the cases are going to stretch some more the next time they're fired; perhaps 2 to 4 thousands.

Are you using military or commercial brass? If you're using military brass, the case has less volume; you should reduce the load by a couple of grains.

[tjndaltx]

I'm using LC 92 brass.

[largom]

The max. length is a safe number for all guns. Chamber's vary greatly. As long as your loaded rounds chamber easily go ahead and shoot them. Unless you can measure your chamber I would trim the cases before next loading.

Larry

[tjndaltx]

Thanks a lot guys. Appreciate it.

TJ

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

You'll probably be OK on both the neck length and the load, but keep in mind that the Lyman reloading manual loads are for commercial brass, and that your mil-spec LC brass has less interior volume than commercial brass. It's great stuff, as long as you keep the reduced case volume in mind, and compensate by reducing your load.

Watch for pressure signs.

[shotman]

I would try one in the M1 A it may not cycle. I dont have the loads I n front of me but was thinking 45gr.

[tjndaltx]

I appreciate all the replies you guys, however, I'm a little confused.

I understand that LC brass is thicker than commercial.

I'm also concerned whether 40 grains of IMR 4895 will cycle in my M1A.

The confusion? The military uses this brass and it cycles in their weapons - what kind of load do they use to make it cycle?

What do I do if 40 grains of 4895 won't cycle my M1A?

Will 45 grains of 4895 be too much for the LC 92 brass??????????????

Should I use a different powder? If so, which one?

[tjndaltx]

I'm finding that resizing my military brass takes a lot of power on the reloading arm to resize the cases? Much more difficult than commercial. Is this normal?

[BruceB]

If you'll go to the "CB Loads/Military Rifles" forum here at Cast Boolits, you will find a very long thread, stickied at the top of the first page, called "7.62 NATO (.308WCF) in the Springfield Armory M1A".

In that thread, I used an amazing variety of powders and bullets in the M1A, and had excellent success. It's astonishing (at least to me) how tolerant the rifle is, and it has functioned with cast bullets as slow as 1300+ fps.

I think I'm quite safe in saying that 40 grains of 4895 with the 147 FMJ WILL operate the rifle successfully. I'd suggest that you bump that load up a couple of grains the next time you load the cases. A long-time favorite in the 7.62x51 for target-shooting is a 168 Matchking (or similar bullet from other makers) with a charge of 41.0 of 4895, so you're certainly well into the ballpark.

Note that ALL the data in my thread about cast bullets in the M1A is from LC88 cases.

Trim the cases to a uniform length, get a cartridge gauge and check EVERY loaded round in it, and don't bother crimping at all. Just remove whatever flare you apply to the case mouths for seating cast bullets, and you'll be good-to-go.

I've now fired about 4500 rounds of cast bullets through my M1A since buying it new in 2005. Make SURE that the bore has all copper fouling removed before shooting lead through it!

Sooo......ya gonna shoot some cast from that wonderful rifle???

[NVcurmudgeon]

I had the same trouble with alleged to be once-fired military 7.62 NATO brass. IIRC they were LC cases. Case length was within limits, but it took a lot of effort on the press handle to FL size them, obviously they had been fired in a much larger chamber than mine. After the first sizing they behaved like any other cases. I was careful to check for incipient head separations with a bent, sharpened, coat hanger wire and found nothing.

[tjndaltx]

To Bruce and NV,

Thanks a lot for the replies.

That's much needed information.

Yes, I'm going to be shooting cast in it. I've actually never fired the rifle. It's brand new.

I have bought casting equipment and am ready to start casting but am trying to learn reloading first and kind of get a handle on that. I've got several hundred pounds of lead and linotype that I'll be using.

NV, maybe that's the problem with my hard to size brass. Maybe they'll be a lot easier next time.

I much appreciate everything.

TJ

[kopperl]

Sounds like you jumped in to relaoding head first. Well, just keep swimming. It is a wonderful experience.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I have bought casting equipment and am ready to start casting but am trying to learn reloading first and kind of get a handle on that. I've got several hundred pounds of lead and linotype that I'll be using.

Smart thinking and of all the boards on the internet, this is the forum to learn both reloading and casting on. I've been a member of many boards for many years and this is the one I come to when I want my questions answered.

NV, maybe that's the problem with my hard to size brass. Maybe they'll be a lot easier next time.

A good lube will help a lot. I suggest using Imperial Sizing Die Wax. Great stuff, really slick and will help with the milsurp cases a great deal. Use a strong single stage such as the Lee Classic Cast single stage or the RCBS Rock Chucker to do the resizing. Slower, but with a couple plastic bins on either side, you'll be done with the lot soon enough. Once it's done once, it's done and over.



Welcome to the forum btw. You can't go wrong with the suggestions from BruceB or NVCrumudgeon.

Regards,

Dave

[1874Sharps]

TJ,

Welcome to the great world of reloading! There is good advice in the above posts. I would offer a suggestion that after you shoot your loaded ammo, keep the brass shot in the M1A and the Rem. 700 separated, then neck size only when reloading them again. That will likely help out accuracy in both rifles.

Military brass does tend to be on the thick side (Winchester brass tends to be on the thinner side). That means it is a bit more heavy duty on the battlefield, but a bit smaller in volume for the reloader, necessitating care in working up toward a heavy load. It is possible to reach high or excess pressures before reaching a maximum load in a manual.

[BruceB]

"I would offer a suggestion that after you shoot your loaded ammo, keep the brass shot in the M1A and the Rem. 700 separated, then neck size only when reloading them again. "

I'll agree with neck-sizing for the M700, and with keeping the brass segregated for the two rifles.

I most certainly will NOT agree with neck-sizing for the M1A!

For the explanation, go to page three in the long thread about cast in the M1A on the CB loads/Military Rifles forum.

Essentially, it is CRITICAL for your own safety that rounds chamber freely in these rifles. Neck sizing inhibits free chambering and can lead to catastrophic slam fires.

[TAWILDCATT]

do you have reloading manuals.they are a must.
the 308 may have been shot in the MG.I aaume you are lubricating the cases before resizing.also the inside of neck.
I donr that a M1A1 but am working on a garand 30/06 and a garand carbine in 308.I tried Acc 2520 with 31.5 gr and 185 gr lead bullet.in both guns,they both ejected and hit where I aimed.not a very precises process.but work in progress.
the book called for 41 gr max.