Can aluminum sheet be annealed?

[Patrick L]

In the Results area we have been discussing our .30 caliber checkmakers. In a recent thread I posted about some .011 aluminum sheet that wasn't good for checks because it wouldn't form cups, instead the forming punch knocked the bottom out, leaving me with a .30 caliber disk and an aluminum skirt on the punch. It was suggested that the hardness of the metal may be to blame.

Can aluminum be annealed by heating it, probably with a propane torch, and letting it cool slowly?

[HORNET]

Depends on the alloy. For 5052, I've got a spec sheet that says to anneal at 650 F and air cool. You could throw some in the oven when SWMBO isn't home......

[montana_charlie]

I've got a spec sheet that says to anneal at 650 F and air cool. You could throw some in the oven when SWMBO isn't home......
Is there a kitchen oven that will reach 650 degrees without using the self-clean cycle?

Try dipping a small piece in a pot of molten alloy.
CM

[Marlin Hunter]

Some people anneal aluminum over a gas flame. Like a Bunsen burner, kitchem stove, or colman stove. Propane torches are too hot, you need a soft flame.

[HORNET]

It might take the self-clean cycle. Since the alloy wasn't specified, a lower temp might also work. The sheet for 2219 alloy say it anneals at 1000 F. Doesn't hurt to try. You can tell SWMBO that you were cleaning the oven as a favor to her....

[Shiloh]

It might take the self-clean cycle. Since the alloy wasn't specified, a lower temp might also work. The sheet for 2219 alloy say it anneals at 1000 F. Doesn't hurt to try. You can tell SWMBO that you were cleaning the oven as a favor to her....

Yeah Right!!

You don't know my SWMBO!! Like she'd buy that!!

Shiloh

[alamogunr]

I've got a lot of 4 mil (.004") aluminum sheet that was scrap from the plant I retired from. I was going to use it with a free check outfit but they went out of business before I could pull the trigger. I've been meaning to ask Pat Marlin if he has anything it will work with. Back to this thread. This material was specified as half hard. I don't remember the specification for the aluminum but it needed annealing so I put a sample in the oven at 500º for about an hour. I let it cool down in the oven and it came out much softer, relatively speaking, than it went in. I have no idea if it was soft enough for checks. Before I went to extremes, I would try your material at max oven temp, not cleaning temp.

John
W.TN

[qajaq59]

Yeah Right!!

You don't know my SWMBO!! Like she'd buy that!!

Shiloh
Ahhh, do it anyway. You can always learn to shoot with just one arm.:kidding:

[PatMarlin]

Ahhh, do it anyway. You can always learn to shoot with just one arm.:kidding:


Yea but first have the video camera going with a feed to Youtube so we can watch ...:mrgreen:

[beagle]

From my experience in the aircraft modification business, all aluminum sheets can be obtained in 0 grade of temper. In the trade, it's refered to as T0 which is really incorrect but that's what it's called.

The thinner stuff is fairly cheap in 4 X 8 or 5 X12 foot sheets.

I also recall that roof flashing is untempered as well.

One material that we used that I thought of was berryllium which is a copper alloy of some kind and looks like the material commercial checks is made from. It's obtainable in thin strips on rolls and is used for bonding jumpers between electrical components. Maybe some of you engineers can tell us what alloy it is and teh possible suitability for GCs.

But, I know, these sources involve that bad word that casters don't want to hear.."buy". I'm kind of frugal myself./beagle

[Firebird]

Beryllium copper is used where you need a conductive spring, things like fuse holders and connectors that hold onto terminals. It is the hardest copper alloy I know of, much harder than brass and also harder than bronze. Not sure it would make a good gas check or not as it may be difficult to get it formed properly, springing back into it's original shape is what this alloy is meant to do.

[Patrick L]

Thanks guys, I'll give it a try.

BTW, what exactly is SWMBO? (I mean I know it's the wife, but what exactly do the letters stand for?)

[wiljen]

She Who Must Be Obeyed (originally from the 1887 Novel "She" but more commonly attributed to the British comedy Rumpole of the Bailey)

[Patrick L]

Oh, got it!

[Patrick L]

Alamogunr,

I've been using .004 soda can aluminum to make gaschecks with my Checkmaker. So far they have worked great for the .30-30, but I need something heavier/thicker for the '06.

[BeeMan]

Beyond the forming issues with beryllium copper, I'd personally stay clear of it for health reasons. Beryllium is listed as a category 1 carcinogen. The risk is probably remote since we understand how to safely handle heavy metals, but when more suitable check making materials are available, why mess with it?

BeeMan

[Firebird]

Uhh, beryllium isn't a heavy metal, it's the second lightest metal (lithium's lighter, but bursts into flame on contact with air). It is dangerous to be around, the guys that machined parts out of it for nuclear warheads used all kinds of protections (isolation suits and breathing gear) and many still had their lungs destroyed. I don't think it's used in any other industry as it is so dangerous to machine. The metal forms tiny slivers as it is cut away from the parent stock, which float into your lungs and cause cancers etc similar to what asbestos does, just much faster and with much less exposure.
Alloyed in small percentages with copper it gives the copper strength and hardness, and the copper encapsulates the beryllium so it can't get free and into your lungs. A lot of electrical boxes, like the ones in your cars and homes, use copper beryllium for the contacts, and it's perfectly safe.

[StarMetal]

I don't think I want to handle beryllium much:

Beryllium is not an element that is crucial for humans; in fact it is one of the most toxic chemicals we know. It is a metal that can be very harmful when humans breathe it in, because it can damage the lungs and cause pneumonia.

The most commonly known effect of beryllium is called berylliosis, a dangerous and persistent lung disorder that can also damage other organs, such as the heart. In about 20% of all cases people die of this disease. Breathing in beryllium in the workplace is what causes berylliosis. People that have weakened immune systems are most susceptible to this disease.

Beryllium can also cause allergic reactions with people that are hypersensitive to this chemical. These reactions can be very heavy and they can even cause a person to be seriously ill, a condition known as Chronic Beryllium Disease (CBD). The symptoms are weakness, tiredness and breathing problems. Some people that suffer from CBD will develop anorexia and blueness of hands and feet. Sometimes people can even be in such a serious condition that CBD can cause their death.

Next to causing berylliosis and CBD, beryllium can also increase the chances of cancer development and DNA damage.

[Treeman]

Patrick, FWIW. I don't have the Checkmaker dies but I do have a Freechex II. My dies punch the bottom out of the cup if I try to cut material .001 too thick. If I back off on material thickness everything works perfectly. If you feel you must use .011 then I think your answer may be to lap the die to get the clearance needed.(What happens with my die is that when material is too thick it wedges against the sides of the die and the punch, if forced, then punches the bottom of the cup out.

[PatMarlin]

Patrick, FWIW. I don't have the Checkmaker dies but I do have a Freechex II. My dies punch the bottom out of the cup if I try to cut material .001 too thick. If I back off on material thickness everything works perfectly. If you feel you must use .011 then I think your answer may be to lap the die to get the clearance needed.(What happens with my die is that when material is too thick it wedges against the sides of the die and the punch, if forced, then punches the bottom of the cup out.


***Warning Warning Will Robinson*** (sirens going off here and the robot is flexing his arms ...:mrgreen:) DON'T lap that die! It will fully handle thicker material, just that yours is too hard. THIS is a total different die than the Freechex II.

-mean no disrespect Treeman ...:drinks:

[PatMarlin]

Patrick annealed his .011 AL and the stellar results can be found here:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=51605&page=4

[Treeman]

Absolutely no offense taken.-You know the dimensions and design of your product. Pardon my irrelevant opining.

[PatMarlin]

Well- normally it would be a good opinion. I just wanted to make sure no one lapped theirs needlessly, then I would have to send them another one... :mrgreen:

[Clark Savage Jr]

When I want to bend Aluminum, I always soften it first. Using an Oxyacetlyene torch, turn the O2 off and "smoke" the Aluminum. Then, either turn the O2 back on or if the sheet is real thin like soda can stock, use a Propane torch to heat it just enough to burn off the soot. Let it air cool.

If you haven't melted it into a puddle, it will be as soft as it can get considering the alloy.