Tell me about your 25-20 Win

[Marvin S]

Im in the market for one these and was wanting to hear the good and bad from people who own them. Figure most of them are levers but would consider all types. I really like the Marlin 27 or the Remington 25 but they are hard to find so will probably end up with a Win 92.

[35remington]

After a bad experience with a TC Custom Shop carbine length barrel, I found improvement by throating the barrel (T/C's throating is......horrid) but ultimately went to a custom OTT barrel with a much more cast friendly throat.

The RCBS 85 FN shoots better with the lube grooves NOT filled. The Lyman 257420 does better cast hard at 2000 fps. The RCBS is my go to small game bullet at 1300 fps or so, but shotgun powders work fine at 1100 fps.

Most levergun throats are an uphill pull with cast. Good luck with that.

The Speer 75 FN jacketed does well in most rifles, and the Hornady 60 jacketed seems to like the short throated ones.

A finer small game caliber cannot be found.

[TonyT]

Quite a few years ago I purchased a nice example of a Remington 27 and an original Marlin Model 94 in 25-20. The bad news was that the bores were rusated out but the exteriors were excellent ++. I had both relined and then have forgot to shoot them. I'll add that to my list of to-do's.

[405]

Have two 25-20s in Win 92s. One a saddle ring carbine and the other a rifle. Most old ones were blackpowder, corrosive primer types so bore condition is everything when looking at them! Shooting cast out of the little 25 caliber, like all small bore/ bare bullet shooting, is a crapshoot. Both of my 25-20s do very well at 50 yards with the 86 gr Rem JSPFN.... the Jbullet that seems especially well suited to the 25-20.

Shooting cast is a real pain. That little bullet has so little mass/inertia I think that the slightest bore or bullet flaw is amplified.... greatly! In turn if everthing is not exactly right accuracy goes south quickly. I also found that leading was problematic, even with correct bullet fit and the excellent condition of the bores in my guns.

So, still my preference for the 25-20 would be the Win 92. I view it as a 50 yard varmint cartridge, but still a lot of fun to shoot. The 86 gr Rem Jbullet seems perfect for the 25-20 while the cast bullets require a lot of attention to detail for good accuracy.

[NoDakJak]

I have been shooting the 25-20 for almost sixty years and it has been one of my long time favorites. I presently own and shoot six rifles chambered for it. A Model 23 Savage, a Model 27 Marlin, two Model 25 Remingtons, one a rifle and the other is the rare carbine, a Model 1894 Marlin that was manufactured about twenty years ago and a lightweight Sportco Martini. The Savage is the most accurate and as it is scoped is used the most for hunting. The Model 27 Marlin is my favorite for woods rambling as it is smooth handling and the exposed hammer works well for quick shots as I am left handed. My favorite rifle for backpacking is the Model 25 Remington. Its short barrel and feathery weight makes it ideal for that purpose.
I no longer own a 92 Winchester. They are now priced out of my reach. Even junkers! It is a shame that Rossi doesn't build one on their 92 clone. Perhaps I have just been unlucky but every 92 that was chambered for the 25-20 that I have owned or shot exhibited excess headspace with the primer backing out. A couple also had oversized firing pin holes and these produced some very interesting looking primers after firing. It is a fairly simple matter to bush the firing pin holes but the headspace is another matter. This is evidently not uncommon as I have seen it mentioned in print several times over the years. One gunwriter even went so far as to have the rear of the sliding locks built up with chrome so as to reduce headspace. After all these years I cannot remember for sure who that was but it may have been John Wooters. I still want another 92 however. Preferably a rifle rather than carbine.
I began casting for the 25-20 about thirty years ago and have always preffered 257312. I have shot umpty thousands of cast boolits through them and must admit that accuracy has been lackluster at best although adequate for hunting and plinking. I have shot several thousand of the Remington 86 grain J-bullets and several hundred of the 75 grain Speer slugs. I have noticed no big difference in accuracy between the two in my rifles so mostly shoot the Remingtons based on cost.
The owner of Rocky Mountain Cartridges has a Ballard match rifle that he built for competion shooting. He breech seats the boolit and shoots groups that puts many varmint rifles to shame. Neil

[Bret4207]

Have 2 Savage 23's, want a pump bad. Great field and woods gun, easy on powder and lead, low noise, no recoil, accurate.....what's not to love?

[jlchucker]

Many years ago, my Dad came home from work with a Savage 23 and two boxes of ammo. It had previously belonged to a minister, who had taken several deer with it, but had passed away and the rifle was raffled off. Dad bought a ticket and won. We 4 brothers all hunted deer with it, getting several. It's still in the family. Much more recently, my brother Art, in the course of his wanderings, stopped at a store/gunshop off the beaten path, scouting for buys on a Model 94. The dealer didn't have any, but said he had a Model 92. Art looked this saddle-ring carbine over (25-20) and saw that it had been well kept but fired little over the years. Art bought it at a real bargain. He's shot a few cast bullets through it, but after going on some gun auction websites and seeing what much worse 25-20's are going for, he now doesn't dare shoot this pristine piece.

[6pt-sika]

I "had" a nice old Winchester 1892 in 25-20 with a button mag and half octagon barrel . But like a fool I traded it off when Kimber came out with the Model 82 back in the early 80's .

About 5 years ago I got my second 25-20 which was a Marlin 1894CL of late 80's vintage . I have since sold that one . But before I sold it I had acquired a nice old Marlin 1894 in 25-20 od 1902 vintage .

Didn't shoot the winchester a whole lot , but the 1894CL and my present "original" Marlin 1894 shoot very nicely !

[atr]

I have a savage bolt action model 25B...in 25-20.....
really a nice cartridge ...easy to shoot and reload.....at 75 yards I can put 10 rounds in a circle about the size of a silver dollar
I prefer the bolt action as you can handload the rounds a little "hotter" than you can with the lever actions.

[beemer]

I have a Savage 23 bolt action in 25-20, it has an old Weaver K4 on it. I really like the rifle and so does everyone who shoots it. My rifle likes the Lyman 257312, it doesn't seem to matter if I use a GC on it or not. It will shoot about 2 in. at 100 yds.

I think the little thing can be a bit sensitive to variations in loads but it can be worked out. When working up loads only change the charge a couple tenths at the time or you can miss the sweet spot.

As I get older it seems I am moving toward smaller guns, they are cheeper to shoot and don't have all the flash and bang.

beemer

[runfiverun]

i have the win version.
it does fine with either j words up to 86 grs or down to 60 grs.
i use a p/b rapine mold for ,it weighs about 72 grs before i swirl lube jpw and b-wax on them.
the faster i went the better it done. i ened up with a regular j-word type [cast] load that shoots the daylight outta clay targets at 100 yds,and beyond.
can't really ask for any better,no sizing no g/c's and shoots well.
just wish they would make repro's of this size carbine again in the usual suspects.

[Marvin S]

Good thoughts guys, I have four 32-20s a 92 Win MFG 1899 with a liner and a Marlin 27s and two revolvers. Thought I would like to try the 25-20 also. NoDakJak how does the 1894CL Marlin shoot? This seems to be about the only one that is half way reasonable priced. Are they micro groove or Ballard type rifling.

[Ramslammer]

G'Day
I have a Marlin 1894cl in 25/20 and also one in 32/20. The 25/20 with a RCBS 85gr lubed with white label 2700+, 11grns IMR4198 and a small pistol primer, shoots fine for CLAS pistol cartridge. I'm intending to try the Lyman 65grn bullet for shooting Wallaby in the near future, so hope fully they'll group OK @ 2000fps.
Juddy

[Four Fingers of Death]

I have a 92 Winchester with 20" Bbl and full length mag tube (rare in Australia, most are half mags like my 32/20). It has that nattly mag tube hanger that is dovetailed into the barrel like the 1873s, nice touch. It has been refinished and I think the Bbl has been replaced (I'm not home, so I can't check).

20 Mins after I bought it I found one my friend owned (he had a stroke recently) for sale, it had a Lyman peep. Don't you just hate that? When I get home I will see if it is still available and cobble up one rifle from the two.

[Bob in Revelstoke]

I have two Winchester model 92's. Serial numbers indicate one made in 1909, the other 1912. They are well worn but look very good. The bores on both look like factory chimneys with half the bricks missing, probably due to corrosive primers. However, both are very accurate with j- bullets. I have a Winchester single cavity bullet mould, nut cracker type. The '09 likes them but the '12 doesn't and they keyhole badly. Even so, both rifles have great sentimental value and I won't be parting with them.

[rbuck351]

I have a 92 and a savage 23. both shoot the lyman 65gr gc plenty good for plinking or hunting although accuracy goes away at about 2000fps. Neither one likes the hornady 60gr and I have yet to try the 86gr jacketed. The win 92 is one of my favorite fun guns. I cast the boolits,make gcs from aluminum and a friend gave me 24lbs of H116 which is about like win680. I can shoot my 25/20s for less than 22lr ammo costs. I also wish they would chamber the 92 puma in 25/20. Any way, I really like the 25/20. I think Rossi would do well reintroducing the 25/20, 32/20 and the 218Bee and for that matter how about the 256Win

[jlchucker]

Good thoughts guys, I have four 32-20s a 92 Win MFG 1899 with a liner and a Marlin 27s and two revolvers. Thought I would like to try the 25-20 also. NoDakJak how does the 1894CL Marlin shoot? This seems to be about the only one that is half way reasonable priced. Are they micro groove or Ballard type rifling.

I had one of those 1894 CL Marlins. A fun gun, except that mine shot so high that I needed to put a ramp on it in order to raise the front sight. I soured a little on Marlins after that, but eventually got over it. Nearly every Marlin levergun that I ever bought new required front sight replacement before printing on target. Once you get past that point, and slenderize the forearm, they are excellent rifles.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I forgot to mention there was a new in box 25/20 Marlin 1894 at a shop interstate that I deal with. They wanted $AU1150 which was about $200 below new price. Boy I arm wrestled with myself over that trying to fight the urge and eventually common sense prevailed. In all likelhood the 25/20 probably wont do anything a 22Mag can't do as good or better, apart from giving you some nostalgia jollies.

[Char-Gar]

I have not been without a 25-20 since 1961. Today I have a Winchester 92 levergun and a Remington 25 pumpgun in that caliber. Both wear receiver/peep sights.

Years ago I read an article by John Wooters entitled "Eulogy For A Cartridge" which was about the 25-20. His load was Lyman 257312/9/4227. The bullet is a flat nose 85 grain gas check design. I have a four hole Lyman mold for this bullet.

I have used nothing but Wooter's old load for 30 years with complete satisfaction. I cast these bullets out of linotype to get well filled out bullet in this small caliber. I am guessing the velocity is around 1.6K or so with this load. I have killed all manner of pests, and small game up to coyotes and javalina with nary a problem.

The Winchester is a little better shooter (2 MOA) than the Remington (2.5 MOA), but in the field, you can't tell them apart in terms of practical accuracy.

The little 25-20 WCF is a crackerjack round, overlooked and unappreciated by most shooters these days. It is still just as good and useful as it was one hundred years ago.

[Marvin S]

Thanks for the educated opinions guys, the search is on for the 25-20.

[ronbo]

Had a Marlin 27 pump that looked great on the outside but had a bad bore so a friend bought it and had the original barrel relined and its a shooter. Have a super clean Remington 25 pump with a like new bore and shoot cast bullets in it no leading with hard cast. I bought both of these some years back when they were still cheap.

[35remington]

"In all likelhood the 25/20 probably wont do anything a 22Mag can't do as good or better, apart from giving you some nostalgia jollies."

Four Fingers, I'm really, really going to have to take issue with you for that.

There's no comparison. After using it for many years on a variety of small game and varmints, the 25-20 has around 3X the killing power of the 22 magnum, and with appropriate loads on coyotes and such there's absolutely, positively no comparison.

You may take the word of a guy who's been hunting with both for quite awhile now, and is fond of the 22 magnum as well. That doesn't make the 22 magnum any less useful, but my comments are to set the record straight, from a guy who's BTDT.

[NoDakJak]

I had high hopes for the new Marlin 1894 but alas it didn't shoot any better than the older rifles. One of these days I will get that crappy Marlin trigger upgraded and the barrel throated and I expect much greater things from it. My finest shooting cast boolit rifle at the moment is a Sako 579 with a Douglas Supreme barrel with a 1 in 10 twist. Wlith 257312 it shoots groups a third the size of my 25-20s at the same velocity. That should make a superb squirrel rifle but actually my 25.20s are plenty accurate for small game hunting.
I recently wrote an article that states that the 25.20 is the ideal subslstence cartridge. I spent six months as a subsistence hunter during the mid sixties. It is certainly not an easy life. When you are weak and shakey from hunger and the cold it makes pinpoint accuracy pretty iffy. Many times marginal shots with a 22lr would have left me hungry but the greater effecitiveness of the 25.20 anchored the animal. When the 25.20 was originated most hunters were subsistence hunters and it was aimed at this segment of society. As I stated previously it may be a bit much for Cottontail and a bit weak for Deer but it suffices in the hands of a good shot and there is an amazing amount of edible game in between. Durig the 1960/61 period I spent some time in southwestern arizona where the oldtimers considered it a favored round for Javelina and the small desert deer. In the late seventies and eighties I lived in Western South Dakota where it was considered to be the ideal Turkey cartridge while the Beaver hunters along the Missouri favored it for Beaver hunting. It is not my ideal idea of a deerr cartridge ut a friend at last count had taken 21 western Blacktail deer with one shot each. He is a rancher however and can pick and choose his shots. I have shot hundreds of Jackrabbits with this round with no problems. The largest thing that I have shot with it was a sheep killer dog that turned out to be the Game Wardens prize Coonhound. I like this cartridge! Neil

[Four Fingers of Death]

"In all likelhood the 25/20 probably wont do anything a 22Mag can't do as good or better, apart from giving you some nostalgia jollies."

Four Fingers, I'm really, really going to have to take issue with you for that.

There's no comparison. After using it for many years on a variety of small game and varmints, the 25-20 has around 3X the killing power of the 22 magnum, and with appropriate loads on coyotes and such there's absolutely, positively no comparison.

You may take the word of a guy who's been hunting with both for quite awhile now, and is fond of the 22 magnum as well. That doesn't make the 22 magnum any less useful, but my comments are to set the record straight, from a guy who's BTDT.

I was just really thinking out loud, I have had no experience with the 22Mag (I have one now, I'll have to give it a run, but when I hunt, I generally prefer to be using my handloads, if I got to hunt every other day, I'd probably use the rimfires more), but thought that maybe it would be close. Giving a bit more thought to the issue (never amiss), twice the bullet weight has got to tell on the target end.

Thanks for setting us straight. Now, I gotta get that Sako out in the paddock!

[Dale53]

I bought one of the Marlin 94CL's as soon as they hit the market. I bought a Lyman 257420 GC mould and also 500 jacketed bullets. I started with the cast bullet. I couldn't get the dern thing to shoot to my satisfaction until I had shot 500 rounds (by actual count). Suddenly, the gun started to shoot and has been doing well ever since. I never did shoot the jacketed bullets...

I ended up working up three load levels:

Small game load (a SUPERIOR small game load) is 4.0 grs of Unique under the 457420 bullet. It does fantastic on squirrels and rabbits. In the head or through the slats they are DRN (Dead Right Now). The "stopping" power is far superior to the .22 rimfire and yet doesn't tear up the meat like a .22 hollow point does.

Mid-Range load: is 11.0 grs of RL-7. I have not chronographed this but it is considerably milder than my "High Speed" load.

High Speed load: This is 14.5 grs of RL-7. It is a compressed load but gives just under 2200 fps in the Marlin. This is equivalent to the original factory high speed load. After working with this a bit, I loaded five cases and fired them 20 times in a row (reloading at the range. The primers were still tight in the pockets with NO signs of pressure after each was shot 20 times with this load. NOTE: This load is NOT to be used in weaker actioned rifles.

The accuracy level of all three of these loads is 10 ring accuracy on the 50 yards small bore target at 50 yards. The "X" count is not high but this is NOT a target rifle but an EXCELLENT small game and varmint rifle (I never shot anything past 100 yards with it but within it's range it was a "sure thing").

Some years ago, my home gun club held lever action matches. No limit of caliber - "use what you brung". We shot from 25, 50, 75, and 100 yards. Some targets were animal targets, some bullseye targets, and some were slow fire and some were rapid fire (to mimic a charging bear - hey, it was FUN!). We had a good turn out and all kinds of lever guns including .22 Zippers, .30/30's and pistol caliber rifles. I shot in 24 matches. My little 25/20 won every match and with cast bullets (most used jacketed bullets both factory and reloads). It WAS satisfying...[smilie=w:

So, you might say I have a great affection for the Marlin AND the 25/50 caliber. It's just a wonderful caliber for the woods bum (me:mrgreen:).

Dale53

[Wayne Smith]

Dale, 457420 in a 25-50?? You must be using very soft lead and sizing a lot! What does your throat look like!!

[Dale53]

Wayne;
That's what I get for signing on so late in the night time. Of course, the correct Lyman mould # is 257420. I have corrected the post.

Thanks for "yanking my chain":mrgreen:

Incidentally, I have been casting those bullets out of linotype. I have several hundred pounds of it, and it works extremely well with .25 and .22 caliber bullets. I just tried to see what would happen. GOOD things happened.

Now, linotype is NOT necessary for this use but driving these bullets at nearly 2200 fps DOES require hard bullets, properly sized (I size at .258").

All in all, my 25/20 experience has been nothing but positive after those first 500 rounds went through my rifle.

Dale53

[Newtire]

I'm only bring this up since I don't have a .25-20 but another .25 to consider is the .256 Winchester Mag in a Marlin 62. Gotta make your own cases but it's easier than most say and you have a bit more than a 25-20 except for the nostalgia part. If I ever see a .25-20 pass under my nose, I will probably sucker in & jump on it. I only have 3-.25's after all.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I only have 3-.25's after all.

It's funny how we seem to get a lot of the same calibres that appeal to us, I seem to have gathered a lot of 22s, 30cals and 44s.

22LR x 5 (as well as a few others which need a bit of something or other to make them good)
22 Hornet
222 Rem x 2
223
22/250 x 2
220 Swift

30/30 x 4
308 x 6
3006 x 5
300WM x 2

44/40 x 6
44 Special x 2
44Mag x 4
444 Marlin

I have guns in other cals, but I really like the above calibres. Everybody is different and they like different things.

[Newtire]

I have guns in other cals, but I really like the above calibres. Everybody is different and they like different things.

If you have a mould (or 10 or 20) already in that caliber, it just makes good sense to keep on buying the guns that the Great Spirit puts in front of us...

[Catshooter]

Excellent posting here gentlemen. I just lucked into the prettiest Savage 23 in .25-20, so I'm paying close attention!

NoDakJak,

Would you/could you hook us up with your article on sustinence hunting? I would love to read it.

[NoDakJak]

Catshooter The article is on the way by Snail Mail as I can't transmit the article. Neil

[Marvin S]

Old/New 25-20 should be on the way. Another Marlin 27S that is supposed to be in excellent condition. Can hardly wait.

[Newtire]

I was just really thinking twice the bullet weight has got to tell on the target end.


I have a friend who goes to South Dakota about once a year on a Prairie Dog "Safari" week. He says that they take along his Marlin .25-20 for the occasional dog along the road. From what he says, it really flings them with that 60 grain J-bullet that Hornady makes.

I imagine the 70(+) grain little Lyman boolit with that big flat nose ought to send out some serious shock.

[Four Fingers of Death]

If you have a mould (or 10 or 20) already in that caliber, it just makes good sense to keep on buying the guns that the Great Spirit puts in front of us...

Good sense? Yep, I bought a pack of 1000 375 gas checks that were way cheap once because I always fancied a 375H&H. Now that I had the checks I kept my eyes opened looking for rifles and moulds. Picked up a mould, found some cheap commercial cast , bought them as well.

About a year later I found a rifle :) Now the money I saved on those gas checks really is starting to make sense. :D well thats my story and I'm sticking to it. Sold the 375Big Bore recently, I'll have to get a 375H&H, be a shame to waste the checks, moulds (there are several now) and boolits, etc. Got a spare 30/30 Marlin, maybe a re-barrel to 38/55 is in order.

heck. I'm glad I'm saving so much money! :(