Shooting Lead and Copper

[Frank]

Is it bad to shoot lead over copper? And what about copper over lead? I understand some suggest shooting copper to "get the lead out". But seems to me doing that would scratch the bore.

[docone31]

Both lead, and copper are softer than steel.
I have many times, fired jacketed rounds after a firing sequence. I do that to clean the bore of large lead particles if any.
If you have a large copper deposit, lead will implant itself over the copper. It is not a plateing, it is more of a planishing. If you have lots of lead, and fire copper, lead being softer than copper will be removed to a certain extent.
There is no substitute for thorough cleaning of the bore before cross contaminating.
To really get a polish in the bore, try paper patching! Shine, shine, shine! Shoots like crap untill everything is out though.

[AZ-Stew]

Frank,

I have seen a revolver barrel (S&W M28, 6"bbl, .357 Mag.) bulged by someone trying to shoot the leading out using a jacketed load. Here's how it occurred:

A new reloader, acting on the advice of "friends", purchased a box of Speer swaged 158gr SWC bullets to do a little "cheap shooting". These bullets, unlike cast WW bullets, are almost pure lead and are VERY soft. They are also covered with a thin layer of a waxy lube. They work fine for "plinker" loads, up to about 800fps or so, and are quite accurate. They are not intended for magnum loads. The new reloader loaded these bullets to full-power level, using the same load he had been using for jacketed bullets.

At this velocity, the soft lead swaged bullets could not grip the rifling in the barrel and were essentially "squirted" through the bore, with the rifling scraping off lead as each bullet passed. When the accuracy had deteriorated to a level where it became obvious something was wrong, our new reloader inspected the revlover and found its barrel heavily leaded. I don't remember whether it was the same or another group of "friends" that urged him to "just shoot out the leading with some jacketed rounds", but he promptly did.

The bulge in the barrel began just in front of the frame. I've seen worse, but it still required a barrel replacement.

Cast bullets using Wheel Weight alloy or something harder typically don't cause this kind of problem. First, they're 2+ times harder than swaged, pure lead bullets. Second, cast bullets typically carry much more of more effective lubricants than swaged bullets. In handguns, this allows them to be driven twice as fast in magnum loadings with little or no leading.

If:

> you cast your bullets from a reasonably hard alloy (WW or harder)

> you've used a good commercial lube, or one of the exotic lube creations concocted by certain members of this board

> you've made sure you're using well-cast plain-based bullets with completely filled-out bases or are using a gas check design with a check

> you are keeping your velocities within reasonable levels

> you are starting with a clean, copper-free barrel then you shouldn't see any leading in your barrel even after firing hundreds of rounds.

If you use a softer alloy or one of the commercial swaged bullets, just keep the velocity down and you should get the same, leading-free results.

In any event, if you have barrel leading, don't try to take a shortcut to clean it out by firing jacketed bullets through a heavily leaded bore. There are other methods of cleaning the barrel that won't require a barrel replacement.

Regards,

Stew

[Frank]

Docone says
lead will implant itself over the copper

AZ-Stew says
you are starting with a clean, copper-free barrel then you shouldn't see any leading in your barrel even after firing hundreds of rounds.


I get it. Firing lead over copper causes leading.

[jonk]

Not necissarily. Shooting lead over heavy copper fouling causes leading. Shooting light lead loads over a barrel that had a few jacketed rounds down the tube, no issue.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I had just gotten a SMLE No4 Mk1 sporter along with a bucketfull of surplus corrosive Jword rounds. I fired off some of the surplus rounds and I was please with the accuracy but not a heavy recoil and muzzle blast.

It then fired off some hand cast lead boolits and the more I shot the worse it got.
Finally when I could not find the paper at 50 yds I stopped.

I have never seen such leading in my life. I plugged the barrel and filled it with Kroil and let it sit overnight. It took me another 30 mins of scrubbing and brushing to get the barrel clean the next day.

Now I am PP my rounds to .314 and I am getting MOA accuracy at 50 yds with reduced recoil and it sounds like a .22.

[pdawg_shooter]

Paper patching WORKS! Why fight leading, low velocity and so so accuracy when it is so easy to get what you want with a little scrap of paper!

[Frank]

Crash Corrigan says
I had just gotten a SMLE No4 Mk1 sporter along with a bucketfull of surplus corrosive Jword rounds. I fired off some of the surplus rounds and I was please with the accuracy but not a heavy recoil and muzzle blast.

It then fired off some hand cast lead boolits and the more I shot the worse it got.
Finally when I could not find the paper at 50 yds I stopped

There you go. I wonder how many people try cast bullets and give up after seeing all that leading. How many bores are out there that have lead embedded in copper.