RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme..my .02 cents

[Newfoundlander2]

Having watched the whole hoop-de-doop over the RCBS IV since its inception a few years back like many I resloved never to purchase one due to the company's outsourcing primary manufacture. There was nothing wrong with the "old" Rock Chucker and most of us would gladly pay more for a "domesticly" (I am Candian) produced item.

All that being said I'm now the owner of a new RC IV that was given to me by a friend who picked it up at a local estate auction. After mounting the press to my bench I ran a few tests and found my specimen did not suffer from some of the out-of-the-box maladies others have noted. First off the ram's runout was very tight as was the toggle block. The handle did not feel mushy or torque under load and the primer catcher nabbed all 200 plus primers and can be left in place when not being used. The priming arm is indeed an afterthought and a retrograde. The added working area is a nice feature as are the toggle stops. The paint job is nice and dead tough. RCBS ballyhoos the ambidextrous handle but it should be considered a standard feature in todays market rather than a selling point.

In short my press was tight, well finished and has some nice features. That being said it's not worth the $130.00-$140.00 price tag even with RCBS's legendary warranty and customer service figured into the equation. Although it's been asked many times before why did RCBS go this route when Lee can make a better product in domesticly and sell for for far less than the RC IV ?

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

The short answer: Greed

Regards,

Dave

[Newfoundlander2]

A rich man will sell you the rope he's to be hanged with.

[Rockchucker]

The Supreme isn't my only press, but it is one of my favorites. It's one solid press that you can do anything on and a warranty you can't beat.

[cajun shooter]

The RCBS Rockchucker is and was a fine press. You have to go back to when it was first put on the market to understand it. When introduced it was the best thing offered by far. It has lived into another era. I have one now and always will but the Lee Classic turret for the same price is a no brain er. Check and see how the Lee looks after it has been out 50 years. Although a great press it might have to take a back seat to what is available. And yes I think it's overpriced in today's market with greed kicking in.

[Rockchucker]

You have to go back to when it was first put on the market to understand it

I can't go back back that far, but I can 25 years ago when when I bought my first Rockchucker, I didn't notice anything superior over the ones built today. Personally I think improvements have been made over the years, like a bigger opening so you have more room. Switching from left hand to right operation. Those are just a few. Longer handle. Where's the problem. Yes they are expensive but so is everything else in todays market. You're gonna pay for what it get. I don't think I'll ever sell my RC, it still gets used for my rifle loads and special projects I do, However I now load on a Dillon so I can do more on the volume scale, with that said the RCBS is a great press and always will be. Just my 2 cents.
Ron

[Bret4207]

Cajun Shooter has it right. You youngster to reloading don't recall when an "O" frame press was exotic. Most presses were "C" style and flex was the word of the day. Shoot, most guys started out with a Lyman 310 or a Lee Loader. An "O" frame press might cost $15.00 more than a "C" frame and that $15.00 was 2 die sets or 4-5 boxes of bullets or a sleeve plus of primers. It was an economy move. The Rock Chucker was the Cadillac of it's day and most guys could only dream of them. "Disposable income" was non-existent for a lot of people. Not like today with the whole "instant gratification" thing.

Folks ought to think on this, I think those days are coming back, and soon....

[Beekeeper]

AHMEN Brett,
and sooner than we think I feel.
I only have one more purchase to make and that is a press to handle the large 1 1/4 inch dies.
Lee classic or breech lock challenger.Which would you choose?


beekeeper

[1hole]

"The other issue is each of the manufacturers use different weapons when they test the loads."

Not really, not as stated anyway. Fred Huntingto (RCBS) developed the A-series of presses with an "O" frame and a "compound toggle' linkage that greatly multiplied the force we exerted. The A presses were massively strong, much stronger than was needed for reloading and their high cost showed it. Responding to he market's desire, he then developed the less expensive Rock Chucker series with he same basic design but lighter and cheaper to build/sell. THAT model has been a great commercial success.

For some years afterwards, Fred licensed his patents (for a fee of course) to others so those design principles were soon available on a few other presses.

When the original patents expired others had simular models ready to sell. They were, and remain, fully equal to the performance of the RC in every way and are generally less costly too. But the legend of the RC was had been formed and continues today. Many still choose to pay top prices for the reputaion gained 40 years ago when others did not have the "O" frame and compound toggles.

No mechanical design remains virtually static without sacrificing market share. The current Lee Classic Cast press is, in the opinions of many who have used both presses (which is the only kind of opinions I respect) says it's better than the RC. Lee added a fully adjustable handle - left/right, angle and length - and that alone is a significant user improvement. The larger opening, the larger diameter and longer throw ram, and a great spent primer catcher system, with precision frame boring on modern CNC machines also count.

As Fred found, moving ahead matters. A company sitting on its laurels for decades doesn't. I have an RC but I have no delusions about it being the "best" press on the market. It isn't. And I have no sense of loyalty to any inanimate object or brand.

[1hole]

"You have to go back to when it was first put on the market to understand it. When introduced it was the best thing offered by far"

Not really, not quite as stated anyway.

Fred Huntington (RCBS founder) first developed the A-series of presses, with an "O" frame and a "compound toggle' linkage that greatly multiplied the force we exerted. The A presses were massively strong, much stronger than was needed for reloading and their high cost showed it. Responding to he market's desire, he then developed the less expensive Rock Chucker series with the same basic design but lighter and cheaper to build/sell. THAT basic model was a great commercial success and still is.

For some years afterwards, Fred licensed his patents (for a fee of course) to others so those design principles were soon available on a few other presses. Not everyone was willing to pay so they had to wait for the patents to expire. They did.

When the original patents expired, the others had simular models ready to sell. They were, and remain, fully equal to the performance of the RC in every way and are generally less costly too. But the legend of the RC had been formed and largely continues today. Many people still choose to pay top prices for a reputaion gained 40 years ago when others did not have the "O" frame and compound toggles. But that changed maybe 25 years ago.

No mechanical design remains virtually static without sacrificing market share. The current Lee Classic Cast press is, in the opinions of many who have used both presses (which is the only kind of opinions I respect) says it's better than the RC. Lee added a fully adjustable handle - left/right, angle and length - and that alone is a significant user improvement. The larger opening, the larger diameter and longer throw ram, and a great spent primer catcher system, with precision frame boring on modern CNC machines also count.

Moving ahead on design matters, sitting on your laurels for decades doesn't.

[GP100man]

they gotta pay for the big green warranty someway.

GP100man:cbpour:

[Newfoundlander2]

FWIW: If I had to choose one press it would be the Lee Classic cast. I presently have mounted to my bench(es):

RCBS RCII; Forrester BC2 Coaxial; Herters Super U3; Herters Super Maximum; CH 4D Champion; Lyman Orange Crusher (older model with die bushing); and a Texan Turret. I've had others including the Redding UltraMag; TR7; Lee Classic Cast Turret and more that I've forgotten.

The Lee does most things and does them VERY well at a very reasonable price. The Forrester would be VERY hard to let go I must say.

[cajun shooter]

I don't know the ages of those that posted after I did. I'm 62 and I 'm like Elmer Keith "HELL I WAS THERE" What I can tell you is that when I first got into reloading in 1968 I was making $120 a week with a newborn son. My reloading bench was the living room floor and my $6.00 Lee loader. After having several primers go off in the seating stage and my wife screaming you are going to kill us all I had to make a move. I had my brother-in-law help with a loading bench in the garage. We really used them to park cars in the old days. Ha!! Ha!! I then went to the three gun stores in town to look. Everybody said and showed me the same thing. You can buy this Lyman in several models the names escape me now or you can buy the king of presses and take this Rock Chucker home. There were a lot of fellows that swaged their own bullets at this time and the RC was the press to do it with. I could not buy it out right and went on a lay away plan. The only bullets that were available for reloading were the 158gr and 200gr rnL. Lee Juras was not in full swing yet. After bringing the press home I had several neighbors come over to look at it and say that they wished they had one. I was the envy of my fellow reloaders. The neighborhood was low to middle income. I still own a RC and I'm a little heart broken that it is now made where everything else is "CHINA" The Chinese leaders predicted when I was a much younger lad that they will topple nthe USA without firing a shot. That prediction is near as we no longer have the base to make anything. Your neigborhood might have been different according to income and your interest.

[Beekeeper]

Damn cajun shooter you were making good money back then.
Was a lowly sailor boy with wife and 2 kids making $198.00 a month and Uncle Sugar gave me an additional $69.00 a month to pay the rent and buy food.
My first and still the best is a RCBS Jr press. Paid $25.00 for it at a secondhand store.
Where we lived in those days gun owners were s$$t so I had to keep it in a closet and take the clothes out when I wanted to use it.
I sure don't miss those days but I guess it isn't much different today in some parts of the country.


beekeeper

[Sixgun Symphony]

AHMEN Brett,
and sooner than we think I feel.
I only have one more purchase to make and that is a press to handle the large 1 1/4 inch dies.
Lee classic or breech lock challenger.Which would you choose?


beekeeper

I purchased a Herters press for $20 with $20 shipping for a total cost of $40 on ebay. You might consider buying a vintage press to save money.

Vintage shell holders turn up on ebay as well. CH/4D makes an adapter to use modern shell holders in the vintage presses.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I only have one more purchase to make and that is a press to handle the large 1 1/4 inch dies.
Lee classic or breech lock challenger.Which would you choose?


No brainer, the Lee Classic Cast single stage and add a Hornady LnL bushing conversion kit to it. That's the press that pushed my RC off my bench.

Regards,

Dave

[Lloyd Smale]

My buddy just got one of the new lees with there version of lock and load. He bougtht it from my recomendation and i felt bad for recomending it once he had it set up. the lock and load style is a nice feature. Ive got the hornday versions and love them. His press though was very stiff and rough operating and seemed very cheaply made compared to my hornady. Considering hornady gives you a free box of bullets with theres thats worth about 30 bucks the price differnce isnt that much and its 10 times the quality in my opinion. By the way i was also so underwelmed by the measure and scale that came with his package that i threw it in the trash and gave him a rcbs scale and measure i had extra. Personaly i think if anything lees quality has gone down in the last couple years. this stuff looked like toys.

[Sixgun Symphony]

I got to chime in that the Lee scale is accurate, they're just not user friendly.

The Lee perfect powder measure works well with extruded powders. Not so much with ball powders though.

Yes, they're mostly plastic. But they're functional tools.


That said, if someone needs inexpensive equipment then I would steer them into buying used equipment off of ebay or from the gunshow. I think one of the reasons why LEE does so well is that they sell inexpesive starter kits, which is why beginners choose LEE. One has to know what they are buying when cherry picking used equipment.

[Landric]

I started handloading in 1994, later than many of you, but before the internet was really available for information and insight. Well, I suppose we had rec.guns, but I don't remember a lot of handloading threads there on the limited amount of time I could spend looking at it on my dial up connection.

I didn't know any handloaders, so I went to a local gun store where I did most of my business and asked the owner, who I trusted, what would be a good setup to get started with. After much discussion, he sold me a Rockchucker kit for somewhere around $200. At the time it included all the stuff it does now, plus a case trimmer (now $90+ at Midway) and some other small items not currently included. The press was a RCII. Its still in service, and it was my only press until 2001. I loaded A LOT of rounds on it. At the time I was only loading for handgun, and hindsight being what it is, I really didn't need a RC, but I wanted quality and I got it.

I'm an on-press priming guy, not a hand priming guy. I prime all my single stage stuff on a Lee Breech Lock Challenger, but all the heavy work still gets done on the RC. The Lee has a better priming system and spent primer catcher, but the RC is a lot stronger and has more oomph.

If I were buying a single stage today for heavy duty work, I'd probably get the Lee Classic Cast. As it stands though, the RC does all the single stage things I need other than prime well. For volume I have a Lee Classic Turret and Dillon SDB.

I like my RCII better than the newer RC IV, which I have played with. None of the RCs are what they once were to the market, but they are still solid, useful presses. I'll always have mine.

[DLCTEX]

I haven't tried the Lee Breech Lock, but I believe I would go with the Lee Classic Cast and the Hornady Adapter and bushings (which I use in my RC and really like them). I suspect the Breech Lock is an aluminum frame, is this so? The Classic Cast has as good, or better, linkage as the RC, and the priming is no comparasion. Throw in the position and left right potions, and it's a no brainer. But then I opted for the Classic cast turret so I don't have to swap dies, just turn to it (in single stage mode).