New Load Manuals?

[alamogunr]

I haven't bought a load manual in 6 or 7 years. I'm considering getting at least 2 new ones and it looks like Lyman 49th and Speer 14th are getting my nod right now. Does anyone have any other recommendations, or comments on these?

John
W.TN

[Russ in WY]

Recently got the Lyman 49th, am pleased with what I have seen in it so for . Russ.

[jhalcott]

With all the new powders around,I guess you are right! Maybe it's time I got a new one also.

[Rocky Raab]

I have always advised folks to use their bullet maker's manual as their prime reference (because bullet design has a large effect on pressure), and the powder maker's manual as a crosscheck. To resolve any differences, or just as an insurance source, the Lyman manual is invaluable. The Lyman is also one of the few with cast bullet data, as we all know.

[Old Ironsights]

I was a little dissappointed in Lyman 49 over 47 because 49 dropped some of my favorite 2400 loads...

Lawyers rule the world... :evil:

[runfiverun]

hodgdons manual is nice to have,they do make/sell whatever most of the powders used now.
the other one i would get is from the company whose bullets you use the most.
kinda ironic i would say that, as i don't publish a manual,and i make over 90% of the boolits i use.
i guess i could sell myself a copy of my load notebook,but i am cheap and would only write down the ones i use the most and not buy it.
besides that i done what lee does and just ripped loads from other guy's that do pressure testing,like hornady,and speer.

[jhrosier]

If I had to use only one manual, it would be the Lyman.
I have bought each new edition since the late 60s and keep all of the older ones for reference.
The Lyman 47th is a "must have" for loading cast boolits.

I have also bought several of the earlier Lymans for reference and data for long obsolete cartridges.

I used to buy one each from the major bullet makers also.
Nowadays I rely on the makers websites for current data.

Jack

[JesterGrin_1]

If I had to use only one manual, it would be the Lyman.
I have bought each new edition since the late 60s and keep all of the older ones for reference.
The Lyman 47th is a "must have" for loading cast boolits.

I have also bought several of the earlier Lymans for reference and data for long obsolete cartridges.

I used to buy one each from the major bullet makers also.
Nowadays I rely on the makers websites for current data.

Jack

You bring up a point between the new loading manuals as well as the up to date load information we can now get online and the recommended powder charges when compared for many are less than what the old manuals would show.

Some say this is for legal reasons but when I have looked at the old manuals and the powder charges and compared them with the lower powder charges of the new books the CUP is about the same. So the question is do you think the way they measure pressure now is much better than years past or maybe the new powder formulations just burn that much better to not need as much powder for a given load?

Just a wild question for a semi newbie lol. :)

I wish I had the Lyman 47 but I have the Lyman 48th and 49th and the new Lyman Cast Bullet load book.

[alamogunr]

Appreciate all the info. I may have to re-evaluate my choice of the new Lyman manual. I have the Lyman 47th and it is the reason I was considering the 49th. There have been about 2 releases of the Hodgdon manual since my last one. Maybe it should be considered.

I'm not cutting this off. Keep the comments coming.

John
W.TN

[jhrosier]

..... So the question is do you think the way they measure pressure now is much better than years past or maybe the new powder formulations just burn that much better to not need as much powder for a given load? ...

The difference is between measuring peak average pressure (CUP) or peak absolute pressure (transducer psi).
The old method assumes that the gun probably won't blow up due to a very brief pressure excursion. The new method is sort of a "zero tolerance" theory.
I'm a great fan of "what works" and don't think that all of the old loading data is dangerous, if approached with due caution. (working up a load).
I do recognise than some cartridge cases and powders have changed over the years.
I fault the powder makers for not giving the "new" powders new names in stead of leaving us with suspect older data.

I have been loading long enough to understand that bullet weight and construction is way more important than maximum velocities and pressures.
The "new data" does not materially change how I load.

Jack

[JesterGrin_1]

Jack I agree on many points that you have made.

I also have not been the type of person to go to the highest charge listed. I tend to start at the very bottom and work up to find a load that works for any BOOLIT type. And I have also found many times the load will work below the max charge given.

But I will say also this is where a great site like this one can really shine with Cast Boolits as if you can not find a load or need help there are many here that can throw out some good information.

And I have also found that lets say in my Lyman 48 book that shows charges of TightGroup for the .44 Mag that I never even made it close to the Max charge given without very hard to extract cases. This was my first venture into smokeless Powder. But I learned a bunch from it. Start at the bottom and work up slow. As some powders such as TightGroup will build pressure FAST.

[HORNET]

I recently got Lyman #49 and it's not bad. It has data on a lot of new calibers that weren't in the older manuals, including case dimensions. Personally, I still find myself looking back to Lyman #45 or even Cast Bullet Manual #1 at times. You DO have to remember that some powders have changed to be a little faster and that some of the old data was never pressure tested. In some cases, the SAAMI pressure standards were changed (like the .22 Hornet dropping Max Pressure almost 20% when they started building them on modified rimfire actions). Start low and work up, but the old manuals can suggest a good starting point.

[markinalpine]

Don't forget to check out the free info available from powder manufacturers:

http://www.accuratepowder.com/
for Accurate Arms Powders, data file in PDF,

http://www.alliantpowder.com/default.aspx
For Alliants site also with their data in PDF, and

http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp
for Hogdon, IMR, and Winchester Powders, which has on-line data by cartridge type.
I think this is the only on-line freebie where they have much data for cast boolits.

There may be other free sites that others know about. I so, please post them.

Good luck and have fun,
Mark :coffeecom

[Hardcast416taylor]

I have heard that Lyman is bringing out a new cast bullet manual later this year. Robert

[lead Foot]

I have heard that Lyman is bringing out a new cast bullet manual later this year. Robert

Would that be the "New Testament" [smilie=1:

[Bret4207]

I have heard that Lyman is bringing out a new cast bullet manual later this year. Robert

What do you want to bet it's heavy on BPCR and CASS type loads and deletes several old favorites?

I have dozens of older load manuals. The one I can recommend NOT getting is the A-square manual "Any Load You Want".

In truth I turn to Pet Loads first, then Lyman, then the others. I usually compare Lyman, Hornady and Nosler first for jacketed.

[1Shirt]

There is no such thing as to many loading manuals. Great for comparisons. Great collectables, and as mentioned, with all the new powders on the market, need to stay updated. Warning however, some of the new powders of the same number as the old (like 2400 for example), have changed over the years. If you are using old data, (very old), suggest a trial reduction of charges of at least 10 percent with the modern powders.
1Shirt!:coffee:

[Rocky Raab]

1Shirt is once again spot on. I'll add that if you worship at the altar of Saint Elmer, you are entering VERY risky territory with today's 2400 powder and other components.

[jhrosier]

Anyone using "Load From A Disk" or some similar software?

Jack

[Rocky Raab]

I have both LFD and QuickLoad.

Ironically, the ONLY time I have seen both badly off (and in opposite directions!) was with 2400 powder in the Hornet. This was just recently, when I was working up loads for the new 30-gr Barnes Varmint Grenade to develop load data for it. One advised very mild loads that supposedly gave high velocity, and the other program advised quite large charges that gave moderate speeds. Neither was right, and both were off by 300 fps!

[EOD3]

I typically "use" the Lyman, Hornady, Nosler and Speer books, supplemented with the Hodgdon annual. Obviously, the "bullet" books are pretty much useless for cast loads.

If Lyman produces a boolit book, I'll be on it like white on rice. :)

PS: Reducing maximum loads in reloading references will make ZERO difference. Stupid people will still do stupid stuff. One of my favorite sayings: Stupidity is it's own reward.

[barrabruce]

Being a newbie I'm on the look out for a "cast book" Bible.


Whats the "book" I should be hunting down???

Iv'e got 2400 and ADI 2207.
Looking for reduced load data's way down to say 900 fps.



I use the pwder companys data for normal or slightly reduced loads of say 1500 fps upwards.

Barrabruce

[Jim_Fleming]

They do produce a reloading manual, and in that book they do make extensive reference to bullet casting and give extensive load data geared toward using their equipment... After all they're in the casting equipment business...

As far as a cast bullet only book...? I know for a fact I've seen one, I might even have it in my gear when I unpack it. You might want to go to the Cast Bullet Handbook, 3rd Edition (http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/publications/cast-bullet.php) and see if you'd care to buy the 3rd edition...

I guess Lyman Products will be glad to see you, EOD... [smilie=1:


I typically "use" the Lyman, Hornady, Nosler and Speer books, supplemented with the Hodgdon annual. Obviously, the "bullet" books are pretty much useless for cast loads.

If Lyman produces a boolit book, I'll be on it like white on rice. :)

PS: Reducing maximum loads in reloading references will make ZERO difference. Stupid people will still do stupid stuff. One of my favorite sayings: Stupidity is it's own reward.

[jhrosier]

.... Obviously, the "bullet" books are pretty much useless for cast loads....

I look at the starting loads for many jacketed bullets as potentially useful data, especially for IMR and other powders that respond well to reduced loads.

This is one reason that I find the Lyman manuals so useful. They often publish data for both cast and jacketed in similar weights. It is interesting to compare both the selection of powders used and the amounts needed to produce the same velocities for jacketed and cast.

I think that some powders, like 4895, have more potential for cast boolit shooting than previously assumed.

Jack

[EOD3]

The Lyman reloading book has a fair amount of cast loads and the Speer book has some data for RCBS bullet molds.

The burn temperature and the ignition characteristics are important factors when trying to reduce leading.

By the way Jim, Lyman will see me coming when they publish a book that isn't damn near 30 years old. [smilie=1: