How can I cannalure a cast bull?

[wallenba]

I have some Hornady cast 255g rf 45 Colts left over from before I started casting, that would creep out out of the case while gun was fired. I tried a taper crimp, but it just resized the bullet down. A roll crimp was not effective either. Is there a tool or something one can make to do this? Otherwise I wil just drop them in the pot with some tin and start over, but I have near a thousand of them.

[docone31]

I wonder, if you severely crimp down on a lead casting, will it be the size you need to fire it?
I have seen cannelure tools, but they are for jacketeds.
How large are you sizeing it?
They might be a little small.

[HeavyMetal]

C-H used to make a tool to do this and the guys at Corbin do as well. The corbin tool has a "bit" that cuts a crimping groove in lead boolits.

For the price you might just as well melt the boolits you got unless you see a need for this tool in the future!

Post an add in the swap and sell section you might get lucky. I found a Corbin tool at a gun show in early 2008 and paid $60.00 for it. At the time I think that was about 1/3 of the new tool.

[wallenba]

Docone31, they are factory Hornady bullets pre-sized.

[Recluse]

I'd do one of two things:

1. Spend $20 bucks on a Lee FCD and see if that helps. I have a number of the Lee FCD as I still reload and shoot j-bullets for certain things. I'm not as crazy about using an FCD for lead boolits, but I've done it on occasion and everything was okay.

2. Toss them in the pot, melt 'em, make your own. I'd just keep the alloy separate unless you know pretty much what the makeup is.

:coffee:

[wallenba]

Recluse, I'm using Lee dies, the bullets are so heavy, their inertia can't seem to be overcome without really crunching the brass. Hornady claimed that only a taper crimp would be needed for cowboy loads. They have a light cross hatch pattern to hold their lube, which I feel is facilitating sliding them out the case. The current version of this bullet is shown on the Hornady web site WITH a crimp groove. I suspect they came to realize the problem and added it. Mine must be older stock.

[wallenba]

Here's pics of what they said they were, and what I got. Hornady tech rep would just not accept what I was telling him and danced around the issue. With those folks (any company rep) it's always YOU, not them. In case you are wondering about the close-up, I put one of thos real cheap plastic loupes in front of the lens, it left a ring around bullet, but I cropped that out. Neat trick, try it!

[mdi]

I believe those Hornady bullets are swaged and pretty soft, if I remember correctly. If you cast bullets, I'd say melt 'em down. If not, maybe you could put a hefty roll crimp in the side of them.

These bullets are soft enough to crimp into the side of the bullet.

[Firebricker]

Have you tried a roll crimp over the ogive ? That might hold em better but be cautious that it
does'nt as that will take up powder space. I think your best two options would be to melt them like the guys said above. Or use them for really light plinkers. FB

[wallenba]

Thanks a lot guys, I pretty much concluded that melting them down was best, I just needed to hear from others. That's a lot of ready made bullets and a lot of work. I got some tin alloy and a Lee Brinnell tester. I got some too hard ingots, I could add them to that batch to bring them down a bit too.

[docone31]

If you are going to melt them,
First, the lube on them makes good flux. Great stuff.
Melt them, and make ingots. Do not blend them yet.
They are pretty soft being swageings, keep them in ingots as pure lead.
I would then get some wheel weights. Ingot them up. I would then blend the pure with wheel weights, about 50/50. Adding either pure, or wheel weight as needed for the blend.
About factory lead. I went to qualify with my new Combat Commander. It did real well with 185gn hollow points, I wanted to carry it on the job. I promptly proceeded to get some swaged lead 230gn bullets to load up. I did so, and felt pretty good about the whole thing. I had been practicing and practicing.
At the first station, I had stove pipes, jams, and keyholes. From that point, I had rounds all over the floor while I tried to get one to work! I was on a timed course. Once it started I had no choice. I had threads of lead comeing out of my barrel, loads that jammed. It was awful!!!!!! I had never had any loads do that untill I cast for myself!
Well, lesson learned.
Now, when I cast, I also size. I pan lube now, the commercial lubes that come with swaged bullets I do not like.
So far to date, with one hang up, I have had much better results than jacketeds!
I would ingot that lead, blend it, cast it, water drop on casting, then size. Sizing makes all the diference.

[AZ-Stew]

A roll crimp at the front of the knurled bullet shank should hold them in place in a normal .45 Colt load.

How fast are you shooting them? These bullets aren't made for magnum loads. They're intended for 700-900 fps. Less velocity=less recoil=fewer or no pullouts.

Regards,

Stew

[deltaenterprizes]

3rd vote on a roll crimp in front of the ogive.

[longbow]

Not sure how much these cost but it should be able to make a crimp groove for you.

http://www.corbins.com/hct-1.htm

[wallenba]

Thought about roll crimping it up there, but that exceeded ( I think) the published minimum over all length. My guns in 45 Colt are the New Model 4/5 size New Vaquero's, which Ruger states will not tolerate high pressures.

[wallenba]

Longbow, I don't think that will be useful on the long Colts as the problem is them pulling out, not pushed in, but it might be useful in my 1911. I'll read more about it. Thanks

[Linstrum]

Hi, wallenba, if I had 1000 bullets I'd think twice before melting them down if they otherwise worked okay for the gun I got them for since it takes me an awful long time to cast up 1000. But that is just me.

The Lee Factory Crimp tool will put a cannelure into a boolit itself if you get the correct size die for the boolit instead of the brass case. I have used a .30-06 Lee Factory Crimp tool to put a cannelure into .338 boolits since the neck diameter of the .30-06 is 0.336". For .45 Colt you might be able to use a Lee Factory Crimp tool meant for the .444 Marlin since its neck diameter is 0.453", or perhaps .44 Special or .44 Magnum as well since those are around 0.456". The Lee Factory Crimp tool will produce a ring indentation just like a cannelure somewhere around 0.015" deep.

Good luck on whatever you decide to do!

rl552

[HangFireW8]

Here's pics of what they said they were, and what I got.

Hmm, anyone else notice a difference between the crosshatch pattern on the marketing pic versus the pressed-in diamonds on the sample?

Hornady's swaged bullets are what prompted me to buy an original Lewis Lead Remover, during that awkward period of time a few years back when they were out of production before Brownell's bought them. I had to search everywhere, but I found one and bought it and deplated my 38 and 45 bores. What an awesome tool, at least, it was before Brownell's got ahold of it.

http://forums.handloads.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=11158&PN=1 (http://forums.handloads.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=11158&PN=1)

Here's a pic of my leftover H. 45's, which will be heading towards the melting pot soon. Anyone care to point out the flaws? :groner:

-HF

[runfiverun]

hornady uses 5% antimony in their swaged boolits..

[Goatlips]

Unless you're really hurting for lead, I'd put 'em up on Gunbroker and let the marketplace decide what they're worth, as opposed to their scrap value.

Goatlips

[Echo]

+1 for Goatlips...

[Grapeshot]

Here's pics of what they said they were, and what I got. Hornady tech rep would just not accept what I was telling him and danced around the issue. With those folks (any company rep) it's always YOU, not them. In case you are wondering about the close-up, I put one of thos real cheap plastic loupes in front of the lens, it left a ring around bullet, but I cropped that out. Neat trick, try it!


I've used these bullets before. I seated therm deep enough to put a taper crimp over the ogive. They stayed in place well enough while using a Full Case of American Pioneer Powder. I did not have a leading issue out of my Single Action Armies.

[wallenba]

HangFireW8, yep, I noticed an overall difference except in weight and diameter. I bought them thru Midway, Hornady lot# 08-018. I'm willing to accept a few flaws in any batch made by high speed machinery, but if this is a case of them forgetting a step in the manufacturing process they should have stepped up. I too use the Lewis lead remover, especially love the forcing cone cleaner cone, that was always a trouble spot. A little difficult starting a new patch, I now use a small piece of 2x4 with a slot in it for the "T" in the rod, hold it down with my feet and pull. These bullets will be in the pot as soon as the rain lets up here.