PDA

View Full Version : Casting with the MiHec .45 Hollow point re-run



cuzinbruce
06-12-2009, 11:18 PM
The mould arrived today, June 12. It looks great. Now to try it out. A quick clean with some alcohol and check it out. Only thing I saw was that the bottom of the sprue cutter needed a little smoothing. No big deal with a stone. I don't have any Lee handles, they have been out of stock at Midway for months, it seems. Try some others, Hensleys are no good. But a pair of RCBS seem OK, a little loose but usable. Plug the pot in. A Lyman Mag 20, dippers and ladles only. It was just sitting there full of Lyman No 2 metal.
Try first with a Rowell ladle. And get used to using the Cramer style hollow point mould. Get the metal hot, 750 degrees. Still can't get the bases to fill out. So try an RCBS dipper. That works better. The bases fill out nice and sharp. Also getting a bunch of pins from the vent lines. Cut back on the temp a bit and that helps. Next time, I will have to try smoking the mould like Miha says in his post. Also I will try the bottom pour pot next time.
But the Cramer system works good, better than I expected. After the mould got a little broken in, it was working fine. Especially after I put some Bull Plate on the pins where they go through the blocks. I use a mechanics hammer with the yellow plastic faces to cut sprues, etc. Doesn't hurt the mould and the plastic doesn't get hurt too bad. Not that it matters, I bought it at the flea market for a buck or two. When I started, I had to touch the pins with the wooden handle to put them back in place after taking out the bullets. After using it a while and lubing the pins, it mostly didn't seem to matter.
First try with this mould and it was really doing well at the end. The best hollow points I have ever made. Sure beats fooling around with the loose pin Lyman's use.
For what it's worth, I used my approximation of Lyman No. 2 metal. Temp was at 750 to begin with. Bullets weigh about 196 grains. Diameter is about .455/.456 as cast. Bases were filling out nicely. Filled out around the hollow point cavity fine, right from the beginning. Bullets drop from the mould easily. If you are going to cast with one of these, check out Miha's website. The part about Cramer moulds is very good.
Some pictures:
http://home.earthlink.net/~bmi07661/45hp1.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~bmi07661/45hp2.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~bmi07661/45hp3.jpg

Firebricker
06-13-2009, 12:04 AM
Looks good can't wait to try mine !

Dale53
06-13-2009, 12:05 AM
cuzinbruce;
Nice report with excellent pictures. Now, we need some targets!:mrgreen:

Dale53

Springfield
06-13-2009, 12:31 AM
If the vent lines cause problems I'm bettin' some spray-on graphite or mould release would work well also.

45nut
06-13-2009, 12:35 AM
wow,, that is a very impressive looking mold. I haven't been following much in the GB area due to $$ constraints so that is the first pic I have seen, but I am quite happy to see folks stepping up and filling the need for molds. Nice job MiHec.

MiHec
06-13-2009, 03:27 AM
Yes,

with this one vent lines are little bit big (blame new cutter :roll:)

Next mold will have smaller vents

But smoking/graphite/other dirt will close them

dromia
06-13-2009, 03:51 AM
I like large vent lines, ensures good fill out especially on a hollow point.

I don't really mind the vent line hairs on a boolit as they flick of easily with the thumbnail when lubing.

Now flash is a different matter, not that you get that with Miha's moulds.

lathesmith
06-13-2009, 08:43 AM
Nice work, cuzin. Looks like another fine mold from Mihec.

As others have mentioned, I also prefer a slightly oversize mold and for me the slightly large vents are no problem either, as I use the spray-on graphite to vary the size slightly smaller. This nearly always makes the mold fill out and release better, and even if you get a few fine "hairs" on your bullets they usually rub off during routine storage and handling.
lathesmith

Springfield
06-13-2009, 12:02 PM
I'm looking at the close-up pic and I noticed something Miha did that I wish all mould makers woud do. He put a little bevel/ramp at the front of the female alignment pin to help out if the mould isn't perfectly aligned. Plus that will help keep the edge from getting damaged, kinda like the crown on a rifle barrel. All you east coasters received your moulds yesterday, I sure hope I get mine today in California.

hicard
06-13-2009, 12:48 PM
Wow, bought the single cavity original moulds and thought I didn't need the cramer 45. Am I sorry now. They look beautiful.

Springfield
06-13-2009, 01:43 PM
Hi-card: I justified the expense fo buying both by getting the 1 cav in .455 for my 45 Colts and the 2 cav in .453 for my 45 Auto. Like I need an excuse!

69daytona
06-13-2009, 02:17 PM
I hope he does another rerun for this mold, great looking bullets, cant wait for my .502 mold to get started and the #503 44 keith style.

guninhand
06-13-2009, 08:23 PM
You might try sprue cutting with gloved hands instead of the plastic hammer. That's how I do it on the single cavity MiHec I have. YMMV but I feel that I can keep the flat on flat pressure more evenly consistant that way so it might give less long term wear.

Springfield
06-14-2009, 12:31 AM
I received my mould today, so I fired up the pot and did some casting. I had noticed that the mould halves didn't quite touch, like they were being held apart by the pins, so I touched up the holes where the alignment pins went through the larger HP pins, but it didn't seem to help. I cast about 50 bullets, and after it warmed up the mould dropped bullets easily and everything seemed to work fine. I still could see daylight between the mould halves unless I squeezed the handles strongly. The bullets measured between .454 and .457, with a bit of oval in them. I had thought the brass might grow when heated more than the steel pins and so the pins would fit better but it didn't turn out that way. After casting I took some fine sandpaper and sanded the slots for the pins and I managed to close the gap most of the way. Tomorrow I may do a bit more work with it. Mihec cuts these mould to VERY tight tolerances, which is much better than the alternative. I can always remove some material until they fit perfectly much easier than trying to deal with sloppy fitting. And I must say, these Cramer style moulds are a joy to use compared to the other single cavity style moulds that I have. I may have to put my original Mihec single cavity mould up for sale now that I have this one.

Maximilian225
06-14-2009, 12:36 AM
Got one of my two molds today. Looks absolutely amazing. Miha's machine work and craftsmanship are a wonderful thing to behold. :roll:

Haven't had a chance to cast with it today. To many other obligations.

Looking forward to making some boolits tomorrow.

:mrgreen:

-Max

DAFzipper
06-14-2009, 11:12 AM
I received my mould today, so I fired up the pot and did some casting. I had noticed that the mould halves didn't quite touch, like they were being held apart by the pins, so I touched up the holes where the alignment pins went through the larger HP pins, but it didn't seem to help. I cast about 50 bullets, and after it warmed up the mould dropped bullets easily and everything seemed to work fine. I still could see daylight between the mould halves unless I squeezed the handles strongly. The bullets measured between .454 and .457, with a bit of oval in them. I had thought the brass might grow when heated more than the steel pins and so the pins would fit better but it didn't turn out that way. After casting I took some fine sandpaper and sanded the slots for the pins and I managed to close the gap most of the way. Tomorrow I may do a bit more work with it. Mihec cuts these mould to VERY tight tolerances, which is much better than the alternative. I can always remove some material until they fit perfectly much easier than trying to deal with sloppy fitting. And I must say, these Cramer style moulds are a joy to use compared to the other single cavity style moulds that I have. I may have to put my original Mihec single cavity mould up for sale now that I have this one.

I may have to try with mine. Cast at .455 to .456 and are out of round, more than the steel single from MiHec.

Springfield
06-14-2009, 03:22 PM
I have a sneaking suspicion the the reason some are getting vent line hairs is not the lines are too deep(I didn't get many) but that the moulds are not closing all the way. Anybody else see daylight when the molds are closed?

Springfield
06-14-2009, 03:28 PM
I have a sneaking suspicion the the reason some are getting vent line hairs is not the lines are too deep(I didn't get many) but that the moulds are not closing all the way. Anybody else see daylight when the molds are closed?

MiHec
06-14-2009, 03:51 PM
There could be some sharp edge....

If you disassemble cramer pins - does mold close properly?

Springfield
06-14-2009, 04:30 PM
I haven't tried that, but when I hold it up to the light the only light showing is at the bottom of the groove of the mould, the edges of the pins seem to be the part hitting. I'm just going to take a rolled up piece of sandpaper and slowly open up the grooves until it is perfect. I get good bullets now, but the mould is "beagled" a bit, so I get larger bullets. It isn't even enough to get flashing.

Springfield
06-14-2009, 06:11 PM
I took the pins out and the mould closed perfectly. So I took some 200 grit crocus cloth and made a roll of it slightly larger than the pin holes and sanded it carefully until the pins fully seated. Reassembled everything and I no longer see daylight under the pins. It didn't take much sanding at all as it was very close to begin with, but now it looks perfect. I suspect my bullets will be a couple thou smaller now. I should be able to cast some tomorrow and see. After my wife gets back with the kids from a B-day party we are going to a carnival at a local church, and after that I am suppossed to help my Bro in Law pick up a new refrigerator, as I am the family free moving guy. Don't really want to be but he is a yuppie type with no pick-up truck. HIS brother doesn't have a truck either, just a Lexus and a Porsche, so I get elected.

AnthonyB
06-14-2009, 07:04 PM
I can see some daylight between the blocks on my mould with no handles attached; haven't had time to put handles on it yet. I think I'll polish the pins instead of the mould if it appears I need to do something but will definitely try it first. Tony

Springfield
06-14-2009, 07:09 PM
I figured it would easier to remove material from the brass mould instead of the steel pins, but it would also be easier to mess it up.

Maximilian225
06-14-2009, 08:37 PM
Did some casting with the new mold. I too could see some light between the cavities and around the base of the pins. It appears the pins are ever so slightly out of round due to the staking process. When I took them out, the blocks closed up completely.

I decided that it would be best to break the mold in and cast for awhile as shipped. Considering how small the out of round was. I thought maybe that as the mold came up to temp, and the steel being harder than the brass, that as casting progressed the pins would "seat".

Turns out that I was correct in this assumption. As the mold came up to temp and started throwing wrinkle free boolits the small gap between the pins and the mold blocks was completely gone. Somewhere around 40 casts.

This is one of the best casting molds I have ever had the pleasure of using. The thick Sprue plate is excellent for maintaining even heat. The deepness of the Chamfer in the sprue holes also allows for a consistent sprue puddle.

Miked and weighed the Beauties soon after cooling to room temp.

Cast from straight Clip on Wheel Weights.


.4537 Parallel to the parting line
.4539 Perpendicular to parting line
Hollowpoint 202 gr.
Round Flat 215 gr.


Update:

24 hrs after casting

.4541 Parallel to the parting line
.4543 Perpendicular to parting line


http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq289/Maximilian225/Mihec453200/Mihec453-200Cramer015.jpg

http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq289/Maximilian225/Mihec453200/Mihec453-200Cramer016.jpg

http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq289/Maximilian225/Mihec453200/Mihec453-200Cramer020.jpg

http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq289/Maximilian225/Mihec453200/Mihec453-200Cramer021.jpg

:lovebooli

-Max

ddeaton
06-14-2009, 11:38 PM
I cast about 100 today and did nothing to the mold except scrub it out real well with Comet and a toothbrush with hot water. It cast good boolits after about the 4th or 5th drop. Mine mic about .454+ and not out of round. I ran a couple through the .452 Star sizer and they went through a little tough, but will work out fine. I am using WW plus a little tin. I would have liked a little smaller on the drop, but is fine. This mold is easier to use than a regular solid mold. You barely touch the pins and the boolits drop right out. Man this would be nice in a 4 hole mold.
Thanks Mihec, its a keeper.

Springfield
06-15-2009, 02:02 AM
The worked on mould is doing better, nice .455 bullets.

ddeaton
06-15-2009, 10:55 AM
Are you all using a softer alloy for these? I didnt on the test, but am planning to on the real deal.

Springfield
06-15-2009, 01:12 PM
I used my softer alloy, measures about 11 Brinnell. I saved up a bunch of old phone books, gonnna use them for expansion testing just for fun.

MiHec
06-15-2009, 01:18 PM
Pictures of expansion test, please :D

Springfield
06-15-2009, 01:58 PM
Of course!

oldtoolsniper
06-15-2009, 02:39 PM
Dang mail person! where is mine!

nighthunter
06-15-2009, 04:12 PM
The mailman brought my mold today. Opened the package and the mold I found inside is a beautiful piece of craftsmanship. I did not have to touch up anything on my mold. I cast up about 500 bullets this afternoon. This mold is the finest mold I have ever purchased. I can cast hollow points as fast as I can cast other bullets with any other double cavity mold. This is my first brass mold and I am thinking that I should have given brass a try a long time ago. I can not say enough good about this mold and the ease with which it casts good bullets. I am looking forward to the 44/444 mold that I am in on. Miha ...... you deserve to be very proud of your work. I hope others on this board get a chance to use your molds.

Nighthunter

Maximilian225
06-15-2009, 04:43 PM
2nd mold received today. :mrgreen:

Thanks Miha.

-Max

DAFzipper
06-15-2009, 06:19 PM
My mold was hanging on the pins. It seems that the mold halves are offset. I could see that both pins were hitting on the same sides in the off side block. I took a round file to it and it closed the gap. It now casts a little smaller than the first run. I measured 4 spots and I got readings of .4525 to,4552. I can catch the offset with the molds closed at the base with my thumb nail. Not sure how far they are offset. They seem to size up OK but you can tell by the the way they look that the mold is not quite aligned. I think they will still shoot OK at the short range they will be used for. It might be more of a concern with the 44 mold MiHec is doing next.

cavemike
06-15-2009, 06:58 PM
Miha,
My mould arrived today in Indiana. It does look very good in the mind of this amateur. I will have time to do some casting this weekend.

I don't mean to harass you about this, but where are the .41 caliber moulds in the queue?

I only ask because deer season is "fast approaching" and I will need to work up loads for this mould.

Thanks for all your hard work on this project.

Springfield
06-15-2009, 09:48 PM
DAF; Mine is like yours, but it cleaned up OK. Sorry, dude, but my 40 S&W mould is in front of the 41 mould! But I am gonna get one of those also. :)

Maximilian225
06-15-2009, 10:46 PM
Remeasured this evening 24 hrs after casting:


.4541 Parallel to the parting line
.4543 Perpendicular to parting line

Growth was .0004

-Max

timbuck
06-16-2009, 12:43 AM
I got mine today, monday. 53132. I also have daylight between mould halves. I will wait until I get it hot and cast until I open anything up. They do look great. How many cavity mould can you make with a cramer type?

ddeaton
06-16-2009, 10:09 AM
I got mine today, monday. 53132. I also have daylight between mould halves. I will wait until I get it hot and cast until I open anything up. They do look great. How many cavity mould can you make with a cramer type?

My same question, after casting with this I could see using a 4 cavity with no problem.

Doble Troble
06-16-2009, 10:39 AM
I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH MINE

It's so excellent in every way that I couldn't stop casting with it and probably produced 500 nice bullets with the first time I used it.

NOW I'LL NEVER NEED TO USE IT AGAIN!

Seriously, mine is perfect and casts really nice 0.453 bullets out of mutt metal. There are hints of vent hairs at the nose, but compared to my nose hairs they ain't nuthin.

If it will quit raining here in Eastern NC I'll shoot some.

The punch is really nice, but I had a bit of a problem a couple of times with bullets getting stuck on it. A swipe of lube fixed that.

Mine is a real work of art, and all of the extra features are really appreciated. I'm particularly impressed with the channel between the sprue holes - it makes it easy to cut off a contiguous chunk thats easier to deal with than multiple "lead buttons". This is a very thoughtfully designed mold nicely executed. Nice work MiHec! Thank you.

If only I'd see pictures like this on the covers of magazines, I might buy one.

http://1zwjlg.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pwJWvmoUn1BxlSwqnoEYA8CoEhPsYdQHgDjymUHTo8gLSxWy k_FZSEcETasbhm1tWYGRKDSVLhpeJvPwgLG__4-FVJZoYIAbE/OfficerSmall.JPG

oldtoolsniper
06-16-2009, 05:36 PM
Got the mold today, I am afraid after using it; this saving money by casting is going to cost me more than my ex-wife did.

This is my first Cramer style mold and it was rough going at first. I looked like a monkey humping a football. After I got it all figured out I couldn’t stop making the little gems.

If you read my “Adventures in top punch making” you can imagine my awe of that top punch. The mold is one of those things that makes you appreciate an artist even when you don’t understand the art.

You do good work Sir!

happy7
06-16-2009, 08:43 PM
My mold halves were also offset. It took a bit of work just like DAFZipper to get it to close. I hope the bullets are not too out of round, but I haven't cast with it yet. Hopefully soon.

Doble Troble
06-18-2009, 10:42 PM
Shot 50 today. They were sized 0.451, BAC lubed = ~ 204 gr, 6.1 gr Unique, OAL = 1.205. Nice and accurate, they were 100 % reliable in my cobbled together 1911.

I tried to dig some out of the berm, but found that the berm is mostly made out of expanded lead bullets - I couldn't tell what was just shot from what was shot 30 yrs ago. I'll have to figure-out how to make a trap.

http://acvqqg.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pfiJXXuVhYMKldYB4VrEqiT1qok96xFBwgz7SmRN9t23zNEc HOeE2MWiUoNjofsLTyo1b_AY73hARR2EGmnBGxmaxZeDKvqGH/IMG_1993.JPG

Storydude
06-19-2009, 01:39 PM
Shot 50 today. They were sized 0.451, BAC lubed = ~ 204 gr, 6.1 gr Unique, OAL = 1.205. Nice and accurate, they were 100 % reliable in my cobbled together 1911.

I tried to dig some out of the berm, but found that the berm is mostly made out of expanded lead bullets - I couldn't tell what was just shot from what was shot 30 yrs ago. I'll have to figure-out how to make a trap.

http://acvqqg.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pfiJXXuVhYMKldYB4VrEqiT1qok96xFBwgz7SmRN9t23zNEc HOeE2MWiUoNjofsLTyo1b_AY73hARR2EGmnBGxmaxZeDKvqGH/IMG_1993.JPG

Screw a trap, just dig some buckets from that berm. :)

69daytona
06-20-2009, 01:20 PM
Miha just wrote me and had an extra one of these molds. I bought it but was wondering how long it took most of you to get yours? Im in Calif.
Cant wait to get it. hopefully before I go to Mississippi in june.
Anyone here from Columbus Miss?

Maximilian225
06-20-2009, 01:40 PM
Miha just wrote me and had an extra one of these molds. I bought it but was wondering how long it took most of you to get yours? Im in Calif.
Cant wait to get it. hopefully before I go to Mississippi in june.
Anyone here from Columbus Miss?


I'm supposing you meant July. It took 5 business days to get to me.

-Max

69daytona
06-20-2009, 04:05 PM
Yes I did mean July, excited over my new Grandson being born on june 18th.
Wow that is some fast shipping from europe.

Firebricker
06-20-2009, 10:19 PM
I checked out my mould and everthing was a nice fit. Vent lines were a little deep and left
tiny bumps but alittle mould release or graphite will cure that like guys said above. I could not
believe how fast this mould started turning out perfect boolits. This is my first brass mould and
my first hollow point. The quality is excellent IMO. Then today I loaded up some 45 acp loads
with power pistol with great results. Good accracy and fed totally reliable. Miha I'm very
happy with my mould and it has been a pleasure doing business with you. FB

Slow Elk 45/70
06-21-2009, 12:03 AM
Miha, Thanks for another great mold, I appreciate your professional work and attitude.:drinks:

swiss 96/11
06-21-2009, 03:28 PM
Mine you could see a little light at the front part of the mould,but worked the mould halfs together,as mentioned on his website.Took about 15 times,casted next for 10 minutes and had perfect mould fit and perfect HP bullets. His moulds are right up there quality wise with my H&G moulds. Thanks MiHec

Beau Cassidy
06-22-2009, 07:57 AM
Miha just wrote me and had an extra one of these molds. I bought it but was wondering how long it took most of you to get yours? Im in Calif.
Cant wait to get it. hopefully before I go to Mississippi in june.
Anyone here from Columbus Miss?

I am not from Columbus but I do have a degree from the Mississippi University for Women. Yep- sure do. Originally from Jackson.

oldtoolsniper
06-22-2009, 09:13 AM
Miha,
You need to start putting your name on your work so we can all get rich selling these molds off in twenty years!

fatnhappy
06-22-2009, 09:46 AM
Yes I did mean July, excited over my new Grandson being born on june 18th.
Wow that is some fast shipping from europe.


Well Congrats are in order!

nighthunter
06-25-2009, 06:28 PM
Made it to the range today to try these new bullets. Had 2 loads ..... 5.5 gr WW231 and 6.0 gr WW 231. Bullets were sized .451. Both loads shot to point of aim at 20 yards. Groups with both loads were about 1 1/2 inches for 14 rounds (2 magazines worth). I only recovered 2 bullets out of about 60 rounds fired. The first was just the skirt, recovered weight was 72 grains. The second recovered bullet had expanded to .693 diameter and weighed 185 grains. My alloy for casting these is 50% WW and 50% range scrap with a small amout of tin added to enhance fill out. These bullets are fantastic. I can't wait to recieve the 44/444 HP mold.

Nighthunter

69daytona
06-30-2009, 10:02 AM
I just got my mold in yesterday. it was sealed in a plastic bag from the post office since they let it sit in the rain and kicked it around a little, luckily everything inside was fine, a little rust on the pins, but it closed up tight after a little cleaning and some 2000 grit sand paper.
I cast about 30 bullets yesterday, it was 118 degrees in the garage so just wanted to test it out and once warmed up it cast some good looking bullets, will do more when its cooler and I have more time.
Going to Columbus MS. this Sunday with a stop in Weatherford, OK.
Cant wait to get the rest of the molds I have ordered from Miha. Great Work Miha.

over the hill gang
07-01-2009, 01:54 AM
Miha, received your mold over the weekend and is a work of art, I cast a few hundred today and sized and lubed them. Cast they were .4553 and after sizing they were .4525 only had a chance to play with the hollow point so far but will cast a few of the flat points tomorrow. here are a few pics of the bullets. oh before I forget they weighed at 200 / 201 grains before sizing and after size and lube they were 203.5 grains.

Hardcast
07-01-2009, 09:03 PM
Although I did not get in on the group buy, this mold intrigues me. Has anyone shot some into water jugs yet?

yondering
07-02-2009, 01:15 PM
I fired into some water jugs yesterday with this boolit. No pictures yet, going to shoot some more and post some in a few days.
The alloy was straight ACWW.
First load was light, 4gr Bullseye for ~750 fps. No expansion that I could tell, shot through all 5 milk jugs, left a nice round hole, boolit was not recovered.
Bumped up the load (a little bit [smilie=1: ) to 8gr Unique for 1100 fps in the 1911 and 1300 in my Mech Tech carbine. This is a hot load and not recommended for most 45's. First two milk jugs blew up, lead fragments in the second, boolit base recovered in the third. Recovered base was from the lube groove back. Similar results from the carbine, but a little more spectacular. Accuracy was good with both guns, 5 shots all holes touching at 15 yards.

Conclusion: ACWW alloy is too hard for this boolit. I cast up some 50/50 ww/pure last night and will try those today. I'd like to get mild expansion with the light loads, and good expansion at about 1000 fps.

yondering
07-02-2009, 01:17 PM
What are you guys doing with this mold to eliminate finning around the hollow point and whiskers in the vent lines? My mold is bad about this, about every 3rd or 4th boolit has significant whiskers and nose finning.

I have smoked the mold heavily, but that hasn't helped much. I might try some moly spray next to plug up the vent holes some.

Hardcast
07-02-2009, 05:34 PM
I fired into some water jugs yesterday with this boolit. No pictures yet, going to shoot some more and post some in a few days.
The alloy was straight ACWW.
First load was light, 4gr Bullseye for ~750 fps. No expansion that I could tell, shot through all 5 milk jugs, left a nice round hole, boolit was not recovered.
Bumped up the load (a little bit [smilie=1: ) to 8gr Unique for 1100 fps in the 1911 and 1300 in my Mech Tech carbine. This is a hot load and not recommended for most 45's. First two milk jugs blew up, lead fragments in the second, boolit base recovered in the third. Recovered base was from the lube groove back. Similar results from the carbine, but a little more spectacular. Accuracy was good with both guns, 5 shots all holes touching at 15 yards.

Conclusion: ACWW alloy is too hard for this boolit. I cast up some 50/50 ww/pure last night and will try those today. I'd like to get mild expansion with the light loads, and good expansion at about 1000 fps.

Although I currently do not own any hollowpoint molds, I hope to in the future. My take on this is WW metal has antimony in it and that makes the alloy more brittle than a lead/tin mix. I'm guessing at the relatively low velocity of the 45 ACP, the more ductile alloy of lead/tin would be more likely to open up without fragmenting. I have never tried it so I don't know if it would shoot accurately or not. Seems I read that back in the days of yor, people like Elmer Keith wrote of using a 10 to 1 lead/tin mix. Anyway, thanks for the report and let us know how the 50/50 mix works out.

Maximilian225
07-02-2009, 05:55 PM
I fired into some water jugs yesterday with this boolit. No pictures yet, going to shoot some more and post some in a few days.
The alloy was straight ACWW.
First load was light, 4gr Bullseye for ~750 fps. No expansion that I could tell, shot through all 5 milk jugs, left a nice round hole, boolit was not recovered.
Bumped up the load (a little bit [smilie=1: ) to 8gr Unique for 1100 fps in the 1911 and 1300 in my Mech Tech carbine. This is a hot load and not recommended for most 45's. First two milk jugs blew up, lead fragments in the second, boolit base recovered in the third. Recovered base was from the lube groove back. Similar results from the carbine, but a little more spectacular. Accuracy was good with both guns, 5 shots all holes touching at 15 yards.

Conclusion: ACWW alloy is too hard for this boolit. I cast up some 50/50 ww/pure last night and will try those today. I'd like to get mild expansion with the light loads, and good expansion at about 1000 fps.

I had suspicions this was how this HP would react in straight WW alloy. Actually it's how I was hoping it would behave. I had a Devastator mold and it opened well at ACP velocity with ACWW.

This mold will suit me better as I like to load the Devastators in both 45 ACP and also in 45 Colt for my Puma 454 Casull. They are coming out of the 454 right at 1300 fps.

They behave much like hand grenades in game out of the 454. :mrgreen:

I am planning to use the Mihec mold with 50/50 for the 45 ACP and straight wheel weights for the Puma.

-Max
:castmine:

Dale53
07-02-2009, 11:45 PM
Hardcast;
Elmer Keith's general alloy recipe for revolvers was 16/1 lead/tin. He used 20/1 lead/tin for hollow points. He recommended 10/1 for auto pistols (not hollow points).

Glen Fryxell's excellent articles on hollow points can be found here:
http://www.lasc.us/ArticlesFryxell.htm

I recently cast a batch of the MiHec .45 Hollow points following Glen's suggestion of WW's/20% pure lead/2% tin. I rather think that will work quite well at 1000 fps or so in the .45 ACP. Glen's suggestions to match the alloy to the cartridge requirements are VERY good and that is what I am doing. I will test in a few days.

Dale53

Hardcast
07-03-2009, 04:09 AM
Hardcast;
Elmer Keith's general alloy recipe for revolvers was 16/1 lead/tin. He used 20/1 lead/tin for hollow points. He recommended 10/1 for auto pistols (not hollow points).

Glen Fryxell's excellent articles on hollow points can be found here:
http://www.lasc.us/ArticlesFryxell.htm

I recently cast a batch of the MiHec .45 Hollow points following Glen's suggestion of WW's/20% pure lead/2% tin. I rather think that will work quite well at 1000 fps or so in the .45 ACP. Glen's suggestions to match the alloy to the cartridge requirements are VERY good and that is what I am doing. I will test in a few days.

Dale53

Dales53, thanks for the correction. :)

yondering
07-04-2009, 02:11 PM
OK, here are a few pictures. These boolits were fired into water filled milk jugs, at about 10 yards. I tested these at 8gr Unique for 1100 fps, and 6.5gr Unique for 820 fps. The 8gr load is hot, and I do not recommend it for anyone else. 7-7.5gr is probably about right for this boolit. I neglected to take pictures of the 1100 fps acww loads, which basically fragmented except for the base. The 820 fps ACWW boolit with the round HP did not expand much, judging from the holes in the milk jugs, and was not recovered.

On the re-re-run thread for this mold, we are discussing having Miha make 4 or 6 sided hollow point pins and top punches; to experiment with this I made my own 4 sided top punch to square up the existing round HP holes. Some of those are shown below.

I believe this really works to give more uniform expansion; note the two boolits in the middle, one with a square nose and one round. The round nose expanded unevenly, but the square HP nose expanded in a nice even + or X shape. These were fired down into the milk jugs, so they impacted at an angle. Entry was near the top of the first jug, angling down toward the bottom of the third jug. Both were recovered in the third milk jug.

With the low velocity ACWW boolits, the round HP nose penetrated all 5 milk jugs and was not recovered, but the same load with the square HP opened up and was recovered in the 4th jug.

Based on these results (and keeping in mind that they were fired into water, not tissue), for 200gr 45 ACP velocity I think 50/50 alloy is a little soft, ACWW are definitely too hard; the 20% pure mix above would probably be just about right.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/molds/IMG_2421a.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/molds/IMG_2412a.jpg

putteral
07-04-2009, 03:51 PM
Great Post and thanks! :drinks: And have a great 4th!

nighthunter
07-04-2009, 06:36 PM
Yondering .... good photos and excellent results. Where did you get the square nose punch? I experimented with some of mine today. Put a drop of hot glue in the HP cavity then tapped in a .177 steel BB. They run through the magazine just fine. I think the BB will help with the expansion. It will probably be a week or so before I will get to the range to try them out. I'll post the results.

Nighthunter

nighthunter
07-04-2009, 06:45 PM
Never mind the question about the source of the square nose punch. I was haveing a blond moment and should have better read the post.

Nighthunter

jdgabbard
07-05-2009, 09:52 PM
Yondering .... good photos and excellent results. Where did you get the square nose punch? I experimented with some of mine today. Put a drop of hot glue in the HP cavity then tapped in a .177 steel BB. They run through the magazine just fine. I think the BB will help with the expansion. It will probably be a week or so before I will get to the range to try them out. I'll post the results.

Nighthunter

Next thing you know some guy will be trying to super glue a primer in the nose for "better expansion"... :holysheep

I think you'll have excellent results without the BB, I'd be afraid of something like that throwing off the center of gravity, and thus opening up the shot group...

yondering
07-06-2009, 12:44 PM
Next thing you know some guy will be trying to super glue a primer in the nose for "better expansion"... :holysheep



Already tried that when I first started reloading (I was a lot younger and dumber then [smilie=1: ). It didn't do anything impressive and was a waste of good primers.

MiHec
07-06-2009, 04:56 PM
@ yondering

Can you give me approx. measures for 4 sided pin?

yondering
07-06-2009, 05:20 PM
@ yondering

Can you give me approx. measures for 4 sided pin?

My pin leaves the HP cavity a little too large since it doesn't have a stop shoulder, but 4x4mm square is about right at the boolit nose. This leaves the cavity mouth a little thinner in the corners, but thicker in the middle of the flats, compared to your current round style. (See picture below, your current design is on the left, 4mm square HP on the right, overlay in the center)

Obviously this would require casting with a 4-sided pin, as the top punch would only cut the corners in a round hole, and not make it truly square. The pin I am using opened up the boolit mouths to about 5x5mm to form a complete square.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/molds/MihecHP.jpg

happy7
07-18-2009, 09:48 PM
I finally got around to casting with this mold. Wow. The cramer design beats the pin method in a huge way. I never want to cast hollowpoints with a removeable pin again. It was only marginally slower than casting with any other two cavity mold. I did have to get it really hot. I reread Glen's article on casting for the 45 acp on the lasc site and followed his advice of casting with a 25:1 alloy. I put the thermostat at 800 and that worked just perfect. Bullets came out perfectly formed and reject rate was almost zero. My mold halves were slightly offset, but only about 1.5 thousands, so I can live with that.

Today I sized some at .452 and lubed with speed green. Bullets averaged 205 grains with my 25:1 alloy. Again following Glen's advice I loaded them over 7.1 grains of Unique. These went over the chronograph at 940 fps from my S&W 4506 and I shot one five shot group for accuracy. I will have to do more accuracy testing later but they went into 1.5 inches at 20 yards and impacted about 2 inches higher than my slow 230 RN load does. Next I shot them into wet phone books, also at 20 yards. Penetration was 6.5 inches. Two recovered rounds weighed 203.5 grains for basically 100% weight rentention. Well that is about it. Apart from the offset blocks, I am very, very pleased.

Dale53
07-18-2009, 10:02 PM
happy7;
Those are certainly expanded! A feller couldn't ask for much more.

Dale53

MiHec
07-19-2009, 05:07 AM
5 sided pins

bgokk
07-19-2009, 08:55 PM
Happy
Those look just like all the gun mag. writers show in their articles. You done good.

The boolits appear to have expanded all the way to the rear driving band. That's near 'bout perfect.

stephen
07-20-2009, 01:45 AM
Just a thought but if you cast a HP w/ a polygonal pin you'll have to align/rotate the top punch to the cavity or you will end up reforming the cavity upon sizing. Star sizers excepted.
I'd be interested in a std round pin w/ rounded tip for the mold I have.

MiHec
07-20-2009, 03:27 AM
I will do different top punches

Something like for swc boolits

KODB
07-20-2009, 09:43 AM
Wow these look fantastic. I'm sorry I didn't see that group buy when it was on; if anyone ends up wanting to part with one of these please pm me!
Regards,
bob

yondering
07-20-2009, 02:02 PM
I will do different top punches

Something like for swc boolits

Miha, personally I'd sure prefer to have a pointed 5 sided top punch of the same style as what you are shipping with your molds now. The round one sure does a good job of uniforming the hollow point cavity, and I can't see that the polygonal shape would be a big issue. Just fit the boolit to the top punch and lower it into the sizing die.

I'd also be able to use it to form 5 sided hollow points on other boolits too.

I hope you will make these. If not, I'll just have a machinist friend make one for me, but the problem is if it isn't made on your CNC program it probably won't match the hollow point exactly.

Springfield
07-20-2009, 04:03 PM
I am interested in buying a set of 5 sided pins for my 2 cavity 45 mould. I hope the 40 HP mould comes with these also.

timbuck
08-02-2009, 09:15 PM
I am interested in buying a set of 5 sided pins for my 2 cavity 45 mould. I hope the 40 HP mould comes with these also.

I also would buy a separate set of pins for the 45/HP. Also for the 44/HP. Hint, hint Mihec.

Hunter
11-02-2009, 12:27 AM
Miha sent me one of the 200gr .452 hollow point molds for the m1911.org ezine.
So far this mold looks excellent.
I plan on casting with it by the weekend and see if it casts as good as it looks.

Thanks Miha

hicard
11-04-2009, 09:03 PM
Miha, you should probably make at least a dozen extra moulds for this buy, I think you will have no problem selling them.