Slugged my 99 303, not good.

[6.5 mike]

Slugged the 303 yesterday, came out 303/311. Bore still very dark, can't tell if it's lead or powder or both. No sign of jacket fouling yet, but may be layered in somewhere.
Based on this, with a lee 185 sized to .309 & two wraps of #20 paper, sized to .311,will this work? I know I'll get some springback, & will need it.
Got lucky, no cleaning rod damage at muzzle. I did lap the crown very lightly & borescope showed rifleing complete to muzzle.
Foamed the bore 4 times, still getting black crap out.
I've got some .311 jwords I pulled from 7.62 russian, might try shooting it out.

[docone31]

Might work ok.
I might consider smearing some Clover on the paches, if they go through ok. This will definately get the black out!
Another note.
Paper patching seems to thrive on full tilt loads. I use minimum start data for the same weight jacketed. Less does not produce the results.
I believe, there is less resistance with a patched load, rather than jacketed. Do not hesitate full tilt loads with paper.
If you go the lapping route, go VERY lightly. The paper itself will also serve as a cleaning medium.
If the .311 does not work well, try .312. The .311 might be a little light on the groove. Mine was at .3135, and I got miserable accuracy. In desperation, I smeared some Clover thinking the bore was loose and I could at least clean it with the patches. Instead, the resulting shots were amazingly accurate! .314 was the sweet spot with my rifle. I use that to this day. If your .311 is an open group, smear just a shadow of lapping compound and see what it does. If the group suddenly tightens up, you found the number, .312.

[6.5 mike]

Docone31, thats a good idea. I only have a lee sizer lapped to .311, could open it another .001 if I have to. Stopped there for the krag & russian, both have .3095 bores.
I was allowing for the paper to springback some. Need to try some & see what I come out at.
Figured to start with lyman's bottom load & work up from there. All my 185's are g/ced, don't guess it would hurt at this point.
I'll try some tomorrow & see how much they grow. Running out of time, have to go back to work wensday. Thanks.
work s***s, more important things to do.

[docone31]

I do not know what the Lyman start data is, however I would cross check it against the manufacturers site. Gas checks did not pose any issue with my patching except for the "feathers" after sizing the prime casting. I do not use gas checks today however. I found no difference other than price.
Definately try the patched loads you have now. If you get 20min of berm, tighten them up with Clover. That was what I did to find my sweet number.
I had thought my Smelly was just garbage. Aside from the bad rep I had heard from others, my first loads sucked in it. Then I tried paper. She is now my favourite rifle. Just feels better to handle, and fire than the others I built.
Even with the two stage trigger, she is a sweetheart. Point, it hits. My paper loads hit flatter than the jacketeds of same weight.
In my opinion, the .303 British is a winner. Useing Collet Dies, I get gads of reloads from my cases. So far, no indications of seperation.
With the right load, you will not get carbon printing on the case neck. Look for that. 2gns under and carbon plus!
When you find your sweet spot, you will know it. The rifle will have a particular ring when it fires. It will feel like it is missing something = - the spot.
When you find it, you will love it.

[redneckdan]

You can paper patch a gas check design boolit sans gas check just fine. I think those boolits at .311 are worth a shot. My buffalo classic slugs at .458 and I'm final sizing to .458 Loaded over a full case of WC860 with 5gr of fast pistol powder over the primer it shoots great. I'm getting 1500fps with a 405gr FN w/50gr WC860 and it sounds like a cannon going off, shoots flame about 5 feet from the end of the barrel. Best part is the confetti.:Fire:

[pdawg_shooter]

You might try shooting WITHOUT the final sizing. Leave them at the diameter they turn out patched. If they will fit the throat the barrel will give them the final sizing. Just rub a little lube on the patch and load. You may find you can use un-sized brass that way. Most of my rifles give the best accuracy that way.

[6.5 mike]

padawg, I'd already sized & g/c'ed all the ones I'd cast, otherwise I'd try as cast. Might not work the mold drops .3115.
Docone31, not alot of current load data for 303 savage. I used starting loads for 30-30 when I tryed plated bullets. I've seen better buckshot pattens at 50 yds. That's when I knew I needed to slug the bbl.
Didn't get any pressuure signs or hard extraction with that, so I'll start there. I should go mic the sized cases & the fired ones & see how much differance I have. That will tell me the chambers neck dia. Fired rounds fell out if I tipped the gun up.

[6.5 mike]

padawg, I are a dummy. Just realized you ment the wrapped boolits.

[pdawg_shooter]

Yep, if they will chamber ok you dont need to give them a final size. My rifles get their best accuracy when the cartridge chambers with a little resistance and the bullet is large enough to load in an unsized case.

[6.5 mike]

padawg, never tried that, but makes sense. I wrapped 10 this afternoon & will check the dia. tomorrow. I got 60 new norma cases not long after I go the gun & have 10 I fired not resized yet. I'll see how they fit after I mic them.
I sized the 185 to .309 & wrapped twice with #20 paper. Rolled the boolits on an old file to rough them up a bit. Thanks.

[docone31]

When you size them, and wrap them, you do not need to roughen up the casting.
When Ross Seyfried described the process, it was for jacketeds. Useing smaller than caliber jacketeds for patching.

[303Guy]

In my opinion, the .303 British is a winner.Oh yes! (And I am not biased).[smilie=1:

Might I ask what 'Clover' is?

Back to topic - I load (not patched - yet) with unsized cases but I use a molten 'waxy-lube' concoction to hold the bullet in place. This stuff seals the case and lubes the bullet (which has no lube grooves). Now reading this thread. I am interested in trying paper patching. (I have had the thought on back burner for some time). Time to make a mould for that purpose.

By the way, I have somehow formed the opinion that the 303 Savage is an ideal cast/paperpatch bullet cartridge. Would you folks agree?

[pdawg_shooter]

You do not need a special mould. Use what you have. Size to .001+ over bore diameter in a push through die and patch. My best 303 SMLE bullet is a 311414, sized .3045, wrapped with 16# printer paper. I lube with BAC and run through a .314 PT die for .415 finish diameter. Load to a little over 2650 with AA2495. Shoots into 2" @ 100 yds with issue sights.

[6.5 mike]

padawg, I checked the boolits this morning. Usized mic'ed .314 on nose & .321 on drive bands. Run them through a 311 sizer, they came out .312 nose & base.
The 10 fired cases I had mic'ed .338 od & .3125 id. I see now how this can work.
I'll make a dummy case when I get back & see how long I can seat them. Now I understand what you were talking about. Thanks
303 guy, the 303 sav is very close to a 30-30. Makes it user friendly, & a good choice for cast. Plus it hasn't been factory loaded in a long time.

[pdawg_shooter]

Any time mike. Good luck and have fun!

[303Guy]

.... Load to a little over 2650 with AA2495. Shoots into 2" @ 100 yds with issue sights.HOLY COW! I'm definately going to try paper patching! My latest bullet is a 210grainer and is a little under size. I was going to hone the mould out a bit but now I will try PP instead. Right now, I have no idea where to start and I have no idea what I am doing - but that has never stopped me before, so.... :Fire:

[pdawg_shooter]

Slug your bore, size the bullets .001 to .0015 over bore diameter, patch, lube and go shoot. You will be amazed at how easy it is!

[bandit7.5]

I am so glad to know that someone else is still shooting the 303Savage, I thought I was the
only one in this area. also when is the next Milton gunshow due , they don't advertize all the way over to Defuniak like they usd to.
Dan in DeFuniak

[303Guy]

I heard of a guy who prefered to to shoot 303 Savage ammo in his Lee Enfield 'because it worked better on moose'! Some folks thought that dangerous but looking at the case dimensions and the chamber dimentions, I see no reason why it would be unsafe in any way. I wouldn't want to try reloading those cases though!:mrgreen:

[6.5 mike]

303 guy, I forgot to answer your clover question, it's a brand name. They make lapping componds in assorted grits.
Bandit 7.5, Only way I know is when I see the signs along the side of the road.

[303Guy]

Thanks, 6.5 mike.:drinks:

Following from this thread I think I am going to have a whole lot of fun with my 1902 MkI Lee Enfield (with a good as new No4 barrel)! I have done some 'experimenting' with what I had and have found ZIG-ZAG Rice paper to be reasonably easy to apply and thin enough to use on my 'normal' cast bullets. So far, all I can say is the bore stayed clean and shiny and lubed after two shots! (I did lube the patched bullets in my ususual way - dipped in molten 'waxy-lube').

[6.5 mike]

This opens a whole new can of worms doesn't it, 303 guy. Have fun.

[303Guy]

Yes it does! I don't have the right 'tools' but I'm just experimenting with what I have and generally just having fun! (With the guidance of the good folks here on this forum).:drinks:

[bandit7.5]

303 guy, I forgot to answer your clover question, it's a brand name. They make lapping componds in assorted grits.
Bandit 7.5, Only way I know is when I see the signs along the side of the road.


That was the only way I found out about it also BUT now they don't set signs all the way to DeFuniak anymore,Nuts:groner: