newbie here with rolling block queries

[fish3006]

i'd love to get some advice on a gorgeous, near mint rolling block.

a friend of mine owns it. he has no intent to sell it, but he is not computer savvy. i told him i'd do some 'net research for him.

1) the rifle is said to be chambered in .43 egyptian. my friend has a box of .43 spanish rounds. i chambered a couple. they seemed to chamber perfectly, but i do understand there are differences between the two. i told him he needs to do a chamber cast to verify.
2) the stock has single "R" cartouche on the heel.
3) each of the barrel bands has a single "U" cartouche.
3) a single "B" cartouche is on the left side of the receiver.
4) no serial number is in evidence. the trigger guard lists "Remington and Sons, Illion ..." and various patent dates.
5) the rear ladder sight is beautifully milled.
6) the barrel has a bayonet lug.
7) the walnut stock, oil finished, is almost unmarked by handling, but it appears to be musket grade; definitely not a slick commercial type finish.
8) the bore and chamber look to be unfired. the firing pin hole look utterly unmarked by a primer ever in its life. muzzle bluing is intact. the cleaning rod is pristine.

perhaps a commercial rifle that got packed away upon purchase? i'd think that if it had ever been in an armory, more handling marks would be in evidence.

Once the chambering is established, my friend wants to fire it once, clean it, then display in a case with ammunition and - he hopes - a bayonet.

many thanks ahead of time,
paul

[fish3006]

By the way, I can post pictures later on ...

[Buckshot]

................If the rifle was first prize, my guess would be that it is indeed an 1879 Argentine contract Remington rolling block chambered in 43 Remington-Spanish. Atop the Knoxform between the rear sight and action ring it may be stamped "Modelo Argentino 1879 EN". If not it doesn't mean it's not an 1879 Argentine.

All I'd need to tell for sure would be a picture of the rear sight, as the 1879 Argentine had the best rear sight Remington ever put on a military RB.

" the rifle is said to be chambered in .43 egyptian. my friend has a box of .43 spanish rounds. i chambered a couple. "

If they chambered it's the 43 SPanish as the 43 Egyptian is much shorter and much fatter at the casehead end.

"no serial number is in evidence."

Remington didn't stamp them with serial numbers. You might find an assembly number stamped on the SIDE of the tang if you remove the buttstock, but it won't mean anything so far as identifying the rifle.

"the trigger guard lists "Remington and Sons, Illion ..." and various patent dates."

I think you mean the tang?

"each of the barrel bands has a single "U" cartouche."

The "U" is there and points as to how the barrel band is to be put on. The U's legs should point toward the muzzle.

"perhaps a commercial rifle that got packed away upon purchase? i'd think that if it had ever been in an armory, more handling marks would be in evidence."

When Argentina began looking around for a replacement rifle with the advent of smokless powder, it was apparent to Remington that no more orders would be forthcoming. It is believed that they had considerable stock on hand and they (without the Argentine markings) were assembled and sold on the domestic market. They may have been sold as being chambered in Remington 44-77 vs 43 Spanish.

When Argentina eventually obsoleted the rolling block they were returned to storage after going through a fairly substantial overhaul/rebuild program. Many hundreds of these rifles were surplused (probably several thousands) and most all were in very good to excellent condition. I have friends who remember seeing crates of them in gunshops and in distributers inventories.

http://www.fototime.com/7CD7CAD02940F78/standard.jpg

My 1879 Argentine Rem RB is on the bottom, with its bayonet above it.

That's a real shame that your pal plans to fire it once and then put it up.

................Buckshot

[fish3006]

Well, if it's that good, then maybe he ought to shoot it more often. I'll get a close-up of the rear sight and post. many thanks for the info.
by the way, are bayonets available?
and yep, of course it's the tang. getting old ...

[fish3006]

Oh yeah, no evident "modelo" marking ...

[singleshotman]

There are lots of them around without the markings and refinished/blued, cause my Father bought just like yours in 43 spanish.Not likely to be 43 Egyptian, unless arabic marked.As to shooting, there are TWO problems with this rifle-first it's chambered for a folded-head case, allmost all of them are, .090 rim, modern is .065.This can lead to head seperations.I can hear someone say what about"348winchester", don' t try it.Get some 44 basic brass as used for the 44/77 and full length size it.The`cases are almost the same, i've shot 43 spanish in an original Remington Creedmore.The outher problem is easy, these rifles are all chambered with a deep throut so black powder fouling will not matter, so seat the bullets out of the case for good shooting.O, i use 77grains FFG and 439186 cast 25/1, enought said.