405 Win mold

[Bullshop]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/bullshop/0d3e640f.jpg

Picking this up from the old sight some may recall I had good results with the NEI 400gn 416 DD RN bullets in the 405. This prompted me to have master mold carver MT. Mold Dan cut a cavity to what my minds eye saw as the best possible big game bullet for this caliber. In straight W/W it drops at .415" and 412gn. As usual he gave me just what I wanted and the whole project is working perty good. This was the first test with the new mold and I am well pleased with the results. Bullets are cast in straight W/W and sized .415" and lubed with speed green. First set of three in the pic was loaded with 50gn WC-846 and chronoed at 1700 fps. Second group had a one grain increase for 51gn but did not chrono. From the increased expansion I would guess they were doing 1800 or better. They were fired into old cotton wood at 100 yards. No problem holding 2 MOA at 100 yards flinches quivers and all. God willing I will have a test report on performance in bear flesh soon. For a died in the wool 45/70 man I like this 40 cal real good. With these 400 + gn bullets at the same speed I get with the same weight in the 45/70 the 405 should shoot a bit flatter and penitrate well. I have always set a 150 yard limit with the 45/70 and this rifle may add 100 yards to that with all the punch of the 45 and no more recoil. Guess T.R. was right BIG MEDICINE.
BIC/BS

[Bass Ackward]

[QUOTE=Bullshop Bullets are cast in straight W/W and sized .415" and lubed with speed green. First set of three in the pic was loaded with 50gn WC-846 and chronoed at 1700 fps. Second group had a one grain increase for 51gn but did not chrono. From the increased expansion I would guess they were doing 1800 or better. BIC/BS[/QUOTE]

Dan,

I always find it interesting what 100 fps more of strike velocity will do. And in truth, I think if you had chronod this, I'll bet the added velocity would have been closer to 50 fps difference in that large volume case.

But either way, look at the difference that it made in expansion. Now some will look at the photo and say, so what? Well the question to ask yourself is would there have been any expansion at all if the muzzle velocity were just 100 fps less at 1600 fps? Or would there be any expansion if the game was less tough than cotton wood? Then they don't realize that just 20 degrees less temperature in hunting season can affect velocity that much. Another thought, would the bullet have had major weight loss if the velocity had been just 100 fps faster at say 1900 fps?

So when people always ask how will my mix perform when hunting? How do you answer this without maybe setting someone up for failure if they push it too close in or out? The correct answer is to teach them to think. And .... that is harder said then done in a post.

The most difficult thing to .... teach someone or for them to learn, is how to adjust all the variables so they will work on their choice of game. Range, the toughness of the particular game you intend to hunt, the angle of the shots you intend to take, really determines the answer. The only humane way to answer that question, (and teach them to think for themselves) is to tell them .... to test it. Which in most cases they won't. This is human nature.

Or simply take the standard lead line; mold hard and use a wide meplat.
Thanks for the photo and the education.

[Magnum Mike]

I am impressed that those bullets are expanding at all, just goes to show what experience teaches you! I was under the impression that wheel weights were to hard for expansion. Are you heat treating or water quenching them Dan?

Good luck with your hunt! Keep us posted!!

[Bullshop]

I am impressed that those bullets are expanding at all, just goes to show what experience teaches you! I was under the impression that wheel weights were to hard for expansion. Are you heat treating or water quenching them Dan?

Good luck with your hunt! Keep us posted!!

Mike... nothing special, just air cooled straight WW. The superior expansion quality is probably the result of my minds eye design. ;-)

BIC/BS

[Magnum Mike]

Mike... nothing special, just air cooled straight WW. The superior expansion quality is probably the result of my minds eye design. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif

BIC/BSLOL!

I picked up a Ballisticast 265 WFNGC from one of the guys here that i have cast of water quenched WW's, sized .411", lubed with Speed Green and loaded over a few different charges of AA2015. I am planning on tryin them later today and if the chrono works (just got it back from being repaired) i should have speeds as well as groups!

I added a brake to the 405 (pic of it is my avatar) this winter and am hoping that will help with the accuracy as previously recoil was terrible! LOL!

[Wayne Smith]

Right now I'm buying LBT 15 Brinnell 350gr GC bullets off of AuctionArms - I forget who but he's always got some there. I hope to get that mold in the future, when I get some cash ahead. I'm shooting them just at 2000 fps with Benchmark, and I plan to add a couple of hundred to that when I get my rifle back with the reciever sight mounted.

At 2000 fps I'm getting no web expansion, no primer signs, and no extraction problems. I'll go up slowly and gradually, chronoing everything. This is out of a Win. 95.

[Magnum Mike]

Right now I'm buying LBT 15 Brinnell 350gr GC bullets off of AuctionArms Those are probably from Dan (Bullshop, Bullet Man Dan on Auction Arms).

I ran my loads over a chrono, Ballisticast 265 WFNGC Bullshop Speedgreen lube, 50 grains of AA2015, 1969fps.

Accuracy was terrible BUT i did get some good groups from the horribly expensive Barnes 300 X-bullets. Soooooooo, this in mind i came home and finally slugged the bore. I took a .360" hornady round ball and gave it a good wack with a hard rubber hammer flattening it nicely. I drove it thru the bore and WAAALA!! .412"!!! ARG! http://castboolits.gunloads.com/images/smilies/icon_mad.gif I havent had good luck with accuracy from this barrel and there is the obvious reason why.

I am guessing that i now need to find a mold and size my booilts to .413"??? Let me know what you guys think...

[Bullshop]

Mike
My barrel slugged at .4125". Closest die I had is a .412" and at that the 300gn and 350gn LBT/LFN bullets shot good not great but I thought they might do better if they were a couple .000" over groove. This prompted me to try the .417" bullets. They are from an NEI mold for a 400gn round nose DD/gc for the 416 Rem and such. They were hard at BHN24 and sized at .417". They seated snuggly in fired but unsized cases and chambered freely. With these hard over size round nose bullets I shot several 3 shot groups well under 2"/100yds. Funny thing is if they were softer they didnt work as well. Since I want to hunt with it and not just shoot paper I wanted to size cases for trouble free chambering as the unsized cases after about four shots were begining to drag a bit. So knowing that this barrel will shurley stabalise a very long bullet I had Dan make a mold. I wanted it to drop W/W at a couple .000" over my groove of .4125" and as I said they come out at .415" Since custom sizer service is a spotty thing I am lubeing them in the .417" die. The .0025" over groove seems to be working well but they do seat in sized cases with a bit of resistance. The die set should have an expander a couple .000" larger. I did a little research and found that most of the origonal Winchester rifles were closer to .415". Havent heard what the new ones are. This will be another cal that is a problem for bullet sellers due to a wide variation in barrel dimensions between new and old production and custom barrels. I sent out some bullets to a customer in .412" for his custom barreled 405 and these gave him poor results. He then sent me a slugg from his barrel that miked .4155" so you see what I mean. Let me know what you do for a sizer die as I am in the market for something like a .414"
BIC/BS

[Magnum Mike]

Since i have a Saeco i would have to go the route of http://www.sizingdie.com/stdprice1.htm . I would have to buy another .411" sizer and send to him for opening to .414". Total cost of about $60-$65 with all the shipping back and forth. I dont know of anyplace offering molds of .414-.415" short of havin' MM make one. I guess i could always look for a .416" mold and go from there...

[Buckshot]

................Size dies can lie. They don't always size the slug to what's stamped on'em, and a more alloyed boolit can have some springback to it. To open a die a thou and a half or two, is no big deal.

..............Buckshot

[Magnum Mike]

................Size dies can lie. They don't always size the slug to what's stamped on'em, and a more alloyed boolit can have some springback to it.Indeed! I check mine as i am aware of springback. My Saeco .411" is sizing to .411" with most of the molds i have. my .476" sizer is sizing water quenched wheel weights to like .4755". :(

[arkypete]

Right now I'm buying LBT 15 Brinnell 350gr GC bullets off of AuctionArms - I forget who but he's always got some there. I hope to get that mold in the future, when I get some cash ahead. I'm shooting them just at 2000 fps with Benchmark, and I plan to add a couple of hundred to that when I get my rifle back with the reciever sight mounted.

At 2000 fps I'm getting no web expansion, no primer signs, and no extraction problems. I'll go up slowly and gradually, chronoing everything. This is out of a Win. 95.


Wayne

I got Mountain Molds to make a flat nosed, bore riding nose, gas checked, 350 grain bullet mold, to use on my now delayed African trip. This bullet has proved to be accurate in my model 95. I've found that a case full of IMR 3031 works very well.
I was also lucky to win the bid on a NEI 330 round nosed gas checked bullet mold on Ebay. I've not shot many of these but will get to it this spring and summer. The few I did shoot, I used the same powder charge as the 350 grainers.
The 405, model 95 combination makes one powerful and accurate combo.
Jim

[Gunload Master]

Good to see you made it jim :)

[Wayne Smith]

Mike, yup, that's him!

Dan, when my gunsmith gets my '95 back to me I'm gonna have to order some more bullets. I've got all the last bunch loaded, and when I get back I'm gonna empty some brass!

Jim, Benchmark is 3031 on mild steroids. I'm not quite filling the case. Do you know the velocity you're getting with 3031 and the 350gr.?

[arkypete]

Wayne
I truely don't know the velocity.
I'm using some data that I got off Accurate Reloading from a fella that's a whole lot braver then I. I'm using a few grains less then what he uses with his 400 Woodleigh jacketed bullets with my 350 grain cast.
He was pushing some where close to 2,100 fps with his 400 grainers. :-?
Jim

[Bullshop]

For anyone interested the new Mountain Mold design will be added to the Accurate Arms auction list soon. The 400+gn one in the test pic starting this thread.
BIC/BS

[Magnum Mike]

For anyone interested the new Mountain Mold design will be added to the Accurate Arms auction list soon. The 400+gn one in the test pic starting this thread.
BIC/BS That is a GC boolit, right? If so, i will buy some to test that diameter in my 405. ;) Let me know and i will just buy em direct from ya and avoid the auction fees for ya...

[Bullshop]

Mike
Yes it is a gas check design. I (BS Mom) just orderd a .413" and a .414" sizer dies so we will be able to offer them in .412" .413" .414" and .415" diameters. Let me know how hard you would like yours and I will get them ready. We still have deep snow but I just cant wait any longer. Bout friday I am going to try to get up in the mountains. Plan to 4 wheel as far as i can then snow shoe in and camp a couple days. Will have to carry my supplies on my back so wont be more than a couple days. If you dont hear from me in a week or so guess the bears musta won.
BIC/BS

[Magnum Mike]

Hardness? - water quenched wheel weights (or similar)
Diameter? - .414" (and i will wait for that new sizer to show)
Quantity? - 50 (should tell me what i need to know)

Thanks! Shoot me an email when there ready and i will get payment to ya. ;)

BTW, if that sizer dont show before you leave, GOOD LUCK!!! I hope to see a pic of a bruin killed by the mighty 405! :D I think Teddy said of the 405, "it kills on one end and maims on the other!" LOL! :D