Just got a Krag...What can I expect

[35 Whelen]

I bought a Krag last week and it just came in. I know practically nothing about them, but to me, the case, what with its long neck, looks like a good cast bullet cartridge.
The rifle is a carbine, and at some point, some one put a barrel off an 03A3. It a Remington 4-groove dated 4-44 and is extremely clean inside. No copper fouling at all and the chamber looks as though it were cut yesterday. It has the original 03A3 sight on the barrel and has had a Williams receiver sight installed on it.
I did have any brass, so I lube ten 303 cases and forced them into the Krag chamber which set the shoulder back. I then neck sized them using my 308 die, primed them, charged them with 12.0 grs. of Red Dot and seated some odd cast bullets I had laying around. All ten fired OK, though it was dark so I couldn't group it.
So, what kind of accuracy are these rifles capable of? I noticed at the CMP 2007 National Trophy Vintage Military Rifle Match a Krag took 2nd place. Anyone have any experience with these?
Thanks,
35W

[madsenshooter]

Your 03A3 barrel is likely to have more consistent groove diameter than the original Krag barrels. Their groove diameters could be anywhere from .307 to over .314. The fellow that got second in 2007 was shooting a light load with Hornady 220gr bullets. 308284 or 311284 were designed for the Krag. Back in 1906 accuracy at 600 yards with boolits from these molds were found to be on par with the service load. Your .303 brass will be a little short in the neck, but usable until you get some cases. I seem to do more loading than shooting and the best I've gotten so far has been with the Lee CTL312-1602R. I've been experimenting with the Belding & Mull 311169 with so far dismal results. Lots of data floating around here on this site. Enjoy it.

[35 Whelen]

Oops!! Forgot to mention. I slugged the barrel and it measured .3077" x .299". And soooo smooth. When sluggin it, by the time the lead ball had cleared the muzzle, I was able to push it the remainder of the way with my 1/4" oak dowel.
35W

[Throwback]

Enjoy. It sounds like you have a good one. I was very fortunate to have an almost mint original bore on my 3rd Krag. Good bores and Krags are not common I am finding. I use H4895 for hunting loads almost exclusively although I will be testing IMR 4064 and 3031 this summer as well. I use 311291 & 311264 and will be adding 311299 to the mix. So far I had one that would tollerate the 311014 but the other two would not because of its flat nose profile.

I haven't shot anything lighter. I use 2400 for target and pest loads. And I will be trying 5744 in the same role. I shot a few for groups last summer and think I may use it in stead of the 2400. Incidentally I have used the 311314 loaded in 303 cases for sqib loads with great success a la CH Harris with cases modified and suitably marked so as not to be used with normal loads.

You will find the Krag to be an easy cartridge to load for. It is one of my favorites. You can use jacketed data in similar bullet weights to develop your loads and you can prety much duplicate factory loads in heavier bullets.

[Char-Gar]

In bench vise now is a barreled action and stock for which I am performing a marrage. The action is a 1901 Krag and the barrel is a new 2 groove Remington 03A3 barrel I had fitted. The barrel was chambered with a reamer ground to minimum specs. It will chamber factory ammo.

I have high expectations for accuracy from this rifle. I have yet to slug the barrel and probably won't bother. 03A3 barrels are speced to .300 to .301 across the lands IIRC. Yours sounds a smidge tight for the specs.

You have a fine rifle and should give you good accuracy if the metal and wood have a good marriage.

[shotman]

you made 30-40 out of 303 by FORCING in the chamber? OK I would guess you shoot 30-40 in a 303 ? and some wonder why a gun blows up

[leadman]

30-40 brass is a seasonal item and is somewhat hard to come by right now, although I bought some a month or so ago.
I think what 35W did was force empty 303 brass into the Krag chamber. The cases are similar so I can see where this would work. Not the first time I heard of this.

[madsenshooter]

you made 30-40 out of 303 by FORCING in the chamber? OK I would guess you shoot 30-40 in a 303 ? and some wonder why a gun blows up

No problem here. Headspace is controlled by the rim. Making cases for your Krag out of .303 British is perfectly safe. 30/40 in the .303 won't work, the neck of the Krag is too long. I have read that right after WWII it was common practice to cut the neck about 1/10" longer in a .303 British chamber so that then more available 30/40 Krag ammo could be fired in them, probably none too accurate, but they went boom. You should probably do a little more homework before making such comments

[MtGun44]

I would suggest that criticizing somebody when you don't know much
is not a good thing. :roll:

No problems with this rough and ready way to make a few test loads.
Rimmed cases are different than rimless. .303 Brit and Krag are very
close.

My Krag "carbine" (cut down rifle in a real carbine stock; don't blame
me I didn't do it) with a temp front sight shot very well right off the
bat with cast. Sounds like you got a good barrel on that one.

Bill

[35 Whelen]

you made 30-40 out of 303 by FORCING in the chamber? OK I would guess you shoot 30-40 in a 303 ? and some wonder why a gun blows up

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. " -Mark Twain :kidding:

LOL...Just kidding shotman. What I did was pefectly safe or I wouldn't have done it.

After "sizing" the the 303 brass in the Krag chamber, they chambered fairly easily during subsequent firings. Ironically, I bought a few once fired Krag cases from a board member and it was all I could do to get the bolt to close when chambering them. Evidently they had been fired in a rifle with a very generous chamber. I lubed them prior to firing thinking maybe they might form to the chamber a bit better, but it just wasn't so.
No matter, I have a set of 30-40 dies enroute and I'll be in business. I did get to hastily fire a few reloads. One load, consisting of 10.0 grs. of Red Dot and a Lyman 311672 sized to .310" grouped 5 shots into 3" at 100 yds., with three of the five going into one inch or maybe a bit less. Might have been a fluke, but I'll do more shooting after my dies arrive.
35W

[StarMetal]

You got lucky, very lucky. A Krag with what can be considered a new up to modern specs in bore dimensions barrel. Couldn't ask for more the that. That should be one heck of shooter. My original Krag has a fairly tight and good bore so I was lucky too. One of my favorite rifles and cartridge. Have fun, and you will, with it.

Joe

[Char-Gar]

What can you expect? A good Krag with a good barrel and a proper fitting cast bullet, a good load and a good rifleman will shoot right alongside of an 03 or 03A3 Springfield in terms of raw accuracy. A stock 03A3 tends to shoot a little better than the others due to a better rear sight and not raw accuracy.

What is this? Well anything over 2 MOA isn't up to snuff. 1.50 MOA is about the best you can hope for on a regular basis. 1.5 to 1.8 MOA is our playground. The occasional 1 MOA group will turn up. That group is a fluke..keep it to impress your friends, but don't try to repeat in front of them. :-) Lying about such things is a venal sin and not a motal sin.

You have a great rifle which will give you a lifetime of enjoyment and you can pass it on to your heirs for their enjoyment. It just may be in generations to come, the only way to get these great things is to have them handed down. That is a good reason, never to sell the core of your gun collection. Have your trading stock you play with for a time and then you sell it down river. But the good stuff stays in another pile.

[KCSO]

Uh... 30-40 is THE best brass for the 303. Yes you have to trim it but the base of the case is larger and it actually fits war time 303's better than factory 303 brass. 30-40 brass in 303 will give you 10 or more reloads in FULL power loads without seperation. 303 is short for the 30-40 and since the case head is smaller it it less than ideal although safe for cast loads. You lose the advantage of the long case neck though.

BUT.. I see that Remington and Winchester have dropped Krag brass back to SEASONAL and right now everyone is out of it.

[TAWILDCATT]

what about boxer russian 7.62 X 54 how close is that???it might be long enuf.
Its amazing how many military cases were mating tho not the caliber.
8 mm lebel /348 win,43 mauser/45/90.8mm mauser-06-7mm-ect.:coffee:[smilie=1:

[StarMetal]

what about boxer russian 7.62 X 54 how close is that???it might be long enuf.
Its amazing how many military cases were mating tho not the caliber.
8 mm lebel /348 win,43 mauser/45/90.8mm mauser-06-7mm-ect.:coffee:[smilie=1:


The Russian case is way fatter in the web and rim. It's a no go.

Joe

[JSH]

"Oops!! Forgot to mention. I slugged the barrel and it measured .3077" x .299". And soooo smooth. When sluggin it, by the time the lead ball had cleared the muzzle, I was able to push it the remainder of the way with my 1/4" oak dowel."

I may be in left field here but. I would slug it again. Push the ball up into the throat a ways, then drive it back out. Take a lead ball and give it a whack with a lead hammer at the muzzle, then tap it out. I find egg sinkers of various sizes to work well at the muzzle.
Not saying your barrel is bad or it won't shoot. Sounds like well intending souls have cleaned it from the muzzle and worn it some. I am going to guess you may come up with some different measurments at the muzzle from what you describe.
jeff