Short-barreled Shotguns...

[BCB]

Sawed-off I believe is a better name for them...A family member has several shotguns he is giving away to relatives. Is a shotgun with a very short barrel--it has had "custom" work done--on a shotgun illegal to own or is it just illegal to use for hunting purposes? And, is the length of the barrel measured from the bolt face to the end of the barrel? Thanks...BCB

[Johnch]

18" is the min length .
I normaly like 18 1/8"or 1/4" incase some one has a short ruler .

Not sure if shorter is legal to own , but a big NO NO if on the gun .

Johnch

[Shepherd2]

Without checking I think 18 inches is the minimum. I have a factory barrel that is 18 1/2". The extra half inch probably a good idea depending on who might be measuring.

Reading the paper last night there was a story from Selma, NC. The police found "two batches of human remains" on this man's farm. They charged him with first degree murder also with "possessing marijuana and a weapon of mass destruction - a sawed-off shotgun". That's a new use for the term WMD as far as I know.

Some LEOs that I know have 14" barrels on their shotguns. Those guns are registered with the BATFE. Sure are handy little things.

[Herb in Pa]

(M1) The types of firearms that must be registered in the National Firearm Registration and Transfer Record are defined in the NFA and in 27 CFR Part 179.
Some examples of the types of firearms that must be registered are:

Machineguns;
The frames or receivers of machineguns;
Any combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting weapons into machineguns;
Any part designed and intended solely and exclusively for converting a weapon into a machinegun;
Any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the control of a person;
Silencers and any part designed and intended for fabricating a silencer;
Short-barreled rifles;
Short-barreled shotguns;
Destructive devices; and,
"Any other weapons."

[grumble]

Yep, a shotgun must have an 18" barrel, measured from the bolt face to the muzzle, and be 36" in overall length.

As a "destructive weapon," a separate tax stamp ($200, IIRC) must be available for each short barreled shotgun. Interestingly, the only SCOTUS case on the 2nd Amendment (Miller) was over a sawed off shotgun. And, they're the reason Randy Weaver got in trouble to begin with.

[Shepherd2]

The AP story said "a weapon of mass destruction". If they had said an unlicensed destructive weapon I wouldn't have thought twice about it. I think either the police or the press used the wrong term.

[grumble]

"...I think either the police or the press used the wrong term."

HA!! Or both. Dramatics are much more important to them than accuracy.

[wills]

Definitions of weapon of mass destruction on the Web:

Any weapon or device that is intended, or has the capability, to cause death or serious bodily injury to a significant number of people through the release, dissemination, or impact of toxic or poisonous chemicals or their precursors, a disease organism, or radiation or radioactivity.
www.csa.com/hottopics/terror/gloss.php

a weapon that kills or injures civilian as well as military personnel (nuclear and chemical and biological weapons)
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Weapons of mass destruction (WMD) generally include nuclear, biological, chemical and, increasingly, radiological weapons. The term first arose in 1937 in reference to the mass destruction of Guernica, Spain, by aerial bombardment. Following the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and progressing through the Cold War, the term came to refer more to non-conventional weapons. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weapon_of_mass_destruction





Not the same thing, I think as a Class III

[fourarmed]

Grumble, didn't you mean to type 26" instead of 36"?

[grumble]

Oops. Yep, it's 26".

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/14mar20010800/edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2002/aprqtr/27cfr178.11.htm

"Short-barreled rifle. A rifle having one or more barrels less than
16 inches in length, and any weapon made from a rifle, whether by
alteration, modification, or otherwise, if such weapon, as modified, has
an overall length of less than 26 inches.
Short-barreled shotgun. A shotgun having one or more barrels less
than 18 inches in length, and any weapon made from a shotgun, whether by
alteration, modification, or otherwise, if such weapon as modified has
an overall length of less than 26 inches."

[waksupi]

A friend of mine, now retired from the Kalispell PD, told me about trying to register in a sawed off shotgun for department use, that had been confiscated. They dealt with the BATF main office for eight months, with no success. But lots of aggravation. Then the BATF field agent happened to be in the PD one day. They told him the problem, and he says, geez, that shouldn't be a problem at all. So, he called the main office. Within five minutes, he was also frustrated, and was calling the agency minion an incompetent *******. So, we see it even runs true within the agency. Hard to tell what a civilian would have to go through!

[357maximum]

Awhile back I was at the yocal sheriff dept. registering a smith model 36. I had been mulling over building a miniature break action .22 single shot 22 so I asked the officer and then she asked another and then they asked the CLEO, then he called the state police down the road. Never did get a 100% answer to my question. They kinda come up with " you can I think, but it has never been done before". According to batf I can, according to state law i think I can if I serial it and get it inspected. Never have felt sure enough to " Finish" it.

If the law don't know the law how do they expect us to. I get nervous every time I register a handgun even though I know I am all good, how is that a free society.

[KCSO]

Prior to building any hand gun you need to apply for and recive a manufacturers license. This takes about 6 weeks to 6 months depending. When you have the license in hand then you can start building. This especially applies if you are using any parts from a long gun, say a frame from an H and R. I can check and give you the form numbers as a friend manufactures barels for Walther pistols and makes silencers and has all the blank forms. We are thinking about using Rossi's to build up Mares Leg pistols.

[Scrounger]

Awhile back I was at the yocal sheriff dept. registering a smith model 36. I had been mulling over building a miniature break action .22 single shot 22 so I asked the officer and then she asked another and then they asked the CLEO, then he called the state police down the road. Never did get a 100% answer to my question. They kinda come up with " you can I think, but it has never been done before". According to batf I can, according to state law i think I can if I serial it and get it inspected. Never have felt sure enough to " Finish" it.

If the law don't know the law how do they expect us to. I get nervous every time I register a handgun even though I know I am all good, how is that a free society.

You have to get a Manufacturer's License from BATF.

[357maximum]

So what you are telling me is that if I apply and recieve the permit, I could take an old H&R reciever and build up a handgun similar to the old handi gun ( i.e pistol they made for a VERY limited time)? does the rifling rule still apply ? I assume so . I woul also like permission to START my single shot 22. Form numbers would be appreciated are the fees aren't outrageous?