Lathe Electrical Question

[Char-Gar]

Well, the lathe bench is built and the next project is to mount the lathe and get the motor hooked up. It is a 9 X 18 Logan (1947)and uses a 1/3 horse 110 volt) 1725 rpm motor. The old motor seems to run just fine, so I will use it until it dies. but the wires and switch much be replaced.

I am an electrical ignoramus so here are two questions:

1. What kind of an on/of switch do I need? Let's talk cheap here.
2. What kind of cable/wire do I need?

Thanks for any help you can give.

[Sprue]

Google Drum Switch.... they ain't cheap tough.

I've almost got my lathe ready to go too. I got lucky, a Furnas 58R44 Drum Switch came (NIB) with mine. Think mine was made in 1945.

Good Luck

[John Taylor]

Depends on if it is a reversible motor. If it is a one way only you can get by with a 20 amp light switch. If you have more than 3 wires coming out of the motor then you need a drum switch.

[dpaultx]

WOW . . . First post here and it's actually something I know a little about.

I also have a 1947 vintage Logan lathe. Mines a model 820, 10"x24", but it has the same 1/3HP, 110v/1P, 1725 RPM motor. I've had the lathe for about 5 years and have totally restored it, from a near "basket case" condition, but, that's a different story.

If you only wanted the motor to run in ONE direction (forward OR reverse), a simple wall type light switch would suffice.

If you want the motor to run in BOTH directions (forward AND reverse) the minimum you would need would be a double pole/double throw/center-off toggle switch also known as a DPDT/ON-OFF-ON. You can find one at Radio Shack for probably $3 to $6. Make sure you get one rated for at least 10 amps at 120VAC .

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n97/clinia/P4060002-1.jpg

The problem with the little toggle switch is that in the midst of the heat of "turning", when you really NEED to stop the lathe RIGHT NOW, it's real easy to over-run the center-off position of the little toggle switch and thus throw the machine into automatic reverse. Needless to say, this is very hard on the machine.

The better way to go is to use a "drum switch" which I'm sure is what came on your machine originally. A drum switch does the same switching as the DPDT/ON-OFF-ON toggle, but it has a larger lever and a much longer "throw" between the forward/off/reverse positions. Much more user friendly and much easier on the machine as well as your nerves.

http://i.ebayimg.com/20/!BOqDolgBmk~$(KGrHgoOKiMEjlLmV6SyBJvvfvCN0!~~_1.JP G

A brand new drum switch can run $60 to $90 but I've seen lots of used ones go for under $10 on sleazE-BAY. Usually all they need is a good cleaning inside.

For wire, 12 gauge AWG stranded copper is what you really want, but 14 gauge would probably suffice.

The real trick to wiring up ANY switch to these motors lies in finding the correct forward/reverse leads inside of the motor itself. All of the lead wires inside of the motor will have identifying number tags on them (or the numbers may be molded into the plastic wire coverings) but some different motor manufacturers use different numbering systems.

In case you didn't know, the Logan Lathe company is actually still in business under the name Logan Actuator Co. (http://www.lathe.com/) and is currently run by Scott Logan, the grandson of the companies founder. They no longer make complete machines but do have lots of New-Old-Stock parts as well as some newly made replacement parts. Make sure that you're sitting down if you visit their website and start looking at the replacement part prices.

There is also a Logan Lathe Users Group (http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/lathe-list/) over on Yahoo that has tons of information about Logan lathes and lots of really great members with years of knowledge and experience using these fine old pieces of American Iron.

HTH . . . All good . . . Doug

[Dean D.]

Welcome to Cast Boolits Doug!

What a way to kick off your first post here, your post is very informative and great job with the pictures!

[Springfield]

Wow, I've got an old Dunlap lathe with one of those drum switches on it. Didn't know is was anything special. Now to get the lathe running!

[Char-Gar]

Thanks guys, your responses have been a big help. Now, for the next stupid question... Do I really need a motor that reverses on this lathe? The antique one that came with it is set up to turn in only one direction. I don't know if it can be reversed or not, but it is not set up that way.

[Sprue]

I'm not going to be running mine in reverse but I do have the setup to do it if I want.

Running it in forward direction you won't have to worry about your chuck hitting the floor, or worse.

Go ahead and hook it up the most econnomical as you can.

You got pics of that bad boy?

[Char-Gar]

Sprue et al.... Well, I dismounted the motor from the countershaft and played with it abit. I noticed a toggle switch on the motor housing. Well that little puppy will reverse the direction of the motor. So, I got that covered. if I need to reverse the motor. I don't see any need for a drum switch to keep from overunning the stop and going into reverse. Should I need to reverse the motor a flick of the toggle will "get er done!".

So, all I need is some kind of 20 amp on/off switch and new wiring..right? The old wiring looks real scary. I will take this down to a place that works on electric motors and have the new wiring, plug and switch done. While there, I will have them look over the motor and make sure it is not a fire waiting to happen.

The motor is a 1/3 hp/1750 rpm/110 volt/60 cycle/6 amp Kenmore/sears. It has a shaft on each ends with oil ports in the motor housing which is iron or steel. It has four long screws with acorn nuts holding it together. It is mounted on a cast iron base that looks to have been intended for a bench grinder. The whole gizmo is bolted to the countershaft with of all things....carrage bolts.

I would like to keep the old motor if possible, as not only am I cheap, but I just like old things that work. Anybody has any feelings about the serviceabity of these old motors?

It has been many years since I ran a lathe and I have alot of learning and relearning to do. I have wanted a lathe for 50 years. I bought this one ten years ago, but due to changing jobs and not living in my own home, it has not been set up. Now for the first time since 1969, I have my own home (debt free I might ad) and a real shop. My shop is only 20 X 20 feet, but it feels huge to me.

Life for me is pretty damn good right now!

It will be this summer before the shop is fully set up. When it is, I will take some pics and post them. The folks on this board have been my chief resource as I have put it together. They have always come through will the knowledge and expertise I lack. I am truly greatful to you all.

[andremajic]

Congratulations on your logan lathe! They're great machines.

When the motor finally dies, or you just want to upgrade, buy a Variable speed drive and a 3 phase motor. Not only are the 3ph motors cheap and easy to find, but the Variable speed drive can control how fast you run the motor, so you have an unlimited range of speeds to run it in - forward or reverse. (Very useful for threading.)

I bought my lathe with a burnt out motor, so I HAD to replace it and that's the setup that I got for it currently. Brand new Baldor 1hp motor, and a mitsubishi vsd.
(Cost was 250.00 for both.)

I grind all my lathe bits by hand (HSS), with a special jig to set a compound angle that I built. Finishing it off with a honing stone will get a really nice finish to the metal being turned. Results - Nothing but blue chips!

If you get a chance, go to www.lathe.com and order yourself a parts manual for your model of logan, or call them by phone. Scott Logan is very knowledgable and I was surprised to find him personally answering my phone calls.

Andy.

[JIMinPHX]

Hi Charger,
The official answer to your original question is that you need a motor starter switch with thermal overload protection. You can find one here - http://web2.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Motor_Controls/Fuji_Manual_Motor_Starters/45mm_Frame_Width


The unofficial answer is that a 20 amp switch like the one shown above will probably work for a while, but will not protect the motor from overloading & burning itself up if you push it too hard or if you have a short.

14 ga wire is plenty heavy for wiring that thing up. You can get away with S-cord (SJ or SO or SOW, etc from Home Depot), but you are better off getting MC (metal case) wire because hot chips coming off the lathe will not melt through it.

As for the old motors with the cast iron housings, you can actually still get them, but you pay a lot extra. Cast iron is considered a premium option now. Its better for heat dissipation & gives the motor more beef. Old motors are good motors as long as they are in good condition. The only exception to that, is the old motors don't hold up well on a variable frequency drive because the insulation on the old windings isn't resistant to corona effect, but that isn't an issue here since it's a single phase motor & will therefor never see a VFD.

[Char-Gar]

Jim......Thanks you for the information. I took the motor down to our local electric motor place which has been in business for over 60 years. They pronounced the motor to be in excellent shape, but in need of new bushings, which they replaced. They also rewired the motor with heavy wire for the plug in and switch. Their motor "Yoda" told me the motor was made about 1920.

I installed a simple 20 amp switch and it has been running great for a couple of months now.

I will certainly consider upgrading the switch, but the lathe has been running since 1947 on a simple 15 or 20 amp switch.

Andre ---- I bought a reprint of the manual from Logan Actuators shortly after I bought the lathe. Then the seller found the original and sent it to me. So, I am flush with manuals and past's lists for the lathe.

It is working just fine and seems to be in excellent shape. It is teaching me allot. I was turning a slight taper (.004 in 12 inches), but set the tailstock over a half a hair. and took that out.

[Clark]

I am my 4th lathe, and my wife is the third woman I have lived with.
Try to learn how to choose a better lathe or woman next time.
I have lived with my wife for 32 years, and my latest lathe for a week.
I think I now have the right woman and the right lathe.

I got the third of those lathes when a friend died.
A 1938 Atlas Craftsman.
I realized he had not taken advantage of his aftermarket 1/5 h.p. motor.
I added a reverse switch.