Teach me about Mace/pepper spray

[Jeffery8mm]

Good day to y'all!! I am seeking info on pepper spay/mace type personal defence. I have NO knowledge of these products. I have a 18 year old daughter that is in college full time and works at a bank full time. Full schedule!! Some of her classes are at night and she closes at the bank some nights. There are other folks at the bank so she is not alone there. I wish I could just arm her with a 38spl as she is a pretty good shot with one, but that is not an option now. I want to arm her with a GOOD spray product. ANY suggestions are much appreciated.
What brands are best. Is there a shelf/purse life on this stuff??
Thanks for the help!!!
Jeff

[Old Ironsights]

Kimber (http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/product/0044111228579a.shtml) sells a nicely pocketable version (http://www.life-act.com/pepperblaster.php)that doesn't look like a "typical" spray bottle.

OTOH, if she lives in a jurisdiction that "allows" it, then get her a genuine Tazer (ML18 or C2).

[danski26]

We carry "First Defense" made by Defense Thechnology Federal Laboratories. It has a 5 year shelf life. It works fine.

[FN in MT]

We took the Class, got sprayed (NO fun at all) and carried OC spray on our duty belts. In our area once a few of the local ###holes got sprayed......that was pretty much it. NO ONE and I mean no one wanted to get sprayed. All a Trooper had to do with a non compliant person was to pull it out of his belt holder...and they did whatever you wanted. It surely works.

A good stream to the face and 98% of the population is DOWN. There are a small per centage though that can fight through it...especially if they have been trained to or have been sprayed before...so they know the sensations are short lived.

My wife has a can and my 82 year old Mom has a can as well. One can go online and buy everything from junk to the good stuff. I would suggest buying from a Police Supply house and getting a can at least 1 1/2" in diameter and 3"-4" tall. The itty bitty cans scare me...too small should one need a 2nd or 3rd spray.

Whatever you buy , try it out...notice how far the spray will travel. Pick a spot on a wall and shoot for it. Let her get a feel for effective distance for use. Be aware of the WIND. Obviously do not spray INTO the wind. Teach your daughter to spray, then sidestep to get away from the threat.

Lastly....is OC Spray legal where she lives? Or legal to carry?

FN in MT

Update....First Defense MK 3, 1 1/4" diam x 4" tall. 1.47 OZ. Red label, with a safety over the release button. Label states..... " 8 one second bursts". Defense Technology corp, Casper, WY.

[Jeffery8mm]

Great replies so far guys!!! I have seen some of the "junk" for sale in the little key chain cans and stayed away from them. I will check with a local sherriffs deputy buddy of mine and see if he can help me with a purchase. The local gun shop carries some, but I dont remember the brand.etc.
What does OC stand for??
Thanks
Jeff

[azrednek]

Follow the previous poster's advice and seek a Police Supply or Police uniform supplier. They may or may not sell it to you. Read the percentage of the active ingredient and be careful of where the decimal point is placed. USPS dog spray is .010 where Police stuff is .10 or greater. A brand for public consumption could possibly be less than 1% and a Police supply may have a brand for the public that is much weaker than what is sold to cops. Some Police suppliers require Police ID before selling anything. If you know a cop ask him/her to get it for you.

Mace was a trade name of Smith & Wesson. Original Mace contained liquefied tear gas. S&W sold rights to the name and you might see drug store strength CS with the Mace name. What was originally packaged as Mace is no longer manufactured. Real Mace was causing permanent eye damage and as usual the courts favored the bad guys.

[azrednek]

What does OC stand for??
Thanks
Jeff


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_spray

I was a mailman for 20+ years. Very effective on dogs and on a few occasions used it on some "minorities". Even as weak as the USPS stuff is, it put them on the ground.

[Bret4207]

I've sprayed quite a few people. I've also sprayed myself multiple times, stupid triggers catch on stuff. It's not something that will knock you on the ground and if the BG knows it's coming all he has to do is turn his face away.

All I'm saying is it's better than nothing, but it's not a gun.

[94Doug]

It also may depend on what level of OC % you are allowed to carry in your State as well.

[azrednek]

the BG knows it's coming all he has to do is turn his face away.



That is what one creep did to me after spitting tobacco juice in my face because I wouldn't give him the food stamps for a vacant house. I put a stream right into his ear and it had to be flushed by out by fireman. I was almost suspended without pay over the incident but the creep never f...d with a mailman again.

[WickedGoodOutdoors]

You do need to train with it to get a fist hand idea of how it works. My first experaince was with the military grade tear gas in boot when they look everyone in a room with our gas masks on and then light the teargas. First one to bail out buys the beer.


You can get a decent varity pack at Cabelas that has 3 size bottles. Its call bear spray but works on bad guys too. 2.0% CRC


http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=froogle-cat603238&id=0054108229005a&navCount=1&podId=0054108&parentId=cat603238&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IK&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat601233&hasJS=true



Also. I am allergic to Bees so I allways have some Bee spray handy. Ever get this stuff in your eyes and down your throut? You kinda get distracted.

http://www.backyardstyle.com/shop/shop_image/product/44498fd87b9d5fe5807dd17c62b5995a.jpg


NOTE: Even though they have that Raciest comment on the can I still purchace their products!~:kidding:


Almost had to spray some Bees at the Gas Station last night at O dark Thiry.

[Geraldo]

All the OC spray points have been covered, but don't stop there. I would recommend a good flashlight. You could get her a Surefire E2D, although any of them of similar size can be used as a short stick for hammer strikes. You could also check out the Gladius light or Pelican 7060, which are not cheap but have a strobe setting. Like spray, it's not 100%, but a buddy of mine volunteered to get strobed and it screwed up his eyeballs for a minute or two.

The best thing to do is to teach her to think and be aware of what's going on around her. The best fight is the one you avoid.

[Jeffery8mm]

Fox labs spray has been recommended to me. Any experience out there??
Jeff

[robertbank]

I've sprayed quite a few people. I've also sprayed myself multiple times, stupid triggers catch on stuff. It's not something that will knock you on the ground and if the BG knows it's coming all he has to do is turn his face away.

All I'm saying is it's better than nothing, but it's not a gun.

Bears like it with just a touch of white wine and warm liver.:mrgreen: I prefer a gun.

Take Care

Bob

[Jeffery8mm]

Bears like it with just a touch of white wine and warm liver.:mrgreen: I prefer a gun.

Take Care

Bob

I seriously doubt a bear will charge across the parking lot of Meridian Community College and attack her. As stated, A gun is out. We are talking about a school campus and bank parking lot. Not welcome places for guns in todays society.
Jeff

[waksupi]

Take a look at Counter Assault. It is made locally here, mainly for grizzly bears.

http://www.counterassault.com/

[9.3X62AL]

OC spray is almost guaranteed to have at least some effect on the deliverer as well as the intended recipient. I'm one of those lucky enough to not be strongly effected by the stuff, but it darn sure isn't "comfortable". OC came online at my agency toward the end of my career, and since I and my sergeant weren't curled up by the spray--and were known at the time as The Jurassic Narcs--the conclusion was reached that OC spray was not effective as dinosaur repellant.

As a part of familiarization and training for the operator, fire some into the wind so that the operator gets some idea of felt effect during a real-time application sequence. Some people are profoundly disabled by the stuff, and it is best to know that before deploying the spray in a critical incident. Bad guys don't always approach from downwind.

[robertbank]

Yes and if he juiced up it may have little effect. From watching police in action (Cops), I have seen a couple of take downs where the BG got a bath of the stuff with little apparent effect.

Take Care

Bob

[eka]

I'm issued Defense Technology Pepper 10 MK-3. Whatever you buy, make sure it is the stream and not a spray mist. Aim for the eyes and anticipate getting some on you as well. In civilian use it's sole purpose is to halt the aggressor long enough for you to get away. So, you probably won't get exposed as much as we usually do, because we have to wrestle around with them after they get it. Most of our guys now have Tasers and I'll have to say, I'm impressed so far with their performance. If you get some in your eyes, use your fingers to pry your eyes open so you can see to run away. It'll hurt for sure, but nothing to worry about long term. If you get it on you flush with cold running water.

Keith

[leadeye]

You do need to train with it to get a fist hand idea of how it works. My first experaince was with the military grade tear gas in boot when they look everyone in a room with our gas masks on and then light the teargas. First one to bail out buys the beer.


You can get a decent varity pack at Cabelas that has 3 size bottles. Its call bear spray but works on bad guys too. 2.0% CRC


http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=froogle-cat603238&id=0054108229005a&navCount=1&podId=0054108&parentId=cat603238&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IK&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat601233&hasJS=true



Also. I am allergic to Bees so I allways have some Bee spray handy. Ever get this stuff in your eyes and down your throut? You kinda get distracted.

http://www.backyardstyle.com/shop/shop_image/product/44498fd87b9d5fe5807dd17c62b5995a.jpg


NOTE: Even though they have that Raciest comment on the can I still purchace their products!~:kidding:

Try Permanone tick repellent to keep bees and yellow jackets off. I got tangled up in a nest of them and thought I would get badly stung but they would lite and fly off. They did not stay on my cloths or skin long enough to sting.:-D

[flounderman]

I have used the issued oc spray and the results are best when it is a surprise. also, if you have time to anticipate using it, have it out, concealed behind you and get your thumb under the safety. murphy kicks in when things go down and nothing happens when you depress the safety. if your thumb is under the safety to start with, you don't have to think about it. you want a stream, not a spray, and the highest oc you can get. I was just issued a can of foam for hospital duty. less overspray, I guess.

[Ed Barrett]

I'm retired from the Missouri Dept. of Corrections, I found that some inmates had a very high tolerence for our capsicum spray. This was a small percent, less than 5 percent, but it was still something to think about. From what I have seen of tasers the only difference in effect is if they will incapacitate or incapacitate and cause the bladder to empty at the same time. I would vote for the taser.

[Bret4207]

Only problem with a taser is you only get one shot. With spray you've got 4 or 5 at least.

[Old Ironsights]

Only problem with a taser is you only get one shot. With spray you've got 4 or 5 at least.
True, but you also get the contact effect... and if you are using spray against a group you are hosed anyway.

OTOH, of you get the Taser with the Laser, o'l BG might get a case of the "Red Dot Dumps"...

FWIW, Hairspray works pretty well too... especially if you also have a cig lighter... :twisted:

[mtnman31]

I'd recommend the First Defense. Have carried a couple cans of it for a while and been sprayed with it twice in a training environment. It works - like was said, it is not a gun; it will just buy the user some time to get away from their attacker - and hopefully come back with a gun:Fire:

It does have an expiration date but that does not mean it just quits working. It just loses some of its effectiveness. Long story short - I had a can that was nine years expired and sprayed a girlfriend with it (she was willing). It still worked. I talked her into letting me spray her after she had spent a little time talking trash to me about how tough she was. Needless to say, she didn't like it, she even made up a few NEW curse words that were not yet part of our English vocabulary. I can say without reservation that she was indeed tough, just not in a butch man-ly way.

[JIMinPHX]

I used to work for a company that made OC, so I'm pretty familiar with the stuff. If you can get in close & get a good shot of that stuff in the attacker's face, then you will mess him up pretty good 95% of the time. Some people have a higher tolerance to that stuff. The basic ingredient is a concentrated extract of Indian peppers, so people that eat a lot of hot Indian food will build a tolerance to it. If you don't get in a good enough shot with that stuff to slow somebody down, then you will probably tick him off something fierce. That needs to be considered.

If you have an accidental discharge at home & and are feeling the sting, the best thing to do is rub the affected area with vegetable oil, rub it in real well & then wash it off with soap & cold water.

[eka]

mtnman31, your post reminds me of a recent training I attended on our new tasers. They asked for volunteers to try it out and one of our female officers stepped right up, no hesitation. There's some pretty tough gals out there. Of course she flopped around shortly afterwords, but I was impressed with her toughness. I'm just waiting for the day when some bureaucrat decides that since police officers carry handguns, they need to be shot with one as part of their training, just to see what it's like. Or maybe get dog bit, since the department utilizes K-9s. As far as the tasers go, they sold me, I believe them when they say they work, I didn't have to do the flop to be convinced.

Keith

[hammerhead357]

Well, I really have nothing to add of any importance but, I once was dating this hot little woman who carried a canister of pepper spray. She left it in her car one sunny day while we were out shall we say enjoying nature at the lake. Well we came back to town and I dropped her off to pick up her car, she had on only a thin dress and nothing under it. When she got to her house she was really hot.. It seems the canister had exploded inside her car and she sat on the seat with only the really thin dress material between her and the seat!!!!!!!Well I thought it was funny as hell at the time anyway......Wes

[Old Ironsights]

I'm one of those with a particularly high tolerance to OC.... as a matter of fact, I use PURE OC (brand name "Pure Cap") as a regular food additive...

(FWIW, "Pure Cap" will cause alkaloid burns if left on the skin... I recently put roughly 1/4tsp into a 1.75 litre of vodka as a base for my next batch of sausage sticks... it's like drinking battery acid.... but tasty. :mrgreen:)

[danski26]

One of the Department near here use the Fox brand. It seems to work fine. I have heard no complaints from then.