.357 to .256

[Texas by God]

I messed around yesterday making some .256 Winchester cases from .357 brass.
I used RCBS case lube and CH FL die.
Going slowly, and turning the case between pushes worked out ok.
I did ruin a couple of the nickel plated cases; I won’t use any more of those.
It’s amusing how the case https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240121/05f12b8f77bd9ae2f5e28af9869c6307.jpg
cannelure becomes a “shoulder marker” after a trip through the die!


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[MarkP]

Looking good. If using a TC Contender you can change the extractor to a 223 Rem and make them from 222's. I made mine from 222's but 223's would work. The Contender Vendor out of OKLAHOMA told me that trick 30 yrs ago.

[cwtebay]

Looking great TBG! What are you firing them from?

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[turtlezx]

nickel never seem to form as well in any case

[Texas by God]

Looking great TBG! What are you firing them from?

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I’m putting together another stub rifle like my 44-40 and .218 Bee Toppers.
I test fired three of them with Unique and 100 gr bullets and all is good.
I’ve wanted a 25-20 for years but the .256 makes more sense for the brass situation.


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[stubshaft]

Looks great! I never had much luck reforming nickel cases myself.

[rbuck351]

I scrounged a set of 256 forming dies and they work fine with brass or nickel cases.

[Bazoo]

Awesome work, thanks for sharing. Be nifty to have a Winchester 92 converted to handle it.

[ipopum]

I have a Win model 92 but what I have read they do not recommend 256 in that gun.

[country gent]

When sizing nickel cases your forming 2 different metals with different strengths, hardness, and flow rates. brass is softer and bends flows easy the nickel plate is much harder and dosnt flow as well.

The .256 win is an interesting round in that it should be able to be loaded light almost to 22 rimfire levels or up to small / medium game.

[Jedman]

I have found that sizing the 357 first thru a 300 blk out die with the neck sizing stem removed works good as a first step before sizing again with the 256 die. I use just a touch of Imperial sizing wax wiped on with my thumb and index finger and both nickel plated or natural brass size good but prefer not to use the plated brass as it doesn’t hold up as well.
I have not shot any cast lead bullets in my 256 yet, but find it shoots 75, 87, and 100 gr. jacketed bullets great from a 1 - 10 twist barrel.
In my handi rifle I can load the bullets out long and use more of the case volume for more powder space and get a bit more velocity than what most loads for a Marlin 62 show in most load data for rifles.
I have read of many deer, antelope, and even mountain lions taken with a 256 carbine.
With 75 gr. hollow points I have shot 200 yard groups , ( 3 shot ) under 1 3/4” and they shoot quite flat.

Out of all the smaller centerfire rounds I have played with the 256 impresses me the most !

Jedman

[firebyprolong]

I cheat and use a 30 mauser die as first step, then follow up in my 256 die with the decap removed and replaced with a gm valve stem turned down to a slip fit in the case neck while in the die, it’s an old trick and really cut down on my case loss.
256 in a H&R is a lot of fun, i really want to short chamber a stub barrel and cut down a set of dies to use a 38 special brass, basically a 25 badger to go with my 30. The badger uses 32-20 load data so the same case necked to 25 should be close enough to start with 25-20 data.

[Rockindaddy]

Nice forming job on the 256 Winchester cases from 357 mags. Frank Barnes discusses the 256 Winchester in his book Cartridges of the World. Frank describes forming the brass out of 357 Mag. Had fellow working for me many years ago who shot a pile of deer with his 256 Winchester. Do you use the 25 cal 60 gr Hornady boolits?? If you don't speed em past 1800 fps a cast boolit should work too.

[endwrench]

Looking good. If using a TC Contender you can change the extractor to a 223 Rem and make them from 222's. I made mine from 222's but 223's would work. The Contender Vendor out of OKLAHOMA told me that trick 30 yrs ago.That's a cool little piece of information I'll need to remember!

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[dverna]

Neat little cartridge. Too bad it never made it commercially.

[Rapier]

I have not had much luck with resizing 357 brass to 256, but never had a reason to do much but to just try it. I had a few 256 guns and still have a bit of factory once fired brass and about 3 boxes of factory loaded. One thing about the 256 brass is it reloads many times, unless you get to the 87gr SP bullets and try to load them up to take 200 meter rams down. Finally got the Contenders loaded up to the point that a horn or high rump hit would take the rams down. Shot the Contenders and two of my Hawkeyes in a few silhouette matches just for S&Gs.
Guy cam buy a couple years ago, with a new 16" carbine barrel he had bought, had no ammo, so gave him a box, he, about 80, loves it for shooting deer that jump his fence and get into his garden, true turnip eaters. I think the loads I gave him were the 75gr cast flat points.

[cwlongshot]

Did this quite a while back. I was also able to o well with nickel cases.

This was when I established Annealing BEFORE necking down and Annealing AFTER expanding or necking UP.


Cw

[Texas by God]

After ruining 6 cases that split at the neck(out of 31)- I followed CW’s advice and annealed the rest of the batch.
Things are better now. The 6 that split before were 5 Remington and 1 Starline.
I’ve done a few of each now and haven’t split any- no matter the head stamp. Here’s the progression from .357 to a loaded .256 Winmag.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240126/93304a9cae26d5132d6ead20bb6159aa.jpg

Thanks CW!


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[cuzinbruce]

It has worked for me, .357 to .256. Starline brass, with the RCBS forming dies. Length seemed OK, no need to use .357 Max.

I did have an issue with new Winchester brand brass (not once fired), Sized, then expanded. When I tried to seat a J-word, the shoulder collapsed. Same setup worked fine with the formed Starline. Never figured that one out. Only thing I could guess was that the new brass was too soft???

I always thought a Ruger 77/357 rifle, converted to .256, would make a neat gun. Should be an easy conversion, just change the barrel. Magazine should be OK.

[Kai]

I just ran brass .357 cases lubed with rcbs case lube straight into the rcbs 256 sizing die. Pretty straight forward. I do have a bunch of factory 256 brass I'd let go if anybody is interested.

[cwlongshot]

After ruining 6 cases that split at the neck(out of 31)- I followed CW’s advice and annealed the rest of the batch.
Things are better now. The 6 that split before were 5 Remington and 1 Starline.
I’ve done a few of each now and haven’t split any- no matter the head stamp. Here’s the progression from .357 to a loaded .256 Winmag.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240126/93304a9cae26d5132d6ead20bb6159aa.jpg

Thanks CW!


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Awesome man!! ❤️*��❤️*��

[Alchemist]

Just bought a 256 Contender barrel and have a few questions for you guys. If I got this right, y’all are sizing directly from 357 to 256 in one step? I bought all the Redding forming dies and go slowly with Imperial wax with complete success. I haven’t fired any yet, but plan to anneal them before loading.

How many cases do you ruin by skipping the gradual progression? How many loadings are y’all getting, and how often do you guys anneal?

BTW, I am using new Starline brass.

Thanks

[cwtebay]

I’m putting together another stub rifle like my 44-40 and .218 Bee Toppers.
I test fired three of them with Unique and 100 gr bullets and all is good.
I’ve wanted a 25-20 for years but the .256 makes more sense for the brass situation.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkI would definitely hook you up with a few hundred 25wcf brass if you want!

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[Texas by God]

I would definitely hook you up with a few hundred 25wcf brass if you want!

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Thanks for the offer, but keep them for yourself and others. They appear to be very rare nowadays- like .218 Bee brass- luckily I’m good there!
After annealing, I’ve only lost one piece out of 65 so far.
After firing, I’m just going to size the minimum that will still chamber easily.
And see how it goes from there.


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[shdwlkr]

Where have you read that the win 92 and .256 win mag is a bad combination please

[rockrat]

Hmm--how about a 256 win max? 357 max brass?

[Alchemist]

Hmm--how about a 256 win max? 357 max brass?

I’ve been thinking the same thing. MGM has it on their chambers list but I haven’t been able to find a cartridge drawing. And would it be possible to use the same dies to load it?

[Texas by God]

Hmm--how about a 256 win max? 357 max brass?

It might be similar ballisticly to the AR cartridge 25-45 Sharps- not quite 25-35 level one would think.


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[Alchemist]

[QUOTE=Texas by God;5680621]It might be similar ballisticly to the AR cartridge 25-45 Sharps- not quite 25-35 level one would think.

Another rabbit hole for me to go down.�� Way less steps to form cases, and cheaper parent cases to start with. Too bad my ideas never culminate in a million dollar invention- cause I could certainly spend the cash pretty quick!

[rescue_171]

Only bad thing about the 256 out of the contender is the twist rate in factory barrels is to slow for heavier bullets. They will keyhole.


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[ebb]

How about a 256MIN on a 38 special case?

[Jedman]

How about a 256MIN on a 38 special case?
Being there is some taper to the body of the 256 WM if you shortened a sizing die by the difference in length between a 357 and a 38 spl. the die would have to small of ID at the bottom to go over the solid head of the 38 brass.
If a guy really wanted to do a shortened die for 38 spl. brass you could ID grind the die at a new angle to accomplish that, I did it before with 2 wildcats I built .
Jedman

[405grain]

Jedman's right about having to make "custom" dies, but there's also another issue when creating a unique wildcat: you also have to have a custom chambering reamer made. This is where cost vs reward comes into play. Is there an advantage to this new cartridge that outweighs the cost and effort that goes into it's development? If the answer is no, or if there is already a factory or wildcat cartridge that does the same thing, then this becomes a money sink hole. It costs the same to program CNC tooling to make 1 part as it does to make 5000, so having these specialty one-off parts made is costly.

There are alternatives, and lots of guys on this forum are pretty creative. First, you could create your own wildcats by either using a combination of dies, or modifying existing dies. The same goes with reamers & throaters. (In one of several examples - shortening a 35 Whelen die to make "35 Mauser") Then there's also the possibility of making your own reamers. There are some posts on a few gunsmithing forums regarding machining your own reamer, be it a conventional reamer or a "D" reamer. An internet search should turn up a couple of hits.

Three of the cartridges that I load for require reforming the brass from something else so I understand what folks are going through making up 256 mag. I think that this is a really neat cartridge. I've read that a rimless version can also be made from 222 or 223 brass. Texas by God; when you get a chance to shoot some targets post up the results. We'd like to see how this shoots.

[Texas by God]

I only had 6 rounds left of my fire forming loads, so I shot 3 on paper at 40 yards and 3 on steel at 100 yards.
I used a 75 gr Sierra hp over IMR 4198 for these.
I’m liking it so far, but that shotgun trigger pull is aggravating….https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240215/566650587186d14382dcfaf1f6d82c4e.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240215/653a08799fd405ebf7fed073f5df609a.jpg
The upper holes in steel were from my 44-40 Topper.


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[cwtebay]

https://youtu.be/4T_8kge23wQ?si=-TlMLmtqRBQqCu_G

Not a simple task, but doable!!!
I did this to my wife's rifle several years ago and never regretted it.
(Other than she touched one off appropriately 30 feet high the first time she fired it)

[Texas by God]

Thanks for the tip.
GBO has trigger job info as well.
I just don’t like dismantling and remantling (new word!) Toppers….


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[cwtebay]

Thanks for the tip.
GBO has trigger job info as well.
I just don’t like dismantling and remantling (new word!) Toppers….


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkI'll be honest - it was terrible. Had it been anyone's but hers, I would have bailed on it.

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[Texas by God]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240219/2a3ad46162cf1afeb135e90bbd354c3b.jpg
That trigger got me twice here. It has a felt tiny click then keeep squeezing bang.
I found those W-W 25-20 bullets at a gun show so I’m using them!


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[midnight]

I had heard that forming 256 Win mag from 357 cases ended up with cases a little bit short so I used 360 Dan Wesson cases. They come out slightly long and can be trimmed to exact length. I also used a 30 Mauser die as a first step and final forming in the 256 Win die. I only lost one case where the neck had a small fold in the neck. As a result I recommend using 360 Dan Wesson brass and a 30 Mauser die as a first step. I have also been told the Wesson brass is of stronger construction.

Bob

[Jedman]

I form my 256 on used 357 brass and some are as long as 1.310 and the case is only supposed to be 1.280. My chamber has no problem chambering the 1.310” long but I trim mine to 1.295 as that’s close to the average of all of the brass I have reformed.
Jedman

[gnappi]

I'm thinking that the crimp line will act like a checkbook burst perforating line, break off the neck and stick in the chamber eventually.

[tward]

When I got my 256 win Contender barrel I could not afford form dies so I lube up some once fired 357 cases with Lee sizing lube and slowly ran them into the 256 die doing it in stages with lube in between . I had about a 5% failure rate but I had brass to reload! Have fun with it. Mine liked the noe 70 gr cast. Tim

[cwtebay]

I'm thinking that the crimp line will act like a checkbook burst perforating line, break off the neck and stick in the chamber eventually.I recall being cautioned about that in 6 mm Lee Navy and 225 Winchester. I'll bet I have 10+ loads out of all of that regardless of if that line is there or not.

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[Beast of Burden]

I, too anneal my cases before forming and rarely have any issues. I have also experienced the fact that Contender barrels in the 256 WM do not do well with heavy boolits. Fun little cartridge, for sure!

[jlsinaz]

The 256 WM is another of those great forgotten cartridges. I had a Contender in that caliber. It was great for jack rabbits with the 60 grain bullets. Mine liked the 87 grainers and was a killer on javelina. I used it to shoot metallic silhouettes and it would knock everything over, if I did my part. Had to hit the rams high. There was gentleman at the last gun show I went to that had a custom B78/1885 in 256 win with dies and brass for sale. I'm regretting now that I didn't grab it.

[Newtire]

I scrounged a set of 256 forming dies and they work fine with brass or nickel cases.
Yeah, me too. Heard that the Nickel cases were tough too but necked them down to a .30 cal in a pistol die first. Can't remember which one but think it was a Mauser pistol. They came out fine actually.

[reddhawkk]

Following this thread with great interest as I just started with Contenders. I have always been interested in the Marlin 62 in .256 Winchester so after getting the Contender I have been looking at barrels in .256 but the brass situation has had me reluctant to get one but now I think I might just have to get me one!

[shdwlkr]

you can also use 360dw brass just like grumpa did

[Texas by God]

I just annealed and reformed 70 mixed .357 brass to .256 with NO losses.
Thanks, TxCowboy52!


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[moosehunt]

I have a 14" Contender .256 barrel on order from MGM, expecting it any day now. In preperation, I just made 100 cases out of new Starline .357 brass. It require 103 cases to get 100, and they look real good, not bad. I had anticipated doing a couple neck reduction steps, but first tried just running them in .256 die with Imperial lube. Found that was all I had to do, didn't bother with any steps. I won't know whether I need to turn the necks until I get the barrel, but I'm really thinking not. That, we'll see.

[Texas by God]

3.5 grs of Red Dot and the NEI 257-85(.258” and tumble lubed plain base) using Fiocchi SPP; group is 7 shots @40 yards.
I think that I have the makings of a good edible small game load here.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240613/0e91f216a9d8bf7b5f474efbb90d0107.jpg


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[Newtire]

That ought to be the ticket.