45 acp 225-230 gn RN

[fn1889m]

I am using the Lyman/Ideal 452374 for a RN .45. But the bullet seems “pointier” than the 230 gn RN that I prefer. Is there a similar mould that would cast a slightly shorter but less less pointed RN bullet of similar weight? I am used to steel moulds. But willing to try others.

This is for ASI competition. I am older and slow but having fun. Shooting a stock 1911 which I built myself. But I had a couple jams with the Lee TC mould, and want to stick to RN.

[ranger391xt]

MP makes a 200 gr, RNFP that works well. I have put several hundred thru a S&W 645 without any problems.

You can get it in the below configurations:

- 4 cavity brass with lube groove and hollow point pins
https://www.mp-molds.com/product/mp-452-200-hp-4-cav/

- 4 cavity brass with hollow point pins and without lube groove if you powder coat.
https://www.mp-molds.com/product/10859/

- 6 cavity aluminum, no lube groove, solid only. https://www.mp-molds.com/product/mp-452-200-solid-6-cavity-mold-no-lube-groove/



Sent from my SM-N981U using Tapatalk

[Bigslug]

Take a look at the Accurate Molds online catalog. Since you're not looking for any kind of "impact enhancer" like a larger meplat, I would suggest you start by examining the 45-230M, 230ML, 230MT, or 230MZ - all the same except for lube groove configuration. These have the smallest meplat (0.18") that Tom's machinery can make.

Personally, I'm a fan of a little more aggressive front end, and have found that profiles in line with the 230A, 230F, and 230H with a meplat of about .30 to .32 will run just fine in true mil-spec 1911's with narrow ramps, even more so if you use tapered feed lip GI mags.

Any of those profiles tend to impact the ramp and barrel on the ogive, not the meplat, so the gun effectively thinks it's feeding hardball.

There's no hard science to making any of the above work - just seat it to where the full diameter shank ends at the case mouth, ensure your taper crimp die is getting that case mouth to the blueprint diameter of .473", and let the pistol do the rest.

[20:1]

I am using the Lyman/Ideal 452374 for a RN .45. But the bullet seems “pointier” than the 230 gn RN that I prefer. Is there a similar mould that would cast a slightly shorter but less less pointed RN bullet of similar weight? I am used to steel moulds. But willing to try others.

This is for ASI competition. I am older and slow but having fun. Shooting a stock 1911 which I built myself. But I had a couple jams with the Lee TC mould, and want to stick to RN.

I'd suggest hitting the catalogs to find exactly what you're looking for. FWIW, 452374 is a total champion for feeding.

[ShooterAZ]

The RCBS 45-230-RN is my go-to 45ACP round nose bullet. It feeds perfectly in all my 1911's, and my mold casts a perfect bullet every time. There's nothing wrong with the MP or Accurate molds, but this one is readily available and is a real winner in my book.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010263668?pid=199161

[Winger Ed.]

With a polished feed ramp, light main spring, mid range charge of Unique, and the 200 Lee TC
is among the most accurate combinations I've found for my old Gold Cup.

[Kosh75287]

It's not my pistol nor my problem, but if I had a .45 ACP that was not feeding LRNs or RNFPs to my satisfaction, I'D look first at problems with the feedway of the pistol, rather than look for a bullet mold that throws "feeding friendly" bullets. Optimizing the feedway to feed anything may be the least expensive way to go.
All of my .45 ACP pistols can feed the SAECO #58 .452" 215 gr. LSWC, which as a short overall length and a very fat (0.355") meplat. It is not the most "feeding friendly" projectile for the .45 ACP, but it does so many things so well, that I won't own a .45 ACP that does NOT feed it reliably.
Sorry if this is not the answer you hoped for, but it may be the most cost-effective. I hope it works out for you.

[justindad]

Saeco and RCBS both make an iron 230 gr RN mold that looks like an H&G clone. The NOE 454-237-RN claims to be the clone in the description. I load the NOE version to 1.275” OACL.

[imashooter2]

I’ve shot many thousands of the Lee 452-228-1R in 1911s and revolvers. Pretty blunt compared to FMJ, but at 1.25 inches COAL it runs fine for me.

[fn1889m]

Thank you for the comments. I purchased a Lee 452-228-1R for a test. It did not set me back much. I am used to Lyman molds, but I can try this out before I spend more money on another round nose 45. I think my pistol is fine, but I need to find the best case/(cartridge) overall length for reliable feeding with a RNFP or TC mould. Seating depth/COAL is my main issue. Thank you for all the the suggestions.

[hermans]

The RCBS 45-230-RN is my go-to 45ACP round nose bullet. It feeds perfectly in all my 1911's, and my mold casts a perfect bullet every time. There's nothing wrong with the MP or Accurate molds, but this one is readily available and is a real winner in my book.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010263668?pid=199161

I have 2 of these RCBS molds which works very well in my guns, easy to cast and well designed to be functional and accurate.
I also have a 4 cavity brass mold made by Tom from Accurate Molds, it is 45-230M in his catalog.....this one is my go to boolit.....it casts piles of boolits in a short time, feeds perfectly and is super accurate to boot!

[Bigslug]

Thank you for the comments. I purchased a Lee 452-228-1R for a test. It did not set me back much. I am used to Lyman molds, but I can try this out before I spend more money on another round nose 45. I think my pistol is fine, but I need to find the best case overall length for reliable feeding with a RNFP or TC mould. Seating depth/COAL is my main issue. Thank you for all the the suggestions.

You have two major variables to contend with:

1. You can't seat the bullet out farther than the magazine will allow.

2. You can't seat the bullet out farther than the leade of your rifling will allow. Drop an empty, sized case into your chamber and see where the case head stops in relation to your barrel hood. That's what you want your loaded rounds to do. If it stops farther back than that, you have your bullet's shank too far forward out of the case.

Within those confines, you want the longest C.O.A.L. you can reasonably manage - backed off a little bit so you aren't right up to the ragged edge of failure.

When the feed pawl of your slide hits the rear of the cartridge, the cartridge starts moving forward, but the nose of the round also wants to dive downward. The recoil of the previous shot is also a contributing factor to this, and how much nose-dive you'll have will also depend on how many rounds remain in the magazine. The goal is to have the forward movement of the round place the ogive of the bullet on the feed ramp before the downward movement can collide the nose with the top of the mag or bottom of the ramp, hence the desirability of the longer round.

Magazine styles can play into feeding as well. I mentioned the GI-style tapered feed lips in my last post because they give the 1911 a Mauser-style controlled feed system that allow the nose of a cartridge to rotate progressively upward as it travels forward, and gradually hand off the groove of the case to the extractor. There are parallel-lipped mags and hybrid types out there that will present the round and time its release differently. It's worth playing with a couple different types to see if the mags are your issue.

[sundog]

FWIW, 452374 is a total champion for feeding.

^^^ This. And if it also shoots well for your application, you're already there.

[AnthonyB]

Not germane to the discussion at all, but since this is Cast Boolits where all threads drift, I have to plug the RCBS 45-230CM. It feeds as well as the RN for me, has a larger meplat, and I can tell no difference in accuracy. What's not to love?
Tony

[20:1]

You have two major variables to contend with:

1. You can't seat the bullet out farther than the magazine will allow.

2. You can't seat the bullet out farther than the leade of your rifling will allow. Drop an empty, sized case into your chamber and see where the case head stops in relation to your barrel hood. That's what you want your loaded rounds to do. If it stops farther back than that, you have your bullet's shank too far forward out of the case.

Within those confines, you want the longest C.O.A.L. you can reasonably manage - backed off a little bit so you aren't right up to the ragged edge of failure.

When the feed pawl of your slide hits the rear of the cartridge, the cartridge starts moving forward, but the nose of the round also wants to dive downward. The recoil of the previous shot is also a contributing factor to this, and how much nose-dive you'll have will also depend on how many rounds remain in the magazine. The goal is to have the forward movement of the round place the ogive of the bullet on the feed ramp before the downward movement can collide the nose with the top of the mag or bottom of the ramp, hence the desirability of the longer round.

Magazine styles can play into feeding as well. I mentioned the GI-style tapered feed lips in my last post because they give the 1911 a Mauser-style controlled feed system that allow the nose of a cartridge to rotate progressively upward as it travels forward, and gradually hand off the groove of the case to the extractor. There are parallel-lipped mags and hybrid types out there that will present the round and time its release differently. It's worth playing with a couple different types to see if the mags are your issue.

All excellent points. Additionally, if OP powder coats, the powdercoating on the bullet nose could change seating depth as well by enlarging the nose diameter.

[20:1]

Not germane to the discussion at all, but since this is Cast Boolits where all threads drift, I have to plug the RCBS 45-230CM. It feeds as well as the RN for me, has a larger meplat, and I can tell no difference in accuracy. What's not to love?
Tony

OP only wants a round nose design. If it weren't for that I'd have had a huge number of alternatives to suggest too.

[Kosh75287]

With a polished feed ramp, light main spring, mid range charge of Unique, and the 200 Lee TC
is among the most accurate combinations I've found for my old Gold Cup.

Is that bullet the Lee 452-200-RF, or their 452-230-TC? I don't see them listing a 200 gr. TC, but I DO kinda like the idea!

[LAH]

Thank you for the comments. I purchased a Lee 452-228-1R for a test. It did not set me back much. I am used to Lyman molds, but I can try this out before I spend more money on another round nose 45. I think my pistol is fine, but I need to find the best case overall length for reliable feeding with a RNFP or TC mould. Seating depth/COAL is my main issue. Thank you for all the the suggestions.

You will probably like the bullet & it should feed just fine. You may need to play with the OAL of the round.

[fn1889m]

You have two major variables to contend with:
…………
It's worth playing with a couple different types


Thanks. I appreciate the detailed reply. I’ll see about seating the Lyman round nose bullet further out.

ETA: The specs in the manual seemed awfully long for my magazines. Mostly 8 rd Checkmate loaded with 7 rounds which allows me 14 with one mandatory reload. That is enough for the ASI matches. I had a good range session today with 200 grain plated TC mystery bullets I purchased a long time ago, and want to feed any standard design bullet, including SWC/TC. But for competition (where no one is afraid of me yet,) I don't want my score to be determined by a misfeed. I am slow, but these local competitions have done more to improved my shooting than any other single thing.

[Bigslug]

Some nerdy armorer semantics that may help your process - we diagnose by looking at where in the "cycle of operations" a malfunction occurs:

On the way forward, the cycle has feed, chamber, lock, and fire.

On the way back, it has unlock, extract, eject, and cock.

If your round has cleared the lips of the magazine, we generally regard it as having "fed". To successfully "chamber" it must strike and nose-up on the feed ramp, strike and nose-down on the top of the chamber, then settle to where its sides are parallel with the chamber walls. From there, the pistol of course needs to lock fully into battery (seating depth and taper crimp are your enemies there). Clearly breaking down exactly where in that process your issues are occurring will help you dial things in.

I learned A LOT about 1911 feed geometry from a short-lived obsession with getting Elmer Keith's .45 Auto Rim revolver bullet - the 452423 - to run in various 1911's, and you can read about that Odyssey and link to a couple of its spin-off's here: https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?237958-Reliably-Feeding-the-452423-A-Science-Project

Today, I would recommend against treading that path, but it was instructive to show that even a bone-stock GI 1911 can be made to run - abeit somewhat roughly - on nose profiles that are WAY off the hardball/round-nose reservation. The real formula for functional success seems to be a bullet with a shank of about .25" -.30" in length and nose of about .3" to make for an overall length of roughly .60" - give or take a few 0.01's. (EDIT TO ADD: If the LBT is any guide, a meplat size of .32" seems to be the practical maximum within this formula) This can be found in the 230 grainers I've mentioned, as well as the classic 200 grain HG #68 target bullet, and they make for a round with a COAL in the ballpark of 1.2". If your throat will let you seat longer without the driving band impacting the lands, by all means try it, but I've found that roughly .3" long nose starting at the case mouth to work just fine.

[405grain]

As others have stated, the RCBS 45-230-RN is a very good choice. Shake-n-bake powder coated, then sized .452", it just works every time. Yes, it's plain Jane, but it's rock solid reliable.

[Good Cheer]

Yep, about the only way to get better reliability than the round nose is to get a revolver.

If you want to have a better energy stacking profile on the front end then change the tip of that most reliable round nose while preserving the rest of its silhouette. That way interchanging pins let you have either wide flat noses or hollow points that behave like drag chutes, good to go for paper, hard or soft targets.