Some OK results out the 30-06 today

[Wolfdog91]

Some ok results so far with some Lyman 311284 in loading my my chopped m1917 30-06. Gotta try and creep up to 1800fps and see what happens
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[30calflash]

That's a decent start, you could bump the charge a little or try a slower powder to get the velocity up for repeatable results. Slower powders seem to work well for heavier hunting level loads with heavy bullets.

[jdgabbard]

That looks good enough. Velocity isn't very high, but that's ok. 1500fps is more than enough to take a deer with. But if you can get it up to 1800 and keep those groups I think you found a winner.

[Gtek]

How much jump do you have? Sometimes a light kiss, just settling nose (with lead) in throat can help or maybe a little more. Just confirm with dummy rounds that it won't pull boolits on simulated loaded round extraction.

[Winger Ed.]

You're doing good.

That rifle & boolit might be a good candidate for 'the load'. 13gr or Red Dot.
I have great luck with it, it's fairly cheap to feed a .30-06 with it, and it should get your speed up some.

[Dusty Bannister]

Looks like two approaches to getting max accuracy from this military production rifle. The slightly long sized case will center the case in the chamber. But a slightly snug fit of the nose of the bullet in the lands ensures alignment with the bore. This might get interesting seeing which method proves more reliable.

[Wolfdog91]

How much jump do you have? Sometimes a light kiss, just settling nose (with lead) in throat can help or maybe a little more. Just confirm with dummy rounds that it won't pull boolits on simulated loaded round extraction.

Maybe 3 thou max. I don't use book COAL/CBTO, find jam back out a few thousands as a safety thing and work from there

[Wolfdog91]

You're doing good.

That rifle & boolit might be a good candidate for 'the load'. 13gr or Red Dot.
I have great luck with it, it's fairly cheap to feed a .30-06 with it, and it should get your speed up some.

If only I could find any, stuff is about the same as Unique

[Driver man]

Your powder coating looks good and your projectiles are well formed but I think I would size my powder coated 284 boolits to 3.09 and see if any improvement to the group.

[lar45]

For the more moderate velocities in rifles, I've gotten much better accuracy from seating into the lands.
You might give it a try with no other changes just to see.
Now for higher velocities, 2400-2800+, I've gotten my best accuracy at seating about .005" off of the lands.
Why? I couldn't tell you.

[charlie b]

I always get better results when seating the bullets into the rifling.

For most cast bullet loads any increase in pressure won't matter as much. For some powders it will help to have that boost in pressure.

[7br]

I am interested in how you coat and size your boolits. How do you seat your gaschecks? Do you size before or after you coat? Are you doing shake and bake to apply the pc?

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[405grain]

Wolfdog: You're getting some very good accuracy. As others have commented, see if you can step up the velocity and keep a consistent group size. If you can, then you'll have a pretty good hunting load. If you want to try for smaller groups the first thing that I recommend is that you try what cast bullet target shooters do: weight sort your bullets. The key to having all your bullets hitting at the same spot is consistency. If you're shooting bullets that have a 5 or 6 grain variation in weight, that means they are going to have velocity and balance variations. If you weigh all of a batch of bullets and separate them into too light, too heavy, and "just right" weights, you will eliminate a major portion of the variation in your cast loads. What your looking for is the average middle weight from that batch, +/- 1 grain. If your middle of the road weight is, for instance 217 grains, you want to collect all the bullets in that batch that are from 216 to 218 grains. These will be your target bullets.

The bullets that are too heavy or too light could have slightly poor mold fill out, internal air bubbles, inclusions, or other imperfections that make them poorly balanced. Some casters say to toss these back into the pot. I say don't do that. By the time you get to the point of weighing the bullets you've already put in a lot of work, and these bullets can be useful. These bullets will be your practice bullets. When you sight in a rifle you're adjusting the center of your group to be the center of your aim point. For this the group doesn't need to be tiny, it just needs to be a decent group. Practice bullets will do fine for getting you on paper with a given load. Also, these bullets are handy for practicing off hand shooting. When people first start out shooting off hand they usually stink at it. That's because the vast majority of folks do their shooting practice from a bench. Unfortunately, when you go hunting, there's almost never a shooting bench out in the woods. Those practice bullets are an excellent choice for off hand practice because you don't really want to waste you're quality target bullets until after you've mastered the breathing, muscle control, and accuracy that comes from training with this style of shooting.

There are lots of opinions about seating distance and the lands. I've heard some people say that best accuracy is achieved when the bullets are in contact with the lands. I've heard other shooters say that best accuracy is found when the bullets are seated between .005" to .025" off the lands. I do not doubt that in these cases both answers are correct - for that individual shooter. As we all plainly know each gun is as different as the guy shooting it. The only way to know for sure what works best is to experiment and discover what YOUR gun prefers. Because Wolfdog's groups already aren't too shabby, I would say for him to keep at that seating depth for now. Try the weight sorting first to see if that improves things. If it does, then try refining the loads with different seating depth. Make changes one thing at a time, other wise you won't know which one of the changes made the difference.

I ran the numbers using Gordon's Reloading Tool and here's what I found. Using the Lyman #311284 in the 30-06 with 22.0 grains of IMR-4227, a 24" barrel with 1-10 twist, gives a velocity of 1587 fps and 16,612 psi. A charge of 28.0 grains of IMR-4227 with the same bullet and firearm gives a velocity of 1885 fps at 27,304 psi. (This load data is for informational purposes, and is only presented to give a general idea of bullet velocity. You should only use published and tested loads in your firearms.)

[firefly1957]

I found best results with cast bullets in Bottle necked cartridges if the bullet base does not extend below the case neck .
I was testing some 158 grain gas checked coated bullets in a 10 inch Contender barrel in 357-44 B&D. There really is no way to keep the bullet seated in the case neck as it is only .15" . Several shots went fine then there was a cloud of smoke and cartridge case , barrel , and barrel ports were lead coated. Pressure was fine as far as I can figure the bullet base riveted before entering the case neck.

[Wolfdog91]

I am interested in how you coat and size your boolits. How do you seat your gaschecks? Do you size before or after you coat? Are you doing shake and bake to apply the pc?

Sent from my SM-G781V using TapatalkSo right now my process is this
Cast my bullets and depends if I air cool or water quench I'll put them in my dehydrator over night to make sure their fully dried. The ill just gas check and size with the NOE system. After which I'll pre heat then in the oven for a little bit . I know I know tons of people don't need to do it but found out it's the best thing for me, think it's due to the high humidity I deal with. So pre heat a bit and shake and bake I use silicone ice cube trays to keep by bullets sitting up right. I I'll let it go on the air fry mode for the first five minutes or until the paint starts to flow well then cut it down to 350-375 and let it cook for 25-30min. Now depending on what I want to do I'll either water quench or let them cool down. After they cooled or I send them through the dehydrator for a bit again. Then I size them again to make sure they're ironed out and theoretically what I want . Also let me see how well my PC is.

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[Bigslug]

Enfield sporter. . .I knew I liked this guy for a reason.:mrgreen:

320140

Wolf, this thread was what prompted mine on the 311299 vs the 311284.

For some odd reason, I can't get my 5-shot group photo to upload. I settled on the 311299 sized .310", Ben's Red lube, and 37.9 gr. IMR4064 to a bit over 2000 fps for the last batch of plinker ammo I cooked up for the rifle a few years back. Given the peep rear, gold bead front, and no provision for optics, 2 MOA is about as tight as this operator can routinely present on paper, though the rifle could clearly do better with glass sights. The 4064 supply is exhausted - I'll probably revisit with 2400 when I take it up again.

That one's a Remington/Eddystone, my unaltered 1917 is a straight up Ilion plant Remington. Both have rather roomy chambers that blow the shoulder of the case forward a bit - undoubtedly to leave clearance for trench mud. Leaving that fireforming in place with neck-only sizing might help your accuracy plight.

[firefly1957]

7br
These are my notes I like spray paint the best at this point .

I have been using paint starting with powder coat for sometime now these are my notes on bullet coating so far i really like the process.
First method was to wet the powder with acetone and shake and roll bullets in it it until it stuck as solvent evaporated.
Next i used the electrostatic sprayer.
Last i used spray paint Kylon in my case.
All bullets should be degreased no matter how you do the coating some like dry tumbling i have not tried that.
When you bake a batch ALWAYS smash one bullet to make sure the coating does not flake off if it does bake longer and maybe hotter.
You will see a difference in the paint when it is "Cured" it becomes a thin plastic jacket around the bullet.
Some people have had great luck with liquid enamel paint they degreased the bullets and add them to a container with a bit of paint and roll and shake until coated.
NEVER bake in a oven food will be cooked in .
I like spray paint as i can paint them and then handle them , i usually use three coats while they stand on there bases.
Wet application requires handling and can be messy while electrostatic spraying needs to be done on the pan or jig you are baking them in as the powder will fall off if touched.
Do not let bullets touch while baking they will stick together.
Of the methods i use the three coats of spray paint is the thinnest and works best on rifle bullets with long noses. The other two methods are thick enough to engage the rifling of my 30-30 making chambering hard. I shoot the lee 309170 cast soft at 178 grains to an average speed of 2040 fps with good results . I have also shot cast and swaged .38 bullets in the 1700 fps range fromA a ten inch contender with good results. Most of my loads are common 38& 45 acp velocities no loads that have been properly "CURED" have leaded my bores.
I have also started loading higher levels for the 45-70 shooting powder painted or powder coated bullets to of 405 grains (417 as cast) at 1900 f/s and the Lee 330 grain mold cast soft (354 grains as cast) @ 2168 f/s both these loads shoot under 2" at 100 yards

IF You use the powder coat paint wet, I use acetone but other solvents that evaporate will work . I put about a teaspoon of powder in a can or jar add a bit of acetone to make the paint wet (runny wet) then wash the boolits in acetone or alcohol dump the liquid and add them to the can/jar with paint shake and roll until they are coated then remove the lid and roll until the paint sticks well. At that point i dump them out stand them on a baking tray on non stick aluminum foil or wax paper and bake them near or at 400 degrees for an hour . They are sized after they cool. Do not bake in oven that will be used for food again the foil or wax paper is used to keep paint from tray if temperatures go above 400 wax paper can darken and get brittle. I now use a silicone baking sheet some paint does stick to it but it works well for me the bullets are stood on points or bases not touching to bake .
Paint has very little mass bumps and blotches seem not to adversely affect accuracy i should test this further but have not yet as i get all the accuracy i need for now .
I have since swaged some coated .185 lead wire and made .224 bullets they did not lead the barrel at about 3000 f/s my dies burr the bullet base and accuracy was awful . I used the cup from a large rifle primer and swaged the core into it as a gas check to get rid of burr accuracy improved quite a bit.

[mjac]

From my 1963 Rem 700 with factory 20" barrel.
Ranch Dog 165g GC powder coated.
The 0615 holes are under the dime :)

[Wolfdog91]

I always get better results when seating the bullets into the rifling.

For most cast bullet loads any increase in pressure won't matter as much. For some powders it will help to have that boost in pressure.Personally I've just had too many bullets pulled and powder spilled to make me want to seat into the rifling I might experiment a little with it but personally it's just not something I like to do lol

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[Wolfdog91]

Your powder coating looks good and your projectiles are well formed but I think I would size my powder coated 284 boolits to 3.09 and see if any improvement to the group.So gotta ask what do you feel sizing down more would do to help accuracy? Honestly, do you feel it's a matter of a smaller sized bullet posting a sweet spot or something with it maybe expanding more ?

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[waksupi]

Personally I've just had too many bullets pulled and powder spilled to make me want to seat into the rifling I might experiment a little with it but personally it's just not something I like to do lol

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I've experienced that problem. I load the bullet out until it makes contact, then set the seating die to put them in a few thousandths deeper in to the case. If a loaded cartridge doesn't extract easily without pulling the bullet, they are seated out too far.

[charlie b]

I do seat them out further. My bore rider is a tight fit to the bore and has excellent accuracy. It is seated such that the rifling engraves the first drive band as well.

Non bore riders are seated to firmly engage the lands. Also give better accuracy for me that way.

And, yes, I even set them to fit in my Garand that way.

But....I don't hunt so there is not normally a reason for me to remove a loaded round from the chamber. One time at the range an incident occurred and I had to unload a round. I simply lifted the barrel up to about 45 deg and rapped on the bolt handle. That time the bullet came out with the case.

I do have to determine the seating depth for each bullet and each rifle separately. All throats are not the same.