? How much tin to add

[zxcvbob]

I have a line on several hundred pounds of foundry soft lead, cheap. They guy sent me a few ingots to try it out, and I cast a handful of .45 bullets last night. They cast OK once I got the mold really hot and the lead at 900°, not nearly as easy to work with as decent WW alloy mixed with pistol range lead. And they still were a *little* wrinkled and didn't have sharp edges.

How much tin do I need to add just to decrease the surface tension? 1%? 2%? I don't need to harden it for .38 Special target loads and .45 Colts, and I that's mostly what I shoot. Then I can save my hard lead for the 9mm's and .357's (etc.) I have a few bars of 60-40 solder, and 25 pounds of "magnum" lead shot, but I think the antimony in the lead shot would be overwhelmed by its arsenic and *increase* the surface tension instead of decrease it (unless I add tin, so why not just add tin in the first place).

I had a pot of hard lead that wasn't casting as easy as it should, and I added just a little bit of solder and it straightened right up. But that probably had a little tin in it already.

Wha'd'ya think?

[grumpy one]

Clip-on WWs only contain around 0.25% tin, and they are kind-of-castable. If you mix in a goodly proportion of stick-on WWs that raises the tin level considerably higher than 0.25%, and the alloy becomes extremely castable in my experience. So, from the castability standpoint I think you'll find somewhere between 0.5% and 1.0% tin will be quite sufficient to make your problems go away. Antimony does not help castability, so your favourable casting experience with WWs should be replicated. If you have been happy casting pure clip-on WWs, you won't even need as much as 0.5% tin.

[runfiverun]

winchester used 40-1 for a long time in their factory lead boolits....
i would start there.

[Tom Herman]

That's what I use. You don't need more than that to improve flowability.

Happy Shootin'! -Tom

[Three44s]

Soft lead is pretty soft.

When I think of an alloy that's just about right ...... it's wheel weights ...... and to that I add about 1/2 to 1% tin if castability becomes an issue.

So for your soft lead ....... probably another 1/2 to 1% more than one would need to for WW alloy ......

Your add would likely be 1 to 2%

Three 44s

[randyrat]

I don't recall where i read it, but 2% should be sufficient to anhance fillout if more is needed there is a problem with technique or alloy. In other words, up to 2% Tin should be enough most of the time for castability.
Try about 1% then add more only if needed.

[hemiallen]

Clip-on WWs only contain around 0.25% tin, and they are kind-of-castable. If you mix in a goodly proportion of stick-on WWs that raises the tin level considerably higher than 0.25%, and the alloy becomes extremely castable in my experience. .

I thought stick on wheelweights are at or nearly pure lead? The ones I sorted out of my newly cast ( last weekend) wheelweights were dark grey and soft, ie I doubt they have more tin than the hard to scratch ww I melted.......

I also found a few painted steel stick-ons, and half a dozen Zinc clip-ons. I also got 1/4 bucket from 2 buckets of dinky ww's I'll save for a day I am out of WW, way too many clip-to-lead ratio in the pot...

Allen

[zxcvbob]

I got burned with the bucket of WW's I bought from the local scrap dealer. It's full of stick-on weights, and pulled 10 pounds of 'em out and melted the (thinking they were soft lead) and I got about 5 pounds of steel, ash, and dross, and 4 pounds of useless zinc-contaminated lead.

I won't buy WW's again. (if I get them for free I'll take a chance because I like WW alloy.) It won't be long before the lead weights are contaminated from the maker when they melt them all together and diecast the mush into new ones.

The lead I pick up under the steel targets at the pistol range works pretty good. In the summer I can get 20# in just a few minutes once or twice a month.
I don't recall where i read it, but 2% should be sufficient to anhance fillout if more is needed there is a problem with technique or alloy. In other words, up to 2% Tin should be enough most of the time for castability.Try about 1% then add more only if needed. I'll see what happens at .75%, that's probably enough for casting heavy .45 bullets. I may need to add more when I'm casting 120 grain .358's.

[Dale53]

I long ago settled on 2% Tin with my WW alloy for my typical pistol loads. It casts beautifully and is hard enough for pistol use.

Dale53

[grumpy one]

I thought stick on wheelweights are at or nearly pure lead? The ones I sorted out of my newly cast ( last weekend) wheelweights were dark grey and soft, ie I doubt they have more tin than the hard to scratch ww I melted.......

I also found a few painted steel stick-ons, and half a dozen Zinc clip-ons. I also got 1/4 bucket from 2 buckets of dinky ww's I'll save for a day I am out of WW, way too many clip-to-lead ratio in the pot...

Allen

I sort my stick-on WWs in two steps. First, toss the zincers and other rubbish. Second, do a twist test on what is left. You'll soon find that some of them are dull grey and twist very easily. The rest of them are shiny and fairly stiff to twist, though nothing like clip-ons. The ones that twist easily are nearly pure lead - mine average 5.3 BHN. The rest of the stick-ons - the stiffer ones - appear to have considerable tin and no antimony. Someone has posted here that they average 1.75% tin, and that would be commensurate with their appearance as well as their stiffness - they are very shiny. My standard practice is to weigh 3 pounds of stiff stick-ons into my mixing pot, which holds 12 pounds total, so I'm using 1 part stiff stick-ons to 3 parts clip-ons. If the 1.75% tin figure for stiff stick-ons is correct, that means I'm producing 0.6% tin in my standard bullet alloy. I find that mix to be very nice to cast.

[randyrat]

If i need soft lead for my BP boolits i sort through the stick ons and look for the bluish tinged soft lead Wws. I know those are almost pure and are very soft.

About half of the stick on Wws are of a little harder alloy and some of those are steal, zink and "who knows".........The point is, don't just melt all your stick ons in one big pot and expect to get a good alloy of any known percentage.

Use a small hand held wire cutter and score each one if you have to. Soft WWs you'll be able to score easily, the zink and steal-won't score, and the harder stickons use in your harder alloys (and watch your melt temp***).
Lately there has been a big variety in WWs mostly with stick ons. I think they can get by with more of a variety with these.
The clip on WWs have to weigh accordingly to the mold they are cast in and with the stick on Wws they can change the cut size if the alloy is a little lighter or heavier. I believe thats why there is no standard alloy for Stick ons.....
***When i melt the harder stick ons i always melt them with regular clip on WWs so i know the temp and i can skim any Zink turds out before they melt. I never use a thermometer, never owned one.. never ruined a batch of WWs with Zink turds..
I have read too many post thinking all stick ons are equal, i just had to chim in........eventhough this thread started out differently.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I add tin ONLY if I have to. I would first try turning up the temp. But some molds are just tough and I start adding tin (bar marked 96-4) to a 10 lb mix at 1/2 inch chunks until the boolit will cast.
Down here it is near impossible to come up with tin, WW, and I have never seen linetype. Car tire weights are pure lead with clips. I purchase old shotshells with hardened shot to get the metal. It gets challenging but you sure learn to cast hot.
Mike

[mikenbarb]

If you dont have access to the amounts of tin you need you can always water quench the WW alloy boolits to harden them. I make a Lyman #2 alloy and I cast all my boolits with it regardless of what their being shot in. The only exception is my muzzleloader boolits which are cast from pure lead. That way I know whats always in my pot and it will be good for everything I shoot.