Preference. & Why?

[versa-06]

O.K. All deer & Black Bear hunters, What caliber 30,35,375,44,& 45 is your preference & why? In my older years the recoil & the loud report is not as exciting as it was when I was 35. What is your favorite?

[versa-06]

P.S. Cast loads Please. -06

[BLAHUT]

You can kill deer with a .22 rim fire, and anything bigger. The old Indian that taught me to shoot and hunt when I was a kid; hunted with a single shot .22, killed everything from ground squirrels to moose and big bear, he hunted with that .22 till he was like 90 then got a 30/30, he would tell me, you shoot them in chest, just like bug bite, have patients, follow along, they will fall down. I usually go with .243, .308., 30/30, .30/06, for bear; my 45/70 guide gun with big heavy pure lead bullets, 515 grs, at about 1200 FPS. Black bears, eah, usually no big deal, for grizzly's, I want down for keeps, like right now..

[dverna]

You have skewed reality. Cast bullets are inferior to premium jacketed bullets.

I can ethically harvest deer and black bear to 400 yards with jacketed bullets. Saving less than $5 a year by using cast bullets is foolish. But ego is priceless I guess. And yes, IMO, the only reason to hunt with cast bullets is ego or being dirt poor.

Anyway, my caliber of choice is the .308. If I was doing it over, I would pick the .30/06.

[1006]

I only go hunting about once a year. I am in agreement with Don, for one or two shots a year, I just use a proven jacketed hunting bullet that my gun seems to like.

I do have a gun of choice: a 30.06 that the local gunsmith installed a muzzle break on for me. It is loud, but kicks about like a 243.

[Digital Dan]

Haven’t hunted with jacketed bullets in over 20 years. Do have a good supply, but no longer need them. Have no favorites for cast, but don’t use them in calibers less than 7mm. .30-30, .38-55, .45-70 and ML of .45 & .50 cal. Used a .44 mag bolt gun with 300 gr pure lead paper patched and it was totally without fault.

[Winger Ed.]

.30cal for deer.
Which ever cartridge you load you'll end up right in line with a full house, factory .30-30 for its ballistics.

For a bear--- .45-70 to make sure it doesn't get any fancy ideas about 'harvesting' me.

[stubshaft]

Being an old bowhunter I like to get close to the game I shoot, usually within 30 yards. I use cast bullets because they have cleanly harvested more game animals than condoms. Being able to get close and picking your shot is hunting, sitting 400 yards away and slinging bullets is shooting.

That being said, I have used one or more variations of the calibers you have listed. It would be a toss up between my Model 94 30/30 and my Guide Gun in 45/70 because they are so handy to tote around.

[winelover]

^^^^This!

Most of my deer are taken with archery equipment. Few, with muzzle loaders. Occasionally, I'll harvest one with my Marlin 1894 and cast.

Winelover

[hc18flyer]

Where we hunt shots are within 100 yards, so my own cast bullets in .357 Max and .358 Winchester are my choice. Were I to hunt out West, my .280 Rem and jacketed bullets would be the better option. Over the last 40 years, most of my deer have been taken with a caplock and round ball, from a tree stand. There is something special about using a bullet you have cast. hc18flyer

[Texas by God]

I think that only hunting for horns to put on the wall is where the “ego” comes in.
I’ve killed deer with .22,.24,.25,26,27,28,30,35,38,41,50 and 54 caliber guns. Jacketed or cast bullets.
I only take shots within the cartridge of choice’s effectiveness.
I limit cast bullet range at 150 yards due to holdover of the 2000 fps loads.
If I won the Texas Grand Slam, I would take my 30-06 bolt action with full tilt jacketed soft points. Same if I hunt Wyoming or Colorado again.
Around here, I’ll just use what the mood that day makes me grab- and adjust accordingly.


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[centershot]

Here in western NY the shots are close, less than 50 yards, most are within 30 yards. I like my '06, loaded with 175 gr. cast at 1900 fps. Occasionally I'll take out my Marlin 1894 .357 Mag, loaded with 158 gr. cast, or my 12 ga. M500 loaded with cast round balls. They all do the job, no drama, just venison on the table. I wouldn't feel undergunned if a black bear presented itself for a shot. Come muzzleloader season it's my .54 Renegade with PRB's.

[Thumbcocker]

You have skewed reality. Cast bullets are inferior to premium jacketed bullets.

I can ethically harvest deer and black bear to 400 yards with jacketed bullets. Saving less than $5 a year by using cast bullets is foolish. But ego is priceless I guess. And yes, IMO, the only reason to hunt with cast bullets is ego or being dirt poor.

Anyway, my caliber of choice is the .308. If I was doing it over, I would pick the .30/06.It depends on your reality. Apparently in your reality: 1.) Centerfire rifles are legal.
2.) Shots out to 400 yards are available.

In many places east of the Mississippi it is slug gun or muzzle loader only and shots are 75 yards or less. 400 yards could well be three property owners over. Under those circumstances cast projectiles work fine. I have used home cast in a TC Hawken, 870 slug gun, and .44 revolvers. All put venison in the freezer. The longest shot I have ever had on a deer was 72 yards, most are 30 to 50 yards.

Here is typical hunting habitat in my area
. No 400 yard shots. There is also the issue of price. Premium deer slugs go for north of $5 a pop these days. Allowing for practice and sighting in you could be looking at serious money for people of limited means.

There is also the satisfaction of making your own ammo. You attribute that to "ego" I attribute it to getting more from the activity. Working up loads and filling the freezer with home cast projectiles adds a level of satisfaction to the hunting experience. It also gets you a lot more trigger time with your chosen firearm. Is an archer who fletches his own arrows being egotistical?

On a side note I do not "harvest " game animals. I harvest beans, corn, sweet potatoes etc. The animals I hunt are killed. Period. Taking the life if a mammal will never be demeaned to pulling up a turnip in my world. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230824/ce61103cf275b70ad191c5e548a8f79a.jpg

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[Johnch]

I only can hunt Whitetail deer here in Ohio
Rifles are "straight" wall only
But a 45/70 is OK

For both jacketed and cast bullets I like as big of bore as possible
So I use a Marlin 45/70 rifle and a BFR 45/70 revolver
BUT I do not load hot ammo
For both the revolver and the rifle I load moderate trap door loads
But I use as large of a meplat as possible for good energy transfer

John

[waksupi]

You have skewed reality. Cast bullets are inferior to premium jacketed bullets.

I can ethically harvest deer and black bear to 400 yards with jacketed bullets. Saving less than $5 a year by using cast bullets is foolish. But ego is priceless I guess. And yes, IMO, the only reason to hunt with cast bullets is ego or being dirt poor.

Anyway, my caliber of choice is the .308. If I was doing it over, I would pick the .30/06.

I have huge objections to shooting ANY game animal at 400 yards. Get closer.

[ChristopherO]

In my skewed reality of SW Ohio my career as a deer hunter began when it was smoothbore shotgun with slugs or certain pistols only, unless using a muzzleloader. I opted for a traditional sidelock muzzleloader with soft lead because I enjoy rifles the best and am a so-so shot with a pistol. Lead has always been in the equation due to those parameters. Eventually rifled barrels for slug guns were allowed, but still the big soft lead Lightfield saboted slug worked as well as the pure lead muzzleloader projectiles I casted. It costs much more than $5.00 to sight in with those. Practicing with that 12 gauge with slugs was not permissible for my budget when raising 5 children. Then came the option from ODNR to use straight wall cartridges. My ego loves to shoot, year round, and cheaply. Along came the 45/70 and a couple of molds. Must say, my ego has been perfectly satisfied with the terminal ballistic results those heavy boolits give on our local deer herd. Never had a need to spend money on jacketed bullets for that rifle when the fairly soft lead is so successful. (I know, I've deluded myself to believe the fairy tale. LOL)

CF rifles an interest of mine and I load for a few different calibers. The time I've shot elk many years ago premium jacketed bullets were employed. When a family member dropped 3 different bull elk he was using my handloads with jacketed bullets. When I shoot coyotes, groundhogs, prairie dogs with the centerfires, jacketed bullets are used. It just makes sense to do so. Squirrels, rabbits, deer at my normal ranges and with the acceptable equipment locally? 22LR HP's for the small game and the WFN lead slug for deer gets it done quite adequately.

To answer the OP's question: 45/70, Accurate WFN 420 grains Range Scrap with GC is what I've happily used for about 8 years now. I'd use the 182 grain Noe WFN GC with the same alloy in a heartbeat but don't have a straight wall rifle to shoot them from and bottleneck cartridges are not permitted for deer where I hunt.

[Daekar]

I have huge objections to shooting ANY game animal at 400 yards. Get closer.

This. In my book, if you can't make the shot with a cast boolit, you shouldn't be taking the shot. The only exception would be something like prairie dog elimination with very high speed varmint rifles.

To answer the OP's question, my preference would skew larger. Given the velocity limitations of cast boolits, we're killing with surface area and penetration. I'm sure that a 30-30 works fine with cast, but I'd prefer something bigger. Were hunting a pastime for me rather than an occasional duty, I would just jump to a 45 caliber cartridge and be done. 45-70 is the obvious go-to, but if you want to standardize on 0.452 bullets you can play with 45acp, 45 Colt, 454 Cassull, and and 460 S&W. In my opinion, your quarry is unlikely to be able to differentiate between most of them very well.

One reason to stay with a smaller diameter is to avoid large primers. To my knowledge (which is admittedly incomplete) the small primers peter out at 35 caliber cartridges like 357 Magnum, 357 Maximum, and 350 Legend, although 400 Legend appears to take small rifle primers as well.

[Digital Dan]

I have huge objections to shooting ANY game animal at 400 yards. Get closer.

My longest shot on deer was 125 yards, that being the first one. After that, 20-50 yards was the norm. We got a lot of trees here in Floriduh. OTOH, my longest shot on people was about 1050 meters. Was with jacketed .30 cal, without sights. Miniguns are awesome. I don't like it when they start shooting at my buddies with a 12.7mm.

[MT Gianni]

I hunt a field that gives me a shot at does for about an hour before sunset. Range is hopefully 300-325 yards. They are in the field at 600 yards so the idea of getting past the last tree and sneaking across 2" stubble is not happening. Ditto to digging a blind in the field, they are out there most of the night. I hope to get a close shot at a buck near sunset @ what is usually 350 yards. I would love to have 175 yard shots with levers and cast but this is where I hunt now. I use a 308 or 30-06 with 150 gr jacketed. Deer have about 300 yards from where I shoot them at to non accessible land. property owner is a friend and wants does taken off there, but trusts very few people to shoot there.

[versa-06]

Do any of you hunt with the 375 bore rifles or the 454 casull rifles?

[versa-06]

Continued for above . I have recently picked a few close range locations to hunt deer & a few bears. I am working with 250-314 grain bullets for both. Most shots not over 75yds.

[ChristopherO]

Continued for above . I have recently picked a few close range locations to hunt deer & a few bears. I am working with 250-314 grain bullets for both. Most shots not over 75yds.

Though I have neither of those two calibers/cartridges I would use them for your intended purpose in a heartbeat. When I mentioned the NOE 182 grain WFN GC that is a .360" boolit I shoot out of a 35 Whelen. I would use those for the same purpose from how well they test out up to 100 yards. Your offerings are even better.

[warren5421]

Don't do bear here in Indiana. For years it was a 12 ga SxS in Indiana and Ohio using cast slugs backed by Black Powder. When Indiana went to pistol caliber rifles I went to a Uberti 73 in .44-40 using a full case of black powder, about 36 gr, felt wad, and a 200 gr RNFP. Shots are under 100 yards.

[Elmer Fudd]

I prefer 35 caliber for cast for both hunting and just shooting. I have more guns, cartridges and moulds in 35 than any other caliber. I sometimes shoot silly heavy rifle bullets in a 357, with 38 brass, after sizing down from .360. I like the heavies (280-310) in the Whelen, and the 230 RD. I use that 230 FN in the 358JDJ and the Maximum. I use more 160-180s in 357s. The 35 seems to kill out of proportion to the bore diameter, where the 338s do not. The larger bores, mostly .4 and bigger, do so to a greater extent. I don't find the 375 H&H to be an exaggerated killer, but it is effective (I have only deer and elk under my belt with it, and jacketed bullets to boot). As opposed to a 45/70 on marmots...

Moral of my story: softest cast or jacketed possible, and the larger the bore the better. As you go softer, muzzle velocities can come down to shoulder-friendly recoil levels. I almost always shoot through a suppressor, so report is mitigated to an extent.

I tend to cast from one alloy, that being COWW. Sometimes, I get better results if I dilute with SOWW, so I do that, and probably add a bit of tin for easier fill-out on certain moulds. They all seem to have different requirements as far as alloy and temp. And for the same reason, probably laziness, I like to use one bullet in several guns. Knowing that, I can't explain why I have a dozen or so 35 moulds.

[Wayne Smith]

Right now it would be my 1895 Steyr with the Frankenstein boolit. Plenty for local deer and black bear. With a condom bullet my .25 Krag AI. I haven't shot cast in that yet except to fully size cartridges. That was with a caseful of WC867 and a small cast boolit. About 100 gr out of a mold designed years ago and group buy.

[35 Rem]

Since you limit it to cast bullets for deer, I'd have to go with 35 caliber and specifically the 35 Remington. Like the story of Goldilocks and the Three Bears, it's "Just Right". :) Big enough to guarantee sufficient penetration and energy without noticeable recoil. The cost of the bullet has nothing to do with my using cast for deer, it's the satisfaction of using a bullet I made myself. Also the handiness of leverguns combined with cast lead bullets lets me almost time travel to the past when hunting.

Not to imply that I'm a purist by any means. I started shooting because of a love for varmint shooting, specifically groundhogs in huge bean fields so jacketed bullets at screaming velocities are no stranger to me. During deer season I like to sit looking over the same big fields sometime with my 257 Weatherby, 25-06 or 270 and there is no way I'd even consider using cast in them. (Has anybody EVER tried cast in a 257 Weatherby?? haha). I have shot a bunch of deer between 300 and 400 yards with the 257Weatherby so Yes, I have done my share of that kind of deer hunting. I was burning out on just killing a deer when I started testing cast bullets using water jugs to convince myself they could be lethal and humane. Once convinced I have it a try with the 35 Remington and I was amazed at how effective it was. Last year I didn't even take a jacketed bullet load out of the house during deer season and got 4 deer with my own cast bullets. Very satisfying. Who knows how I'll hunt this year.

One point where I differ from a lot of you is that I'm using only cartridges that operate in the velocity range where cast works equally well to jacketed. If your rifle can't fling a bullet any faster than say 2,200 ft/sec, the jacket adds nothing but expense and wear on your barrel. In fact a cast bullet of the same weight with a larger meplate and cast softer will almost certainly be more effective on game. So far my cast bullet deer rifles are 30-30, 7.62x39, 32 Win Special and 35 Remington. I'm shooting loads that give the full potential of these cartridges so I'm giving up nothing to shoot cast. I can see where somebody might feel "cheated" somehow turning his 30-06 into a 30-30 by shooting cast in it. To each his own - there is no right or wrong in this hobby. It's for fun anyhow, right??

[Smoke4320]

used to hunt where typical shots were 150 to 500 yds .. Most were 200 Plus . At those ranges I preferred Jacketed bullets for the better accuracy.
Now where I hunt 50 to 100 yds is average so Cast Bullets do the trick.
as far as caliber its what hits me for that day it could be 300 Blackout 247 gr subsonic HP's or up to 45-70 350 gr HPs. If the bullet is placed correctly they all die VERY quickly

[versa-06]

My 375 Win.'s & 38-55's & 454 casull rifles haven't taken any game because I got them after the last season. I did take out 2 beavers with the 38-55 re-bore by Jessie using a round ball pushed with titegroup & quite devistating. I feel I can get a little more range with the 375 bores, but the 2 454's are really heavy hitters with less powder consumption than a 45-70. There was a big fire in the woods by my house & the deer have changed their traveling routs. Started traveling in a very dense holler that can be hunted up close & personal. These big bores may score yet. -06

[ChristopherO]

Keep us posted. We know they will work and work very well. Looking forward to hearing the stories and viewing the photos you post this season.

[AlaskaMike]

Continued for above . I have recently picked a few close range locations to hunt deer & a few bears. I am working with 250-314 grain bullets for both. Most shots not over 75yds.

That's pretty much the situation I've had when I've gone hunting blacktails and black bear in Prince William Sound up here. Certainly no shots beyond 100 yards, and most would be within 50 yards.

I used my Rossi 92 .44 mag using a 295 grain bullet from an old Lee group buy we had here maybe 15 years ago. Here's one thread I started when I was trying to come up with load data that shows the bullet design: https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?25714-Load-data-for-big-fat-flat-44-(290-gr-GC)&highlight=fat+flat

Unfortunately I never got a shot with it, so I can't say how it works on either deer or bear. I'm certain it's a serious thumper though.

I recently got another Rossi 92 in .454 Casull, but the only cast bullet that I've had the opportunity to shoot any significant amount is the RCBS 45-270-SAA. It shoots great with midrange loads using Unique, as well as top end loads using IMR-4227. I wouldn't hesitate to use it with either load for deer or bear.

[Good Cheer]

My preference for deer is a heavy 3/8" bullet launched fast enough to shoot so flat as to make shots out to 200 yards a no brainer. In other words, no rainbow trajectory for me to plot on the fly. That said, I want a long neck for lots and lots of lube grooves and so I don't have to jack around with bore rider designs, just the right case capacity to hold the right amount of slow burning powder, a handy overall length of rifle while still having enough barrel length to get the velocity I'm after. And I want to do it all without using an alloy that's too hard for hunting.

[georgerkahn]

O.K. All deer & Black Bear hunters, What caliber 30,35,375,44,& 45 is your preference & why? In my older years the recoil & the loud report is not as exciting as it was when I was 35. What is your favorite?

Sadly, my knee has gotten to point (bad!) I'm down to but rim-fire-varminting, but I have a zillion good memories in the woods seeking Bambi :). My first was a model 92 Winchester in .38WCF; I "graduated" to a .30WCF (.30-30 in a 336) for year or two; then went "Hamer" with a .30-30 Remington (Model 8). BUT, in my last decade or so in the woods it was my .38-40. For relatively short-range shots -- most at 75 yards or less -- with minimal report and recoil, with pie-size-paper plate accuracy off-hand at this range -- I found this calibre hard to beat. All my cast bullets propelled with IMR3031 powder.
geo

[Rapier]

I pretty much use 35s with the 200 grain FN RCBS/Saeco style. Saeco makes the plain base version in an iron mould, great for powder coating, nose down, without a GC. I can push them up to 2,500 fps with no leading and get sub 1/2" groups. Use them in colt guns, single shots to ARs and in revolvers. Cartridges like the 35 Whelen, 350 RM, 358 Win, 358 MGP, 357 Super Mag, etc.

[versa-06]

Been Blessed to take several with a 358 Win & that 35-200 RCBS mold, it's a good one. Was even fortunate to get a good 8pt & a Large 6pt. I'm not a horn hunter but if he's got a big rack I'm all in. I am a real lover of deer steaks, over the years we have learned how to prepare them without them being tough. -06

[ChristopherO]

I pretty much use 35s with the 200 grain FN RCBS/Saeco style. Saeco makes the plain base version in an iron mould, great for powder coating, nose down, without a GC. I can push them up to 2,500 fps with no leading and get sub 1/2" groups. Use them in colt guns, single shots to ARs and in revolvers. Cartridges like the 35 Whelen, 350 RM, 358 Win, 358 MGP, 357 Super Mag, etc.

Nose Down. NOSE DOWN! You, Sir, are a genius! Thank you for posting that bit of brilliance.

[Earl54]

Here in my part of Florida shots are 100 yds max. This year I am shooting a 30/30 load that was an old drilling load in the past. I have come to believe that a meplat of close to .300 or larger, a velocity of at least 1200fps, and a long for cal. bullet will do the job at " my" ranges. .311 cast bullet, 1350fps, 214 grains, .290 meplat, out of a 22 inch barrel,is my choice for this year - we will see.

[versa-06]

Seems like the closer an animal gets, the more exciting it gets. Sitting in the woods & a good deer (I'm a buck hunter & not a trophy hunter) comes out & he's close, my heart goes into overdrive & the excitement is awesome. A big bore rifle that won't beat you to death adds to the picture. The confidence in your own hand load, carrying a bullet with some weight & a large meplat, is assuring that the animal will go down soon. -06

[Good Cheer]

We're thrilled that way when they're chasing each other around the yard... uh, except when they start destroying stuff we're trying to grow.

https://i.imgur.com/MRU5seR.jpg

[Tom_in_AZ]

If hunting with cast, I like the .45-70 with wide meplat bullets. I usually load them hot, but there’s no reason why you couldn’t load them to trap door velocities. 405 grains at 1300-1400 fps.

[warren5421]

For deer at 100 yards or less, most shots are less than 50 yards, I like a Winchester 73 Musket in .44WCF loaded with max case black powder with 200 gr RNFP lead bullet. For the small black bear around the farm outside of Minford, Ohio I like the .38-55 WCF in Browning High Wall.

[405grain]

I use jacketed bullets for long range varminting. That's the only hunting that I do with jacketed bullets. Looking back, every pig or deer that I've shot has been with cast bullets. Casting and loading the best bullets that I could make, practicing off hand shooting at the range to become proficient, learning stalking skills to approach game undetected, making ethical shots to harvest game, I consider these things to be skills, not ego. The enjoyment of crafting my own ammunition, being out among nature, the excitement of the hunt, the comradery of my hunting buddies, all of these things are a blessing, but none of these things felt like "ego". There is confidence in being skilled and satisfaction in achievement, but these are good feelings - not pompous blustering to inflate ones appearance of worth in the eyes of others. I've made a good enough living that I could afford jacketed bullets if I wanted to, but I choose casting and hunting with cast bullets because I enjoy doing it. Years ago the state where I live in took this away from us with their "lead bullet ban", so now I have to travel to other places to hunt game. I have never felt disadvantaged with using cast loads. Even if I were using the most capable of jacketed cartridges I would still stalk to within 200 yards or less to my quarry, or else not take the shot. I am not "dirt poor", and ego did not play a part in any of those hunts, but adventure and satisfaction did, even if I came home without catching anything.

[Electrod47]

Quote: from Thumbcocker..
On a side note I do not "harvest " game animals. I harvest beans, corn, sweet potatoes etc. The animals I hunt are killed. Period. Taking the life if a mammal will never be demeaned to pulling up a turnip in my world.

Thank you that needs to be said...and its the only thing I have a grudge with Ted Nugent about.

[Jedman]

I have never used a cast 30 cal. to shoot any big game but have used the 35, 375, 44 & 45 and they all work great ! My longest shot has probably only been slightly over 100 yards but the bear have all been close like 20-25 yards. As said many times, just wait until you have a GOOD shot and place the bollit in the correct place for the animals position and caliber wount really matter.

Jedman

[atfsux]

I think the answer to this is in great part dictated by your region, it's topography and game laws.

Out here in the west, while there may be shots under 100 yards, there are also very often long shots well beyond that. And thus, the preferred weapon and caliber in my region is often dictated as a bottle-necked cartridge such as .308 or .243 or anything else capable of flat trajectory. Which is not to say calibers of lesser performance cannot be pressed into service. My first whitetail was taken with an old .32-20 at about 80 yards.

But in states like Indiana where the law stipulates straight-walled cartridges are what is required, or in terrain that is densely wooded and shots beyond 50 yards are unlikely, a short and handy "Trapper" lever gun in .357 is capable of the job. If worried about bears, step it up to .44mag or .454Casull. Likewise for elk or moose.