Blood lead levels.

[dearslayer]

I'm unsure if this is the proper area to post this question. Out of curiosity and because I already had to have blood work done for other reasons I asked my Dr for a requisition to test for lead levels. Got the results and was wondering if anyone else ever had higher than acceptable levels and what was done to get those levels back to normal. The reference range is max .10 and mine is.14.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Have you done a search of the Forum's archives? There have been extensive threads on this subject in the past.

DG

[M-Tecs]

The reference range is max .10 and mine is.14. Your numbers don't seem to align with the guidelines.

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?152152-High-lead-levels-help

https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/csem/leadtoxicity/safety_standards.html

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/lead/advisory/acclpp/actions-blls.htm

[barnetmill]

I'm unsure if this is the proper area to post this question. Out of curiosity and because I already had to have blood work done for other reasons I asked my Dr for a requisition to test for lead levels. Got the results and was wondering if anyone else ever had higher than acceptable levels and what was done to get those levels back to normal. The reference range is max .10 and mine is.14.

I am not sure what you physician told you, but if needed there are ways to lower metals in the blood. friend of mine that had worked as a contract toxicologist at a local EPA facility in gulf Breeze Florida all of a sudden got real sick and what were obviously incompetent MDs could not diagnose what was wrong.
Out of desperation she went to someone that was a practitioner of traditional Chinese medicine and they told her she had a problem with metals. She lost her voice and all of her hair fell out. She had since regained most of her voice, the hair never grew back.
What had happened is that she lost her ability to detoxify metals and so now with blood chelation they lowered the metals and she avoids what is likely to expose her to metals.

Chelation therapy uses special drugs that bind to metals in your blood. You get the chelating medicine through an intravenous (IV) tube
If concerned, wash you hands after shooting or handling lead. Also adequate ventilation when needed and common sense.

[deces]

You might want to try chewing on spirulina tabs every day for a while.

[barnetmill]

You might want to try chewing on spirulina tabs every day for a while.

So I looked Spirulina on google and found
The Role of Spirulina (Arthrospira) in the Mitigation of Heavy-Metal Toxicity: An Appraisal



Abstract

Heavy-metal toxicity imposes a potential worldwide threat to the environment and humans. Cadmium, mercury, lead, and arsenic are nonessential toxic heavy metals that are most frequently involved in environmental and health hazards. Conventional chelating agents are unsuitable for subchronic and chronic heavy-metal toxicities. Scientific literature reveals that Spirulina (Arthrospira), a photosynthetic filamentous cyanobacterium that is generally known as blue-green algae, alleviates experimentally induced heavy-metal toxicity. The present review attempts to summarize such studies regarding cadmium, mercury, lead, and arsenic toxicity. A total of 58 preclinical studies demonstrate the alleviative effect of Spirulina against experimental arsenic, cadmium, lead, and mercury toxicities. Five clinical studies reported protective effects of Spirulina against arsenic toxicity in humans. Clinical studies against three heavy metals were not found in the literature. The present literature study appears to show that Spirulina possesses promising heavy-metal toxicity-ameliorative effects that are mainly attributed to its intrinsic antioxidant activity.

[pete501]

The reference range is max .10 and mine is.14.

If that is your blood's BHN Hardness, then you are in trouble.

[Bmi48219]

At a .14 BLL I wouldn’t start shopping for a burial plot. We went for BLL testing when hired and every six months after. My highest was .17. That was after it was discovered the air filtration system secondary filters were defective. At the next draw my level had went down to .11.
Your BLL isn’t your biggest concern. The lead in blood migrates to calcium like your skeletal system. Thus a person with prior chronic lead exposure can test a low BLL and still have a high concentration of lead in their bones. Chelation is pretty effective for removing lead from the bloodstream. Not so much for lead in the skeletal structure.

[barnetmill]

At a .14 BLL I wouldn’t start shopping for a burial plot. We went for BLL testing when hired and every six months after. My highest was .17. That was after it was discovered the air filtration system secondary filters were defective. At the next draw my level had went down to .11.
Your BLL isn’t your biggest concern. The lead in blood migrates to calcium like your skeletal system. Thus a person with prior chronic lead exposure can test a low BLL and still have a high concentration of lead in their bones. Chelation is pretty effective for removing lead from the bloodstream. Not so much for lead in the skeletal structure.
There is an exchange or turn over rate. I would discuss this with someone that is a toxicologist MD

about 2% per year for lead
The bulk turnover rates for compact bone are about 2% per year and 8% for spine. Turnover activity varies with age and health. Even though lead approximates calcium, radium, strontium, barium, fluorine, and other bone seekers, the rates for each are different.

[dearslayer]

Because I melt my own lead and cast my own boolits I was just curious so I asked the Dr for the test. When he told me the level he just asked how often I handled lead and I said only once in a while. He didn't seem overly concerned about the level and suggested I just take a break from it and not handle it too often. His words not mine. It was a phone apt so I'll talk to him more about it when I see him in person in a couple weeks. I only asked here because I'm not familiar with what might be considered a high level and how to get it lower.

[15meter]

I had mine tested last summer, it took a couple of years for me to get a test, my (ex)doctor is a moron. I started asking for a blood lead level test and for 3 years she wrote it as a urine lead test, that doesn't exist. Finally convinced her to write it as a BLOOD test and did manage to get a test. It tested at 5. The doctor went into panic mode. SOMETHING HAD TO BE DONE AND DONE NOW!

I chose to call my best friend, a retired consulting pharmacist for geriatric patients. PHD from University of Chicago, his response was to not sweat it. He did some research, came up with the fact that virtually every teenager in 1970 had a blood level of 5 from the lead in leaded gas. Big city resident higher that country residents. At my age, it was not a big deal. At 5 years old it would be a concern.

Mine, I'm convinced comes from shooting pistols in a 1940's vintage indoor range that has horrible air circulation. Still shoot there once a week. And eat a donut while I'm shooting. Pretty sure the sugar will kill be before the lead dust in the air.

Or the Harley, or the iceboat.

Or the wife for me hanging around too many gun clubs, boat clubs and various places where I can practice the lessons I learned in a misspent youth.

[Big Boomer]

Always took the usual precautions over the years (I'm 83 plus now): do not smoke so that was not a problem, tried to stay upwind of a heating pot with lead melting as well as when using wax or sawdust to clean alloy, stand waaaay back when melting stick-on WW, wash well before eating, etc. Asked the dr. to check my blood lead level once when he said it was time for blood work. His nurse called me afterward and specifically stated: Your blood work is all very good. I tried to specifically ask about blood lead level and she said: You don't have a problem. So I take it that unless a person is not really careful around lead or other hazardous metals, unless they are forced to work around such the dangers are minimized if a little caution is exercised. Big Boomer.

[deces]

A possible cause of lead exposure & often overlooked is a vibratory tumbler, Richard Lee wrote about people who were around him, that were exposed to high levels.

[Bmi48219]

For the average non-caster leaded gas was the common source of exposure. After China banned leaded gas childrens’ BLL decreased but not a great deal. Burning coal is a big contributor to BLL.

[M-Tecs]

For the average non-caster leaded gas was the common source of exposure. After China banned leaded gas childrens’ BLL decreased but not a great deal. Burning coal is a big contributor to BLL.

Very true for China since they don't use scrubbers in the smokestacks. They built them without any pollution control measures thinking the West was going to pay for the pollution control measures with carbon credits.

In the US due to much stronger pollution control measures it's not an issue.

[barnetmill]

A possible cause of lead exposure & often overlooked is a vibratory tumbler, Richard Lee wrote about people who were around him, that were exposed to high levels.

Thanks, probably best to run those outside on a breeze part of the porch.

[John Guedry]

It's amazing I am still alive. First "real" job 4yrs. Worked in a shop where when we finished a product we then sand blasted it and cadmium plated it. Left there in 1967 and went to work in a chemical plant .33 yrs later retired. Since the 90's casting/reloading and shooting. Always had the lead levels checked and was told "normal".

[elmacgyver0]

If I were worried about it, I would just quit shooting.
Guess I'm not worried about it.

[KenH]

........ The reference range is max .10 and mine is .14.
That must be in µmol/L of lead units. From this site: https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/003360.htm
It says the range for adults is less than 10 micrograms per deciliter (µg/dL) or 0.48 micromoles per liter (µmol/L) of lead in the blood

It seems most labs tend to use ug/dL which is a larger number giving <10 ug/dL as the range for adults.

[BD]

Read the very extensive prior threads on this site. Boiled down: With proper etiquette and clean up, casting is not really an issue. it is the salts and oxides of lead that much more easily absorbed into your bloodstream. lead styphanate from primers and oxidized lead dust from indoor ranges are the primary culprits for most shooters. Don't eat or smoke while handling lead, wash your brass in soap and water before putting it in a vibratory tumbler and wear a dust mask at the indoor range, and you should be fine. My levels went from the mid twenties down into the single digits in about 10 years after figuring this out.

[Harter66]

I tested 11 once . Told the doc what I did and admitted to being a little casual with drinks and things around the bench .
Not long after word I was layed off for about 5 months. During which time I did a lot more casting and shooting. I was down to 7 in 6 months . Turns out it was the old GI galvanized frames and oxidized lead based paint at work causing the issues.

Today I test about every other year and I'm at 3-4 .

Chelation can be accomplished self medicated with orange or grapefruit juice . A problem that can happen with medical grade is that it will start to draw long term exposure out of the bones and make it worse than it was to begin with.

Look at all of the possible exposures when you start looking at mitigation you might be surprised at where its coming from.

[45_Colt]

A possible cause of lead exposure & often overlooked is a vibratory tumbler, Richard Lee wrote about people who were around him, that were exposed to high levels.

No doubt, it is prudent to use mineral spirits in the corn/walnut to eliminate the dust. Works for me.

45_Colt

[bruce381]

LOL when i tested for fun was a ?? 12 or so the CAL OSHA called me to demand where I worked (think they saw a big pay day) told them retired and had a bullet fragment stuck in my spine from Vietnam they stopped calling.

[littlejack]

Had mine checked a couple months ago. Test results were "6". Doc said not to worry, they don't get concerned unless it's a lot higher than that.

[koger]

I have mine checked every year, and is also way below normal. I cast a lot of lead in a small shop, with a small fan blowing over the pot. Probably 1000# per year for the past 20+ years.

[imashooter2]

Lead has been all but eliminated from consumer products. As exposure falls, so do the “recommended limits" for blood lead levels.

That said, I want a doctor to tell me when I have a problem. I want real information. If my doctor told me I had a problem, or to modify my behavior with a lead blood level of 14 μg/dL I would find another doctor and tell him why.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Because I melt my own lead and cast my own boolits I was just curious so I asked the Dr for the test. When he told me the level he just asked how often I handled lead and I said only once in a while. He didn't seem overly concerned about the level and suggested I just take a break from it and not handle it too often. His words not mine. It was a phone apt so I'll talk to him more about it when I see him in person in a couple weeks. I only asked here because I'm not familiar with what might be considered a high level and how to get it lower.

I would suggest to look at the sanitation part of your procedures and find out where and how it's getting in your blood.

Also, one of the largest sources of inducing lead for us reloaders is
from tumbling fired brass with spent primers intact.
some of the dust coming from tumbling can have Lead styphnate from the primers.

Even though the levels you mention are not that serious to you,
it should also be stated that if young children are nearby that is not so good.

[justindad]

You might want to try chewing on spirulina tabs every day for a while.

At the end of first 2 years casting I went through roughly a 2 month supply of spirulina. My blood levels were 4. Orange juice is also said to help.
*
Ejecting spent primers and cleaning brass seems to be a more meaningful source of lead in your blood than casting.

[deces]

At the end of first 2 years casting I went through roughly a 2 month supply of spirulina. My blood levels were 4. Orange juice is also said to help.
*
Ejecting spent primers and cleaning brass seems to be a more meaningful source of lead in your blood than casting.

I actually started to enjoy the very mild sweet taste of the spirulina. For years I thought I had been exposed to high levels of lead. I did a blood test from my Dr and I was told I have no lead in my system, since then I think that test was garbage. Oh well.

[fredj338]

Because I melt my own lead and cast my own boolits I was just curious so I asked the Dr for the test. When he told me the level he just asked how often I handled lead and I said only once in a while. He didn't seem overly concerned about the level and suggested I just take a break from it and not handle it too often. His words not mine. It was a phone apt so I'll talk to him more about it when I see him in person in a couple weeks. I only asked here because I'm not familiar with what might be considered a high level and how to get it lower.

It is more important as to where you shoot. I have been casting & shooting lead bullets for 45y. My blood work came back under 10. I avoid indoor ranges at all cost. I do 99% of my shooting outdoors. Even if it means driving an hour each way, which I do at least 2x a month.

[AlaskaMike]

One thing I keep seeing in these threads is that people seem to think that above "X" level, you're in serious trouble, and anywhere below that level, there's absolutely nothing to worry about. It just doesn't work like that, it's not a hard threshold.

Like any potentially hazardous exposure, you need to look at it as intensity vs. duration. High intensity exposure can cause problems quickly. Low to moderate exposure can still cause problems if it's sustained over a long period of time.

Just something to think about. We all want things to be extremely simple, but reality is rarely like that.

[1006]

Over period of 7 years mine went from a value of 12, to 15, to 17. During this time, I got more and more careful, nothing seemed to help, until I quit shooting indoors. Within a year I was back down below 10. I have never been a caster, just a reloader, and used to shoot about 1000rounds a month at indoor ranges- fairly modern, newer ranges.

[45_Colt]

Over period of 7 years mine went from a value of 12, to 15, to 17. During this time, I got more and more careful, nothing seemed to help, until I quit shooting indoors. Within a year I was back down below 10. I have never been a caster, just a reloader, and used to shoot about 1000rounds a month at indoor ranges- fairly modern, newer ranges.

Yes, indoor ranges can be an issue. Good ventilation is a must. And even more important is that the air intake is behind the shooting line. With the exhaust down range. Yes, I've actually been in a range where the exhaust was behind the line. No thanks.

On the other side of the coin, lead can come from elsewhere. For a period of time in my career I worked in a building that at one time was wall-to-wall lino machines. They printed greeting cards. Yea, didn't take but a year or two to have blood levels that were very high.

Short term memory loss and aching arms were the biggest issue. And it was for everyone that worked in this particular area. The memory loss was spooky. As it was, a conversion would take place, then 5 minutes later, one or both participants would deny it ever occurred.

Freaky when one of the two, was like, what? We just talked about this... No we didn't...

Other areas of the building already had the air duct work sealed by spraying the duct interiors with liquid latex. So it was a known issue. Sucked.

45_Colt

[John Guedry]

I have been told to drink lots of milk after handling/casting.

[JSnover]

I have been told to drink lots of milk after handling/casting.

I don't have a medical or scientific background but there could be some truth to that. The Dutch used to give windmill employees 'milk rations.' Milk was thought to protect them from arsenic and possibly some other toxic materials at the mills.

[barnetmill]

I don't have a medical or scientific background but there could be some truth to that. The Dutch used to give windmill employees 'milk rations.' Milk was thought to protect them from arsenic and possibly some other toxic materials at the mills.

Most of us including myself forget that there are people that cannot drink fresh milk. Not sure if the milk has to be fresh for it to detoxify. And I am also unsure if it is true.

[littlejack]

A little off topic, but in the shops I worked in, drinking milk was supposed to be the go to remedy if someone was to get sick welding galvanized metal.

[Idz]

A quote from www.aiha.org June 2022 "Under current OSHA lead standards, the medical removal level is ≥60 µg/dL in general industry and ≥50 µg/dL in construction, and the blood lead level required for an employee to return to lead-exposed work after being medically removed is <40 µg/dL. A discussion of the health effects of lead exposure in the Federal Register notice announcing the ANPRM states that blood lead levels as low as 5 µg/dL “have been associated with impaired kidney and reproductive function, high blood pressure, and cognitive effects attributed to prenatal exposure.” Research has also shown that adults with blood lead levels of 5-19 µg/dL performed more poorly on neurocognitive and neuropsychologic assessments than adults with levels below 5 µg/dL." Old research looked for effects of lead and couldn't find much effect below about 100 ug/dL. But modern biased researchers claim to find effects at much lower levels.
There is a lot of politics and not much science involved in modern 'standards'. It seems non-woke things such as bullets, oil, and gas are deemed hazardous by woke 'researchers' funded by woke bureaucrats. I preferred the old days when the chemistry lab had a death head on dangerous stuff. Now every chemical is considered deadly except for marijuana.

[deces]

A quote from www.aiha.org June 2022 "Under current OSHA lead standards, the medical removal level is ≥60 µg/dL in general industry and ≥50 µg/dL in construction, and the blood lead level required for an employee to return to lead-exposed work after being medically removed is <40 µg/dL. A discussion of the health effects of lead exposure in the Federal Register notice announcing the ANPRM states that blood lead levels as low as 5 µg/dL “have been associated with impaired kidney and reproductive function, high blood pressure, and cognitive effects attributed to prenatal exposure.” Research has also shown that adults with blood lead levels of 5-19 µg/dL performed more poorly on neurocognitive and neuropsychologic assessments than adults with levels below 5 µg/dL." Old research looked for effects of lead and couldn't find much effect below about 100 ug/dL. But modern biased researchers claim to find effects at much lower levels.
There is a lot of politics and not much science involved in modern 'standards'. It seems non-woke things such as bullets, oil, and gas are deemed hazardous by woke 'researchers' funded by woke bureaucrats. I preferred the old days when the chemistry lab had a death head on dangerous stuff. Now every chemical is considered deadly except for marijuana.


My lead levels must be off, because I'm having a hard time comprehending the studies you are referring to. :kidding:

[firefly1957]

I am not sure when all the standards changed it was mid 1990's when a fellow gun club member that worked for AC Delco Flint Michigan found out his lead was really high . He was in production where circuit boards where ran though the solder bath to be soldiered and blood work was done but he was NEVER shown with high blood levels of lead. A trip to his dentist showed a dark line under his gums it was from lead and he tested very high though his personal doctor . He was overweight and they put him though chelation therapy , he said this was the worst thing he had ever been though ! After chelation therapy he gained a lot more weight had bariatric surgery and it shut down his entire digestive system causing death .

GM blamed him for the high lead levels as he would smoke ,eat, and drink at his work station .