What Are Your Worst Powders?

[mtnman31]

We’ve seen a few posts for your best or favorite powders or powders that you can’t live without. Time for a post of your least favorite powders. I’ve used a large number of powders over the years with varying levels of success. Some powders are versatile and work great for me while others not so well. Below are a few powders that may be valuable to other reloaders but just didn’t work well for me. I tried each of these powders in multiple cartridges with multiple bullets and loads. Some of them I wasted a lot of time and components on trying to find a good load with little or limited success.

Green Dot – While other shooters have reported good loads with this powder in multiple pistol cartridges, I’ve just never had great success with it. I’ve tried it with both cast and jacketed and was never able to get anything better than mediocre performance. It only worked well for me in just one load. This one hasn’t worked well enough for me to keep on my shelf.

Accurate 2200 – I have tried this in a couple of jacketed small-bore cartridges with little success. My velocity spreads were always much higher with 2200 than other powders with similar burn rates, sometimes as high 2-300 fps for a load. I tried multiple primers, varied charge weights, different neck tension, etc. with little improvement in extreme spread. I’m washing my hands of this one and finishing off what I have left of this powder in a plinking load.

Hybrid 100V – another one I have never been able to achieve anything better than mediocre performance with. I got a few jacketed rifle loads to shoot under two inches, but not much better than that. There are plenty of other powders that performed better with very little effort in load development.

What are some powders that didn’t work well for you or that you have had bad experiences with? What was your experience and why do you stay away from it?

[Green Frog]

MM31,
I’ve never had experience with your second or third “choices” but I’ve found Green dot to be great in shotguns (20 ga) and HBWC target loads for 38 Spl. Not what I would call an all around flexible powder, but very useful for its intended purposes. I always have it on my shelf.
Froggie

[imashooter2]

I never understood the fascination with Unique. Ho hum at best.

Blue Dot can be scary spikey. I won’t use it anymore.

[BrianL]

I am up in the air about Buffalo powder, supposedly equivalent to 5744. Dirty with a lot of unburned powder

[pworley1]

I don't think of powders as being good or bad. Some powders are just much more useful than others.

[uscra112]

Trail Boss. Don't let me get started.

I like Green Dot in .38 Spl.

[Misery-Whip]

I have a love hate relationship with 800x.

[higgins]

I too never got more than mediocre accuracy with Unique in a couple of pistol calibers. I'm not having much luck with AA5 but that may be the guns I'm using it in combined with my shooting ability.

[M-Tecs]

Some of the powders listed here as "the worst" have given me outstanding results. I can't really think of any powders that haven't worked well for me for some applications. True, some don't have as wide of application range as others but they still have their uses. I load for over 50 calibers so I generally can find a good use for most anything.

Some of the black powder subs are the "worst" for me not based on performance but on being highly corrosive.

These subs and Trail Boss are on my never purchase at full price again. If I get a good enough deal I am willing will to re-consider them.

[dale2242]

My worst powders are the ones with excessively high prices.
All powders have their place in loading.
they are all equally usable to me.

[Baltimoreed]

Hated Trail Boss too.

[BrianL]

I got a deal on Promo a few years back, $124 for 8lbs. One of my worst powders because I can't find it anymore

[gewehrfreund]

My vote goes to CFEblk. Still haven't found an accurate load in any cartridge I've tried it in, and it's very dirty

[SoonerEd]

Triple 7...leaves a bad crude ring. Switched to Blackhorn 209 and can now shoot 10+ shots without cleaning.

[dverna]

I currently have 27 powders on hand. None are bad but I do not chase fads either.

I have settled on four that will do everything I need doing.

[crash87]

My worst powders are the ones with excessively high prices.
All powders have their place in loading.
they are all equally usable to me.
I agree, It interests me that alot of the now available Hodgdon Powders namely H4831 /H4350 / H4895 go to powders for a lot of rifle reloaders are now priced $10-$15 more than comparable other brands in the same burn range. It wasn't always like that. But for some reason $50lb is what these are bringing. Powders I've heard alot of guys say they will always use and have on their shelves, mainstays. But I'm wondering, do they want to stop marketing these powders for some reason? Just jack the price up, shooters find cheaper alternatives, and its over, Discontinued because lack of sales? you tell me.
And my worst powders are the ones I've gotten loads worked up with and Poof theier now gone not on the shelves. Case in point, they came out with it so I thought I'd try it, IMR enduron powders, remember that fleeting johnny come lately, all the new rage now where is it?
So Old stand byes so high priced we try to find alternatives, and newly introduced powders that we feel can be used in their place. then poof. they are gone.
Crash87

[farmbif]

I think I have at least 50 or 60 different powders in the bunker ive accumulated over the years just trying out different things. and one I can agree about is that hybrid 100 stuff, but I no longer load any big rifle magnum cartridges. green dot is an excellent powder for 1 1/8 oz skeet loads. 2200 is the cats meow for top velocity 6.8 jacketed loads. almost every powder can be very useful for certain purposes. some just happen to work very well at a lot of things, like varget or 2520 for rifle or 2400 or unique for pistol and lots of cast rifle loads. some powders offer very good to excellent accuracy at a wide range of loadings like 8208 where as some you only get the best accuracy at top load volumes like LVR.

[WILCO]

Trail Boss. Don't let me get started.


I bought that powder for use in 45-70 government.
My first disappointment was it isn't a full pound.

[smilie=b:

[stubshaft]

Trail Boss! I never found a really accurate load in any of the cartridges I've used it in.

[kd185]

869
looked like they swept it up off the floor
more junk floating around in the mix than actual powder

[firefly1957]

I am with another on Unique I have had very mixed results on it and for some reason my S&W model 29 hates it even starting loads flatten primers and stick cases . Same bullet same gun shoots MAX. loads of slower powders just fine? Shooting Unique in Contender is no problem either. I first used Unique shot shell loads it was very dirty.

I have had trouble with Blue Dot in magnum pistol but love it in shot shell and .45 acp.

Over the years I have collected many powders I rarely use I even have some AL-8 on the shelf yet it was my go to powder for my S&W model 28 with 110 grain bullets . Last loadings of it was in my 44 magnum it makes a nice flask out of the cylinder gap it did the same from .357 Magnum also .

P.S. that is AL-8 in my Avatar

[Cast10]

So much to agree with here.

Some 45+ years ago with my first 44mag, I tried Herco. I am not a shotgun reloader, but read a lot about shotgun powders in pistols/revolvers. Seem to recall it was a mild/mid range powder for 44mag. But gosh, was it dirty. It also didn’t shoot very well, or maybe it was ME! LOL. I soon went to 296 and developed some nice loads. Haven’t tried it since; dirty.

As stated, each powder has its place. I’m glad they’re so many as if one doesn’t work well for a given application, try another. Also, never been a H fan, and noticeably higher in price than the other ownings.

[georgerkahn]

We’ve seen a few posts for your best or favorite powders or powders that you can’t live without. Time for a post of your least favorite powders. I’ve used a large number of powders over the years with varying levels of success. Some powders are versatile and work great for me while others not so well. Below are a few powders that may be valuable to other reloaders but just didn’t work well for me. I tried each of these powders in multiple cartridges with multiple bullets and loads. Some of them I wasted a lot of time and components on trying to find a good load with little or limited success.

Green Dot – While other shooters have reported good loads with this powder in multiple pistol cartridges, I’ve just never had great success with it. I’ve tried it with both cast and jacketed and was never able to get anything better than mediocre performance. It only worked well for me in just one load. This one hasn’t worked well enough for me to keep on my shelf.

Accurate 2200 – I have tried this in a couple of jacketed small-bore cartridges with little success. My velocity spreads were always much higher with 2200 than other powders with similar burn rates, sometimes as high 2-300 fps for a load. I tried multiple primers, varied charge weights, different neck tension, etc. with little improvement in extreme spread. I’m washing my hands of this one and finishing off what I have left of this powder in a plinking load.

Hybrid 100V – another one I have never been able to achieve anything better than mediocre performance with. I got a few jacketed rifle loads to shoot under two inches, but not much better than that. There are plenty of other powders that performed better with very little effort in load development.

What are some powders that didn’t work well for you or that you have had bad experiences with? What was your experience and why do you stay away from it?

Bion, my number one criteria on ANY powder is the ease of which I reload with it. Huh? Generally, "Bullseye"-type powders will be measured by any/all of the 10 or so different powder measure devices (Ohaus, Dillon, Harrell, Redding, RCBS electronic) with hardly any variation in their throw. Others -- 'specially "stick" powders are not so. I've spent more time -- not happy time -- trying to get consistent throws from most any of these. Such that I have set powder measures for a minus-one grain, and then resort to using a Hornady crank powder trickler to add requisite. Not just one -- pretty much all stick powders are, to me, the worst!
geo

[Texas by God]

Paying the one pound price for a half pound of powder(Trailboss) is a non starter for me.
Not a “bad” powder; but Superformance is so limited in use for my guns(22-250 and 30-06 higher velocity loads)- I won’t buy any more.


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[FullTang]

While the standard response is that all powders have their place, and that's generally how I feel, I have to agree with the OP's assessment of Accurate 2200. I've never had as many hang-fires with any powder as I have had with a single pound of that stuff---in multiple loads with multiple calibers, and not reduced loads, either. Needless to say, velocities were all over the place, too.

[FullTang]

Paying the one pound price for a half pound of powder(Trailboss) is a non starter for me.
Not a “bad” powder; but Superformance is so limited in use for my guns(22-250 and 30-06 higher velocity loads)- I won’t buy any more.


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The one thing that Trail Boss is good for, in my opinion, is light loads for obsolete rifle cartridges with little or no data available. It is very handy that you can just fill the case up with Trail Boss and shoot your old mil-surp, and it will work with decent accuracy. Still doesn't justify the price, though.

[gypsyman]

After reading the posts above, it dawned on me. Company's making powder, are thinking just like the cigarette company's. Here's why! Growing up with my parents having a small convenience store in Toledo, in the 60's our cigarette rack held about 6 brands, about 2 ft. wide. By the time I sold it in '85, it was 8 ft. wide and well over 50 brands, plus all the options!(menthol or reg., 100's length and light-blah-blah-blah) Didn't increase sales, just inventory went way up. If the powder company's knock off trying to bring out new and improved, and made more of what has been established as a go to powder, lower the price down so we could shoot more, they could keep their overhead lower. Win-Win for both side's!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Alcan AL-8 is a square flake powder...I gotta wonder who came up with that idea?
Bridging...I think I could build a bridge across the San Francisco Bay with AL-8, LOL.
BUT, once I got the stuff in my cases, it shot good in my Mod 629.

[Kosh75287]

MY pistol propellants usually consist of Bullseye/RedDot, Unique/Herco, and Alliant 2400/IMR-4227. The only propellant mentioned by mtnman31 that I have used is Alliant Green Dot (MIGHT have been HERCULES, back then). It worked okay in .380, .38 Spl., .40 S&W, and .45 ACP, but seemed to not provide the performance of Unique/Herco, while not being as economical as Bullseye/RedDot. I have identical feelings about W231/HP-38.
I got the impression that Green Dot was formulated with its use in certain shotgun gauges as the first consideration, and its use as a pistol propellant second (or last?). I certainly would not go out of my way to obtain any, but neither would I refuse it if it was offered as a gift.

The propellant that I'VE found most nightmarish Hodgdon CLAYS. In .380, 9mmP, and .45 ACP, the usual work-up results were:
Starting charge weight(s) = low velocities, would not operate slide.
Middle charge weight(s) = higher but sub-par velocities, would operate slide, often unreliably.
Max/Near Max charge weight(s) = on-par/high velocities, FULLY(overly) operated slide, flung brass into the next zip code.
In SOME loads, there were no "middle" charges, or the charges in the middle exhibited the same results as lower charges or max/near-max. I WILL say that the propellant lived up to Hodgdon's claim of burning cleanly. All my brass that did NOT leave my zip code looked almost unfired.

Either I'm overly tolerant of Unique/Herco, or I'm not experiencing the same problems with them as others. While neither will win the "Cleanest Burning Propellant" award, they seem to burn cleanly ENOUGH, especially when used in loads developing ~18,000 p.s.i. and higher. They do not "meter" like water, as some newer propellants do, but they measure well enough that their shape does not give rise to variations in velocities, thus accuracy. I have used both propellants in pistol calibers from .32 ACP (a chore, admittedly) to .45 Colt. They have never worked less than "okay" and, in an overwhelming majority of loads, either worked very well, or delivered best results.
In .357 Magnum, 7.0-7.5/Unique/158 gr. RNFP or LSWC has never failed to 1150+ f/s velocities in any revolver in which I used it.
In .38 Super, 5.4, 5.7 & 6.0/Unique/140 gr. LSWC gives slightly over 1100 f/s, ~1150 f/s, and just under 1200 f/s, respectively (I use small rifle primers in these loads).
In .45 Colt, 7.5/Unique/250 gr. RNFP or LSWC gives a true 850 f/s from 4 & 3/4" and 5.5" barrels, perhaps slightly more from longer ones.
Elevating the charge to 8.0-8.5/Unique/250 gr. RNFP/LSWC gives ~100 f/s more velocity, if one feels it is needed. 9.0/Unique/250 gr. RNFP/LSWC, used IN RUGER/T-C STRENGTH GUNS ONLY, routinely breaks 1000 f/s from most barrels, and approaches 1100 f/s in my 7.5" RedHawk. Loads using HERCO in place of UNIQUE usually require 0.3-0.5 gr. more propellant, but tends to give slightly higher velocities as max loads are reached.
Not surprisingly, all loads tend to shoot more cleanly as charge weights increase, but the lightest loads are by no means "filthy". I also use slightly heavier crimps than some reloaders might.

[P Flados]

My worst experience with a powder was an 8# jug of H110 (that is now 1/2 gone). I had been using 296 for years with no problems. The H110 batch had issues with poor ignition (high velocity spreads, individual low power rounds and bullets stuck in barrel). This was in a number of different guns / calibers. This was also about the time I switched to powder coat and was working up a bunch of new loads and it seemed worse in cold conditions.

I tried H4227 as a replacement. At first I was happy. Then one of my 357 Max loads that did good for load workup was found to be way to strong on a hot day. When I backed off enough for hot weather shooting, the load fell out of the "happy place" when fired at typical temperatures.

The above represent "bad experiences". Now I will talk about a "disappointment" with no real bad issues. Unique just never seemed to do exceptional at anything I have tried it for. I bought an 8# jug as part of a big order to spread out the hazmat. It works ok for some specific loads in some of my guns, but none of these loads are good enough to justify me buying any more when the current jug runs out.

[MT Gianni]

107 It is the equivelent of AA #7 but meters like square hockey pucks, 5010 a close second with a Lincoln Log shape. I have enough cartridges to load I can always find a use for a powder but some are a pain to move quickly with. IMR 7383 can cause some pucker you up moments.

[clearwater]

Trail Boss by far

223-stuck jacketed bullet in bore with full charge.
25-06 - shotgun pattern with jacketed, not even on paper with cast
308 not on paper with cast
44 mag- larger groups than 2400, Bulleye

Have a fun load for IMR Green (green dot) 375 Ruger with 240 grain cast

[BrianL]

I have had no standout loads in 300 BLK with l'LL gun. I went through a couple of pounds and found that H110 for supers, and 1680 for subs, covered my needs. Ant the other issue was that the L'll gun seemed to burn into the sides of my Uniflow if I left it more than a day or two.

[dale2242]

To get the most consistent charges with any powder dispenser, use ball powder.
There is ball powders of every burn rate.
To solve all your dispensing issues, buy an electronic dispenser, if it`s within your budget.

[NObamain2012]

H380 when it was a surplus powder, 2-3 inch vertical stringing at 100 yards in 22-250, 243, 7x57, 257 roberts,308. And a tar like residue in the barrel that was a SOAB to clean.H110 in .410 shotshells.

[Rockindaddy]

Every load I have tried with 2400 I find unburned little deposits that could be half burned powder or the cellulose the nitroglycerin was soaked in. Have several pounds of it and quit using it. Maybe take it to a gun show and trade it off.

[GONRA]

GONRA hasn't had any modern powder (WW231, HS-6, etc.) mess up transparent powder measure hoppers.
(Dillon, RCBS, etc.) Wonder what it is in L'll Gun that that eats 'em up? ??

[brokeasajoke]

Lilgun id my only bad experience with powder in a 22k hornet. Trailboss may not be accurate but my kids can shoot big boomers with it.

[BrianL]

Paying the one pound price for a half pound of powder(Trailboss) is a non starter for me.
Not a “bad” powder; but Superformance is so limited in use for my guns(22-250 and 30-06 higher velocity loads)- I won’t buy any more.


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I have ALMOST bought Trailboss a couple of times but could not get past the price.

[fayettefatts]

Trailboss works well in my 25-20. Hope I can find more before I run out.

[uscra112]

Paying the one pound price for a half pound of powder(Trailboss).......


Strongly suggests that the retail price of powder is driven by distribution and marketing, not the cost of manufacturing the product.

[Kosh75287]

And the other issue was that the LIL' GUN seemed to burn into the sides of my Uniflow if I left it more than a day or two.
I had the same problem with W231, back in the day. It was the only propellant from which I had that behaviour. Of course, the RIGHT way to do things is to not leave the powder hopper full overnight, but sometimes "SPIT" happens...

[mtnman31]

Geez, don't get me started on powder and component pricing. I'll just say that some of the Shooters World powders currently aren't the bargain they were. Their pricing on a few of their products has seen a big jump. Alliant powders are being priced off my bench. Currently, some of their rifle powders (the few currently available) are priced around 60 bucks a pound. Alliant may have some good powders but not so great that I can't find a suitable, more affordable replacement for. There are alternatives from other manufacturers that work well in the 45-50 dollar range.

I appreciate the good discussion on this thread.

[huntinlever]

My worst powders are the ones with excessively high prices.
All powders have their place in loading.
they are all equally usable to me.

Yeah, I can't chime in because among my powders nothing has proven to be a total tank. Each has their purpose based on bullet weight, etc.

But I will say, $80-90+ for 8 oz. of Blackhorn 209 is a no-brainer for me.

[BrianL]

What has been your experience with Shooters World Buffalo Rifle. My understanding is that it was sort of equivalent to 5744? Other than in 45-70, I tend to have a lot of unburned powder and dirty and have not worked up many loads because of this.

[wasa]

Unlike others, TrailBoss is my favorite powder by far. As another said, I shoot it out of my MilSurp (8mm Mauser, 303 British, 7.62x54R, 8x56R). If anyone is SE Michigan is selling any.... ;-)

Worst powder? Not a fan of Unique in pistols. Never had good luck with it and it is very dirty. Also doesn't meter worth a darn. CFEPistol for 9mm or 45acp I'm not a fan.

[Rapier]

870, was not bad, was just disappointing, they stopped making it, and I had a 1,000 yard custom 6mm rifle that only shot real well with the 870 and the 115 VLDs.

[405grain]

All the powders that I have suit their purpose. I can't think of a "bad" powder, but there is one that has some limited applications. That is Levereloution. It isn't a bad powder, but you can only use it in a limited number of cartridges.

[mozeppa]

i could never get johnsons and johnsons baby powder to work in any gun!:kidding:

[Electrod47]

Winchester AA Super-Handicap
I have a Lb of this for years now. Have made up a half dozen rounds of .38 now and then. But since I can't confirm anything published I just leave it sit. I have used Bullseye data reduced.

[PDshooter]

Win 630

[bedbugbilly]

I know a lot of folks like Unique, but I just have never been that impresses wit the results I've had with it in either my pistol or rifle loadings - still have a pound of it and will certainly use it up, but the three powders I always seem to reach for is Bulls Eye, Red Dot or Green Dot. But everyone is different with different experiences.

If anything, my one "dislike" is not the powders, but rather, the packaging some mags. come up with. I have shot more BP in the last 60 years that smokeless - and let's face it, powders were generally sold by the pound for, well, centuries. During the Obama shortage when shelves were pretty much bare, I was able to buy, what I thought was 2 1# containers of 700X. When I got it home, I read the container before putting it on the shelf and discovered that instead of being 16 ounces of powder, it was 14 ounces. Huh? A number months later, I was in the LGS where I had scored an 8 lb jug of Red Dot and they had two containers of Trail Boss on the shelf. OK - I had read a number of things about it so asked to see a container of it. As already mentioned in one of the posts here, I quickly discovered it held half the usual weight of most powder containers but was priced at the amount of what you'd expect to pay for a pound. No thanks.

And yes, I'm old and well understand business, distributor pricing, supply and demand, etc. Not much different though from what we are experiencing now from food suppliers who cut down the size of packaging and the quantity within, yet started out still charging the same price as before - now increased even more by Biden's inflation.

[uscra112]

A l-o-o-ng time ago I tried Unique in .38 Special. All I can remember is that it was extremely dirty. Later I loaded it in the .32-20 at a higher pressure and it was better, but I didn't pursue loading that cartridge very far. Haven't used Unique since. Probably 20 years now. But it still scores well above Trail Boss in my book.

[MT Gianni]

If I had 50 primers left in the world, 50 38 special cases and 40 different powders to choose from, I would happily load 5 gr Unique and the Lyman 358477.

[NObamain2012]

Any of the slower ball powders in 12 and 10 gauge hunting loads used in sub-freezing weather. I agree Longshot works well in 20 and 28 gauge, but larger gauges, NO.

[GONRA]

GONRA noted: "5010 powder" in ABOVE discussion. That's for .50 BMG ammo fellas....

[technojock]

Lil'Gun. It burns 3x as hot as any other powder and seems to have random pressure spikes. I'm glad to be rid of it...

Tony

[uscra112]

Lil-Gun wasn't meant for revolvers or semi-auto mag dumps. It doesn't burn hotter, but it does burn longer which causes barrel heating when it's mis-used in such applications.

[challenger_i]

i could never get johnsons and johnsons baby powder to work in any gun!:kidding:

You're loading it on the wrong side of the wad, Pard! Had a jokester of a friend that would load 12 ga shells with J&J and then sneak one in the mix when we were shooting clays. Makes for a BIG puff of white cloud!

[challenger_i]

If I had 50 primers left in the world, 50 38 special cases and 40 different powders to choose from, I would happily load 5 gr Unique and the Lyman 358477.

+1.

Several folks have listed Unique in their "don't wannas". Can't speak to that, as I haven't had their experiences.
I have found Unique to work well with 45 ACP, 45 Colt, 38 Special. It is the ONLY powder that works exceedingly well
in 9mm Browning Long with 110gr XTPs.

Every cloud has a silver lining: if there are folks that do not care for Unique, that saves more for me! :)

As for Trail Boss, I find it works well in 45 Colt, in my 1858 Remington with conversion cylinder.

[Carrier]

Only powder that I have that wasn’t impressed with is Titegroup. Still have a 8lb jug I bought 10 years ago that has less than a 1/4lb out of it. Runs too hot for my liking. As far as Unique goes none better for 45 Colt except Black.

[Shanghai Jack]

I currently have 27 powders on hand. None are bad but I do not chase fads either.

I have settled on four that will do everything I need doing.

and they are???

[Harter66]

10x didn't bring me bliss and it wasn't something I could use in other places I have .
H110 . It's good in the 357 but just a PITA in the 45 Colts.

As a qualifier I'm down to almost exclusively cast bullets.
I load 2 from the 308 family,1 from the 300 Savage family, 3 from the x57-58 clans , 1 belted mag , 2 from the 06' family,4 more or less ACP clan , 410 ,45-70 , 20 ,16 and 12ga . Plus 4 more pistols .
22,25,26,27,28,30,32,35/38/9, 40 , 45 rifle and pistol . In total 17 cal , 5 ga , and 30 cases . It's a mouth full to say I could get by with just 4 powders but 7-8 make it much easier.

[technojock]

Lil-Gun wasn't meant for revolvers or semi-auto mag dumps. It doesn't burn hotter, but it does burn longer which causes barrel heating when it's mis-used in such applications.

I was only using it in a .22-K Hornet. I'm still happy to be rid of it...

Tony

[poppy42]

I never understood the fascination with Unique. Ho hum at best.

Blue Dot can be scary spikey. I won’t use it anymore.
Unique one of the oldest powders and the one powders and the one powder that can be used to load more different calibers than any other powder. I’ve loaded 9x19, 9x18, 38 special, 30-06, and 12 gauge to name a few. May not be the best in all but it’ll work! As for blue dot being “spikey “ if you mean temperature sensitive yes.

[Maven]

Many here think Lil'Gun is the spawn of the devil, but I've successfully used it as a reduced load in my .30-06 (I should have used a few grains more), as an initiating charge in7.62 x 39mm cartridges, and as a starting charge in my SBH revolver. The bbl. wasn't hot after each cylinder full. As for IMR 5010, who could resist a propellant @ $7.00/lb.? Although difficult to meter and slow burning, one learns to adjust quite quickly. LR mag. primers and judicious use of some sort of filler, e.g., spherical shot buffer, or better, powdered bran, raises pressure enough for a cleaner burn in the .30-06.

Both Lil'Gun and 5010 aren't the first choice of many I'm willing to wager, but sometimes they can be had at bargain prices. and that's a good thing!

[uscra112]

Less than a caseful of slow powder + magnum primer + heavy jacketed bullet = the recipe for the dread "SEE" event. Dense filler in lieu of compressed charge pretty much mandatory. Maybe safer with cast bullet, but ????

[Maven]

uscra112, The reason a filler is used is to insure a cleaner burn, which for example, means using at least 48gr. 5010 + 1cc (Lee dipper) of filler in a .30-06 case.

[uscra112]

What you have to be mindful of is the case where the primer explosion drives the bullet into the throat, where it stops before the powder burn develops enough pressure to keep it going. Bullet is then a bore obstruction. If you're shooting cast, the bullet isn't strong enough to do this, jacketed and especially solid copper bullets definitely are. Your filler will hopefully crowd the powder against the primer and make it light up quicker, but ???? Be watchful for pressure signs.

[AlaskaMike]

Maven, I wish we were closer--I'd give you the pound of Lil' Gun I have for free!

I'm not sure why it didn't heat up your guns to the disturbing level it did mine, but I have seen similar stuff in other folks' posts. I really wonder if it didn't get reformulated along the way at some point.

Regardless, I can get equal results out of 296/H110, and better results from 300MP, both of which I have ample supplies of, so I have exactly zero use for Lil' Gun.

[Maven]

Thanks Alaska Mike! Truth to tell, I got mine in FL some years ago when the gun shop/indoor range was closing out their reloading stock. If you want to experience bbl. heat, try a .44mag. cylinderful with ~33gr. blackpowder! (LOL)

[Tracy]

I agree with those who list Trail Boss. It's way too expensive. And, I have a real problem with the dangerous misinformation that a lot of newbie reloaders spread about it. Trail Boss does nothing that I can't do for much less money with Red Dot.

I also don't buy black powder substitutes. I would probably try 777 because it does seem intriguing, but I have read that it starts losing potency within a few months after you open it. That's a no-go for me. Real black powder works fine and doesn't need replacement.

Lastly, H110/W296. I have, use and like it. But among the powders I use, I could give that one up more easily than most because of its inflexibility.

[hc18flyer]

I have a 1# of Lil' Gun that I bought for .45 Colt that I am not sure how to use up? I also have a 4# of Tite Group I bought before I knew there were better powders for cast boolets. I have heard from others that TG works with cast, I just like to use others? hc18flyer

[rintinglen]

Powders that I have had poor results from. IMR 4320, mediocre accuracy in every thing I tried it in. Green Dot in pistol cartridges. HS-6 in standard velocity loads. AA #2--I had a lot of trouble with every can seemingly having a different burn rate, ranging from fast Bullseye to slow WW 231--I haven't bought any in 30 years.

While I can agree that most every powder has its niche, some of those spaces are awfully narrow, where as powders like IMR4895, Bullseye, Red Dot, Varget and 2400 have broader utility.

[beemer]

I save my Green dot for my shotguns, works great.

Unique might be dirty but it sure is versatile. I tried Blue dot but never really liked it for some reason, could be because Unique does every thing I want to do in a handgun.

Trail Boss, has it's place but it is not here. Worked for light loads in my Mosin-Nagant but Red Dot worked better.

5744 works well in my 30-30 at 16-17 grains and a filler but leaves more unburned powder in my 45-70 than I care for, 2400 works better.

I have some IMR 4320, not much luck but works for my 8mm Mauser. I will use it up and it's gone, think it is discontinued anyway. Prefer 4064, its my go to powder. I have several powders in the 4064 range, wish they all were 4064. Most are great but no better or worse than 4064.

I have some AA 2230c, works well in my .223 but BLC2 was hands down the best .223 powder I have ever used. Don't have any and at this point will probably not buy any.

I have a pound of Lil'gun, I bought it for my 410 but have read it eats hulls for breakfast, anyone have any experience with it.

I have a good selection most work well for what they were designed for but there are several I would not buy again. In over 50 years of reloading I have tried a lot of powders, my results or opinion might differ from yours but it sure is fun.

I could get by easily with,

Green Dot
Unique
2400
IMR 4198
AA 2460
IMR 4064

[Rockindaddy]

I am shooting powders that were surplus. I bought 5744 for $3/pound and Winchester 680 ball for $3/lb quite a few years ago. IMR4759 was more expensive at $5/lb. Best 45-70 and 50-70 powder ever. Don't see surplus powder much anymore. Still have 5010 that I load for 50 BMG.

[ebb]

Superformance

[atr]

I don't have any "bad" powders. I have been using the same types since the 60's and know each ones best uses and limitations.

[Rockindaddy]

Hey Fayettefatts: I load 25-20 WCF with 680 ball powder( I think its 1680 now) and also use it in my 22 Hornet that shoots raggety one hole groups. You might want to try it. I am just north of Fredericktown PA. I would give you a pound to try.

[fayettefatts]

Hey Fayettefatts: I load 25-20 WCF with 680 ball powder( I think its 1680 now) and also use it in my 22 Hornet that shoots raggety one hole groups. You might want to try it. I am just north of Fredericktown PA. I would give you a pound to try.

Thank you and appreciate the offer. I actually got a pound of AA1680 a while ago so I'm set. It will be the next powder I test. Are you shooting cast or jacketed bullets? I hope it works well with cast.

[Tedly]

opposite for me , finding it nearly same as A5744 . Glad I got it when I could

[TurnipEaterDown]

See several posts naming Superformance as worst.

Not my best powder in everything applicable, but now and again there is something else to see...
7x57, 160 Sierra BTSP, F210, 0.1 off lands, 48.5 gr. 100 yds, 5 shots.
318915

[Dancing Bear]

I am up in the air about Buffalo powder, supposedly equivalent to 5744. Dirty with a lot of unburned powder
Well that's not good to hear. I was thinking of using it (if I can ever find it) instead of 5744 for my Savage 10ML.

[uscra112]

I found out a long time ago that the original XMP5744 had to be loaded to ~ 25 kpsi before it would burn clean. These copies are probably the same. It was good in the .30-06 with heavy GC bullets at hunting velocities. Good in the .35 Remington 200 grain at 1950 fps. Not so good elsewhere. I still have plenty of it, but don't load those cartridges anymore.

[gwozdz]

Some of the old timers on here may recall Herters. When I first started reloading, there weren't many shops in my area that sold reloading stuff, so Herters was the "go to" place to stock up on supplies. I don't recall ever getting any Herters powder in the "worst" category. I sure do miss those days. I'm glad I kept their catalogs.

[Tripplebeards]

I like trail boss! Send it to me.lol. Never got good groups with anything using H380 accept for low powdered 90 grain Seirra FMjs in my 243. To be honest trail boss never grouped worth a darn in anything accept for my 45 colt vaquero. Everything else horrible groups. It's a tac driver in my vaquero with similar 22 wmr recoil to boot.