Burrs in my cylinder

[AlanF]

I purchased a S&W Model 31-1 off the internet and have discovered that 5 of the 6 chambers have burrs. Fired brass is very difficult to extract and comes out with a rather nasty gouge. Fired cases will freely come out about 1/4" and then will not budge without me forcefully rapping on the ejector rod, which I hate to do. I have asked around and can find no revolver smith in my area. What do you recommend I do? Thanks.

[metricmonkeywrench]

Get it checked real good, that may be a sign of a bulged cylinder from really hot rounds….

If it checks out look into a product called Flex Hone. It’s a small abrasive brush for cleaning up revolver cylinders.

[AlanF]

No bulge. Just burrs. Thank you.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Burrs in cylinder chambers?
OR
maybe a tweaked extractor?

[AlanF]

As noted, the brass is heavily gouged once I get it out of the cylinder.

[Dusty Bannister]

Pictures might be more helpful so we can see where the damage is actually occurring.

[shooting on a shoestring]

There’s been an occasion or two when I’ve had a problem cylinder. Each time I figured the gun was worth fixing and bought a finishing reamer and a flexhone (like a barrel brush but with little abrasive pellets on the ends of the bristles).

I’d pull the cylinder out of the gun, wrap it in leather and hold it in a vise with the back of the cylinder up. Run oil down the chambers and all over the reamer and I used a tap handle to turn the reamer. Went slow until the reamer just bottomed out. Then still turning the same direction I’d lift the reamer out. Never turn a reamer backward.

After running the reamer in all the chambers, I’d hold the cylinder in one hand and have the flexhone in a hand held drill motor, again lots of oil, and spin the hone while running it in and out of the chambers for about 10 or 15 strokes. Clean it all up, put it together and live happily ever after.

Cost for the reamer runs $100 give or take a bit. The hone is about $40. Then you’re set for life for any other problem guns that come up in that caliber.

For about another $50 you can get an appropriate sized chucking reamer to open and uniform the chamber exits before doing the hone. I use a piece of brass case split length ways to make a “pilot” to center the chucking reamer in the chamber and ream from the chamber side out the front of the cylinder. Easy to screw up and ruin a cylinder if you go fast or don’t have a feel for what’s going on. I grew up in a machine shop so I’m not afraid of reaming.

Due to modern day gunsmithing rules I can’t lend you hand. But someone like DougGuy could probably take care of you. He has a Sunnen hone that is a superb tool for doing chamber exits. He might could turn a finishing reamer for you. I suggest you search him and contact him.

[JimB..]

@dougguy will most likely have a solution for you. He’s a very well regarded reamer and fixer of revolver cylinders.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

As noted, the brass is heavily gouged once I get it out of the cylinder.
Can you see the burrs?
I only asked because I can't imagine how burrs could happen in a cylinder, but I have seen extractors that were either sloppy or damaged that would scratch a brass case.
.
Although now thinking about it, Maybe the previous owner used some reloaded nickel plated cases that were flaking...some nickel flakes could have gotten stuck in the chamber? I know I've wrecked more than one FL sizer die due to flaking nickel cases.

[JimB..]

I’ve already made one dumb statement about metallurgy this week, so at the risk of making it 2 I’ll say that flaked nickel may stick to the inside of a sizing die or chamber, and cause scratches to subsequent cases, but it can’t harm/damage the steel. It’s just stuck there and needs to be removed mechanically.

[littlejack]

+ one on DougGuy.

[elmacgyver0]

If it were me, I would Find the burr and just deal with it, if indeed it has burrs.
I have polished chambers by making a hone out of a shell casing and drilling out the primer and either by mechanical means or epoxy affixing a rod of some kind to chuck in a drill motor.
smear some fine abrasive compound on the makeshift hone and polish away.
I have cleaned up more than one chamber in this method that I can guarantee were worse than those revolver chambers.

[AlanF]

Thank you guys. I have some more investigation to do in order to figure out exactly were the burr lies.

[DougGuy]

A flex hone hones everything, and for burrs you would want something that targets the high spots, i.e. the burr itself, and doesn't go needlessly honing the entire chamber. I would first try a finishing reamer and see if it will knock down the burrs, and go from there. It may benefit from some light honing afterwards, more polishing than anything else.

My question would be how did these burrs get there? Did Bubba try his hand at something before you got the gun? I can't believe this is an un-altered factory cylinder.

I would be glad to take a look at it and offer an opinion and perhaps an avenue of repairing the chambers. Send me a PM and I will give you shipping info, etc.

[Dusty Bannister]

Have you actually cleaned out the recess between the star ejector and the back of the cylinder? If so, pay particular attention to the small pin that projects from the cylinder into a hole in the ejector star. Some folks fail to insert a couple of empty cases in the cylinder when tightening the ejector rod nut and can damage those pins. I do not recall if you have one to two pins. If those are bent or broken off, that would be a place to start with repairs. The threads, if I recall correctly are left handed so a person could easily damage things trying to loosen it turning the wrong way. Good luck.

[AlanF]

Thank you for the additional info. I will check the pin(s).

The revolver was in this condition when I received it. So far it appears the burrs are at the very mouth of the chambers. Not sure what one would do to damage that area.

[wilecoyote]

Thank you guys. I have some more investigation to do in order to figure out exactly were the burr lies.

...brass painted with a black felt tip marker should reveal where it start to scratch. if already full sized brass, just a cigarette paper around it, and see where it tears...

[Sam Sackett]

My suggestion is to send it to Doug Guy. He sees a lot of cylinders and can give you a straight answer.

Sam Sackett

[bedbugbilly]

Burrs in the chambers? Are they visable - if they are severe enough to gouge brass, I would think they would be visable. Not doubting that they could be there. Z soft cotton patch pushed in to the rear of the chamber on a jag and then withdrawn ought to confirm that there are burrs - or take part of a cotton ball, push it in the chamber from the rear and then push it back out from the front should easily confirm it as the burrs would catch and tear off cotton fibers.

[DougGuy]

Thank you for the additional info. I will check the pin(s).

The revolver was in this condition when I received it. So far it appears the burrs are at the very mouth of the chambers. Not sure what one would do to damage that area.

Sounds like they were planning to use a drill bit to drill out cylinder throats, they bite right in, REAL FAST and now you got a cylinder full of whodunits.

[AlanF]

It looks like a small nic at the mouth of several cylinders.

[DougGuy]

Ok, got this cylinder in hand and found that there were some lava rock as I call them, rock hard carbon deposits in most of the chambers making it difficult to extract fired cases, and consequently difficult to load new ammo. It just needed a really good cleaning, it required the use of a reamer for a similar caliber which when turned lightly by hand scraped the carbon off the chamber walls without hurting the chambers. Throats pin out to .3145" and I suspect the previous owner didn't have much knowledge in maintaining his firearm, and likely sold it when it became difficult to load and shoot. Doh....

Should make a decent shooter with .314" boolits.

[Hannibal]

Ok, got this cylinder in hand and found that there were some lava rock as I call them, rock hard carbon deposits in most of the chambers making it difficult to extract fired cases, and consequently difficult to load new ammo. It just needed a really good cleaning, it required the use of a reamer for a similar caliber which when turned lightly by hand scraped the carbon off the chamber walls without hurting the chambers. Throats pin out to .3145" and I suspect the previous owner didn't have much knowledge in maintaining his firearm, and likely sold it when it became difficult to load and shoot. Doh....

Should make a decent shooter with .314" boolits.

Thanks for posting this. Some folks doubt the existence of 'hard carbon' even in rifles. Very interesting to me to know that it can accumulate in pistols as well.

[DougGuy]

Thanks for posting this. Some folks doubt the existence of 'hard carbon' even in rifles. Very interesting to me to know that it can accumulate in pistols as well.

When a bronze brush turned in a drill motor won't remove this lava rock, that's what I call "hard carbon." A flex hone will shine it and skip right on over it. It takes a mechanical means such as a reamer, dremel tool with a steel brush, something metallic and sharp enough to dislodge the carbon but not harm the chamber is the only ways I know to get it out.

[Hannibal]

Yes I understand. I've never tried dealing with a revolver cylinder. In rifles it builds up at the end of the case mouth and the end of the neck in the chamber. A mild abrasive such as Losso or JB Bore Paste and plenty of elbow grease is the only way I've found thus far to remove it. I've been reluctant to use a chamber reamer as if you don't have the reamer that the chamber was initially cut with the fit won't be perfect, you might alter the headspace and as hard as that stuff is the reamer might very well get damaged.

I understand you're dealing with cartridges that headspace off the rim so different circumstances.

[justindad]

I got a .45 Uberti that had carbon stuck just ahead of the boolit. I soaked it is Hoppe’s #9 for a few days and chipped at it with nylon pick. Not as bad as the OP’s sample. I keep it clean, so the deposits have not returned.