Any love for the 17 Hornady Mach 2?

[vonfilm]

I have my eye on a good deal on a Savage A17 in 17 HM2. It seems an ideal small game round with a 120 yard maximum point blank range. I see encouraging reports for accuracy, penetration, and reliability for this rifle and round. I know the 17 HMR is more popular, but it seems too much gun for squirrels, and bunnies.

My Henry .327 using .32 SWL has been a great squirrel round up to about 40 yards, but lacking something on those 80 yard shots.

What is your experience with the 17HM2?

[405grain]

My younger brother has a Savage in 17 HM2. The cartridge is very wind sensitive (more so than a 22lr). It is quite explosive on impact, and makes a good varmint rifle on ground squirrels out to 100 yards. Much beyond that wind drift spoils the accuracy. It would be somewhat destructive on meat at close ranges. After he owned the 17 HM2 for a couple of weeks he bought another Savage bolt gun in 22lr, and prefers it to the 17, not only because of the ballistic performance, but also because 22lr is more widely available with more bullet type choices.

[fastdadio]

Good choice if you like paying too much for ammo that you can't reload.

[crappie-hunter]

Some of the ammo has a short shelf life, I have a brick of CCI FAST AND FURIOUS that is unusable because the cases split at firing, CCI said it’s my responsibility to use up my ammo in a timely manner.
Still have my rifle a heavy barreled marlin, it’s plenty accurate with the right ammo, but would not buy another M2.

[sigep1764]

I think the better deal would be a Savage FVSR B22 and CCI Standard Velocity or SubSonic ammunition. I can almost guarantee you'll be happier in the long run.

[dverna]

There may be a reason it is a "good deal". I would not buy it for the reasons others have shared.

If your .327 using .32 S&W's is lacking on squirrels at 80 yards why not download .32 H&R cases? Seems a better way to go.

[elmacgyver0]

Some of the ammo has a short shelf life, I have a brick of CCI FAST AND FURIOUS that is unusable because the cases split at firing, CCI said it’s my responsibility to use up my ammo in a timely manner.
Still have my rifle a heavy barreled marlin, it’s plenty accurate with the right ammo, but would not buy another M2.

That sounds like garbage, so are they starting to mark the boxes "Best if used by..."?
If properly stored, ammunition should last almost indefinitely unless it has some sort of manufacturing defect.

[Lloyd Smale]

had one. a savage heavy barrel. it was a tack driver on a calm day. i dont shoot many small animals im not going to eat and that thing tore holy hell on squirrels and rabbits. got much more to eat with a 22lr at half the cost for ammo

[Beaverhunter2]

I have a NEF HB single shot in 17HM2. I love it. My daughter calls it my "squirrel sniper rifle". Super accurate and flat shooting. Its a single shot hunting rifle so I don't usually blast off 100 rounds in a range session like I might with a 22LR. Of course I don't do that with my .30-30, .30-06, or 6.5 Grendels either. On the other hand if you're looking for something to plink with- it's cheaper than a centerfire and much flatter shooting than a .22LR. It also won't cut your squirrel in half like an HMR. Personally I think it's the best squirrel caliber ever developed except I'd prefer a more controlled expansion bullet option.

JMO

John

[cwlongshot]

I love my H&R! YES, Its a SQUIRREL SNIPER Extraordinaire !!

The 17M2 is a Squirrels nightmare! The epitome of a squirrel hunting caliber. Its laser beam accurate making head shots probable IMHO its about perfect.

CW

[Bent Ramrod]

I find the Mach 2 is perfect for pest control for the “Ranchette Lifestyle.” Relatively low noise; reduced incidence of ricochets and flat shooting enough for a significant practical range advantage over .22 rimfire.

A lot of the cases crack at the shoulder on firing. The story I heard was that the shells are primed .22LR brass, at the final state of hardness to just sustain the crimp on the .22 lead bullet. Necking them to .17 work hardens them too much, but they can’t easily be annealed again because of the priming.

Doesn’t seem to hurt the accuracy, and it isn’t the kind of round a person would shoot boxes of at a time. Also, the shells are discarded after firing. So I haven’t seen any chamber burning or any other “issues.” Except, of course, the expense and the rarity on the average store shelves.

[farmerjim]

Good choice if you like paying too much for ammo that you can't reload.

ditto

[Kai]

I can't speak to the hm2 in a rifle but I have a conversion for my 1911. Quite the accurate little round in an autoloader. Never had any issues with cases splitting and I have some ammo that is many years old. As for cost the 17hm2 is less money than 17hmr or 22 mag.

[vonfilm]

I appreciate the comments.
I currently have a vintage 10-22, a Brno Model One, and a Lakefield bolt action, so I am pretty well set for .22 Long Rifle.
I see 17 HM2 available for about $15.00 for a box of 50. That’s acceptable for hunting. For plinking I would use a .22.
I do use reduced loads at 32-20 velocities in .327 cases, but I hesitate to send 100 -115 grain boolits into the treetops. They do work great on raccoons, possums, and foxes on the ground.
I’m always thinking about the next firearm.

[405grain]

If you want a 17 caliber, want bullet choices, want it to be reloadable, want it to be accurate, and want to be able to adjust it's velocity, why not look into the 17 Hornet?

[vonfilm]

If you want a 17 caliber, want bullet choices, want it to be reloadable, want it to be accurate, and want to be able to adjust it's velocity, why not look into the 17 Hornet?

If I ran into a great deal on a 17 center fire, I would probably go for it.

Right now I’m kind of focused on this little A17 HM2 auto loader. Some of the places that I hunt squirrels only allow rimfire or shotguns. At .30 cents a round, I don’t think I can reload .17 center fire much cheaper with 9 cent small rifle primers and .17 J-word bullets. Are .17 cast boolits a thing?

[M-Tecs]

If I ran into a great deal on a 17 center fire, I would probably go for it.

Right now I’m kind of focused on this little A17 HM2 auto loader. Some of the places that I hunt squirrels only allow rimfire or shotguns. At .30 cents a round, I don’t think I can reload .17 center fire much cheaper with 9 cent small rifle primers and .17 J-word bullets. Are .17 cast boolits a thing?

I own 17MII's and 17 HMR's. I have owned a 17 Hornet. I love the 17 HMR's and I real like the Mach 2's. I sold the 17 Hornet. The noise to effective distance ratio on the 17 Hornet didn't impress me much. I mostly use them for shooting prairie dogs. For that the HMR is more effective. The Mach 2 gets the nod for pests in the yard.

If you are shooting the squirrels to eat if you can find FMJ's they would be preferred.

Midsouth normally has the best prices for 17 rimfires. Mach 2 for $8.65 a box. https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/00020948cc/17-mach-2-17-grain-vnt-50-rounds

[Beaverhunter2]

If you want a 17 caliber, want bullet choices, want it to be reloadable, want it to be accurate, and want to be able to adjust it's velocity, why not look into the 17 Hornet?

I looked - very closely; and then long and hard as a matter of fact. If you can tell me where to find one for a reasonable price I'll buy it and send you a thank you gift. Rifles that were $500 new (before CZ bailed on the 527) are over $1000 used now. The Savage 25 was also around $500. Now they're $800+ and 17 Hornet is not available anywhere I could find one. I have a 17WSM to go with my HM2. Gave my daughter the HMR as it seemed to have lost its purpose. (Too hot for squirrels, not as powerful as the WSM for coyotes.) When it seemed like the Hornet was never to be found, I decided to look further into reloading the WSM. I have 1300 rounds on the shelf but plan to empty some brass in the next few weeks to start playing with. With the WSM I don't really need a Hornet (but I still want one! Lol)

John

[vonfilm]

A friend has a 17 Remington. It is great for headshots on pigs, feral cats, and coyotes.

[gc45]

I Have two CZ sporter rifles in 17M2. The one I shoot is so much fun I grab it first when squirrel shooting. The 2nd one is also a CZ sporter 17M2 and new unfired. Have thought to sell this one as I don't need two of them. I also have 5000 rds of Ely ammo and thinking to sell maybe 2000 rds with the rifle. Make someone a nice package. The CZ's are really nice little guns...

[303Guy]

A lot of the cases crack at the shoulder on firing. The story I heard was that the shells are primed .22LR brass, at the final state of hardness to just sustain the crimp on the .22 lead bullet. Necking them to .17 work hardens them too much, but they can’t easily be annealed again because of the priming.


I've seen that with 17 HMR. With the round head spacing on the rim, is the chamber shoulder not too far forward? It wouldn't take much clearance to allow the neck to crack with hard brass. Just wondering. That HMR ammo was not old and besides, shelf life for ammo to crack is BS. I've had that with old 303 Brit ammo but we are talking pre WWII ammo. Mind you, I've had cracked necks in my 25/303 that were annealed less than 20 years ago that were reloaded once or twice and not loaded since.

[M-Tecs]

The claim is the brass is not annealed after necking down to 17 Call from 22 Cal due to the priming compound being inserted before the neck down. I occasionally get shoulder and neck cracking with the HMR but they are much less common than with the Mach 2. The claim is the HMR was not expected to be nearly as popular as it is. When the Mach 2 came out the SAAMI specs weren't finalized so lots of different chambers specs are out there. It was such a problem they stopped making Mack 2 until they fixed the problem.

All 12K of my Mack 2 ammo is the original run that was purchased on clearance for between $1.99 and $2.49 per box.

[dverna]

All 12K of my Mack 2 ammo is the original run that was purchased on clearance for between $1.99 and $2.49 per box.

Smart move!

[gc45]

Having shot lots of Ely Mach2 ammo I never had an issue in my CZ rifle..

[SoonerEd]

The 17 HM2 seems to have not stuck and loosing popularity. 17HMR seems to be mainstream, at least for a while. You don't want a rimfire that is a dying breed if you plan to keep the gun and shoot it many years to come. I would go with an HMR unless you have a specific need for the reduced power of the HM2, or interested for some other reason like uniqueness or less report.

[Bigslug]

A light, frangible varmint bullet in the reloadable .22 Hornet would seem to make about a billion percent more sense to me for what you're after.

[vonfilm]

It seems like those that own rifles in 17 HM2 love them, and those that don’t are skeptical. I can get a new Savage A17 HM2 for about $370 total in my hands. Cartridges are about .18 to .25 a round. That’s 4 squirrels for a dollar.

I could see myself with a 17 HMR in the future, but I think it is too loud and too powerful for squirrels, and bunnies. I think a Henry lever action in 17 HMR would be pretty fun.

I used to have a Contender with a .22 Hornet barrel and I still have some ammo on hand. If I ever run across a reasonably priced CZ 527 I would probably go for it. I’m not looking to spend a $1,000 on a rifle right now.

[SoonerEd]

Bigslug,

That's exactly why I have a 17 Hornet in addition to my HMR.

[SoonerEd]

A light, frangible varmint bullet in the reloadable .22 Hornet would seem to make about a billion percent more sense to me for what you're after.

That's exactly why I have a 17 Hornet in addition to an HMR. I can also get better accuracy as I can develop a load for the rifle instead of just using what RF is available.

[Bent Ramrod]

You can use Aguila’s 17 Aguila ammo as a sub-load in the Hornady Mach 2. It it a little shorter, and blows out to fit the chamber, but doesn’t crack or leak gas in my experience.

It features solid point at a slightly reduced velocity. Sight settings have to be changed, and the stuff seems not quite as accurate as HM2, but it is still accurate enough, and the small game destructiveness would be avoided. Don’t know how it would feed through a repeater; my Mach 2 experience has been with single shots.

The HM2 really is a tragically under-appreciated cartridge. :cry:

[gc45]

You can use Aguila’s 17 Aguila ammo as a sub-load in the Hornady Mach 2. It it a little shorter, and blows out to fit the chamber, but doesn’t crack or leak gas in my experience.

It features solid point at a slightly reduced velocity. Sight settings have to be changed, and the stuff seems not quite as accurate as HM2, but it is still accurate enough, and the small game destructiveness would be avoided. Don’t know how it would feed through a repeater; my Mach 2 experience has been with single shots.

The HM2 really is a tragically under-appreciated cartridge. :cry:

I agree. The little M2 is a killer on most smallish game up to rabbit size inside 100yds. Can't tell you how many crows and Starlings I have shot over the years, to many to count.

[Beaverhunter2]

You can use Aguila’s 17 Aguila ammo as a sub-load in the Hornady Mach 2. It it a little shorter, and blows out to fit the chamber, but doesn’t crack or leak gas in my experience.

It features solid point at a slightly reduced velocity. Sight settings have to be changed, and the stuff seems not quite as accurate as HM2, but it is still accurate enough, and the small game destructiveness would be avoided. Don’t know how it would feed through a repeater; my Mach 2 experience has been with single shots.

The HM2 really is a tragically under-appreciated cartridge. :cry:

"17 Aguila" Never heard of it until this thread. I now have some on the way. Should be fun to play with!

I'd love a decent 17 Hornet but like Vonfilm said, I'm not interested in spending $1000 for one. I figure I got my 17M2 (an NEF Sportster HB) for $140. I can buy a lot of ammo with the money I've saved.

[Thundarstick]

I thought the 17hm2 was the best squirrel round ever made! The first ammo produced was extremely accurate, and then the case splitting issues reared their head! On top of that, it just didn't work very well in semiautomatic platforms. I got rid of all my rifles, but have several thousand rounds of ammo I really need to move out.
I'm thinking a 22lr case using a .20 non healed bullet will one day make its way into production and solve the splitting and semiautomatic issues while still being a superior small game round.

Ironically, my go to squirrel getter today is a subsonic HP bullet through a suppressed rifle, and for small varmints is a 17hmr through a suppressor. The latter reminds me of the 17hm2 sound wise.

[uscra112]

I'm thinking a 22lr case using a .20 non healed bullet will one day make its way into production and solve the splitting and semiautomatic issues while still being a superior small game round.


Your wish has been granted. Look into the ".21 Sharp".

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?457949-21-sharp

[vonfilm]

Researching the A17 in 17HM2, I am reading of a lot of dissatisfaction with the A17’s Accutrigger. Apparently it is much different than the Accutrigger in Savage’s bolt action rimfires with creep and grittiness. The best solution is said to be the Jard trigger which cost $249. That’s a lot for a sub $400 rifle. Some say what do you expect for $400.

The other alternative in17HM2 is a Mark 2. I have an old pre Savage Lakefield in 22 LR. It is accurate, but it’s trigger is not that great.I wish they made the B17 in 17 HM2. I can get a B17 FV for less than $300 in 17 HMR with a great Accutrigger. Maybe I should go that way for now.