Is it time to move away from Unique?

[TXTad]

This year I've noticed that several powder brands are available, sometimes at pretty reasonable prices. I bought several pounds of W244 for about $27 / lb earlier this year, and both Natchez and Brownells have it right now for right around $30. Unique has finally showed up again, but is "on sale" at Natchez for $45.39 / lb. Power Pistol and BE86 are about the same, and RL 16's "sale" price is $61.19. RL 15 is still AWOL.

244 isn't Unique*, but it is pretty useful and at 2/3, or less, the price, I have been using it where I would normally be using Unique, only using Unique for my .44 Special Skeeter loads and nothing else right now.

I'm hoping that this is temporary and maybe caused by Alliant in particular having government contracts that the other powder vendors don't have, but that seems a little far fetched. I would imagine that all powder vendors have government contracts.

I know none of you have better crystal balls than I do, but does anyone have any interesting guesses as to what's going on or what the future might hold?


* Some burning rate charts disagree and show 244 adjacent to Unique.

[crandall crank]

I still use Unique, however I have been using W231 alot in many pistol cartridges.

[TXTad]

I still use Unique, however I have been using W231 alot in many pistol cartridges.

231 is great and I almost bought that when I got the 244, but the 244 was on super-sale around the holidays so I decided to give it a try.

[Winger Ed.]

My first thought was:
Move away from Unique? Oh noooo.......
This is blasphemy......... Burn the witch!!

It's all I'd ever used for .38 & .45ACP. Awhile back I got a old 5 pound metal can of Bullseye for $40.
When everything dried up, I found a couple cans of 231 for $20. each and grabbed them.
Unique was off the shelf then, and I couldn't pass those deals up.

Both are good, and if I ever run out, I'll probably go back to Unique unless the price goes all stupid.

[TXTad]

My first thought was:
Move away from Unique? Oh noooo.......
This is blasphemy......... Burn the witch!!

It's all I'd ever used for .38 & .45ACP. Awhile back I got a old 5 pound metal can of Bullseye for $40.
When everything dried up, I found a couple cans of 231 for $20. each and grabbed them.
Unique was off the shelf then, and I couldn't pass those deals up.

Both are good, and if I ever run out, I'll probably go back to Unique unless the price goes all stupid.

Believe me, I don't want to move away from it, but between availability and price, I've had to at least learn to be flexible.

[dverna]

Unique is one of my core powders. I use, or can use it, in many applications and stocked up on it. IMO it will not be displaced or obsoleted by Alliant. That does not mean it will easily available or cheap until things get back to "normal".

If it remains difficult and/or expensive to acquire, there are other powders that will get the job done.

I am in that situation with Varget. It has been tough to get over the last 5 years. I made the mistake of not stockpiling enough. I am down to 3 jugs and if it stays scarce and expensive, I will move to another powder.

My advice is to carry a 10 year supply of any component that is critical for your needs. Of course, now is not the time to implement that plan. But things are improving; so I watch the sales and will buy more components as opportunities arise. I think powder will get to the $225/jug range and primers to $225/5k sleeve. Those are my current "trigger" points where I will order more stuff.

[Winger Ed.]

Believe me, I don't want to move away from it, but between availability and price, I've had to at least learn to be flexible.

Yeah.
I hope Win 748 doesn't have similar 'issues'.
That'll really give me itchy palms, an upset tummy, and night sweats.:bigsmyl2:

[TD1886]

Unique is one of the best powders ever created and it has the most fitting excellent name. NO I'll never move away from it and I was able to find it and buy.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Move away from Unique? :shock: MAY IT NEVER BE! There might be powders as useful, but few, if any, as versatile and that do their job better. To me it's kind of like....would I give up and quit using my .30-30 Marlin because a Tombstone lever came along? Some things, like Unique, are timeless. :D

DG

[HWooldridge]

I got away from Unique about 25 years ago and never looked back; I was always able to find something that worked better in a particular application. Unique is not a bad powder but you can generally do better with some effort. I know that's blasphemy so let the stones fall where they may.:mrgreen:

[Hannibal]

I'll always keep some Unique around just because it's so versatile. It's not the best for many things but it'll work fine in so many things. Indispensable for me.

[TXTad]

My advice is to carry a 10 year supply of any component that is critical for your needs. Of course, now is not the time to implement that plan. But things are improving; so I watch the sales and will buy more components as opportunities arise. I think powder will get to the $225/jug range and primers to $225/5k sleeve. Those are my current "trigger" points where I will order more stuff.

I am actually in good shape with Unique, but as long as there is no end in sight to the availability problems with it I'm using available alternates anytime I can.

I see primer prices coming down to something like they were before, corrected for inflation.

[TXTad]

Move away from Unique? :shock: MAY IT NEVER BE! There might be powders as useful, but few, if any, as versatile and that do their job better. To me it's kind of like....would I give up and quit using my .30-30 Marlin because a Tombstone lever came along? Some things, like Unique, are timeless. :D

DG

This thought isn't because something newer and better has come around, it's because I'm not sure if I can count on being able to get Unique like I could in the past. If I can, but I have to pay 33 to 50% more, then I'll just use it for things like my Skeeter loads.

[Electrod47]

Reloading costs have never been "cheap" just cost effective. Even in the cost environment we are in today. its still cost effective as is. Nobody has said yet they are going to stop producing the most widely used and documented powders in firearms history. When that day comes there won't be anything at any price.

[txbirdman]

Yeah.
I hope Win 748 doesn't have similar 'issues'.
That'll really give me itchy palms, an upset tummy, and night sweats.:bigsmyl2:

Don’t think you have anything to worry about in the immediate future. I bought a pound of 748 at my local gun shop yesterday and there quite a few more left on the shelf.

[black mamba]

Now that Unique is more expensive than Vihtavuori N330 (very close burn rate and nice and bulky, too) why not switch over to the better powder? Meters better, shoots cleaner and more accurately.

[Castaway]

25 years ago, I settled on Unique as my primary powder, loading 380 ACP, 38/357, 9mm, 45 ACP, 45 Colt and shot shells. Since the “shortage” of Unique started, I now have found substitutes for my pistols and saved some, but not much of Unique back for loading my 12 gauge loads. Unique has such a devoted base because of its versatility across the board.

[Froogal]

I have experimented with the 244 replacing Unique. I LIKE it. When my supply of Unique is exhausted, I'll just move on to the 244. No problem.

[deces]

Unique is one of my core powders. I use, or can use it, in many applications and stocked up on it. IMO it will not be displaced or obsoleted by Alliant. That does not mean it will easily available or cheap until things get back to "normal".

If it remains difficult and/or expensive to acquire, there are other powders that will get the job done.

I am in that situation with Varget. It has been tough to get over the last 5 years. I made the mistake of not stockpiling enough. I am down to 3 jugs and if it stays scarce and expensive, I will move to another powder.

My advice is to carry a 10 year supply of any component that is critical for your needs. Of course, now is not the time to implement that plan. But things are improving; so I watch the sales and will buy more components as opportunities arise. I think powder will get to the $225/jug range and primers to $225/5k sleeve. Those are my current "trigger" points where I will order more stuff.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I have noticed that a lot of the newer powder are claiming to be "Green", as if that is something any reloader cares about. I can see lawmakers making a big deal out of it though, possibly implementing it by law.
Well, there would go all of our time tested classics.

[TD1886]

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I have noticed that a lot of the newer powder are claiming to be "Green", as if that is something any reloader cares about. I can see lawmakers making a big deal out of it though, possibly implementing it by law.
Well, there would go all of our time tested classics.

The fact that powder burns it's NEVER going to be green!!! What are they going to do, put a catalytic converter on the end of our muzzles?

[deces]

I really hope Hodgdon isn't infested with so many green weenies, that they think this is what we really care about. How about just import more powder, since you can't make any.

[Rapier]

We are now going to be shipping 6 million rounds of ammunition to the Ukraine, according to the talking heads. More and more looks like it is not a shortage, at all, is in fact a planned and executed product shortage created by priority federal contracts and ordering millions upon millions of rounds of ammunition. Play book 1, chapter 2.

[Winger Ed.]

We are now going to be shipping 6 million rounds of ammunition to the Ukraine, according to the talking heads..

In the scheme of things, that really isn't as big a deal as we're led to believe.
Just the Lake City plant can produce a million a day without running extra shifts or overtime.

Our military has so much on hand they throw some of it away.
A neighbor that is a Navy vet tells of doing interdiction/inspections by boarding foreign vessels during the Gulf War.

He was driving a Zodiac with SEALs who were a boarding party.
They checked out the ship, didn't find anything wrong, and on the way back to their ship, they were unloading magazines
and tossing the ammo in the ocean.

It shocked the heck out of him and asked them why they did it.
They told him the ammo had been exposed to salt spray and would corrode pretty soon.
So they dumped it and would draw new ammo for the next boarding.

[TXTad]

The fact that powder burns it's NEVER going to be green!!! What are they going to do, put a catalytic converter on the end of our muzzles?

Shhhhhh!

[TXTad]

I have experimented with the 244 replacing Unique. I LIKE it. When my supply of Unique is exhausted, I'll just move on to the 244. No problem.

So far I'm liking what I see with it, but I wish I had the ability to test it up against Unique for some of the slightly out of bounds pistol uses, such as .44 Special Skeeter loads, 1950s-like .38 Special loads, and .38-44 duplication loads.

I'd love to know what 244 loads give the same pressure as 5.5 gr in .38 Special under a 158 gr SWC, and 7.5 gr in .44 Special under a 250 gr SWC.

[deces]

More like 6 Billion probably...
Looking back at the shortage during the 2nd half of obama's term, it's obvious that a lot of the ammo was going to Syria in support of the moderate head choppers. [smilie=1:

[HWooldridge]

6MM 7.62x39 rounds would consume about 24,000 lbs of powder - that’s obviously a lot to an individual but doesn’t sound like much for commercial capacity.

[TXTad]

Yeah.
I hope Win 748 doesn't have similar 'issues'.
That'll really give me itchy palms, an upset tummy, and night sweats.:bigsmyl2:

I was a little concerned when 296 was hard to find six months ago. I see that it and 748 are available right now and at not excessive prices. You may want to jump on some 748 while you can.

[Winger Ed.]

More like 6 Billion probably...

American production figures are sometimes almost beyond velief.
There's a picture around that shows a train of some railroad cars that look like oil tank ones parked on a siding.
On the side of each one was big giant letters that spelled out HERCULES POWDER COMPANY.

I doubt if they were all of the ones they owned and there was others in other places.
Plus, they aren't the only company that makes gun powder.

[atr]

I am going to stick with Unique for as long as possible. It is harder to come by and its expensive but I like the powder.

[Kosh75287]

YES!!!
Yes, you should ALL move away from using UNIQUE! Do not look for it, do not BUY it, do not even USE whatever you have laying around! Just send it to me, and LET ME deal with it! NONE of you should be BURDENED with that nasty ol' dirty-burning EXCUSE for a propellant!

[Randy Bohannon]

I still have about a quarter of a pound of my original purchase of Unique for my 41 Mag. in 1982. It didn’t take long to discover better powders were available for my purposes, I bought 2 pounds of it 10 years ago when I learned 8-10 grains of Unique was magic in 32 Win.Special. Probably a life time supply as I have more than 50 firearms that get spread around . I won’t ever be without at least a pound or two.

[gpidaho]

I bough an eight pound jug of HP38. That should take care of my pistol loading here on out. Gp

[JimB..]

I bought 2x8 a few years ago when cheap just because everyone runs on about it, figured good to have stocked, but have yet to break the seals. Guess I’m waiting for a unique application.

[ddixie884]

Unique was my original handgun powder because it was so good in revolver calibers. Over the years I have discovered that another powder choices do better in certain applications. Meanwhile I always keep a couple of pounds put Back besides the one I have open because it can be used in so many different ways. I don’t think it is always the best choice but it’s nearly always a good choice. It is still hard to beat in revolver Loads except full house magnums. That last 200 fps is out of reach.

[poppy42]

If you check the labels on newly purchased Hodgdon powder( Hodgdon, Winchester, IMR) you’ll find a lot of them that are reasonably priced are not 1 pound (16 oz). I bought some Titewad at a LGS and I noticed that the price was pretty close to what it was a couple years ago, before the current drought. When I got home I looked closer at the label I found out that it was not 16 ozs it was 14 ozs! I went back to the store to complain and that’s when I noticed that there were very few Hodgdon powders that were actually 16 ounces ! Most were 14 and quite a few were 12 ounces! I don’t know about anybody else but I can load a hell of a lot of pistol rounds with either 2 or 4ounces of powder! When you do the math it turns out that the Hodgdon powder is roughly the same price as the unique! The difference being unique is still 16 ounces while the Hodgdon powder is either 12 or 14 ounces !

[RJM52]

Have been using Unique since the 1970s in just about everything...that said, I now reserve what I have left for revolver shooting, .41 and up, and have switched to other powders that shoot as well as Unique for semis like 9mm and .38 Super.

Bob

[GhostHawk]

All of you will be glad to hear I don't use much Unique! I do use a lot of Red Dot and I do have a good stash. I have not bought powder in 3 years and I am still sitting very close to my 30 lb mark.

I do have half a can of old unique in a tin, but it is just not worth working up loads for half a pound.

[pworley1]

I have enough Unique to last me several years, but I did buy several pounds of 244 when it was on sale. It has worked well in all my pistol cast, but I have not tried it in any cast rifle loads yet.

[charlie b]

I stopped using Unique decades ago. Went to ball powders for pistol and have been happy with the results. Mainly 231 but have 244 as well.

[TurnipEaterDown]

If you check the labels on newly purchased Hodgdon powder( Hodgdon, Winchester, IMR) you’ll find a lot of them that are reasonably priced are not 1 pound (16 oz). I bought some Titewad at a LGS and I noticed that the price was pretty close to what it was a couple years ago, before the current drought. When I got home I looked closer at the label I found out that it was not 16 ozs it was 14 ozs! I went back to the store to complain and that’s when I noticed that there were very few Hodgdon powders that were actually 16 ounces ! Most were 14 and quite a few were 12 ounces! I don’t know about anybody else but I can load a hell of a lot of pistol rounds with either 2 or 4ounces of powder! When you do the math it turns out that the Hodgdon powder is roughly the same price as the unique! The difference being unique is still 16 ounces while the Hodgdon powder is either 12 or 14 ounces !

Nice to know that Hodgdon is using the potato chip price control method -- make the bag smaller when people react to price increases...
So effective...

[TXTad]

I bought 2x8 a few years ago when cheap just because everyone runs on about it, figured good to have stocked, but have yet to break the seals. Guess I’m waiting for a unique application.

Sadly, I wasn't very active a few years ago when things were good again. I do have some stashes of various things, so I'm OK now, but definitely not where I want to be.

[TurnipEaterDown]

Looking on powder valley listing it shows every powder I checked from Hodgdon as 1 pound minimum except for Trailboss (that is 9 ounce).
Even shotshell powders I had not seen before.

[Charlie Horse]

A friend got some Unique this week from Midway.

[poppy42]

Nice to know that Hodgdon is using the potato chip price control method -- make the bag smaller when people react to price increases...
So effective...

Exactly what I thought of when I first found out!

[poppy42]

Looking on powder valley listing it shows every powder I checked from Hodgdon as 1 pound minimum except for Trailboss (that is 9 ounce).
Even shotshell powders I had not seen before.

They might be 1 pound jugs but they don’t have 16 ozs of powder in them!

[poppy42]

315285315286 same size Container when you looked in the back it no longer has 16 ozs in it! So I ask you which one is the better deal? 1 pound of unique for $45 or 14 ounces of tightwad for $39?

[deces]

That is pretty sleazy of Hodgdon.

[rbuck351]

I bought a 4lb cardboard container of Unique in the 70s. I still have 2 or 3 lbs of that left as I bought several lbs of w230 that a fellow shooter was getting rid of as it was being discontinued. When I used most of that I got some of the newer w231 which it and its twin HP38 were my go to powders for 38spl and 45acp. About 15/20 years back I tried Universal Clays. Now I still have the Unique but I use either 231 or Universal as they work as good or better than Unique for me.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The last gunshow I was at, there was one table with four vintage cans of powder, small square steel cans, all sealed. One was Unique, one was 2400, one was Bullseye, the other, I forget? all were priced at $25 each. I made a reasonable offer and walked away with all four.

So anyway, I won't be moving away from Unique, it will always be around.

[Froogal]

Sadly, I wasn't very active a few years ago when things were good again. I do have some stashes of various things, so I'm OK now, but definitely not where I want to be.

Same here. I have enough, but not enough to be comfortable with experimenting. I have to be content to load what I know works.

[Saxon]

pppppssssssttttt hey man you got any of that TIGHTGROUP i'm low on unique :D
no really it good for 45 acp ;)

[muskeg13]

Is it time to move away from Unique? Akkkk! Is this a trick Demm-o-Commie question? Unique is probably the most useful and versatile smokeless powder ever developed.

[TXTad]

Is it time to move away from Unique? Akkkk! Is this a trick Demm-o-Commie question? Unique is probably the most useful and versatile smokeless powder ever developed.

No trick. It is of the best and most useful powders ever made. That's why I'm upset that it's been hard to find and expensive when you do find it. As long as that's the way it is, I will use alternates when I can. If the situation improves, I will buy about 150% of what I think I'll need for the rest of my life.

[Texas by God]

It is my main powder for 44-40 WCF, but it’ll make pretty much any gun go bang.
I just checked- I’ve got about 3-1/2 lbs left of an 8 pound keg under the church pew.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[P Flados]

Unique is "versatile". It is not really optimal for much of what it gets used for.

I have used it off and on. I bought a jug when it was cheap enough (shortly after the Obama shortage ended). I was not really that happy with it for a number of loads I tried. I also restocked on Promo at the same time.

I considered Promo closer to optimum for most any application where I can use it to get the desired results.

I am cost sensitive, and I do like good complete load data (both data for lots of cartridges and good detailed data with pressure values). Where I would have rated Alliant "as good as any" at one time, they have been disappointing more often than not in recent years.

If you care about both cost and availability, there is a trend that seems to have become evident during this shortage. It looks like cost and availability are better with ball powders.

I think this overlaps with the "green powders" discussion. I recall reading that makers of traditional flake and extruded products are facing regulations that are increasing cost and/or interfering with production. If true, I seriously doubt that this pressure will just "go away". If making ball powders is "just easier", it will affect cost. In turn, powder cost is a real consideration to ammo makers. And remember that ammo makers "drive" the powder making business not us measly reloaders. If the fraction of commercial / military ammo made from ball powders is "ever increasing", the relative availability and cost of ball powders to reloaders will improve while flake and extruded will do the opposite.

Again, I do not really care for Unique but I do like Promo. However, unless I see more cost competitive offerings from Alliant I may have bought my last jug of their product. I do intend to carefully evaluate my options when my supply is gone (in a couple of years?).

[B1GB1RD]

I was able to get allocated 6 - 8# jugs of Unique, I said send um, then I got them in, my cost was over 250.00 an 8, wow, WTH happened Alliant?

[Hanzy4200]

I use it pretty exclusively in gallery rifle loads. I have turned to W231 and TG for most all other pistol loads. I have also started loading a good bit of Ramshot for these very reasons. Much cheaper.

[TXTad]

I was able to get allocated 6 - 8# jugs of Unique, I said send um, then I got them in, my cost was over 250.00 an 8, wow, WTH happened Alliant?

$31.25 / lb isn't bad at all. I wish that was the single pound price, with 8# going somewhere closer to $200.

[45_Colt]

same size Container when you looked in the back it no longer has 16 ozs in it! So I ask you which one is the better deal? 1 pound of unique for $45 or 14 ounces of tightwad for $39?

On a per ounce basis they are nearly the same price. The less then 16 oz isn't really new. Back in the '90s AA Nitro 100 came in 12 oz containers. Still does, but it isn't $10.50 a container like back then either.

45_Colt

[TXTad]

On a per ounce basis they are nearly the same price. The less then 16 oz isn't really new. Back in the '90s AA Nitro 100 came in 12 oz containers. Still does, but it isn't $10.50 a container like back then either.

45_Colt

I seem to remember an IMR powder back in the late 80s and early 90s that was sold in a quantity less than 16 oz. Maybe as low as 8 oz. I don't remember which powder, since I was only loading .38/.357 and .44 Spl and Mag, so my only two powders were Unique and 296.

I think the container was the same physical size as the other powders, so at the time I just assumed that particular powder was bulkier.

[TXTad]

After years of just not getting around to it, I finally have a Lyman 429421. I'll definitely be using up some of my Unique under those 7.5 gr at a time!

[black mamba]

I seem to remember an IMR powder back in the late 80s and early 90s that was sold in a quantity less than 16 oz.

Probably SR4759. It is a very bulky powder of roughly the same burn rate as H110, designed for low velocity rifle loads. Accurate 5744 is a current equivalent.

[charlie b]

700X is one of those that comes in 14oz bottles and 4lb jugs. Bulky stuff.

[anothernewb]

I moved into the reloading game about 15 years ago. my friend gifted me with some powder to start. among it was Unique. I have to say it is a very flexible powder. but the darn stuff really doesn't like progressive machines all that much.

I moved my unique recipes to BE86 after it came to the shelves. While it's not an exact replacement - for me, BE86 covered MY uses 100% - and it goes thru a powder measure in a way unique can never hope to match.

[TXTad]

I moved into the reloading game about 15 years ago. my friend gifted me with some powder to start. among it was Unique. I have to say it is a very flexible powder. but the darn stuff really doesn't like progressive machines all that much.

I moved my unique recipes to BE86 after it came to the shelves. While it's not an exact replacement - for me, BE86 covered MY uses 100% - and it goes thru a powder measure in a way unique can never hope to match.

I tried some BE86 and liked it pretty well. It certainly does meter better than Unique.

I think the real benefit of Unique is that it has many time-proven recipes that you will never find in a loading manual.

If I ever win the Powerball, I'll buy myself some pressure testing equipment and find other ways to get to Skeeter loads and others like it.

[JKP]

I used a lot of Unique before covid. When toilet paper became scarce, I stocked up on primers, remembering the last shortage. I didn't think powder would be an issue, so I didn't stock up on Unique. I've moved on, to Universal, HS-6, CFE-P and W231. As long as I have primers, I'm OK with different powders

[RichardB]

Why move away when I have 10+ lbs sitting here?

[TXTad]

Why move away when I have 10+ lbs sitting here?

Hopefully by the time you're through that, availability and price will be reasonable again.

[barnabus]

Unique is one of my core powders. I use, or can use it, in many applications and stocked up on it. IMO it will not be displaced or obsoleted by Alliant. That does not mean it will easily available or cheap until things get back to "normal".

If it remains difficult and/or expensive to acquire, there are other powders that will get the job done.

I am in that situation with Varget. It has been tough to get over the last 5 years. I made the mistake of not stockpiling enough. I am down to 3 jugs and if it stays scarce and expensive, I will move to another powder.

My advice is to carry a 10 year supply of any component that is critical for your needs. Of course, now is not the time to implement that plan. But things are improving; so I watch the sales and will buy more components as opportunities arise. I think powder will get to the $225/jug range and primers to $225/5k sleeve. Those are my current "trigger" points where I will order more stuff.

that will never happen......

[T-Bird]

Early in my reloading career I switched to AA#5. It's cleaner and I got better accuracy. I load all my revolvers with it, 38 special, 357, 44mag, 45 colt. It's available too.

[TXTad]

...
My advice is to carry a 10 year supply of any component that is critical for your needs. Of course, now is not the time to implement that plan. But things are improving; so I watch the sales and will buy more components as opportunities arise. I think powder will get to the $225/jug range and primers to $225/5k sleeve. Those are my current "trigger" points where I will order more stuff.
that will never happen......

The powder is almost there. W231 is $232.59 today at Natchez. Primers are nowhere near that $45/K price, but I've seen a few photos lately of people seeing some in-store prices down in the $70s.

Alliant powders are still at ridiculous prices, but I'm hoping that is because they are only just now starting to be available again.

[Txcowboy52]

I like Unique, I load a good bit of it and I have a good supply. That being said if I find something that works as good or better, is cleaner and cheaper, I’m not married to Unique, I actually have replaced it in some loadings. I like experimenting and trying different loads with different powders, thats part of the enjoyment I get from reloading , not only that but saving a little money here and there doesn’t hurt either.

[45_Colt]

Alliant powders are still at ridiculous prices, but I'm hoping that is because they are only just now starting to be available again.

I hope this post isn't true:

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?231107-What-Powder-Did-You-Buy-Today&p=5594912&viewfull=1#post5594912

But have my doubts. I've seen the prices of a lot of items go way up. And not just reloading supplies.

45_Colt

[TXTad]

I hope this post isn't true:

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?231107-What-Powder-Did-You-Buy-Today&p=5594912&viewfull=1#post5594912

But have my doubts. I've seen the prices of a lot of items go way up. And not just reloading supplies.

45_Colt

That's a pretty huge increase, but the current prices seem to indicate this may be true.

It is interesting that the MSRP for Unique is $50.49, while W244 is $35.49.

Maybe Hodgdon has better buyers, or just hasn't done the raise yet.

[jonp]

Ive stocked a few kegs of Unique as ive found nothing that does everything like it does. I dont care what it costs, a do everything powder is solid gold.
Unique, Red Dot (Promo), 4064 and 3031. Tell me something i cant work up a load for

[TXTad]

Ive stocked a few kegs of Unique as ive found nothing that does everything like it does. I dont care what it costs, a do everything powder is solid gold.
Unique, Red Dot (Promo), 4064 and 3031. Tell me something i cant work up a load for

I could see Unique being the one powder I would pay too much for relative to other powders if that's what it takes. Until there's price and availability parity, I'm going to be judicious with using my stash of it.

[1Papalote]

Unique has way too much history/data for me to stop using it. If other powders had the data and versitility, it would be easy.
Dirty? So? My boolits land in little groups where they're supposed to. Until it is discontinued/unavailable, I will use it.

[TXTad]

If other powders had the data and versitility, it would be easy.
Dirty? So? My boolits land in little groups where they're supposed to. Until it is discontinued/unavailable, I will use it.
The available data is the biggie. Of course that means the decades and decades of experimental data that may be out of SAAMI bounds, but that the competent user safely can use to good advantage.

The only "moving away" from Unique I'm doing is using something else for loads that don't need to use Unique. It has, at least for now, moved away from being my default powder for everything to the one I use very specifically for certain things.

[1Papalote]

Agreed TxTad. I'm too old to start changing things. 50 yrs of bullseye, herco and unique have me set in my ways.

[P Flados]

I was just poking around and saw Natchez has 8# jugs o Unique in stock and a free hazmat special until the 4th.

However, the $315 is steep compared to their $233 for 8# of 231.

That is a 35% premium over a powder that has just about as much available load data including good comprehensive load info (with pressure data) from the maker.

[Chena]

Unique solves many needs without extensive load development. Sticking with a few old standards also simplifies powder inventory. I wish jacketed bullet rifle loads were as simple. I sold a .300 H&H a couple of years ago, and now am stuck with 4 pounds of R-19 I have no earthly use for. I would be in hog heaven if I could trade the many partial cans of niche rifle powders I have left over from old projects for half their weight in IMR-4064.

[35 Rem]

I know I have an unopened 4lb can of Unique and not sure how much beyond that. I think I have a large part of an old 8lb carboard can too. I love it for 32-20 cast loads with the Lyman 115 grain bullet at somewhere around 5 grains for about 1,280 ft/sec and also mid range loads in 44 Magnum. I originally bought Unique for shotshells however as it works great for duplicating the old factory "Duck and Pheasant" load of 3 3/4 Drams with 1 1/4 ounces shot in 12 gauge. It was natural that I would give it a try in my 44 Magnum revolver loads once on hand. Would not want to be without it.

[Charlie Horse]

Just got a pound of Unique that I ordered a couple years ago. It came in at $46. If I hadn't ordered it I wouldn't have paid that price. This was through my club. I like Unique but not that much.

[cowboy4evr]

Unique is a very good powder and it's one that I originally started reloading with . But ----- a few years ago when it couldn't be bought , year after year I switched to a " replacement " . A gentleman on another forum recommended Winchester Super Field . I bought some and have never looked back , I like that that well . Load data is a little thin , but I discovered to use unique starting loads and work up from there . Usually 1/2 to 1 grain more did the trick . On a burn rate chart it's close to Herco . It burns very clean , meters well and is accurate enought for me and ----- is much more available than unique most years , and it's not as expensive .

[TXTad]

Unique is a very good powder and it's one that I originally started reloading with . But ----- a few years ago when it couldn't be bought , year after year I switched to a " replacement " . A gentleman on another forum recommended Winchester Super Field . I bought some and have never looked back , I like that that well . Load data is a little thin , but I discovered to use unique starting loads and work up from there . Usually 1/2 to 1 grain more did the trick . On a burn rate chart it's close to Herco . It burns very clean , meters well and is accurate enough for me and ----- is much more available than unique most years , and it's not as expensive .

I'm doing something similar with BE-86. There are good data for it by now, but not quite as much as Unique. I believe there is very little that can be done with Unique that cannot also be done with BE-86. It just doesn't have the history of experimentation that Unique had, and probably never will since the circumstances that Keith, Jordan, Skelton, et.al had will never occur again. WinClean 244 is also available and relatively cheap so I got some of that to use for more mild-mannered loads. I did jump on an 8lb jug of Unique when Midsouth finally had some at the end of December. A friend also bought one on the same order, so we shared hazmat. With free shipping, it worked out to $44.62 per pound. More than I liked, but barely tolerable. With some other powders in my rotation now, this will last me a very long time.

[TXTad]

Just got a pound of Unique that I ordered a couple years ago. It came in at $46. If I hadn't ordered it I wouldn't have paid that price. This was through my club. I like Unique but not that much.

I understand. I didn't like paying what I paid for what I got last month, but I'm set now.

A friend just finally found some RL22 that he needed very badly for his .257 Wby...$65 per pound!

[jimb16]

I hear you guys crying. I'm not....YET. I still have 2 8# kegs of which I just opened the first one and have used less than 1 pound. Never the less, I'm going to be conservative in my use of it. I was using it in .45 Colt, but am switching to 231 for now. I'll keep the unique for shotgun loads. Being a skeet shooter, I go through a lot of powder.

[Beaverhunter2]

I'll try very hard NOT to move away from Unique. I use it in 9mm, heavy (260gr.) 45ACP, and it's versatility is hard to match. I have an 8lb keg stashed that I will never open unless there is nothing else left. That being said I have dropped 8208XBR for my 6.5Grendel and 69gr .223 loads. Too hard to find and too expensive if you do. I'll make H335 and LVR work. Those are more reasonably priced and much more available.

[TXTad]

I hear you guys crying. I'm not....YET. I still have 2 8# kegs of which I just opened the first one and have used less than 1 pound. Never the less, I'm going to be conservative in my use of it. I was using it in .45 Colt, but am switching to 231 for now. I'll keep the unique for shotgun loads. Being a skeet shooter, I go through a lot of powder.

I think I'm good for a long time as long as I use the alternatives I have when I don't need Unique. WC244 and BE-86 can cover a lot of bases.

[Charlie Horse]

I started reloading so as not to be a slave to the market. As Unique becomes cost prohibitive I'll just move on to something else that isn't, thank you very much.

[Rockindaddy]

I think the manufacturers of Unique are just pricing themselves out of business. Just bought 8 lbs of Accurate for $100. Still shooting old Dupont 5066 that I bought for $2/ lb because it was discontinued. When the Unique runs out I will fall back on what ever propellant is available! The correct boolit design and bore/ groove fit is more important than a particular propellant.

[justindad]

True Blue does a whole lot of things, meters like water, burns clean, and has given me single digit SD numbers in multiple pistol calibers. The problem with new powders, is manufacturers do not have a motive to test a powder in both pistol and rifle calibers - they make more money withholding that load data crossover.

[Tall]

I stocked up on powder and primers when it looked like there would likely be a President Dukakis. Thankfully that never happened but as it turns out buying a huge quantity of reloading supplies 35 years ago was actually a wise move. I still have a metal tin of Unique and a 4 pound cardboard box of it that I have not opened. Probably a lifetime supply.

[dverna]

Ive stocked a few kegs of Unique as ive found nothing that does everything like it does. I dont care what it costs, a do everything powder is solid gold.
Unique, Red Dot (Promo), 4064 and 3031. Tell me something i cant work up a load for

I think along the same line. It gets easier with judicious selection of calibers/gauges you want to reload for.

My core powders were Promo, Unique, Varget and H4895. Varget was a mistake as it has become difficult to get and pricey so will be moving to something else as I am down to 3 jugs.

Anyway, with those powders I could load all my "go to" calibers/gauges. .223, .30/30, .308, 9mm. .38 Spl, .357 Mag, .40 S&W, .45 ACP, 12 ga, 20 ga and 28 ga.

Last year I sold the 20 and 28 ga guns so I no longer need Unique expect for the few 12 ga hunting loads I use a year. I have a lifetime supply of Unique for that so will not buy more.

I buy other powders if the price is right. 30 lbs of Clean Shot for $450 delivered was such a case. I had never used it, but I do not get anal about pistol or 12 ga loads. It's not like 9mm plinking loads need to be shooting 2" groups at 50 yards.

I am seeing sales for pistol powder under $250/jug and that is close to my buy in price. If I did not have a good supply of powder for pistols I would jump on it. Still waiting for rifle powders to come down but that may be a silly wish.

One thought. When the war in Ukraine winds down, and it will, there may be "surplus" powders in the pipeline that become available. If that happens, it could provide a buying opportunity for those shooting popular calibers. I regret not buying surplus powder when it was available years ago and will not make that mistake again.

[atr]

I am not moving away from UNIQUE.....one of the best utility powders.

[charlie b]

...One thought. When the war in Ukraine winds down, and it will, there may be "surplus" powders in the pipeline that become available. If that happens, it could provide a buying opportunity for those shooting popular calibers. I regret not buying surplus powder when it was available years ago and will not make that mistake again.

I am not sure anymore what will happen. If recent reporting about the limited sources of nitrocellulose (China and Russia) are correct, we may be in this shortage for the long haul, even possibly the military. Someone may have to build or reopen a plant in this part of the world to fix that, and environmental stuff may be a huge hurdle.

But, it could get fixed. Look at the new companies trying to start up primer production.

[Kosh75287]

It takes very little more than nitric acid, cellulose, a reinforced reaction chamber, and the technical skills of a Bachelor's level chemistry degree to manufacture nitrocellulose. Environmental impact is not particularly nasty, and obtaining zero-emission status (or very near it) can be done at reasonable expense. I don't know what obstacles the ATFE/DOJ might throw in the way, but DOD might be able to smooth the process on the basis of military need.
If congress gets off their posteriors and funds the Ukraine like they should, the need for nitrocellulose will doubtless increase and, with any luck, so will its production by countries that are not our adversaries.
A surplus of small arms propellants MAY happen as the U.S. and Europe get serious about fully equipping the Ukrainians, enabling them to win. I think the propellant surplus for which we all (mostly) hope is MOST likely if there is an abrupt (and, one hopes, favorable) end to the conflict, AFTER propellant production has fully geared up. If the war ends suddenly, before propellant production is scaled up, or ends on a timeline that is sufficiently long and predictable that propellant production can be scaled down accordingly, we may see precious little surplus powder on the market.

[Lance Boyle]

I think along the same line. It gets easier with judicious selection of calibers/gauges you want to reload for.

My core powders were Promo, Unique, Varget and H4895. Varget was a mistake as it has become difficult to get and pricey so will be moving to something else as I am down to 3 jugs.

Anyway, with those powders I could load all my "go to" calibers/gauges. .223, .30/30, .308, 9mm. .38 Spl, .357 Mag, .40 S&W, .45 ACP, 12 ga, 20 ga and 28 ga.

Last year I sold the 20 and 28 ga guns so I no longer need Unique expect for the few 12 ga hunting loads I use a year. I have a lifetime supply of Unique for that so will not buy more.

I buy other powders if the price is right. 30 lbs of Clean Shot for $450 delivered was such a case. I had never used it, but I do not get anal about pistol or 12 ga loads. It's not like 9mm plinking loads need to be shooting 2" groups at 50 yards.

I am seeing sales for pistol powder under $250/jug and that is close to my buy in price. If I did not have a good supply of powder for pistols I would jump on it. Still waiting for rifle powders to come down but that may be a silly wish.

One thought. When the war in Ukraine winds down, and it will, there may be "surplus" powders in the pipeline that become available. If that happens, it could provide a buying opportunity for those shooting popular calibers. I regret not buying surplus powder when it was available years ago and will not make that mistake again.


i bought 16 pounds of virgin surplus wc844 (loads like H335). I am still working the stuff that I bought probably around 2008.

[Lance Boyle]

It takes very little more than nitric acid, cellulose, a reinforced reaction chamber, and the technical skills of a Bachelor's level chemistry degree to manufacture nitrocellulose. Environmental impact is not particularly nasty, and obtaining zero-emission status (or very near it) can be done at reasonable expense. I don't know what obstacles the ATFE/DOJ might throw in the way, but DOD might be able to smooth the process on the basis of military need.
If congress gets off their posteriors and funds the Ukraine like they should, the need for nitrocellulose will doubtless increase and, with any luck, so will its production by countries that are not our adversaries.
A surplus of small arms propellants MAY happen as the U.S. and Europe get serious about fully equipping the Ukrainians, enabling them to win. I think the propellant surplus for which we all (mostly) hope is MOST likely if there is an abrupt (and, one hopes, favorable) end to the conflict, AFTER propellant production has fully geared up. If the war ends suddenly, before propellant production is scaled up, or ends on a timeline that is sufficiently long and predictable that propellant production can be scaled down accordingly, we may see precious little surplus powder on the market.


I recall seeing youtube “urban” explorers lurking/trespassing on old military owned powder and ammunition depots. Rows of huge buildings that handled powder components and powder. All abandoned, decaying, some dismantled but the whole area was fenced, gated, and lightly patrolled. Signs iirc said superfund site.

Talon Mfg iirc had contracts to demilitarize a lot of old munitions and stored propellant stocks. They got in big trouble if my memory is correct by hauling a lot of it to the back forty of the depot and dumping the unusable powder on the ground.

[TXTad]

i bought 16 pounds of virgin surplus wc844 (loads like H335). I am still working the stuff that I bought probably around 2008.

Oh, you got the new stuff. :-)

[TXTad]

I am not sure anymore what will happen. If recent reporting about the limited sources of nitrocellulose (China and Russia) are correct, we may be in this shortage for the long haul, even possibly the military. Someone may have to build or reopen a plant in this part of the world to fix that, and environmental stuff may be a huge hurdle.

But, it could get fixed. Look at the new companies trying to start up primer production.

With the myopic focus on offshoring everything to keep costs down, the idea of strategically important industries has been completely forgotten. We can and should tool up certain industries again and maintain their presence here. Sadly, anything left from yesteryear has decayed beyond salvage at this point and anything will be a from-scratch endeavor. Even worse, I suspect a lot of people just don't understand that even now, and even if we do start this, attention will wander and things will be left to wither away again.