Bail bond question

[HWooldridge]

Three years ago, my oldest son got arrested on a bunch of drug charges that apparently originated from an informant in his neighborhood who passed on bad information. The county sheriff swept in with a bunch of SWAT officers, arrested my son, hassled his wife, took their kids, etc. My wife and I coughed up $6500 for the bond deposit, and another $15,000 in attorney fees. Took a year to get their kids back, and the DA burned up 35 months before admitting there was no evidence or grounds for the charges, and they quietly dropped everything - like it never happened. He never went to court after the bond hearing and was never indicted.

Of course, we are still out the money. The lawyer’s fees clearly stated it was a flat rate charge and we would not get a refund, but at least he is going to get my son’s property returned and his record expunged.

The bail bond office also said it was a flat fee and no refund of any sort. During his time with them, my son checked in once a week and was a model “customer”…they didn’t have to work very hard for those dollars.

My question is whether anyone thinks we have recourse to recover some of the money, or are we just screwed? I realize we could probably go to court but that’s just throwing more money at attorneys. My wife and my daughter-in-law want their pound of flesh but I’m thinking it’s a real long shot and not worth it.

[Epd230]

If you have a case for wrongful arrest the attorney should take the case on a percentage basis. You will not have to pay any money at all. If you don’t win, you don’t pay. But, if you win, He/she will take 1/3 of your award.

The lawyer should give you a free consultation to see if you have a case.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Winger Ed.]

Usually the bondsman is paid a percentage of the bond amount.
If the bond is $10,000. you pay the bondsman a percentage of that. Say, 10%,,, or $1,000.
If the person doesn't show up in court- the bondsman has 'so may' days, 30, 60, 90--
whatever, to deliver that person into custody, or they pay the full amount of the bond.

If the person shows up as expected. Fine.
However; that thousand dollars paid to the bondsman to cover a $10,000 bond is gone. You don't get any of it back.
That's the price you pay not to sit in jail until the court date.
And that's how the bondsman makes a living and pays their bills--- including the bail jumpers he covered.

As far as getting any money from the county-- since he wasn't falsely imprisoned,,,
Ask a attorney in your state, but I think you're kicking a dead horse as far as getting money from them.

It's like going to court and being found 'not guilty'. There is no refunds for that either.

[frkelly74]

Red Flag laws are going to play right into this situation. Just to state the obvious.

[BLAHUT]

It is a rigged game, you pays your money and takes your chances, you can talk to some attorneys and see ?? You can talk to these attorneys, https://pacificlegal.org/contact - they are a not for profit, do work with clients that have run into ?? with government's ?

[georgerkahn]

HWooldridge -- I feel very badly for you! Our department secretary was in a similar paradigm. Her son was sipping a beer or two in a bar, as the fellow sitting next to him was saying he's about to drive a few miles to check out a snowmobile he was thinking on purchasing for his ladyfriend -- asking secretary's son if he knew anything about snow-machines and cared to accompany him. Six or seven miles down the road they were pulled over by a slew of different LE agencies -- and both ended up in jail -- no one believing his innocence. (Driver had dope in his pockets complemented with a pile of cash and an illegal unregistered unlicensed handgun under the seat.)
The parents, too, spent quite the retainer on a barrister as well as a considerable sum for bail. This was about twelve years ago; similar sums expended; and... they have yet to see a penny back :(! I clearly recall, too, that both the lawyer and bail bondman demanded U S cash ONLY, upfront, as acceptable payment.
Again, I feel for you...
geo

[HWooldridge]

I think Ed’s analogy is pretty accurate. It’s like being found not guilty in court but there are no refunds. The only satisfaction is reversing the wrong and resetting the record; the money is lost.

[MT Gianni]

If he was bonded for $65,000 you paid the 10% and are due nothing. If he was bonded for $6500 then you might get money back. We don't have enough information.

[ascast]

I wish you luck. Talk to some lawyers. I once got arrested and spent a night in jail on a domestic violence issue. It was ill founded. After a month or so, n court, my attorney told me they "would drop all charges if I sgned an agreement not suing them for false arrest."
Maybe your first lawyer missed something. I lost $1500 and had trouble buying guns for several years. That may have had a 5 years limit.
good luck

[Winger Ed.]

Here- if you put up the full amount of the bond with the court, when the person appears-
they do a rather slow process for it, but you get the full amount back.
If they skip out--- you lose.

These modern generation bounty hunters usually work for a bondsman.
When someone jumps their bond, the bondsman has a period of time to return them to custody
and not pay the full amount of their bond.
It's a 'make your best deal' sort of thing for the bounty hunters.
If they can catch and turn the person over to the Police, or take them to any jail within the 'grace period',
they get paid a percentage of the bond.


I've heard of parents going through a bondsman and putting up their house as collateral for a large bond.
The kid jumped bail, didn't get caught, the bondsman had to pay the court, and the parents lost their house.
The kid is still a wanted criminal, and when eventually caught-- that initial bond money/parent's house is gone.

[HWooldridge]

If he was bonded for $65,000 you paid the 10% and are due nothing. If he was bonded for $6500 then you might get money back. We don't have enough information.

It was $65,000 for the bond and we paid the 10%. They claim the funds were consumed over the 3 years it took to vacate the charges. $2000 per year to cover surveillance is not unreasonable.

We could have put up the $65K in cash but I didn't want that much money tied up in the court system. I never doubted my son's innocence but I don't trust the legal system.

[waksupi]

I would be more inclined to find out who the informant was, and go after them for big bucks.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Sadly, unless Texas has some unusual laws, you're out the money. You paid the bail bondsman to guarantee the bond above the 10% you had to put up. You paid for a service. The lawyers performed a service, representing your son, and eventually getting the charges dismissed. I don't believe that there is any way for you to recover those funds civilly, and suing criminals has usually proven fruitless; as if they still possess any funds they were ill gotten, and belonging to someone else they were usually confiscated. Sorry for your situation, but glad for your son's eventual disposition.

DG

[HWooldridge]

Sadly, unless Texas has some unusual laws, you're out the money. You paid the bail bondsman to guarantee the bond above the 10% you had to put up. You paid for a service. The lawyers performed a service, representing your son, and eventually getting the charges dismissed. I don't believe that there is any way for you to recover those funds civilly, and suing criminals has usually proven fruitless; as if they still possess any funds they were ill gotten, and belonging to someone else they were usually confiscated. Sorry for your situation, but glad for your son's eventual disposition.

DG

Yeah, I get it. For the record, the defense lawyers didn't actually do anything - the county DA simply dropped the case. No fanfare or court appearance - just a text that they were not moving forward. I'm happy with the outcome and realize sometimes bad things just happen.

I also got news today that a good friend I used to work with, died yesterday from pancreatic cancer - one month short of his 55th birthday. He leaves a wife and 9 kids - life ain't fair, never has been - never will be...

[poppy42]

Usually the bondsman is paid a percentage of the bond amount.
If the bond is $10,000. you pay the bondsman a percentage of that. Say, 10%,,, or $1,000.
If the person doesn't show up in court- the bondsman has 'so may' days, 30, 60, 90--
whatever, to deliver that person into custody, or they pay the full amount of the bond.

If the person shows up as expected. Fine.
However; that thousand dollars paid to the bondsman to cover a $10,000 bond is gone. You don't get any of it back.
That's the price you pay not to sit in jail until the court date.
And that's how the bondsman makes a living and pays their bills--- including the bail jumpers he covered.

As far as getting any money from the county-- since he wasn't falsely imprisoned,,,
Ask a attorney in your state, but I think you're kicking a dead horse as far as getting money from them.

It's like going to court and being found 'not guilty'. There is no refunds for that either.

+1^^^^

[Mk42gunner]

I would be more inclined to find out who the informant was, and go after them for big bucks.

This sounds more likely to me; although even if you win in court, you will still have to collect the money somehow.

Robert

[HATCH]

I would be more inclined to find out who the informant was, and go after them for big bucks.

here ya go


A claim of malicious prosecution is a common law tort that protects an individual’s “interest in freedom from
unjustified litigation.” Doe v. State, 2 F.3d 1412, 1420 n.15 (5th Cir. 1993); Beker Phosphate Corp. v. Muirhead, 581 F.2d
1187, 1188 n.1 (5th Cir. 1978).
To sustain a malicious prosecution claim, Texas law requires that a plaintiff show “(1) a criminal
action was commenced against him; (2) the prosecution was caused by the defendant or with his aid;
(3) the action terminated in the plaintiff’s favor; (4) the plaintiff was innocent; (5) the defendant
acted without probable cause; (6) the defendant acted with malice; and (7) the criminal proceeding
damaged the plaintiff

you need to find out who provided the information that the police acted on.
Its going to cost you some money to go down that path. It might be easier to just call it a day and walk away.

[deltaenterprizes]

I would be more inclined to find out who the informant was, and go after them for big bucks.
Agreed, but he most probably doesn’t have a penny!

[kerplode]

I would be more inclined to find out who the informant was, and go after them for big bucks.

Yeah, except it's gonna be some lowlife drug addict or something similar. You think some tweaker has more than $20 to his name? Confidential informants are nearly always lawsuit-proof...In other words, you can't collect what they don't have. There are no big bucks.

OP, your money is gone. Sorry. Time to let it go and move on.

But hey, on the plus side, your kid ain't in prison, so it was probably money well spent even though your ladies don't see it that way. It could have very easily turned out differently...

[Alstep]

Our wonderful criminal justice system.
It's the system that's criminal, and there is NO justice!

[Alex_4x4]

... -- and both ended up in jail -- no one believing his innocence. (Driver had dope in his pockets complemented with a pile of cash and an illegal unregistered unlicensed handgun under the seat.)
...

Law enforcement flaw: according to their logic, the "secretary's son" should have been accused of gang rape, since there were two men in the car and each of them had a "tool" for this.

[Soundguy]

Usually the bondsman is paid a percentage of the bond amount.
If the bond is $10,000. you pay the bondsman a percentage of that. Say, 10%,,, or $1,000.
If the person doesn't show up in court- the bondsman has 'so may' days, 30, 60, 90--
whatever, to deliver that person into custody, or they pay the full amount of the bond.

If the person shows up as expected. Fine.
However; that thousand dollars paid to the bondsman to cover a $10,000 bond is gone. You don't get any of it back.
That's the price you pay not to sit in jail until the court date.
And that's how the bondsman makes a living and pays their bills--- including the bail jumpers he covered.

As far as getting any money from the county-- since he wasn't falsely imprisoned,,,
Ask a attorney in your state, but I think you're kicking a dead horse as far as getting money from them.

It's like going to court and being found 'not guilty'. There is no refunds for that either.

I agree.. I think the only way to get bond money back is if you put up the entire cash bond.. and then it could be refundable...

[Winger Ed.]

I agree.. I think the only way to get bond money back is if you put up the entire cash bond.. and then it could be refundable...

Yep. That's how it works.

That's how the bonding amount and bondsman works.
He puts up the full amount of the bond, but doesn't have to pay or forfeit that amount if you show up for court-
or gets you back into custody in a certain number of days if you don't.

[lightload]

I worked for two sheriff's dept's in Texas. My opinion is that nothing will be expunged. For example, the fact that an arrest occurred will remain in the computer system and will show up whenever a cop enters the name in his computer. It will show up on background checks. People think that juvenile records are unavailable. Not so. In Texas when a cop arrests someone, if this person has a juvenile record, it appears on the car's computer and all this is sent to the jail electronically. It arrives at the jail immediately. Been there, done that, seen that.

[MightyThor]

Our wonderful criminal justice system.
It's the system that's criminal, and there is NO justice!

Easy to say, but where have you seen a better system? Almost everywhere else in the world would make it near impossible to get out of jail awaiting trial, and in some countries the misdemeanor defendants don't live long enough to see trial.

[deces]

Yeah, except it's gonna be some lowlife drug addict or something similar. You think some tweaker has more than $20 to his name? Confidential informants are nearly always lawsuit-proof...In other words, you can't collect what they don't have. There are no big bucks.

OP, your money is gone. Sorry. Time to let it go and move on.

But hey, on the plus side, your kid ain't in prison, so it was probably money well spent even though your ladies don't see it that way. It could have very easily turned out differently...

Yeah, you don't want to bother a current narcotics dealer who just so happens to be working for the cops at the same time. This should be common sense. :Fire:

[10x]

I wish you luck. Talk to some lawyers. I once got arrested and spent a night in jail on a domestic violence issue. It was ill founded. After a month or so, n court, my attorney told me they "would drop all charges if I sgned an agreement not suing them for false arrest."
Maybe your first lawyer missed something. I lost $1500 and had trouble buying guns for several years. That may have had a 5 years limit.
good luck

Look up extortion.

[dverna]

It is stories like this that make me cringe.

Our system is not perfect. It gets manipulated by folks who are incompetent or have an agenda.

I worry about the impact of "red flag" laws and am certain they will be used to persecute people.

I am blessed to be able to live away from "civilized society". Yet, the only time I have had to draw a weapon was here in the middle of nowhere. The idiot was not a local and was looking for trouble. What can I say...**** happens.

HW, like others have suggested, best thing is to put this behind you. **** happens.

[HWooldridge]

It is stories like this that make me cringe.

Our system is not perfect. It gets manipulated by folks who are incompetent or have an agenda.

I worry about the impact of "red flag" laws and am certain they will be used to persecute people.

I am blessed to be able to live away from "civilized society". Yet, the only time I have had to draw a weapon was here in the middle of nowhere. The idiot was not a local and was looking for trouble. What can I say...**** happens.

HW, like others have suggested, best thing is to put this behind you. **** happens.

Don, you are exactly right - stuff happens. We will move on and be thankful that nobody has to go to court. My son and DIL went through 3 years of hell but it’s over now.

Unrelated subject but my wife and I just finished fighting the IRS for the past 18 years. They claimed we made income in 2005 that was not correct. We had the paperwork and proved our case in an audit but they still tied our hands for a long time. Filed liens and threatened us, etc. Fortunately, we found a good CPA with tax experience and he kept them at bay until the clock ran out.

[mexicanjoe]

My suggestion is contact a competent attorney and sue both the DA and the informant. Since your son did not commit any crime, I would demand a large amount of $$$.....

[JimB..]

Even if the warrant was based on crap evidence that the police accepted, and a judge signed, I think it unlikely that you make much progress.

Do have to wonder of they would have dropped it if your son had a public defender, but no way to ever know.

[elmacgyver0]

My suggestion is contact a competent attorney and sue both the DA and the informant. Since your son did not commit any crime, I would demand a large amount of $$$.....

Yeh...that'll work.

[jonp]

This is what is called "Lawfare". Us little people get ground into the dirt until we can't pay anymore even if innocent. We then take a plea to stop The State and the DA gets to strut his stuff

[GregLaROCHE]

Don’t individuals who have been falsely imprisoned for years, get a payout of some sort?

[Winger Ed.]

Don’t individuals who have been falsely imprisoned for years, get a payout of some sort?

Yes, but the key word here is 'imprisoned'.

Pre-trial detention doesn't count.

[HWooldridge]

I talked to a couple different attorneys and they both said it was a real long shot to collect anything - as in most likely less than 5% chance of winning.

We are happy the whole thing went away so best to chalk it up to experience and get on with life. I did learn the police were mad that my son “lawyered up” immediately, and they assumed he was a big fish - but in fact, he was just being smart at the time.

[Winger Ed.]

I did learn the police were mad that my son “lawyered up” immediately,

Over the years, I've seen a couple or so of Police Officers that after working so long with members of the lowest rungs on
the ladder of society can develop sort of a 'us vs. them' outlook.
Anything someone does that they don't like at the time, and makes their job more difficult, is often perceived as a 'them'.

[farmbif]

if that type of sloppy police work is common practice for that jurisdiction and there are many other victims y'all need to get together and sue the pants off those in power who are responsible. is sloppy police work and not doing actual investigation but just going off drug addicted informants word common practice is I would think you should be able to have some recourse if you could find the right attorney or organization. but if was just a one time thing for the cops and DA to screw up not sure about what you could do.
if you do decide to go after them get help from out of town. local good ole boy networks are very real.