G'day Newbie seeks advise

[barrabruce]

Been tossing up to get a pig rifle.
Got me .22 and have shot more pigs with that then any. Only cos' I had it at the time in my hands.
Got a 'ol Bruno (50's) K hornet which I used to use for rabbits and foxes.
Could always put one in the noggin up to 150 yrds I suppose.
But having a straight 8x on it and have to wait for a good clean head shot.

Have a 303-25 but will sell it to a freind cheap as its a bit long and awkward to used left handed.

Was thinking of a Single shot.
Small light and packable for around the camp for unwanted visiters and if I come across something fair game for the pot or exterminate the odd cat and pig.
Pigs would probably be the biggest thing I would run into.
(maybe an 'ol scrubber Bull).

Have been playing with me Baikal .410 and have the trigger nice now.
Will take it to the range soon and put a few slugs and things through it from the bench to see how it feels!!!

Theres remingtons I think but never seen advertised.
And other options such as rebrelling a Martin Cadet or one of those seemingly useless Contender cast things that need new every thing to shoot.

Big question is What Calibre??
.243
6.5 x 55
30 cal.

Like the look of those "pencil" looking bullets of 140 grains in 6.5

Like to play with .22 std velocity loads for up to 100 yds or more .
I suppose a factory load for the longer rqnge or bigger nasty stuff be o.k. too.

I don't plan or shootin a buff with me Hornet and stand there and rattle one up its nose to its brain Sort of thing.

Whats the general idea.

Thanks
Barra

[barrabruce]

Maybe I should just ask.
What would be a good beginners cast bullet rifle for pigs.
Something light and handy and not to much shoulder bashing.

Seen a Ruger 3 in 45/70 and althou it sounds nice on paper. I doubt if my shoulder would like using it. Bit like a H&R 12 guage with 1 1/4 oz 4 dram loads. Kills at both ends but you don't waste your shells needlessly.
Barra

[montana_charlie]

Hello, and welcome in...

Your mention of 45/70 makes me wonder if you are considering black powder loads.
If you are...or even if you aren't (because it's a good candidate for smokeless)...you might be enthralled by the Pedersoli 38-55 Hiwall.

It's the top one on this page...
http://www.cherrys.com/ped_cart.htm

CM

[northmn]

I do not know what is available in Australia but H&R makes a single shot Handy Rifle that ideal for what you want. For cast bullets it comes in a variety of calibers from 223 to 500 S&W. 30 Cals offer about as good of selection of molds as you can get. A 30-06 with a Lyman 311284 215 grain bullet will handle a wide variety of critters. H&R has their own website and are a part of Marlin firearms.

Northmn

[3rptr]

Barabruce, I've recently read of the .300 Whisper.

Have you looked at it?

Plenty of cheap brass, great selection of boolits, lite recoil, cheap to shoot...

I like the subsonic prospects.

Don't have a link handy, but it should google up easily.

3rptr

[barrabruce]

:coffee: been reading up on things.
Me brain hurts!!!

A 300 whisper sounds awesomely allureing.
I'd like subsonic project to ..but we can't use susspressors over here..!!
BC and high retained energy.

7.62x39 be awfull close but the twist of 1:10 limits it to 150 grainers. I think.
Would that matter much?? for cast??

Would a 310 martini be in the show??


Not discounting noth'in yet!!

Not into black powder.

Not that I'm predudiced about rimless cases but I thought rimmed would be the go in single shots!!
Thanks
Barra

[Buckshot]

:coffee: been reading up on things.
Me brain hurts!!!
7.62x39 be awfull close but the twist of 1:10 limits it to 150 grainers. I think.
Would that matter much?? for cast??
Thanks
Barra

http://www.fototime.com/2EC26214BAA2239/standard.jpg

7.62x39 (30 Rooski Shortski) Left one loaded with a Lyman 311284 (215grs) and right a Lee C312-155-2R. I have a SR Mauser chambered to this with a 10" twist 30cal bbl and it will stabilize the 215gr 311284 easily. Probably an all round great boolit for it is the Lee C312-185-R.

Considering the wide spread of critter sizes and weights you're talking about I'd sure recommend a 30 Cal. Maybe 30-06 or 308. You can get great results from a 77gr RN (intended for the 32 ACP) and tiny charges up to the Lyman 215gr slug with all manner of weights and designs in between.

................Buckshot

..................Buckshot

[Gerry N.]

Hello there Barra lad! The folks you see runnin' around loose! Have you considered the good ol' tried and true .30-30 Winchester? Easy on the shoulder and on the pocketbook. Dozens of good mold designs. And it's rimmed. NEF chambers the Handi in .30-30 as well.

I just fell into a sweet ol' H&R Topper in .30-30 that's never been fired. Asked around here and found it was made in '68. Got it for $100 usd and I'm dedicating it to cast boolits. I have an ooooold Ideal 311299 and a not quite that old 311291 as well as a Lee C309-130-R to work up loads with.

I bought a Weaver base for ten bucks to mount a Weaver K-4 of similar vintage on it. I'm getting feeble in the eyes and need a little help. Anyway a "new" rifle and scope set-up for $110 is hard to beat for someone like me who was "Born cheap and had a relapse."

I tried some .310" swaged muzzleloader roundballs thumb pressed into an unsized case over 2 grains of Bullseye with a gob of lard smeared over the mouth of the loaded round the other day. They hit point of aim at 60 feet and make less noise than an air rifle. No leading either, and I plopped five shots into 2" at 60 feet. Not exactly Olympic Free Rifle class, but minute of possum. All the balls are too far into the fir round I use as a backstop and tomahawk target to retrieve.

Gerry N. (AKA Nordicthug)

[missionary5155]

Greetings Barrabruce and WELCOME !
I am on the other side of the BIG blue..
The Baikals are popular here in Peru. Inexpensive, Well made and light wieght. There was a 2 barrel set for a while 12 guage & 308. With that you could pop rabbits (100 cast in 308) up to man eatting hoppers (.735 Round Ball in 12 bore).
Any of the center fire Toppers, Handi-rifles in .30 caliber will take care of your needs with cast/reloads. Unless you decide to hunt 6 meter + crocs.... you will have Plenty of gun.
Mike God Bless you mate

[barrabruce]

"Hello there Barra lad! The folks you see runnin' around loose!"
Thuggy.!!!!

But being short armed and having long pockets I've quickly dispelled the erge to indulge in a Purdy or Blazer or one of them Merkals.
Not that I wouldn't mind one thou if they we giving them away!!

Hmmm thanks all.
Good food for thought.
Don't plan on having a go at a 6 mtre croc.
But one up to about 18 ft be a different matter.:-D (have to be better than wacking one on the head with a garden rake!!!)

Hey aint those boolits set into those "shorty Ruskies" a bit too deep??

I reckon I can could live with a 30- 30 or 308
Least I can get 30- 30 or 308's in any place I can think of being that can sell ammo .Or Station.
Just gotta find me a shooting stick now and moulds and shells and powder and .....Scope an....wifes gunna kill me.......and....one of them things n'

Ohhh would barrell porting muzzle breaks be lead boolit friendly???
scrape off lead etc etc???
Or for that matter s/s jobbies !!!!
Just in case.

thanks
Bruce

[Gerry N.]

Don't be so whiney, your missus ain't gonna kill ya. She's just gonna bend you a bit too far in some uncomfy places. If she's at all like mine your morning oatmeal might taste a bit "off" for a few days, too. They do have their ways, don't they?

Even in Oz, the NEF Handis shouldn't break the bank and an inexpensive scope will do the trick until you can afford better. I'm learning to like the good ol' thutty thutty again. Seems as if it was designed as a cast boolit shooter. Nice long neck, mediumish sized boiler room and that loverly, loverly rim. Once ya gets over the vulgarity of the thing, it really is quite nicely put together.

Damned good to hear from you again. It's like old home week.

Gerry N.

"Is oatmeal supposed to be crunchy?"

"Yours is."

[barrabruce]

No Oat meal for me I gotta get me own so I starve like the dog!!

Can get a Baikal 308 for about $400 new landed at home or a H&R for $500 plus the rest.
Seen one listed in 30-30 Soooo have to inquire more.

Now I aint seen H & r since I was a lad. But I thought that the fore-arm come off like a shot gun with the springy latch thingo. But they again it had a thumb lever to open the breach and web of my small hand if didn't grasp it right. Plus a nice metal trigger guard , just shaped right to hurt me web in between me fingers. Maybe thats why it had bandaids in it at one stage. Well I was only eight when I fisrt started shooting it.
Don't know what happened to it and don't rightly care!!!!

Said something about needing a screw driver to change barrells ..beats me.


What are these fellas getting for accuracy wise roughly!! with patched or cast slugs??
Don't want to get well toooo hopefull. Minute of rabbit head at 100 long paces or fairy steps???

Been looking up patching and stuff:shock:
Could be here a while!!!!
dies for this dies for that.
Bloody hell can't I just wack a few sinkers or wheel weights in a milo tin ..poke a stick in the sand for a mould and load 'em up and get perfect one shot one hole groups!!!

Barra

[Pepe Ray]

BarraBruce;
So--Economy's yer thing, is it?
If I can remember back to 1962, I recall the fella that got me started did it with a dinner knife, a ground down ice pick, a center punch , a slab of flat wood and a stick from the firebox.
Now of course it wernt no target rifle, just a 30-30, everything else was storebougt. Primer, powder, condomed bullet. (This was before my casting lessons). They shot fine. Punched holes rite where I wanted 'em.
Oncw the principals were understood then the questions about this 'n that and the exceptions could be delt with.
Casting was much the same. Scrounged pots 'n ladles, old camp stove. I did have the luxury of a boolet mold but years later found ways of satisfying simple needs.
Any luxury will make your life easier and may be worthwhile. Your innate frugality will keep you restrained. Just don't go shoppin' with a "snoot full".
30-30 all the way!!!
Pepe Ray

[barrabruce]

Ecomomy is not the real issue here. Honest!!!But I'd like to take me loading gear with me and maybe wack up a small batch of stuff on the fly if I'm travelling ...But don't want to take up half the ute to do it.
The gun I wish to take is "hopefully" accurate enough for rabbits heads at 100 yrds ( so I can eat 'em)and loaded up for pigs at say 150- 200 max.

Read great write ups about the "300 whisper"

But figure a std case and twist rate be well hopefully up to scratch!!! If not as far fetching in the range department.

Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree!!!.

But I really only want to take 1 gun.

I've seen the post with the faceless rabbits I just hope the meat be o.k. to eat still!!!

If not what would be a good "platform" to work from.

I really like the idea of quiet!!!

I don't intend to shoot a couple of hundred rounds every week- end at the range at paper in competition or such!!!

Don't care if it takes a while to load a shell up!!!
I'm willing to give things a shot but trying to hedge me bets on something that "should or is known pretty well" to deliver the goods.With in reason, like the odd "lemon" Hopefully with out needing a world class target rifle !!! Don't mind smoothing over some machine marks and castings to slippery up a roughy with a decent barrell.
Hell most store bought stuff now needs work on them anyway to get 'em to shoot unless your lucky or pay upgrades.
Don't need pretty just accurracy!!

Sorry if I've miss understood.

And cast won't do it :(

Bruce

[Pepe Ray]

barrabruce;
Well now, you've expanded your desires and thrown a new wrinkle at us.
Explain please---
"Sorry if I've miss understood.

And cast won't do it

Bruce "
Is this one sentance or two?

[Bigjohn]

Bruce, Where do you hail from?

A .30/30 or a .308" Win would be the two cartridges to choose from. Both .30 cal's and with all sorts of components to reload with. Both cast and 'J' word projectiles sizes.
If you want single shot rifles; then you can find both of these calibres chambered in them. With a single shot, you can load the pointed projectiles for better BC in the .30/30. Both of these can be loaded with a 'Tree stump' reloading kit like the LEE Load-all. I believe I have one kit in .30/30 and .308 here for just such a reloading session.

.310" Martini would be good for rabbits and hares but unless you plan on doing a lot of walking following up wounded game; I wouldn't try the pigs with it.

As for the Buff, well they can soak up a bit of lead but generally can be bagged easily with good shot placement. The .308" would be the better option here.

You could try checking out the options at http://www.usedguns.com.au

John

[barrabruce]

Hey pepe.. What I ment by that was if cast bullets in a H & R or Baikal wouldn't be up to scratch as far as "likely" getting it up to the accuracy I desire from it.
Went to the range today and fired a 30 -30 win 94 Hmmm not bad. just J bullets but gave me a fell for what I'd be up for.:-D :drinks:
Love the loong neck for seating bullets.

Also fired a few 308's out of a new Savage bull barrel thingo with 40x scope with some "acurri trigger" thing. Gongs at 300 easy 500 yds well I think he adjusted his turrents wrong. The weight and all the bench rest gizmo makes it well mechanically non challenging in a way. To me any how. Lots of mirarge!!!

A couple of blokes there were into "cast" and a quick chat seemed as if they where doing well with some of the old girls and barrell stuffers as well !!!

Whoo whooo

Yep !! My hesitations and doubts are lifted alot now.
Not that I doubt use mind but aren't shooters a bit like fisherman!!!!

Anyway starting to get serious about this more now and on the trail of a shooting iron.

Buff would only be a once in a life time encounter As I lived the the Gulf for 20 yrs and only seen 2 or 3. "Fair way off near" the NT Border on the salt pans and 1 up close in a bull pen.
Booted a frisky medium grown bull up the falacka with me trusty suzi ute once in the house yard. Ripped up the lawn a bit but was fun bull doggin the "lovely little thing" back out into where it was supposed to be.:-D:-D
So I would be over gunning me self if I in reallity.If I go the 308. Plus it'd boot a bit much in one of them things for a fun gun to shoot all the time. I figure for me anyway.
If I was gunna persue long range stuff then I think I'd go for the 6.5 x 55 in something accurate with a top lens on it and wheel it around I mean shoot over the bonnet!!!


I live now about 100km Sth of Cairns.

The "Lee load all" thats what I was trying to remeber!!!
They'd be just as accurate in loading with any wouldn't they??
Powder charge exculed.
I know in the old days if you got a barrell job done the bloke id cut you a set of hand dies for a bit more.
But never seen any.

P.M. me if you like.

Thanks
Everyone I appreciate you's putting up we me very much.

Cheers for now
Bruce
P.S. been looking at "used guns" Was a nice rifle on there but got snapped up the first day before I found it!!!:) Got to be quick or lucky sometimes!!!

[Wayne Smith]

Yes, the original Lee loaders can make match quality ammo, and the dippers, with a little practice, can provide pretty precise (how's that for an oxymoron!) powder measurement. Finding one in 30-30 shouldn't be much of a problem given how popular they were. They may still make one in that caliber. For your desires the 30-30 may be close to perfect with just two or three molds. The Lee soupcan for the small stuff, one about 150gr, and maybe one larger if you would need it.

A single shot in 30-30 with a decent throat and you could shoot spitzer condoms, to boot!

[Gerry N.]

Getting "minute of rabbit head at 50 long paces" should be a piece of cake. Depending, of course, on how big a rabbit's head and a long pace are. I'm thinking you mean about 2 1/2" at 70 yards. Hell, I can do that with cast boolits in my M94 .30-30 Winchester carbine. 'Course it's got a peep sight on the reciever. I dunno yet what I can get from my "new" Topper with the old Weaver K4 on it.

Tried out some cast loads this AM at 50 yds. I got some promising results, 3" five shot strings, using 1.3cc of Unique and Lyman 311291's cast out of wheelweights. I tumble lubed 'em and shot 'em as cast. Working up a more accurate load is gonna be quite a lot of fun.

Tuesday, I'll go get a couple more pounds of Unique and some 2400. We'll see how that goes. I've had good luck in most of my .30 and larger military rifles using 150-200 grain bullets cast of wheelweights, tumbled with Lee's mule snot and shot unsized. My standard load is a Lee 1.3cc dipper of Unique in all of 'em, .30-06, 7,62x51, 7.62x54, .303 Brit, .30-40 Krag, 7.65 Arg. Mauser, 8x57, all of 'em.

Gerry N.

[barrabruce]

Thanks!!
Sounds good.. have to get the rifle first and do the throat thing and bore measurements and all that tek-nickle stuff.!!!

Keep me informed Gerry things are sounding promissing.

Wonder if w 390 be o.k. in me hornet and for the 30-30 as well for the reduced loads.!!!
Nearly out of 4227

Bruce...:)

[Bigjohn]

BarraBruce, w390 ????? Are you sure the number are correct, I don't know it.

Just came in from the reloading store room, have LEE Precision Inc. Reloading Kit #90244 30/30 WINCHESTER, 30 REMINGTON; complete but used. Yours for postage if you get a rifle in that cal. It isn't going anywhere and I don't have a 30/30 at present.

MRC or Mequon Reloading Corporation are the other company which makes or made this type of reloaders kit.

John

[barrabruce]

Big John may take you up on that offer!!! Thanks

Powder was supposed to be W 680

Only used IMR 4227 as Me Khornet just seemed to love it.

Think we can get all the common stuff here in Nth QLD

Maybe something I can use in me KHornet as well as the 30-30. Something that it just nice and easy like " balls" to measure. flakes and sticks give me the "willies"

If'n its good for the reduced loads and all that techincal stuff about burn rates / coatings and load orientation .....stuff.

Bruce

[Gerry N.]

Big John may take you up on that offer!!! Thanks

Powder was supposed to be W 680

Only used IMR 4227 as Me Khornet just seemed to love it.

Think we can get all the common stuff here in Nth QLD

Maybe something I can use in me KHornet as well as the 30-30. Something that it just nice and easy like " balls" to measure. flakes and sticks give me the "willies"

If'n its good for the reduced loads and all that techincal stuff about burn rates / coatings and load orientation .....stuff.

Bruce

For light to medium loads my go-to powder for forty years has been Unique. About the only things it won't do to my satisfaction is make my oatmeal taste sweet and function my M1 Carbine.

Don't let the delicate, flaky texture of Unique frighten you, it is one of the most consistent powders to measure there is. I have had very good success with the Lee dippers with Unique. Uncannily consistent.

I've had good to excellent results in military calibers with medium to heavy cast bullets with 1 to 1.3 CC of Unique. On the other hand, I don't particularly want ultra high velocities, I'd much prefer no leading. A paper target, tin can, or NECCO wafer doesn't really care much that the bullet that hit it was only going 1200 fps. A 120# coast blacktail doesn't either, it just breathes it's last and dies quietly.

Gerry N.