45-70 twist rate question

[tejano]

Feel like a new contender carbine barrel. I hadn’t visited the SSK website in years. Once you sign up you can access their barrel configurator. For the 45-70 only a 1 in 14” twist rate is offered. My plan was to use this barrel for lighter weight cast boolits from collar buttons up 350 grains. In other words, this would be for quieter fun on paper targets and cans, etc. Is the 1 in 14 too fast for my intended use?

[Outpost75]

Not at all. The Trapdoor was one turn in 20 inches to stabilize a 500 grain bullet with full charge loads from the 32" barrel.

From a shorter barrel, even with lighter bullets the 1:14" should be a good choice. Especially if you want to shoot subsonic with a can!

The SSK folks already figured this out long ago. I used to shoot a 10" bull barrel Contender in .45-70 with the 300-grain Federal factory load and killed truckloads of game with it until my wrist gave out and required surgery. Have fun while you are young and tough.

[marlinman93]

1:14" twist would be too fast for a longer rifle barrel, but for a shorter barrel it's great. Even with lighter bullets. It's easier to work up a good load for a twist rate that's fast, than trying to work up a load for a twist rate that's too slow.

[Rapier]

Probably the world's foremost authority on the TC hand cannon is J.D. Jones, founder of SSK Industries. He created the line of JDJ cartridges, the SSK Hand cannons and the 300 Whisper, which is the forerunner of the 300 Black Out.

[tejano]

Gents, thanks for your insights.

[redhawk0]

Yeah...a 1:14 is fast...my Henry is 1:20

redhawk

[GARD72977]

I don't like to spin lead bullets to fast. I would look at other makers. A 1/18 would be as fast as I would want for lighter lead bullets. Not sure what's out there. I would think 1/20 would be plenty fast

[Larry Gibson]

No reason to go any faster in twist than 1 in 18" for the 45-70.

[GregLaROCHE]

What twists are the new lever guns in 45/70 using?

[tejano]

Larry, I’ve shopped around a bit online. 1 in 10” or 1 in 20” appear to be the only options. MGM gives you a choice between the two. SSK and Bullberry Legacy do not. The new Marlin Guide gun is 1 in 20”, but I already have the original.

[Harter66]

A guy on here had an adjustable mould that could have gone out to something like 11-1200 gr . In a 16" twist he shot up to something like 975 gr still punching round holes with groups with a 1-16". He called quits something about it not being fun anymore.

I honestly don't know what the twist is on the Marlin parts Illion assembled 1895 G is but both the 458132 (NOE version) and 45-500 FN make nice round holes from 800-1200 fps .

For .007 inches in 45 cal the Colts carbine M92 Rossi has a 1-32" . A custom Mountain Mold 453-350 just won't settle down but a 458-340 Lee sized down to .454 does and a 300 gr TC from Bear Creek may actually end up being the desired 100 yd bullet .

Based on all of that yeah 1-14" is probably a little faster than is needed. But if you should decide that you want to launch 2-2.5 oz of .458 dia teetering towards 1.0 BC at 1073 fps that will probably do the job . Should be pretty easy to get everything to shoot well.

[GARD72977]

Get the 1/20. For the the bullet weights you asked about this will work well.

[tejano]

Get the 1/20. For the the bullet weights you asked about this will work well.

I’m leaning that way. Thanks for the input.

[beltfed]

It is noted that the 458 Win Mag has a 14" twist.
But that is for stability at short range to travel in a straight line
thru an Elephant's scull with a 500 grain bullet.
My experience in my '86 Win/ 20" twist is that it stabilizes 300 gr up to a 500 gr bullet well.
But, to show you what can happen with light/short bullets,
I made up a plinking/practice load with a 0.457" as cast 45 colt 255 gr bullet, and
if I shot it too fast, it was "spray and pray" for accuracy.
I had to drop the load of Unique way down and then it "behaved' as a good short range
practice round. The 20" twist was too fast for the short bullet.
I can't imagine how a 14 " twist barrel would have worked on really short bullets
beltfed/arnie

[Edward]

My TC Renegade likes a 1-17 twist 32 inch Rice barrel for launching BACO s 443-530 gr Elliptical PP over OE 1 1/2 F 80-81 grains/Ed

[Larry Gibson]

Larry, I’ve shopped around a bit online. 1 in 10” or 1 in 20” appear to be the only options. MGM gives you a choice between the two. SSK and Bullberry Legacy do not. The new Marlin Guide gun is 1 in 20”, but I already have the original.

As mentioned, get the 1-20 twist. It will do just fine for what you want. My TDs are all 20" twist and they handle everything from RBs up to 500 gr bullets (the heaviest I shoot).

[tejano]

Thanks Larry.

[Chill Wills]

US made Springfield's 45 Govt. (all of them) were made with 1 in 22 inch twist.
Replicas come in an assortment of twists.

[tejano]

Just to close the loop on this thread, earlier today I reached out to SSK customer support to inquire if it was possible to purchase a Hunter carbine barrel with a 1 in 20” twist rate. I received a reply in less than 2 hours. The answer was “no”. They purchase Hunter blank barrels 100-300 at a time and have not received sufficient requests for the 1 in 20. So I will either order from MGM or Bullberry, or I suppose I can look for a Henry single shot, which is probably the least expensive option overall. Thanks to all for the comments.

[Larry Gibson]

US made Springfield's 45 Govt. (all of them) were made with 1 in 22 inch twist.
Replicas come in an assortment of twists.

My bad, Chill is correct. I was thinking of the Ruger and Marlins I used to have with 20" twists. My SA TD and my H&R TDs (OM & Carbine) all have 22" twists.

[tejano]

Larry, sorry to disappoint you (just kidding) but you may have been right after all. I did some checking online this afternoon. The trapdoor carbine replica that Taylor sells is 1 in 18. Pedersoli’s is 1 in 22, and Cimarron’s description doesn’t say what the twist is and other links on its site suggest it is 1 in 18 or 1 in 20.

[Good Cheer]

When I put together the requirements for my muzzleloader to use medium weight range 45-70 molds the barrel was spec'd out as 24" twist because while that was a faster twist than needed, eh, I wanted to be on the conservative side.

[7br]

Not want to be a negative Nelly, but a 45-70 in a 6lb carbine might be too much of a good thing.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk

[GARD72977]

Not want to be a negative Nelly, but a 45-70 in a 6lb carbine might be too much of a good thing.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk

He was asking about lighter weight lead bullets. It will be great for that.

[Good Cheer]

NOE has (or had) a 45-70 diameter light weight spire point mold. I managed to pick one up to cast from soft lead to try out in the .458 bore muzzleloader. Paper patched .45 Colt molds work so maybe that one will shoot OK lubed.
There are lots of good options for light weight "45-70" boolits.

[tejano]

Well, after all my procrastinating about this and that, this morning I online purchased a Henry Single Shot. :)