Taurus 856 problems??

[leadhead]

Anybody been having any kind of problems with the Taurus 856 .38 special revolver?
I'm planning on buying one for my step daughter, and want to make sure it will be
ok with no problems. Thanks for any info.

[FergusonTO35]

I had one for several years and it was the equal of my Smiths and Ruger's. Even better once I added a Wolff spring kit. We sell bunches of them at my side job shop and I don't remember any coming back. .38 Special wheelguns and the 9mm autos descended from the PT111 series (G2, G3) are Taurus' best products and I have full confidence in them. In the event that you do have problems, Taurus customer service is really good

[shooting on a shoestring]

Leadhead, can’t help on experience with the revolver but…..

I appreciate your wanting to give a good gun to a family member. But, I’ve noticed when I’ve had the bright idea to do similar, the results haven’t been what I’ve expected. It’s been my experience that’s as useless as picking out a purse for a woman. You might get the polite smile, but the chances of it being what they want or will use are remote.

Of course I don’t know how close you are to her. Don’t know if you shoot with her weekly. Don’t know anything about the relationship. Maybe you’re giving her what she’s asking for. But if my assumption is correct that you’re only operating on trying to do what you think is a good idea, to give her a good gun so you’ll know she’s well armed, I expect you’ll be disappointed in that you’ll get a polite smile and she won’t be using it as you imagine.

[Finster101]

I don't own a Taurus and don't ever plan to.

[leadhead]

She is going to a firearms class to learn about the in's and out's of firearms.
I have a model 85 .38 that she really liked, so my plan is to give it to her
and get the 856 to replace my wife's 85. I'm a firm believer that for a woman,
a revolver is better than a semi as there are to many moving parts on a semi.
She agreed with me, as it was very hard for her to operate the semi. With a
revolver, all you have to do is pull the trigger. No safeties to fool with etc.
Just my opinions.

[rintinglen]

The only complaints that I have heard were that the trigger pulls were a little rough and the point of aim/point of impact was sometimes a little off. My LGS sells a lot of them and he recommends them highly. I don't know how durable they are, but they seem to be at least equal to the Charter Arms guns these days. Since the 90's, the Taurus Revolvers have been pretty good, as were the older, 80's model 85's. The 70's and earlier stuff was wretched, as were many of their initial forays into semi-auto production.

I will add that if you can work on a S&W, you can work on a Taurus. My Tracker has a pretty good trigger now after a bit of work.

[racepres]

There is a 3" model 85 (I think it is) here...one with ported barrel... I like it alot...and tho it does Not sport the finish of my M&P (most newer Guns Do Not BTW) it is decent looking, reliable, shoots to POA... I don't ask much more from my Guns... Lots of Loads have been down that Barrel..... Yet the good ole 148 WC over 2.8 gr of Bullseye...Never Misses!!!

[leadhead]

Are all 856 revolvers +P rated?

[FergusonTO35]

Yes, all Taurus revolvers are +P except the now discontinued magnesium frame models.

[leadhead]

Yes, all Taurus revolvers are +P except the now discontinued magnesium frame models.

Rural King is saying the matt finished stainless 856 there selling are not +P rated.
When were the magnesium models discontinued? Thanks for any replies.

[Electrod47]

Lay out your shootin' irons and let her pick/borrow what she likes. Pick out a first a second place piece. She'll learn best on her own. Don't leave out an auto for her to contemplate also.

[FergusonTO35]

Rural King is saying the matt finished stainless 856 there selling are not +P rated.
When were the magnesium models discontinued? Thanks for any replies.

I work at RK part time and we aren't supposed to give advice that contradicts what the manufacturer says. Taurus has stated many times over the years that all their revolvers are +P rated except the magnesium frames which were discontinued about 10 years ago. I think the official Taurus name for them was "Hy-Lite", they had a warning right on the barrel stating no +P. Now, like every other maker under the sun Taurus says that continuous use of +P will result in the need for service sooner.

[leadhead]

I work at RK part time and we aren't supposed to give advice that contradicts what the manufacturer says. Taurus has stated many times over the years that all their revolvers are +P rated except the magnesium frames which were discontinued about 10 years ago. I think the official Taurus name for them was "Hy-Lite", they had a warning right on the barrel stating no +P. Now, like every other maker under the sun Taurus says that continuous use of +P will result in the need for service sooner.

OK Ferguson, Finely a answer I can live with. It's not like I'd be shooting +P's thru it all the time, but nice to know you can.
I will be on my way to RK in the morning. Thank you so much for the info.

[FergusonTO35]

You got it bro. I really don't think you gain much of any advantage with +P in a snub nose. Every gel test I have ever seen indicates that JHP .38 Specials nearly always expand inconsistently or not at all from a short barrel, whether +P or not. On the contrary, sedate wadcutters have no problem reaching the ideal FBI penetration zone and produce a decent cavity in the gel, of course they are accurate and easy to shoot also.

I actually have an 856 in layaway jail right now. Should be able to spring it next payday.

[leadhead]

You got it bro. I actually have an 856 in layaway jail right now!

I got a e-mail from RK yesterday and they have the 856 on sale for $289.99 so I think I won't be
able to do much better than that.

[racepres]

I lent the M85 to a young friend to get her CPL... I attend the classes that are not Full (to fill them up) and was with her class... her Boy Friend decided she should use +P in class... she nearly did Not pass... I went and told her ..use the rounds I gave Ya... Good Ole 148 Wadcutters,, short of the story...She passed, without problems or discomfort!! That Taurus can handle +P with No Problems... Most shooters Cannot.. certainly Not New Shooters.. Effective, requires you Hit The Target

[FergusonTO35]

Well, there's your answer!

[shooting on a shoestring]

Trouble with most guys making gun/ammo choices for girls is the guys don’t consider just how much they take their strength for granted.

I’m often amazed and surprised when my wife can’t rack the slide of what I think is an easy to use automatic like a 1908 Colt or a Kimber Micro 380. Or how much she detests the heavy calibers like 38 Special. It blows my mind that the double action trigger pull on a K-frame Smith is too heavy for her to fire.

But….it’s similar to me trying to shoot double taps with full throttle 300 grain 44 Magnums. Too much gun for the shooter is not effective. Doesn’t matter what someone else can shoot well. It’s what can she shoot well.

[FergusonTO35]

Totally agree. I'm a big dude, 6'2/300, and I don't like shooting anything stronger than .40 S&W or .357 in a full size handgun. Really, 9mm or .38 Special is more my speed. By contrast there is a woman customer at our shop who can shoot lights out with her Super Blackhawk all day long. My sister's carry piece is a big ol' Ruger P95. Her husband bought her a Glock 43 and she told him to keep it!

[Sasquatch-1]

Is she planning on using this for CCW or just target shooting? If CCW I would give very close consideration to a S&W J-frame. Especially if she has small hands. Second place would be a Ruger LCR.

[frkelly74]

I was going to give my daughter a Charter arms 38 .. It is very light and fool proof with good ammo. She fired it to qualify for her CPL, 100 rounds without a break. It was too much, the trigger on that bites you and makes your finger raw. She did finish and qualify though. Afterwards she tried my G2C and liked it better so she has that now. I had it broken in and had gotten a load it liked worked up. It did require a breakin period but smoothed out pretty nice. So now I have the taurus 856 I got to replace the Charter Arms gun and no Taurus G2C. The 856 is heavier and a 6 shooter and seems reliable to me and more comfortable.. Still looking at the g3c now when they are on sale.

[dverna]

https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/#38spl

There are a number of good factory loads or the .38 even with a 2" barrel. If you want to save some money, you can buy factory bullets and reload. Nice to be able to practice with relatively inexpensive cast bullets. .38 is darn near idiot proof.

I agree with your opinion on the revolver being a good choice. Simple to use and no slide to rack. If your daughter likes it then it is an excellent choice.

[leadhead]

Well, I picked it up this morning from RK. I got the last one in the store. It seemed to check out OK
but won't know for sure till I get it to the range. I do load and use cast bullets in all my firearms.
It's getting pretty hard to find any kind of .38 special ammo. I did pick up a box of Federal .38 +P
punch awhile back, but would only use it for defense only.

[Four-Sixty]

Here is my experience with an 856 that is almost a year old.

I now have about 700 rounds through mine. It sits waiting for me to send it off for repair. About 200 rounds in, I got FTF. It turned out the bit that holds the cylinder in place, at the bottom of the frame, won't engage the cylinder. So, about 4 or 5 rounds in of shooting, the cylinder that is no longer balanced would rotate due to mass (unfired bullets) being largely to one side of the cylinder. The cylinder rotates so that the loaded bullets end up in the 6 o'clock position. Slow fire makes this worse.

As I've shot it more and more my 856 nearly won't work at all now. I've taken off the side plate and inspected the parts. I've cleaned and lubed the parts. I can't resolve the issue. I did note that when reassembling it, if you tighten the screw too much the frame warps.

I was really excited about this gun. I love 38 special. Mine is the blued 3" model. I go to the range pretty much every weekend. I need a gun I can count on. No more Taurus revolvers for me. I had a G2, and it worked 100%. So, I'd buy a semi auto from them. And, the grips on the 856 are just uncomfortable for my extra large hands.

Your milage may vary. I shoot my guns, and am kind of hard on them. I have returned at least 5 guns to the factory. This Taurus will be number six. I should be a gun tester, or QC person...

[FergusonTO35]

Very sorry to hear that. I shoot my carry guns alot, I figure those are the ones which should receive the most use. The 856 I used to have was excellent, as my G3C has been so far.

I bailed out my layaway 856 yesterday. Soon as I got it home I detail stripped it and installed a Wolff 9 pound trigger return spring. These springs are a bit long to fit multiple guns, I had to trim mine about .25". Everything appears to be in order and I really like the design. Hopefully it will shoot as good as it looks.

[leadhead]

Very sorry to hear that. I shoot my carry guns alot, I figure those are the ones which should receive the most use. The 856 I used to have was excellent, as my G3C has been so far.

I bailed out my layaway 856 yesterday. Soon as I got it home I detail stripped it and installed a Wolff 9 pound trigger return spring. These springs are a bit long to fit multiple guns, I had to trim mine about .25". Everything appears to be in order and I really like the design. Hopefully it will shoot as good as it looks.

I just ordered the Wolff trigger hammer and trigger return spring for mine too. The hammer spring is supposed to reduce the
double action pull. Will see. Did you get the stainless model?

[FergusonTO35]

Yes, mine is stainless. I left the original hammer spring in place. My aim was just to reduce the pull down to about what my other snubs are, not get a light trigger. I would guess it is now about 5 pounds SA and 9 pounds DA which is fine with me.

When you go to replace the trigger return spring, you will notice the rear of it is captured by a little round piece that is held by a cast in pin on the left side of the frame. The side of the round piece with the smaller hole that has a countersunk opening faces forward and captures the spring and guide rod. Here is how I determined how much to trim the new spring. Remove the spring, guide rod, and circular piece. Put the new spring on the guide rod and compress it down as far as it will go on a flat surface. You should trim enough off of the new spring so that the guide rod will come out the other side of the circular piece to allow you to capture the whole assembly by putting a small pin through the protruding end of the guide rod, same way you would a hammer spring. Reassemble, and make sure your trigger has full rearward movement until the top contacts the frame and cannot go any farther. If not, just trim the spring a little at a time until it's right.

[FergusonTO35]

Here is my experience with an 856 that is almost a year old.

I now have about 700 rounds through mine. It sits waiting for me to send it off for repair. About 200 rounds in, I got FTF. It turned out the bit that holds the cylinder in place, at the bottom of the frame, won't engage the cylinder. So, about 4 or 5 rounds in of shooting, the cylinder that is no longer balanced would rotate due to mass (unfired bullets) being largely to one side of the cylinder. The cylinder rotates so that the loaded bullets end up in the 6 o'clock position. Slow fire makes this worse.

As I've shot it more and more my 856 nearly won't work at all now. I've taken off the side plate and inspected the parts. I've cleaned and lubed the parts. I can't resolve the issue. I did note that when reassembling it, if you tighten the screw too much the frame warps.

I was really excited about this gun. I love 38 special. Mine is the blued 3" model. I go to the range pretty much every weekend. I need a gun I can count on. No more Taurus revolvers for me. I had a G2, and it worked 100%. So, I'd buy a semi auto from them. And, the grips on the 856 are just uncomfortable for my extra large hands.

Your milage may vary. I shoot my guns, and am kind of hard on them. I have returned at least 5 guns to the factory. This Taurus will be number six. I should be a gun tester, or QC person...

There is a large spring loaded plunger on the crane where it fits backwards into the frame. This plunger applies pressure to the cylinder stop, causing it to actuate. Did you check this part? May simply be some metal burs or something keeping it from working.

[leadhead]

Yes, mine is stainless. I left the original hammer spring in place. My aim was just to reduce the pull down to about what my other snubs are, not get a light trigger. I would guess it is now about 5 pounds SA and 9 pounds DA which is fine with me.

When you go to replace the trigger return spring, you will notice the rear of it is captured by a little round piece that is held by a cast in pin on the left side of the frame. The side of the round piece with the smaller hole that has a countersunk opening faces forward and captures the spring and guide rod. Here is how I determined how much to trim the new spring. Remove the spring, guide rod, and circular piece. Put the new spring on the guide rod and compress it down as far as it will go on a flat surface. You should trim enough off of the new spring so that the guide rod will come out the other side of the circular piece to allow you to capture the whole assembly by putting a small pin through the protruding end of the guide rod, same way you would a hammer spring. Reassemble, and make sure your trigger has full rearward movement until the top contacts the frame and cannot go any farther. If not, just trim the spring a little at a time until it's right.

OK, thanks. I watched a couple of U-tube video's on it. I had it apart this morning and it doesn't look that hard.

[Four-Sixty]

There is a large spring loaded plunger on the crane where it fits backwards into the frame. This plunger applies pressure to the cylinder stop, causing it to actuate. Did you check this part? May simply be some metal burs or something keeping it from working.

I have taken the side plate off, yet not worked up the courage to remove and individually inspect the parts. Oddly, the problem has become progressively worse. It is to the point now it almost does not work at all. So, I suppose that should actually make it easier to troubleshoot shouldn't it? My guess, at the moment, is there is a failed spring. Is the spring in that area available from Wolff?

[FergusonTO35]

Last time I checked Wolff only made springs for the trigger return and hammer. However, if you measure the dimensions it shouldn't be hard to match it up to a universal spring. Still, probably best to just let Taurus handle it since you have a warranty. They might even just give you a new gun.

[leadhead]

Last time I checked Wolff only made springs for the trigger return and hammer. However, if you measure the dimensions it shouldn't be hard to match it up to a universal spring. Still, probably best to just let Taurus handle it since you have a warranty. They might even just give you a new gun.

OK I've been checking the internet for some of the problems the 856 has and the biggest problem seems to be the cylinder
turning both ways when the trigger is barely moved to the rear. To me, this is a real problem, and I've watched how one guy
fixed it by filing the hand so it can engage the cylinder ratchet quicker. This makes a lot of sense to me, but others say it's
no problem at all and to just shoot it the way it is. The factory won't even address this as a problem.
What is your take on this?

[racepres]

OK I've been checking the internet for some of the problems the 856 has and the biggest problem seems to be the cylinder
turning both ways when the trigger is barely moved to the rear. To me, this is a real problem, and I've watched how one guy
fixed it by filing the hand so it can engage the cylinder ratchet quicker. This makes a lot of sense to me, but others say it's
no problem at all and to just shoot it the way it is. The factory won't even address this as a problem.
What is your take on this?
I rarely turn my Cylinder by Hand when engaging the Trigger... Maybe I try That Trick...Will Report.. Got a hunch my oldest H&R may be Guilty!!!!

[FergusonTO35]

OK I've been checking the internet for some of the problems the 856 has and the biggest problem seems to be the cylinder
turning both ways when the trigger is barely moved to the rear. To me, this is a real problem, and I've watched how one guy
fixed it by filing the hand so it can engage the cylinder ratchet quicker. This makes a lot of sense to me, but others say it's
no problem at all and to just shoot it the way it is. The factory won't even address this as a problem.
What is your take on this?

Most revolvers I've encountered have a point where, when thumbing back the hammer or pulling the trigger double action, you can stop and turn the cylinder manually. It has never been a problem for me when actually shooting. I'll check out my wheelguns tonight and see if any of them do this.

[racepres]

Welp.. only the Pietta Replica Remington, and the poor old abused model 900 H&R will do that.. None of the others will do that... not even the Taurus model 85, nor .32 H&R.. Not in wrong direction anyway.. going With the Hand... of course they advance..or the hand could Not push them...

[FergusonTO35]

On my 856, if you pull the hammer back about 40% of the way there is a point where you can manually rotate the cylinder to the left. It won't go to the right at all. I put 35 rounds through it after work with my favorite loads and she did as good or better than any of my other snubs. Double action is especially good.

[leadhead]

On my 856, if you pull the hammer back about 40% of the way there is a point where you can manually rotate the cylinder to the left. It won't go to the right at all. I put 35 rounds through it after work with my favorite loads and she did as good or better than any of my other snubs. Double action is especially good.

Good to hear Ferguson. The problem as I understand it, is if your shooting in double action, and you shoot say 4 rounds, and
then start to pull the trigger on the 5th shot and just barely pull the trigger for the 5th shot, that drops the cylinder bolt just
enough that the weight of the unfired rounds will move the cylinder clockwise and then with full pull, you will end up on a
already fired round. I can't explain it any better than that. If you put 2 dummy rounds with 158 gr bullets at the bottom of
cylinder and fire in double action, and just barely move the trigger a hair back, you'll see the cylinder counter rotate from the
weight of those 2 rounds.

[FergusonTO35]

Hmm, I see. I will check it out, however I suspect this is a minor design flaw that any revolver based on the S&W double action system could have. Parts fit and tolerance would play in as well.

[leadhead]

Hmm, I see. I will check it out, however I suspect this is a minor design flaw that any revolver based on the S&W double action system could have. Parts fit and tolerance would play in as well.

There's a whole 3 pages of how to fix this problem on this sight. Just google Taurus 856 cylinder hand problem or such and you
should be able to find it. I'm going to "fix" mine today if I have time.

[racepres]

There's a whole 3 pages of how to fix this problem on this sight. Just google Taurus 856 cylinder hand problem or such and you
should be able to find it. I'm going to "fix" mine today if I have time.
Interesting I'm pretty sure a Longer Hand will fix my H&R, not worried about the Remington replica...
Will look for this "Fix"

[FergusonTO35]

There's a whole 3 pages of how to fix this problem on this sight. Just google Taurus 856 cylinder hand problem or such and you
should be able to find it. I'm going to "fix" mine today if I have time.

I will take a look at it. That being said, the only revolver problem I ever had was where burrs or something had built up in the little frame hole where the cylinder nub pushes back the bolt. The bolt was staying forward and blocking the hammer. A good cleaning and a bit of chamfering the hole solved it. My previous 856 never malfunctioned in any way and I put a fair number of rounds through it.

[leadhead]

I will take a look at it. That being said, the only revolver problem I ever had was where burrs or something had built up in the little frame hole where the cylinder nub pushes back the bolt. The bolt was staying forward and blocking the hammer. A good cleaning and a bit of chamfering the hole solved it. My previous 856 never malfunctioned in any way and I put a fair number of rounds through it.

I see that you have a G3c. I have one and a Gx4. The Gx4 is my EDC gun, and I shoot .358 dia cast in it too.
What made you decide to get it throated? What bullet are you using in it?

[FergusonTO35]

My G3c had a very tight throat, none of my boolits would chamber without difficulty. Jacketed chambered just fine and shot really well so it is not something Taurus would cover. Sent it off to Doug and now it eats everything. My boolits are Accurate Molds 359-130-RF sized .358 seated to 1.070.

Fired the 856 some more today and it shoots great. I tried to make it turn backwards as described. There is a point where you can pull the trigger back a bit, let it go, and the cylinder can go backwards, however the cylinder stop still catches it and it won't go farther back than it was. I'll check it periodically but unless it gets noticeably worse I'm not going to worry about it.

[leadhead]

My G3c had a very tight throat, none of my boolits would chamber without difficulty. Jacketed chambered just fine and shot really well so it is not something Taurus would cover. Sent it off to Doug and now it eats everything. My boolits are Accurate Molds 359-130-RF sized .358 seated to 1.070.

Fired the 856 some more today and it shoots great. I tried to make it turn backwards as described. There is a point where you can pull the trigger back a bit, let it go, and the cylinder can go backwards, however the cylinder stop still catches it and it won't go farther back than it was. I'll check it periodically but unless it gets noticeably worse I'm not going to worry about it.

Good to know yours is working. I just ordered a hand for mine from E-bay, so I hope it works better than the one that's in it.

[FergusonTO35]

Really hope it works for you. I wonder if the 856 uses identical lock work parts to the 85? Seems like this would be feasible if they just opened the frame a little for the fatter cylinder and used a six notch ratchet. If my 856 is typical of the breed today, I can see an aluminum frame version in my future also.

[leadhead]

Really hope it works for you. I wonder if the 856 uses identical lock work parts to the 85? Seems like this would be feasible if they just opened the frame a little for the fatter cylinder and used a six notch ratchet. If my 856 is typical of the breed today, I can see an aluminum frame version in my future also.

Yes, I believe the 85 and 856 use the same internal parts. From the pics I've looked at, they look the same.

[charlie b]

Glad you are figuring it out. Had two Taurus, 805 and 85. Both were kinda impulse buys when I looked at them in the gun shop (late 80's). The DA was so smooth I just could not believe they were so cheap.

Wife's 85 was a great little gun. It was her first carry gun and it worked well. Not shot a lot, but, it suited her.

The 805 was mine and I put a lot of rounds through it. It was rated for 125gn .357 loads and I fired a lot of them. I had two malfunctions. There was a screw that connected the cylinder latch to the pin that held the cylinder. After about 200 rounds of full house .357 loads the screw would back out. I'd have to remove the side plate to open the cylinder. The second time it happened I used red loctite on it. Never backed out after that :)

Both were let go for various reasons, none related to how well they worked.

[FergusonTO35]

Interestingly I found two very low miles 85's at a pawn shop recently with only the faintest turn line on the cylinder. The finish indicated they were not used as carry guns. Both of them had a lot of play in the cylinder with the hammer cocked, enough to where I would not feel comfortable firing them. The styling cues would date them as 2000's production, a time when there were alot of complaints about Taurus.

[FergusonTO35]

Still shooting my 856 with no malfunctions. I did end up trimming the trigger spring some more as I found it was binding and pulling me off target in both single and double action. Disassembled the action while I was at it and was impressed at how smooth the parts fit is in this gun. I figured I would find at least a few spots that needed to be smoothed out but there are none. I also switched to the older style rubber OEM grips. The newer ones didn't have enough backstrap for my big old claws. Planning to get one of the Ultralite models at some point.

[frkelly74]

My 856 has been reliable, it is a fairly heavy gun, compared with my Charter Arms Chamelion and my Rossi 66 . Both of those are 5 shooters while the Taurus holds 6. Heavier is not necessarily a bad thing given that it will dampen recoil better. But concealment could be an issue.The grip is short and tapered , good for smaller hands perhaps. The double action trigger takes some getting used to, Single action is good though from my unsophisticated point of view.

[FergusonTO35]

I'm planning to practice with mine an awful lot the next few months. For some reason, it takes me forever to get used to a new revolver even if it's very similar to one I already have. I find mine likes the Lee 358-125-RF and shoots it to almost the same POI as the usual 150 and 158 slugs, unlike the other .38's I have.

[leadhead]

Ferguson, Nice to see you back again on the 856 Taurus.
I've been shooting the hell out of mine with the cast and
haven't had any problems at all with it. I did replace the
rubber grips with a set of those Pachmayr Renegade ones.
There checkered and fit my large hands a whole lot better.
Denny

[Four-Sixty]

I should provide an update on mine. I did find the spring/plunger assembly that fits within the crane had a kink in the spring. It took a couple months to get the part, but after installing the new part it seems to have remedied my problem. So, if you remove the crane be very careful putting it back together.

[R-71]

I really like the looks of the 856 as well as the 3” barrel, but I simply don’t trust a Taurus. I’ve owned 3 all of them broke in some way within a short time and few rounds.

1. The beretta lookalike, the magazine catch fall out of the gun in the first 200 round’s of ammo and I had to send it back for repair which took months.

2. A pocket 38, it turned into a rattling out of time mess and also took forever to repair.

3. One of those little tip up barrel 22s, the firing pin broke after about 300 rounds.

If I had the choice I’d pick a 4” model 10.