Move Over Bullshop Jr Jr

[StarMetal]

Here's two identical loads except 5 were made up in WW cases and 5 in Remington cases, shot out of my CZ 527 at 50 yards. This is the Lyman 225438 which weigh in at 45 grs and they have my own made gaschecks on them. The WW case group is marked with WW, the unmarked one it the Rem. I had 3 cutting one another. These aren't any snuffy loads, they're moving along in the good 2000 fps bracket. Little fine tuning and I think the Remington case loads will cut a hole. The two groups were fired one right after the other and I think it's amazing how the different cases made that much difference.

Joe

http://www.hunt101.com/watermark.php?file=500/7385Hornet.JPG

[44man]

Case capacity makes a tremendous difference but by working loads identical results can be obtained. The only problem is that some brands of cases are not made to tight tolerances. I had some WW brass that had head dimensions and brass thickness so far out that I just threw them out.

[SharpsShooter]

Nice shooting!

[powderburnerr]

I'd bet the winchester cases would respond the same if you used the same percentage of volume as the remington. different internal capacities thus different group size perhaps? ............... Dean

[Buckshot]

.................Not bad. 100 yards?

..................Buckshot

[StarMetal]

No no no Buckshot.....that group was shot at the official Buckshot 50 yards (buckshot 50 yards has to be measured to exact strict tolerances by laser beam measuring devices). I made a major change in how I was reloading cast for that 22 Hornet, as you remember I wasn't getting satisfactory results with cast before. Got it figured out now and the clue come from some posters here and Felix and that was switch from a rifle primer to a pistol primer. After I fine tune it at the Buckshot 50 yards, I'll progress to the Starmetal 100 yards.

Joe

[Buckshot]

................I was just curious. My co-hort Ron has an old Win M54 in 22 Hornet. It will shoot cast like that at 100 yards at velocities similar to jacketed slugs. I do have to be 100% honest here and add that for no apparent reason to him or me the exact same load will produce a 2.5" group for 5 rounds then a couple 1" groups with 3-4 shots stacked on top of each other and then another 2" group.

Naturally the big groups can have 3-4 real nice. One or 2 flyers will open it. His slugs are cast from (old) lino and they're scaled as are the powder charges. Our old rangemaster had a Savage 340 in 22 Hornet that did the same thing. He said he thought it was because a bird flew over or something.

A tiny bullet in a tiny case and a tiny 'something' that happens, makes a big difference at 100 yards. Lube? Primer? Caseneck tension? Etc & etc.

.................Buckshot

[StarMetal]

Buckshot

I agree with you. For one thing I don't weigh my bullets for that Hornet. Probably other more critical casters would throw out some of the bullets I shoot in it. Like I've said alot of times before I load most my cast rounds like I'm loading jacketed bullets...in a rush. Now for the next round with this load I have trimmed the cases, deburred the primer flash holes, weighed the charges, but still loaded the same old hastely checked bullets. We'll see what it does.

Rick I've noticed with my CZ527 that with the Hornady V-Max..it will indeed shoot five shots into one round 3/8 hole consistantly....BUT I've found with cast what your friend has...shoots one group really good, the next not so. But this last venture is the first time it's started shooting cast consistantly. What makes me happy about it is that I made the gaschecks. I have to cast up somemore of those little bity bullets and maybe the next loading I'll scale the bullet and make a real attempt.

Joe

[waksupi]

Sounds like a lube problem, to me. Too much?

[StarMetal]

waksupi,

It's not a lube problem, I explained in an earlier post what it was so I'll repeat it here for you. I was using rifle primers before and I switched to pistol primers....it shrank the groups and they are consistant now. Just like Felix and another poster said....the rifle primer was blowing the bullet and powder into the bore rather then igniting it and pressure build up pushing the bullet into the bore. So I gave it a try and what a difference. It's not lube, at least not in my case.

Joe

[44man]

Star, be surprised what a tiny variation in case tension will do. This is almost out of our control though. Doesn't seem to matter too much with jacketed but with lead it really will. I don't know how to control it! Depends on the brass itself. What happens if you anneal, will it tighten the groups?

[waksupi]

Sorry, Joe, I hadn't read the full topic. That just sounds like what happens to me, when I get over lubed.

[StarMetal]

No problem Waksupi Ric, believe me I tried alot of things with that Hornet and cast bullets, including the lube, and it wouldn't bulge until the primer change.

Joe