Winchester commeratives

[freakonaleash]

Anybody ever shoot these? I got an Ollie Winchester in 38 55 on the cheap a couple months ago and finally got out to pop of a few rounds a couple days ago. EXCELLENT shooter! This one has been shot before me, The action is all slicked up and has a very nice trigger. I have always passed these by because they are so garish with the stupid medallion inlay and all the plating. The Checkering is all hand cut and the wood has lots of curl in it, so big bonus there.
I think the sights have been changed out too. They are marbles front and rear, the front being a bead which fits right down into the round opening in the bottom of the VEE slot in the rear. I can actually see the sights! Are these normal for the Commemoratives?

[veeman]

I have 2, a Chief Crazy Horse 38/55 and a Buffalo Bill rifle 30-30, shoot both. Prefer the CH. I got them mainly because I wanted the 94 in full length rifle without the lawyer crap built in. Both are excellent shooters too. The CH I D&Ted for a Skinner peep sight, will probably do the same for the BB.
https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/render/00-Dhr2tlvawMSNFX4TrMAMCKr_1AnQ3pv5Eb7vbRPURMpI9tHytF XzMsWBE_S31cS5?cn=THISLIFE&res=medium&ts=1558561771
https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/render/00-Dhr2tlvawMSNFX4TrMAMCKr_1AnQ3pv5Eb7vbRPURMoarZPOCr V7zE3Eb2jpnrpo5cYdfB3jRoL_VZILaXEufg?cn=THISLIFE&res=medium&ts=1649886368

[Griff]

I have four, a '67 Canadian Centennial that's been remade into a Trapper (.30-30), a '76 Bi-Centennial (.30-30 carbine), a Legendary Lawman (.30-30 Trapper), and a '66 Centennial (.30-30 Short Rifle). Everything except the Bi-Centennial has been shot. The Canadian Centennial is my truck gun, and the others are used for matches & hunting depending on my mood and what I'm hunting. All shoot as well as I can, no complaints. The '66 Centennial has been d&t for a tang sight and has had the front sight replaced with a Lyman 17A.
310280

310284

310282

310283

[Winger Ed.]

I have had four of them come through my hands, unfired- all boxes & paperwork, and I just never got around to shooting them.
They were a rifle and carbine each of the Teddy Roosevelt and Buffalo Bill Cody ones in .30-30.
I got them on the cheap, held 'em a few years, and a guy that really, really wanted them for him & his kid found me
around the time I was thinning out the herd in the gun safe.

[pietro]

.

IMO, the Winchester commemorative leverguns are a bargain, to say the least - especially for hunters/shooters.

Where else can one get a Winchester levergun with high grade wood, extra finishing, and engraving for less than 50% of the cost of a pre-64 Winchester Custom Shop rifle ?

I paid $600 for My .32 Special Canadian RR Centennial commemorative that's the same pattern as a fancy/Custom Shop Model 55 - gennies are $3K+ in pristine/new condition (if one can even be found in that condition).

At those times afield, when game is scarce/not moving, at least an owner has a beautiful rifle in their hands to admire.

.

[Winger Ed.]

.IMO, the Winchester commemorative leverguns are a bargain, to say the least - especially for hunters/shooters.

I think the price went flat on them because they were so over produced.
They made too many of each one, they came out too often, and as one gun comic book writer said-
They have commemorated everything but a dog walking across the street.

[Griff]

The only one that has kept pace in appreciation has been the John Wayne Commemorative. And, as their reputation as good shooters is spread, they all are all rising in cost.

[freakonaleash]

I've been looking at the J. Wayne's and they are bringing more money than I wanted to pay. I have a M '53 Winchester take down that was made in 1929 in 30-30 that came with an extra take down M94 barrel in 32-40 that interchanges, so I kind of have my 32-40 covered.

[indian joe]

Anybody ever shoot these? I got an Ollie Winchester in 38 55 on the cheap a couple months ago and finally got out to pop of a few rounds a couple days ago. EXCELLENT shooter! This one has been shot before me, The action is all slicked up and has a very nice trigger. I have always passed these by because they are so garish with the stupid medallion inlay and all the plating. The Checkering is all hand cut and the wood has lots of curl in it, so big bonus there.
I think the sights have been changed out too. They are marbles front and rear, the front being a bead which fits right down into the round opening in the bottom of the VEE slot in the rear. I can actually see the sights! Are these normal for the Commemoratives?

I have one of those - came supposedly unfired (doubtful but were no marks on it to disprove the claim) "action all slicked up and has a very nice trigger" mine came out of the box like that and is also an excellent shooter - I paid 850 when an angle eject 30/30 carbine was about that money or more - i reckon I won that deal!

[missionary5155]

Why not shoot them ? They are just rifles /carbines that so far the value has not grew dramatically. Some are even a far better bargain that their un-goobered cousins.
For hunting Black Tape on the barrel to hide that gold stuff.

[indian joe]

Why not shoot them ? They are just rifles /carbines that so far the value has not grew dramatically. Some are even a far better bargain that their un-goobered cousins.
For hunting Black Tape on the barrel to hide that gold stuff.

mine gets shot blackpowder mainly ....................

[dverna]

Why not shoot them ? They are just rifles /carbines that so far the value has not grew dramatically. Some are even a far better bargain that their un-goobered cousins.
For hunting Black Tape on the barrel to hide that gold stuff.

I have a dozen of them. I did not shoot them because I had other .30/30's to shoot so why reduce their value? I am selling them all off now. I will not lose anything on them, but they have not kept up with inflation. All of them are gorgeous rifles.

Like you, I do not understand folks buying well worn "normal" 94's when for a little more they can have something nicer.

[georgerkahn]

Times have, imho, gotten sooo sad re pretty much all firearms in general. Demographic trends are a quite mobile population. The post-WWII concept of building or buying a homestead to raise a family and live out ones life, working at one -- maybe two -- employs throughout, was what was the goal. Today? Electronic entertainment -- remember the phonograph/turntable/record player and the many 33 1/3rpm records? The tape recorder.. then 8track... then "cassette"? NOW pretty much all do "streaming". Bills, etc, are dealt with by the ever many as "paperless". And how few write letters, even sending greeting cards, with eMail, "123-cards", etc.?
I had a colleague who LIVED by the "RULE OF 50!" -- which meant that ALL of his possessions (e.g., his toothbrush was counted as one) in total -- everything -- summed to fifty or less!
In a mobile population, minimalist of "stuff" (they have, albeit I have never viewed) television shows dissing people who have lots of stuff: "Hoarders" -- there's pretty much no space for any collectibles! Compounded monthly "Internet + cell 'phone + 'Cloud storage" bills take away much cash as well.
Commemorative firearms surely would not have allowed room. I may be way off base, but a few "young'ens" I know are happy as one might be with "their AR and Glock". Period.
geo

[Garand]

Back about 2006, I spotted a Silver JW Commemorative for about $1,750 (Cdn). Given how many commemoratives Winchester dumped on the market, I waited. A few years later I found one that a previous owner had allowed some water in the base of his rifle rack, so the butt plate showed signs of minor rust, destroying it as a collectable. $900.00 (CDN) later I have a very pleasant shooting rifle.

[samari46]

Some years back before the current madness of high prices on all lever action carbines and rifles, I bought a used Canadian Centennial for $160 stuck a globe sight up front and a Williams on the rear. Very accurate. Then I bought another CC from Cherry's Fine guns except it was the 26" rifle version for $600. That one was NIB. Cannot do that today. Frank

[Bigslug]

Like you, I do not understand folks buying well worn "normal" 94's when for a little more they can have something nicer.

Well. . .they're kinda the difference between the Marlboro Man and the cowboy in the Village People. :mrgreen:

To the OP, they varied quite a lot in features, so I wouldn't count on consistency of sights between all the offerings. At the point you get one fired and without the box, you might as well add what you want to it. If you have the box and are shooting it anyway, keep your OEM parts in the box. Same goes for an original oldie - try to keep the stock parts where your heirs can maybe have a chance of figuring it out.

[TNsailorman]

I had one called "Classic" which was black chrome receiver and a nicely blued 26" octagon barrel. Had some subdued engraving(which I could have done without) but no gold or silver. Had a fairly decent trigger for a 94 and was very accurate. I sold it to get some cash for another rifle and I regret it to this day. It was the most accurate 30-30 model 94 I ever shot. For me, it was a natural pointer at 100 yards and I had no trouble keeping it around 3" to 4" offhand but I was much younger then and had great eyesight. I wouldn't mind having another one but at the prices being asked for the commeratives now days I guess I never will. james:coffee:

[Just plain Bill]

I have loved Winchester lever guns for ever, growing up watching westerns with my dad. He and my uncle both had 94 carbines and I just thought they were as cool could get. The fall of 67 dad took me along on his annual deer hunting trip, that week one of dad's buddies had a new Canadian Centennial 1894 rifle with the long bbl. To a 10 year old boy that gun was without a doubt the ultimate rifle someone could ever own.

[winelover]

Wife bought me the Boy Scout Commemorative, in 22 LR as a X-mas gift in the 80's. Great wood, as well as, fit and finish. Good shooter, also. Will never part with it.

Winelover

[eastbank]

some of the lesser made winchester commeratives rifles have seen a big increase in value, while the common ones seem to go up at a lesser rate. winchester and baseball-football cards suffered from the same over production and killed the golden goose.

[Reverend Recoil]

European collectors pay big bucks for the John Wayne collection rifles. I have often wondered how much the John Wayne estate profited from these rifles.

[BB57]

In general, Winchester kept itself both busy and afloat manufacturing “commemorative” rifles and carbines, with most of them being made in numbers far to large to be collectible. Some like the Centennial 66 had production numbers that topped 100,000, and the Canadian Centennial rifles exceeded 90,000. There are four others with numbers in the 40,000-50,000 range, a few with over 25,000 and several with a more limited 19,999, which is still way too many for a collectible.

Winchester eventually figured it out and started making commemoratives with 1000-2000 total.

But at the same time they started doing limited runs for just about everyone. When I was a kid for example, you could order a commemorative “Centennial” Model 94 carbine with the name of your town and its 100 year dates on it. Given that I was from SD, and many of the towns were formed about 100 years ago in SD, ND and WY, it was a pretty common thing to see. Similarly other towns farther east with 150 year anniversaries also were offered “commemorative” carbines. They were all XTR grade carbines and they are still an inexpensive way to get an XTR grade carbine.

——

Personally, I have a pair of Legendary Frontiersman, both purchased as shooters. I got into shooting .38-55 via a Big Bore 94 in .375 Win. When jacketed bullets became scarce during the 2008 shortage and then never really recovered in terms of availability or cost, I started shooting cast bullets in it, and quickly found the fast 1-12 rifling twist and oddities of throat versus bore diameter (the subject for another post) were just not ideal for cast bullets, I started looking for a .38-55.

The Legendary Frontiersman (along with the Oliver F. Winchester and Chief Crazy Horse) are still the least expensive way to get a .38-55 lever gun as they sell for $700-$800 in excellent to mint condition without a box. That’s an artifact of Winchester making 19,999 of them in 1979, about 17,999 more than they should have made for an actual collectible rifle. With those numbers the value of all three models is as shooters.

The LF is a rifle pattern with a 24” round barrel, although the round barrel is carbine rather than rifle weight. The silver plated receiver looks very good with a tarnish and over all it’s an XTR grade rifle with polished hammer and lever flats, generally very nice wood with some figure in the butt stock and nicely cut checkering. With the exception of the medallion in the stock, it’s not overly garish.

With the addition of a tang sight it’s also a solid 2 MOA rifle with commercial cast bullets and a bit better with jacketed or my own cast bullets. The rifling rate is 1:15 which isn’t as optimum as the old 1:18 but still works fine.

—-
https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/h470/SDBB57/Lever%20Action%20Rifles/.highres/3B17DE0C-64AC-4A2B-A2BF-A5C916195118_zpsuopihii9.jpg?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/h470/SDBB57/Lever%20Action%20Rifles/.highres/D3A0C723-B6C7-4B06-A888-39EFB15C6BE5_zpsx2w7j0b0.jpg?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/h470/SDBB57/Lever%20Action%20Rifles/.highres/82637187-0FE2-462C-9EB9-B2515BEC749A_zpsx8flyvak.jpg?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds

I also own a Model 94 Classic, which isn’t a commemorative but is often treated like one. After Winchester’s sales success with the Canadian Centennial rifles with upwards of 90,000 sold in both 24” rifle and 20” short rifle models, Winchester thought their might be a market for a more upscale Model 94 rifle, since it had not had a regular production rifle since it discontinued the Model 64 in 1957.

The Classic was chambered in .30-30 and had a 26” octagon barrel. It had machine scrolling on the receiver similar to the Canadian Centennial rifles, nicely figured wood, a gold plated loading gate and “Winchester Model 94 Classic” script on the barrel. Those last two, and low sales numbers are why many people think it’s a commemorative or treat it like one.

Winchester was wrong about the market for a higher end rifle pattern Model 94 in .30-30, or perhaps they’d filled that market with the Canadian Centennial rifles which were also not overly garish and often purchased as shooters.

In any case they only made about 40,000 of during the four years it was cataloged and it took a couple more years to actually sell them all. There are a number of commemoratives that were sold in larger numbers.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/h470/SDBB57/001(106).HEIC?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/h470/SDBB57/001(105).HEIC?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds


I bought mine in very good to excellent condition for $600. It had been sitting in a local shop for a couple years and I bought it as soon as I heard Marlin 30-30s were no longer being produced. I’d been considering a lever action .30-30 rifle in order to retire my very nice 1926 26” Model 94 rifle from field use. The Classic fills the role well and with a Williams receiver sight is a solid 2 MOA rifle.

It was well timed, as those previously not all that sought after Classic and commemorative rifles started flying off the shelves with customers getting them as shooters. They are a much cheaper alternative to a new Miroku made Model 94.

[Harleysboss]

I bought a Canadian Centenial 30-30 with the 26" octagon barrel from a member here. Once it arrived, I turned right around and shipped it to JES Re Bore in Oregon to be turned into a 38-55. The collector value was out for this one anyway and I wanted a nice octagon 38-55 lever gun and voila!

[Gray Fox]

I'm picking up a '94 Classic tomorrow at what seems to be good price and I've got a Williams Fool Proof with target knobs due in Sunday from Amazon. I'm going to load up some of Larry Gibson's 150 grain jacketed loads with Leverevolution and run them through my chrony on the way to a target to try to see what the rifle is capable of. Then I'm going to cast up a batch of Ranch Dog's TLC311-165-RF boolits to see how they shoot. I'll probably water quench them and lube with LLA.
I've got several appropriate powders to play with. Any of you that have a Classic '94 have an opinion about what the boolets should be sized to? I have the Lyman case neck expander die. GF

[coalsmoke]

I picked up a Buffalo Bill rifle really cheap about 10 years ago. Never liked the long barrel and never found anyone who wanted to trade me a shorty for it, so I chopped it off. It is a sweet little brush poppin pig killer now.


I can't figure out how to post pics.