Can a .32 RF be converted to a centerfire?

[pertnear]

I found a "Merwin & Hulbert Junior 32 Rimfire Falling Block Takedown Rifle" on another forum. It is chambered in .32 RF. It is being advertised as a "Wall Hanger" but looks to be in good shape. The ammo itself has become a collectible but you can still get it with a search & a heavy wallet hit!

Looks like a neat little rifle & neat round for cast bullet loading & plinking. Can the rifle be converted to centerfire? Can any existing cases be used to convert into suitable ammo?

I must admit, curiosity has got the best of me on this one....

TIA

[ohen cepel]

I think I have read about some of the Steven's Crackshots in 32rf being converted to 32 Long. I think it can be done, but have not done it myself.

Does seem like a great way to bring back an old rifle! Plus, I really enjoy the 32's.

[Snakeoil]

To measure is to know. Measure your bore and your chamber and then look up the SAAMI specs for .32 centerfire cartridges. You might have to shoot a heeled bullet depending on the chamber/bore relationship.

Not knowing what the action looks like, and given that there were in business in the 19th century, I'd only shoot BP loads in the gun.

[Bruntson]

The 32 rim bullet has a .316" diameter, where the 32 S&W short and long uses a .312 ' diameter bullet. Since the S&W bullet is about .004" undersized to the 32 rimmed barrel, I can only imaging the blow by and poor accuracy that such a conversion would occur. Now if you really like to spend money, the barrel could be relined and a new throat cut to the correct size.

[marlinman93]

Not all .32 Long RF or CF have the larger bullet, or the larger bore. I have owned numerous Ballard #2 rifles in .32 Long with the Marlin reversible firing pins that allowed you to shoot either RF or CF ammo. Never owned one with a groove diameter over .313" and most were .312"
Whether the M&H Jr. can be converted to CF depends on the firing pin setup. Some singles are easier than others. The real question is whether you can find .32 Long or .32 Short ammo, or cases for it? They are a smaller OD than .32 S&W Long or Short, so the more common S&W wont chamber in one. If the M&H is strong enough it could be reamed to the larger .32 S&W case, and loaded to appropriate pressure levels. But I'd check to see if it can handle the higher pressure case before taking on the project.

[Scrounge]

I think I have read about some of the Steven's Crackshots in 32rf being converted to 32 Long. I think it can be done, but have not done it myself.

Does seem like a great way to bring back an old rifle! Plus, I really enjoy the 32's.

Crackshot that I have is .32 short RF. YMMV. I do have a 1915 Stevens Favorite in 32 Long RF. You can buy swaged .32 Long Colt brass from Starline. It is swaged from .32 S&W brass. Not cheap, but doable if you aren't a fanatic. ;) Or you can swage your own. May have to make your own swaging dies. DIY, you'll also need to turn the base of the cartridge down. You will also need a heeled bullet, like the .22 rimfire cartridges.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.32_Long_Colt
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.32_rimfire
https://www.ammoland.com/2017/12/32-rimfire-obsolete-round/#axzz7seUHDhF3\

If you're well-to-do, you can buy what you need, if not, you'll need to learn how to make your own. I'm following that path. Been a little interrupted several times, health problems both mine and spouse, and our youngest moved back in with us, loosing me much of my workshop area.

Bill

310233 310234

[Kosh75287]

The 32 rim bullet has a .316" diameter, where the 32 S&W short and long uses a .312 ' diameter bullet. Since the S&W bullet is about .004" undersized to the 32 rimmed barrel, I can only imaging the blow by and poor accuracy that such a conversion would occur. Now if you really like to spend money, the barrel could be relined and a new throat cut to the correct size.

OR...MAYbe...you could use THIS mold to cast bullets and NOT size them to a smaller diameter? If the bullets, as cast, are a true .315" diameter, then the hollow base might expand enough to provide you with accuracy that ranges from "usable" to "surprisingly good". Polymer-coating the as-cast projectiles might enable them to engage the rifling a shade more completely.

https://noebulletmolds.com/site/315-90-wc-hb/

Since your rifle is a single-shot, the wadcutter's flat nose would not be a huge concern, except that it might shed velocity a bit fast. Since you are dealing with a firearm engineered for rimfire ignition, at black powder pressures, ranges beyond 40 - 50 yards were probably not contemplated, anyway.

[Ajohns]

To convert to centerfire, the link for the block only needs to be made a bit longer.
Then as said you can run 32 long or short Colt as is, or run a .335 reamer in just deep enough to take a 32 short or long Smith and Wesson.
They make a dandy little shooter.

[Castaway]

Larry Potterfiled has a video where he converts a 32 rimfire to 32-20. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XZ7sQya7tyk

[pietro]

.

FWIW, I long ago converted a solid frame (I wouldn't convert a take-down) Remington #4 Rolling Block from .32RF to .32 Short Colt (Winchester makes a few runs of the ammo per year).

The .32 Short Colt readily chambered/fired w/o issue after I changed the RF firing pin from RF to CF ( a 30min job, with common homeowner tools)

.

[LAGS]

I have a .32 RF Leader revolver from back like in the 1900's.
I couldn't find more than one box of ammo for it.
So I epoxied a turned down .22 barrel liner into the barrel.
Then I made some cylinder liners and epoxied them into the cylinder and reamed them to fit .22 LR.
The gun fires great , and is fun to shoot.
It shoots .22rf shorts as well.
Plus,
If I ever want to restore it back to .32 RF.
All I have to do is heat up the parts , and pull the liners out and clean up the parts.
The gun is not any kind of collectors piece.
Plus it wasn't in Perfect condition.
But I am able to go out and shoot it when I want.
Plus the cost of the pistol was next to nothing , and the conversion didn't cost me much to do myself.
But on some guns.
I would rather do a professional conversion or make up casings to fire the gun without making major conversions.
Too bad I couldn't find .32 RF casings.
I do reload .22 RF's also

[uscra112]

Larry Potterfiled has a video where he converts a 32 rimfire to 32-20. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XZ7sQya7tyk

A very, very bad idea for a Hopkins & Allen Junior. I seriously wonder about Potterfield at times.

I have converted one to CF by fitting a longer link. Problem is that with the breechblock now riding higher in the frame there is interference with the extractor travel. You can relieve the top edge of the block, but only by a little.

.32 Colt brass is easily made by swaging down .32 S&W. The heeled 299153 bullets have been easy to buy up until recently, but Jack Harrison is having health problems, and isn't listing them at the moment. So maybe reaming the chamber to S&W is going to be the way forward.

[dtknowles]

I have a .32 RF Leader revolver from back like in the 1900's.
I couldn't find more than one box of ammo for it.
So I epoxied a turned down .22 barrel liner into the barrel.
Then I made some cylinder liners and epoxied them into the cylinder and reamed them to fit .22 LR.
The gun fires great , and is fun to shoot.
It shoots .22rf shorts as well.
Plus,
If I ever want to restore it back to .32 RF.
All I have to do is heat up the parts , and pull the liners out and clean up the parts.
The gun is not any kind of collectors piece.
Plus it wasn't in Perfect condition.
But I am able to go out and shoot it when I want.
Plus the cost of the pistol was next to nothing , and the conversion didn't cost me much to do myself.
But on some guns.
I would rather do a professional conversion or make up casings to fire the gun without making major conversions.
Too bad I couldn't find .32 RF casings.
I do reload .22 RF's also

I have not been able to get prime all to work in my 32s, don't know what I am doing wrong. I have a dozen I would like to make work. I have hundreds of 32 RF but I don't want to burn too much of it as it is quite valuable. I mostly shoot using ramsets in modified centerfire brass.

I have been converting 32 boolits to heeled boolits on a lathe. None of my 32s have groove diameter more than 0.313.

Tim

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello pertnear,

I have a project in the works to make re-loadable 32rf.
I've taken .32 S&W cartridges, sized them down to .3167" all the way to the rim.
Next step will be to drill out the primer pocket to except a .27 Caliber Power Tool Cartridges for both primer & powder charge.
I will load a heeled base bullet above all and hopefully it will go bang.
As I've decided to make these rf cartridges, I didn't care if the primer pocket of passage ended up shrinking.

AntiqueSledMan.

[pertnear]

Hello pertnear,

I have a project in the works to make re-loadable 32rf.
I've taken .32 S&W cartridges, sized them down to .3167" all the way to the rim.
Next step will be to drill out the primer pocket to except a .27 Caliber Power Tool Cartridges for both primer & powder charge.
I will load a heeled base bullet above all and hopefully it will go bang.
As I've decided to make these rf cartridges, I didn't care if the primer pocket of passage ended up shrinking.

AntiqueSledMan.

AntiqueSledMan, I definitely want to hear how that comes out! Don't forget a picture or 2.

Thanks everyone for their replies - good info in this thread!

[jaguarxk120]

Get the March issue of the Rifle magazine. The article to read is, Reloading a Rimfire? Sort of...

[uscra112]

Keep those nailgun loads mild - grey or at most brown. The hotter ones are too much for the old revolvers and boys' rifles.

[dtknowles]

Keep those nailgun loads mild - grey or at most brown. The hotter ones are too much for the old revolvers and boys' rifles.

Yes, no point in trying to make a magnum and ruining an old gun.

Tim

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello pertnear,

I have so many irons in the fire that I don't know when I'll get back to the 32's.
For forming, I made a block 1 x 4 x 3/8" thick and put 4 holes in it.
The first was 0.332/0.330", second was 0.327/0.325", third was 0.322/.0320", and the forth was 0.317/0.315".
I pushed the 32 S&W case in each hole to the rim on my little arbor press, then flipped the block and pushed them out with a 1/4-20 bolt.
Like I said earlier I wasn't concerned if the primer pocket or passage closed up a bit,
as I planned on drilling through for the .27 Caliber Power Tool Cartridge.
I just didn't like the idea of turning the case down near the base, even though many do it.
There is a lot of information here about the .32rf, a very long post but lots of information.

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?147224-reloadable-32-rimfire-brass&highlight=32rf

There is a guy on gunbroker selling both sized cases and heeled bullets for the 32rf.

Hope this helps, AntiqueSledMan.

[uscra112]

The "guy on gunbroker" is Jack Harrison.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/970346717

As I posted earlier, Jack is facing some health issues, and is scaling back his offerings. As of this morning he has bullets and .32 rimfire adapters for sale, and I'd recommend that anyone needing either one place an order ASAP, because it may be a while before he can make any more.

If nothing else, read the tutorials he posts in his listings.

if you choose the make your own brass, do NOT use Starline. Their walls are too thick, and you'll have to do extra lathe work to cope. Don't ask me how I know. Jack is using PPU cases from Graf's. To quote: "It's for this reason I use ppu brass from Graf's. The rim diameter is kind of variable, but not only is the brass thinner, it stays thin far enough that you can make shorts and still have a thin enough wall."

[ulav8r]

Larry Potterfiled has a video where he converts a 32 rimfire to 32-20. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XZ7sQya7tyk

That is a link to relining a 22 barrel. Here is the link to converting a Remington to 32-20. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfFxjX4jMkU

[uscra112]

He's doing it to a #1 rolling block there. Not a boys' rifle.

[marlinman93]

I would not consider any small single shot a good candidate to convert to .32-20 cartridge; especially a rifle that doesn't have the barrel threaded to the receiver! But even some that do have threaded barrels still are not strong enough for the pressures a .32-20 cartridge operates at. Even a .32 S&W Long is too much for many of these old single shots.

[uscra112]

The Hopkins & Allen "medium frame" would be OK, despite being a slip-in barrel. I can't think of any others. The "medium frame" has other defects, though; notably that misbegotten extractor.

[Head Shot]

Hello:
I read out on the internet that there might be a 32rf brass adaptor that a 22cal nail gun power load was put in adaptor with a 32 cal muzzy ball .
Anybody know where or what on it ?
I just bought a stevens favorite in 32 rim fire and boy it looks pretty decent for its age so looking at options to shoot it as a rimfire with some type of adaptor of sorts.
Anyone here offering a adaptor to work in the 32 rimfire ?
Thank you
Head Shot

[uscra112]

My friend Jack Harrison has adapters and the required heeled bullets.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976898390
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976899429
Read the little tutorial he has in his listings
Jack has some health issues and is slowing down, so don't wait too long.

Jack still advocates for using .22 nailgun loads (the two mildest ones) but I like to use 6mm acorn blanks with a pinch of Bullseye (1.0 to 1.3 grains). The nailgun loads swell and thus are hard to punch out of the adaptors, shortening their life. The acorn blanks are so short and mild that they practically fall out. Several places sell the acorn blanks. I buy from Gun Dog Supply
https://www.gundogsupply.com/rws-crimped-6-millimeter--22-cal-copper-coated-steel-blanks-100-count.html
They are more expensive than generic nailgun loads, but you save in the end by not wearing out your adapters.
If you have a lathe or access to one, Ii have a drawing for a clever seater/crimper die. This is the only tool you really need until it becomes necessary to full-length size your brass, but what with the low pressure that doesn't happen often.

[Green Frog]

It looks like I’ve missed this thread for over a month. Must be my Cataract Surgery healing strangely.

Anywhoooo, I’d first have to examine the specific rifle being considered for conversion, but I will relate that I have had two of the smooth frame low walls converted from rf 32 to cf 32. One just got a cf breech block and was shot with 32 Colt ammo. The other was further modified by reaming the chamber to 32 H&R when that caliber first came out… the bore was pretty marginal, but it seemed to like the 110 grain half Jacketed bullets designed for the M1 Carbine.

As mentioned by friend Marlin93, the folks at Marlin offered both a Ballard single shot and a Model 1892 lever action that right out of the box would accept both 32 rf and 32 (Colt) cf with a simple change of the firing pin. That was the best idea! :mrgreen:

I’ve only had tangential experience with converting any 32 rf boy’s rifle to 32-20, but except for all but the strongest of the breed would steer clear of those conversions. I’ve had the same 10 fingers and the same 2 (slightly modified) eyeballs for nearly 74 years and have become quite fond of them.

Froggie

[uscra112]

Again - NO boys' rifle should EVER be converted to .32-20.

DATA:

The bolt thrust of the .32 RF that these guns were designed for, loaded with an 86 grain bullet to 1160 FPS, calculates out to about 760 pounds-force.

The .32-20, loaded conservatively to 1200 fps with the canonical 115 grain bullet, calculates to about 1000 pounds-force.

BTW .32 H&R Mag full loads are something like 1800 lbf, which puts it well above the .22 Hornet.

[Head Shot]

Hello:
Can a 32 long rimfire stevens favorite be changed to 32 colt long or 32 sw long and be safe assuming rifles in good shape ?
Wasn't to keen on going to 32-20.
But was thinking center fire conversion then load lightly with a 310or 315 lead ball or the 90gr heeled bullet in the stevens favorite 32 cal long rifle if wasnt strong enough for the above mentioned cals.
What's your thoughts on that angle ?
Thank you
Head Shot

[uscra112]

Yes, of course. But I much prefer the 1915 Favorite over the '94 pattern, due to the wider link. Not keen on .32 S&W since some factory loads run too hot for the action. Stick to the .32 Long Colt.

[EdZ KG6UTS]

[QUOTE=Snakeoil;5530951]To measure is to know. Measure your bore and your chamber and then look up the SAAMI specs for .32 centerfire cartridges. You might have to shoot a heeled bullet depending on the chamber/bore relationship.

I bought 90gr .32 heeled bullets from Old West Bullet Moulds, https://oldwestbulletmoulds.com/ , nice folks to deal with and several items for loading rf ammo.

EdZ
.32rf #2 Rolling Block

[EdZ KG6UTS]

My friend Jack Harrison has adapters and the required heeled bullets.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976898390
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976899429
Read the little tutorial he has in his listings
Jack has some health issues and is slowing down, so don't wait too long.
I buy from Gun Dog Supply
https://www.gundogsupply.com/rws-crimped-6-millimeter--22-cal-copper-coated-steel-blanks-100-count.html
......
Thanks for that info, I just placed an order as a gift to my .32rf ~8^)

EdZ

[uscra112]

I bought 90gr .32 heeled bullets from Old West Bullet Moulds, https://oldwestbulletmoulds.com/ , nice folks to deal with and several items for loading rf ammo.

EdZ
.32rf #2 Rolling Block

That picture looks like the .299" diameter hollow-base bullet that was used in the so-called .32 Colt Long Rifle. The brass was longer and the bullet seated inside, so the lube grooves were protected. Not heeled.

[EdZ KG6UTS]

That picture looks like the .299" diameter hollow-base bullet that was used in the so-called .32 Colt Long Rifle. The brass was longer and the bullet seated inside, so the lube grooves were protected. Not heeled.

The ones I have are heeled lead with external lube. I pan lubed with SPG.