First 5 hand loads

[TonyR]

So I have been kicking the thought of reloading ammo for years and have slowly accumulated things here and there to start reloading as a hobby. More so, to fuel my real hobby which is shooting.

I mainly run .223 and 9mm. Don’t get my wrong, I’ll shoot anything that goes bang but these two rounds in particular is what I carry everyday in law enforcement so I am wanting to get set up to reload LOTS of rounds in both.

I started with 5 rounds of .223. I didn’t load more because I want to test the load before I start mass producing. Here’s what I’m starting with

50 Gr military pull frangible bullets (they were cheap)
26 gr BL-C2
CCI 400 primers
The case lengths were all between 1.74 and 1.75, which I’ve read it’s ok to be off by .01, the trim length for .223 being 1.75.

The OAL range from 2.18 to 2.21. My press is set up for 2.21 and the reason for the shorter rounds is that some of the pulled bullets have the tip smashed down. Herein lies my question that I can’t seem to find an answer to. I’m aware the max OAL is 2.26 but I can’t find anything on a minimum OAL. Or does this even matter? All of the rounds chamber and eject and aren’t for precision shooting. I want them to be accurate enough that I can run and gun with on the range but I’m not out to win any competition with these rounds.

Will I be ok to run these through a rifle without damaging it? It has a 16” barrel if that matters.

On another note, I’ve noticed the federal .223 brass is all crimped at the primer with the ring crimp. What do you guys use to remove these when reloading a lot of ammo in a sitting.

Thanks for any advice
Tony
308643

[Winger Ed.]

I use that de-burring tool that's about the size of your thumb to remove the crimps.
Doing a few- I'll do it by hand, a bunch- I put it in the lathe going as slow as it'll go.
Midway used to sell a adapter thing to put it in a drill press, but I haven't seen it offered in awhile.

On your OAL length- paint a round with something a little thicker than sharpie ink, like a crayon or latex house paint.
Run it through the magazine and chamber it. Pull it out, If you don't see rifling marks on it--
you won't get in too much trouble, or shoot your eye out kid.

Your seating die will grip the bullet somewhere below the tip. That's the important part for the length.
Line up several bullets on something really flat like glass.
Now look across the tops. You'll see there are some with different heights.

When you measure OALs with a caliper-- you'll go crazy fighting that little bit of difference with seating die adjustment.

I'm all about being safe, but try not to over think this stuff.

[Castaway]

If you have a choice of error, go with the longer OAL. You won’t get into pressure problems with too great an OAL if you’re seating the prescribed bullet with the prescribed powder and charge. You may have problems feeding but you’re on safe ground unless you seat so long the bullet is jammed into the rifling as the pressure may increase. Try 0.1” off rifling. If seated too deeply, pressure goes up; again, assuming the bullet, powder and charge are what are called for in the “book.” The crimp you mentioned is found on military ammunition. The easiest way I’ve found to get rid of it is with an RCBS primer pocket swagger.

[TonyR]

I use that de-burring tool that's about the size of your thumb to remove the crimps.
Doing a few- I'll do it by hand, a bunch- I put it in the lathe going as slow as it'll go.
Midway used to sell a adapter thing to put it in a drill press, but I haven't seen it offered in awhile.

On your OAL length- paint a round with something a little thicker than sharpie ink, like a crayon or latex house paint.
Run it through the magazine and chamber it. Pull it out, If you don't see rifling marks on it--
you won't get in too much trouble, or shoot your eye out kid.

Your seating die will grip the bullet somewhere below the tip. That's the important part for the length.
Line up several bullets on something really flat like glass.
Now look across the tops. You'll see there are some with different heights.

When you measure OALs with a caliper-- you'll go crazy fighting that little bit of difference with seating die adjustment.

I'm all about being safe, but try not to over think this stuff.

Thanks for the info! I’m sure with higher quality bullets they will be more consistent in terms of OAL. Do you have a margin of error for different lengths or do you even measure each cartridge individually? I wouldn’t mind if I was loading say 50 rounds but with the intent to do thousands of .223 I don’t see myself checking them.

[TonyR]

If you have a choice of error, go with the longer OAL. You won’t get into pressure problems with too great an OAL if you’re seating the prescribed bullet with the prescribed powder and charge. You may have problems feeding but you’re on safe ground unless you seat so long the bullet is jammed into the rifling as the pressure may increase. Try 0.1” off rifling. If seated too deeply, pressure goes up; again, assuming the bullet, powder and charge are what are called for in the “book.” The crimp you mentioned is found on military ammunition. The easiest way I’ve found to get rid of it is with an RCBS primer pocket swagger.

I’ve noticed the ring crimp on federal American eagle brass as well which is where most of my brass comes from. I’ll definitely check out the RCBS swager.

[Texas by God]

I use an AR15 magazine to set OAL for the .223
I’ve never measured my ammo.


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[Winger Ed.]

. Do you have a margin of error for different lengths or do you even measure each cartridge individually? .

When I get set up for a run, If it's FMJ for a military cartridge and open sight rifle, I'll start with the recommended OAL,
make sure it functions in the magazine, and the bullet is off the lands a few thousandths, seat a few, check 'em, do a few more and check
everything,. If it's all Ok, I check one after each dozen or so, and call it good.

Bolt action hunting or target rifles get a little more involved.
I'll take a case with just a little bit of neck sizing, put a bullet in the case, and close the bolt on it.
It will push the bullet back into the case as it hits the lands.

I'll set the seater for seating a few thousandths deeper than that, and go from there.

There's several ways to do all this.
I'm just passing on what works for me and I've been doing it since the 80s.
I'd recommend learning all you can from others, what works for them, then do what works for you.

And don't fall into splitting hairs and over thinking things you don't need to.
Not that it's bad, but for me it takes some of the relaxation and fun of the hobby.

[ebb]

You made a brilliant statement, that you had the tools to start reloading, because if you are like every other reloader in the world you will be buying the latest reloading tool long after your ability to reload is gone.

[rancher1913]

keep in mind both 223/5.56 and 9mm are subject to bulges at the base from oversize chambers, not super common but it can be there. a push through size die will eliminate the problem or you can rollsize them.

[sigep1764]

For crimped primers, you can use the RCBS tool and it works. It is slow and prone to sticking requiring force to operate. The Dillon 600 primer pocket swager is a much better tool for doing a LOT of cases. If you want the RCBS tool, pm me. But the Dillon is the cats meow. Also, carbide dies really speed things along and allow outstanding die life. Dillon case lube is awesome and can be replicated with alcohol and liquid lanolin for cheap.

[stubshaft]

I use an AR15 magazine to set OAL for the .223
I’ve never measured my ammo.


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+1 - If it fits in the magazine it gets shot.

[Thin Man]

TonyR, welcome to the asylum. Your current and my previous work are the same, LEO. I started handloading the .223 (for a Remington 788) before I owned an AR, then was assigned as agency armorer and expanded my abilities and workload. The one obstacle I ran into most frequently was getting the rifle functional with handloaded ammo. Ammo testing can be simple or simply frustrating based on what we feed it. To determine if the load is right for the firearm I load one (1) cartridge into the mag and fire it. That round must lock the bolt to the rear by the bolt catch, not just by the upward force from the mag. Watch your ejection. You want the brass to travel out of the receiver at the 3-4:00 direction and go about 8-12 feet from the receiver. If the brass ejects toward the front of the rifle the round is overloaded or has excess gas flow to the bolt, yet if it comes out with mild exit remaining in the receiver or close to your position it is a weak load or you need more gas flow. Once you are comfortable with your load specs everything should go well. As for removing primer pocket crimps I have used the RCBS primer pocket swaging die set with great success for over 40 years, no complaints. Enjoy the ride, you're headed for fun.

[contender1]

Tony,, welcome to the fun of handloading your own.

I started in the 1970's, and I'm still learning.

Lots of good info above. As noted,, do not get too uptight about the OAL in general. As noted,, the main length thing is where the bullet touches the rifling lands in the barrel. And, as noted, the pressure increase/decrease with depth. Luckily,,, the .223 isn't as sensitive to this as the 9mm is. The .9mm is a lot more depth sensitive.
Different company's bullet will all have a slightly different profile, so again, as noted,, if it'll chamber easily and feeds well, you'll be good to go w/o worrying about .003 differences in length.

The primer pocket crimp ring. The bane of handloaders.
As noted,, for a smaller batch of brass,, the classic "deburring tool" that chamfers the case mouths when you trim them,, can be gently used to remove the primer pocket crimp. Or, if you have a larger quantity of brass to work, the RCBS is a step up, and the Dillon is about the best. Once that crimp is removed, you don't have to worry about it anymore. PERSONALLY,, I prefer the Dillon.

.9mm

Some handguns are built to where the brass gets a slight bulge at the base when fired. It has to do with the chamber cut in the barrel. Many people use a full length sizer & are fine. Others use a push through sizer when you can find one. Due to the slight taper of the case,, that type of tool isn't often made. And lastly, a newer method is to use a "roll sizer" machine. They can be pricey for the casual shooter. Competition shooters who use a LOT of brass will buy one. Study YOUR needs before investing. I've been using the normal carbide sizing dies w/o issues. I shoot USPSA competition with a .9mm revolver. I use a "Case gauge" (well worth the $15 or so,) to make sure my ammo will seat properly in my gun.
Next,, the .9mm is the type of ammo that handloading for can be a little frustrating for newer handloaders. OAL, or especially the seating depth of the bullet is more critical than many calibers. AND,, you NEED to get a "taper crimp die" and crimp the .9mm ammo on a separate step in loading. It's a small case, small amount of powder,, yet pressures can spike easily.

Lastly,, do NOT hesitate to ask questions. Your post here proves you are smart enough to ask. Often,, a little frustration can cause embarrassment IN YOUR mind, but not to those of us who've already had our embarrassments before you.

[JoeJames]

I learned from bitter experience to measure the overall case length. .223 and .556 seems very prone to expanding in length which did not work well at all with my AR. Do that before you have loaded 20 or so rounds.

[wv109323]

Others have offered good agvice.
You will need to start trimming the cases when they exceed the maximum length. Trimmed brass will go 2-3 firings before needing to be trimmed again. Also rifle brass case life can be extended by annealing the case mouth. Case preperation is a bear for rifle cases. Annealing can be done with a propane torch and a deep well socket mounted in a drill. Spin the case for X amount of time in the flame. I would keep my brass segregated as to know what needs to be done as a next step in extending case life.
Others have mentioned the deburring tool to eliminate the primer crimp. Machinist have a countersink tool that works the same way as the deburring tool but has a larger handle. Also not mentioned is a primer pocket cutter. Think of a square ended drill bit on a handle. This will cut the crimp straight and not remove a chamfer in the primer pocket. Next are swagers that push the crimp back. The most popular is RCBS. Others make them and if memory sevres me correct one made by C4H is attractive.
OAL in not to critical in rifles. As a general rule you do not want the base of the bullet below the bottle neck of the case. Next is maximum length. The round must fit in the magszine. You do nor want the bullet jammed into the rifling. Most prefer .010-.015 off the rifling for optimum accuracy. Most important the OAL must function through the semi auto.
9MM -Start with a jacketed bullet. Use carbide dies. OAL is critical for functioning and pressure.
Ask questions here. I would load at jeast 10 rounds as a test. Load one round in a magazine several times to issue the bolt/slide locks back.

[grayscale]

Welcome to the madness, you start reloading to be able shoot more. And soon find that you are shooting more as an excuse to reload. Its a vicious cycle.

[WRideout]

If you have a choice of error, go with the longer OAL. You won’t get into pressure problems with too great an OAL if you’re seating the prescribed bullet with the prescribed powder and charge. You may have problems feeding but you’re on safe ground unless you seat so long the bullet is jammed into the rifling as the pressure may increase. Try 0.1” off rifling. If seated too deeply, pressure goes up; again, assuming the bullet, powder and charge are what are called for in the “book.” The crimp you mentioned is found on military ammunition. The easiest way I’ve found to get rid of it is with an RCBS primer pocket swagger.

I also use the RCBS primer pocket tool. I find it much easier and less damaging than the case mouth chamfering tool. It is also useful for 9mm Para which occasionally has crimped in primers.

Wayne

[jonp]

I use an AR15 magazine to set OAL for the .223
I’ve never measured my ammo.


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+1

Easiest way to check.

[Lefty Red]

Set one of the Lee APPs up for depriming and the other for swaggering, the swagger is in the white tube box I gave you. Good Luck!
Lefty