Tell me about the 348 Winchester

[RickinTN]

Hello all!
Tell me what you think about the 348 Winchester. I have thought for some time about a Browning reproduction model 71 chambered as such. What bullet (mold) do you prefer? What size gas checks? What is your favorite powder?
If I do get one from Santa it will most likely be loaded very mild, to the mid-teens velocity wise.
Please share your thoughts.
Thanks, and Merry Christmas to all!
Rick

[HWooldridge]

Model 71 is a great action and the .348 is a powerful cartridge that will take pretty much any big game in N. America - but it has been surpassed by other cartridges that are more efficient and ultimately more popular. You'll either love it or hate it - although sounds like you will be handloading so that may make the experience more appealing.

With light loads, you can use Unique or 2400, and likely a WW lead boolit. Gas checks may not be required if you aren't pushing for high velocity.

[RickinTN]

Thank you for your quick response. Yes, it certainly will be a handloading proposition. I usually always use gas checks in rifles even at mild velocities. I have looked a bit and am "stumped" as to which gas check the 348 would take. Is there a favorite mold those of you who shoot the 348 use?
Thanks again,
Rick

[david s]

The 348 is basically a lever action 30-06. Where the bullet weights overlap the velocities are very similar. Bullet diameter is of course different. I've tried both the RCBS and Lyman moulds but with no real luck on my end. Hornady use to make 348 gas checks but discontinued them, I heard they are making them again but haven't seen any. Gator gas checks does make 348 gas checks. My Browning 71 shoots very well and makes an easy to carry hunting rifle.

[Martin Luber]

Orphaned brass and bullet size, hard to find and expensive

[dverna]

Orphaned brass and bullet size, hard to find and expensive

What he said.

If I wanted a lever action rifle in that caliber range I would go with a .358 Win. Seeing as you are going to load it down anyway, it makes little sense to go with a "bastard" caliber that uses "bastard" cases. And there are many good jacketed and cast bullets in 35 caliber. If they stop making .358 cases, you can use .308 cases and be good to go. But it is unlikely that .358 cases will be obsolete. It is easy for manufacturers to make them when they are tooled for .308's.

[david s]

Starline currently has 348 brass in stock.

[RickinTN]

Starline currently has 348 brass in stock.

I saw that.
I understand all the reasons not to but there is one reason which trumps them all......I want one!
Rick

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I have a Browning 71 with 20" barrel and a Winchester 'long tang beater' with 24" barrel. Compared to the Savage 99 in .358 and the Marlin in 45-70 or 444, the 71 in .348 is big and heavy, cannot be scoped easily and provides little advantage over the above mentioned rifles. I do own at least one of each of the others and have taken elk with them. I have shot the Winchester to some extent, using factory open sights, I can get groups under 2.5 MOA in good light using the 200 grain Hornady jacketed or Bullshop cast 225 grain bullets. Hornady did make a gummy tip and Swift makes an A-frame, I have both but have not fooled with them. Due to limited sight options and the heavy weight, I don't expect to ever take them hunting. 4350 and 760 with magnum primers were used satisfactorily for load development.

[david s]

Hawk bullets makes 348 bullets between 165 and (165-180-200-220-250-270) 270 grains. Barnes offers their originals in 348 and Hornady may still offer the 200 grain bullet. "I want one" makes perfect sense to me.

[RickinTN]

Hawk bullets makes 348 bullets between 165 and (165-180-200-220-250-270) 270 grains. Barnes offers their originals in 348 and Hornady may still offer the 200 grain bullet. "I want one" makes perfect sense to me.

Hello David,
I've been perusing the Hawk bullets. I have some for my 38-55 I have yet to try. No more than I would shoot a 348 Hawk bullets certainly make sense. I already ordered bullet sizers but haven't bought the rifle just yet.
Thanks all, and keep it coming,
Rick

[david s]

In my 348 Hunting load I'm still using the Barnes 220 grain X bullets they made back in the late 1990's. Still have half a box of the 220's and two boxes (100 bullets) of the 200 grain Barnes X bullets after that. For hunting rounds that should see me thru. Garage saleing we found some of the 200 grain Winchester factory and a box of Remington 200 grain loads. Like at a pawn shop you ever know what you'll find.

[gunther]

Hornady has .348 gas checks. Very few other sources. Buy brass as soon as you see it. Kinda scarce. I think RCBS still makes a mold for .348, other than that, Lyman used to, 350447 was the pattern number. Start looking on Foobay, and expect to pay too much.

[dverna]

I saw that.
I understand all the reasons not to but there is one reason which trumps them all......I want one!
Rick

Maybe the better question is why do you want one?

Seems most people who are being honest with you are telling you it is a poor choice. There are always the "enablers" who will tell you what you want to hear.

.348 brass is close to $500/250.

If I had a gun from my dad or granddad in that caliber, I could justify keeping it and using it. Spending a bunch of money to buy a new gun and feed it is a question you need to answer.

Post #9 from MostlyLeverGuns should be read again IMO.

But if you really want one...just go for it. Life is too short not to scratch some itches. Enjoy your new gun!!!

[elk hunter]

If you like classic rifles and want a model 71 get one. I doubt you'll regret buying it. Brass and bullets can be scarce but can be found. I like my circa 1940 model 71 deluxe. It's built the way I like: You know blued steel and walnut. I don't really care for plastic and stainless rifles they're just not my thing. Given a chance a model 71 will start a deer's freezer training with class. I've tried a few cast loads but haven't really put any effort in to it. I do plan on working up more cast loads for it when the weather breaks next spring.

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[david s]

NOE has 348 Gator gas checks listed as in stock, 19 available, at $32 a thousand. And as mentioned Starline is offering brass that's listed as in stock. Not sure where everyone else lives but around here 348 ammo or components have never, even in the best of times been common. Doesn't mean there unavailable though and yes when found the cost tends to run more than say 308 or 223.

[Eddie Southgate]

I love my 1936 model71. Wanted one since I was a kid and finally got one this year. Hornady no longer makes the 200 grain bullet but Barnes makes the 250 original and Hawk and Fury both make bullets for it . I sourced brass from gun broker and a couple of WTS adds on the boards . My local gun store has .348 ammo in Hornady at roughly $70 a box and I was able to trade a few boxes of bullets I didn't need for six vintage boxes of ammo from a guy on the campfire. You can find components without going broke, no, they wont be cheap but neither is a lot of other stuff I shoot. If you want one buy it and ignore the "Bastard" junk written above. Nothing "Bastard" about it , it's just not creedmore and you wont be shooting it in an AR so production ammo and brass is not a top priority with the ammo makers or the component companies. Bayou brass and Ammo has gas checks for a very reasonable price and they are Vet made and nice checks.

[Eddie Southgate]

I saw that.
I understand all the reasons not to but there is one reason which trumps them all......I want one!
Rick

And that's the best reason in the world !

[Duckiller]

Get it ! Its a great gun. I have a year 2 Model 71. I may get to shoot a Roosevelt Elk with it. If not a son may use it. A great gun to be enjoyed.

[labradigger1]

Ill ad my 2$. I love lever guns a d always will. I have never had an opportunity to purchase a model 71 but have in the past had great buys at public auctions for 348 factory loaded winchester silvertips. I made several of these purchases through the years and made quite a profit selling the loaded ammo and vintage boxes they came in. Artwork was a bear on the box iirc.
If you are able to source brass or loaded ammo you'll be ahead to purchase it as opposed to buying it off GB where i sold mine. It is expensive. It is also the most powerful lever action caliber ever offered and from what ive read packs a punch on both ends.

[cuzinbruce]

I have been using old Lyman .348 gas checks. With a thousand to a box, they should last a while. Original 71, regular, not the deluxe. RCBS bullet. Or old Hornady J-words. 4064 powder. Might want to check old Handloader magazines for info. I think Barsness had an article on it. Most Lyman manuals should too. Enjoy it.

Here is a link to the article I remembered. It wasn't Barsness after all.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/the-348-winchester

[muskeg13]

Hornady has .348 gas checks. Very few other sources. Buy brass as soon as you see it. Kinda scarce. I think RCBS still makes a mold for .348, other than that, Lyman used to, 350447 was the pattern number. Start looking on Foobay, and expect to pay too much.

There are also the Lyman/Ideal 350457 (250 gr multi grease grooved Loverin FP) and 350482 (250gr blunt RN). Both of these are gas checked designs.

By the way, the 350447 is a 183,185 or 187 gr gas checked FP, depending on the year of the Lyman/Ideal reference. I've also seen the nominal 250s listed as 250, 251 or 255 gr, depending on the age of the reference.

In addition to ebay, you may be successful in obtaining old molds at gun shows or on GunBroker.com.

[LIMPINGJ]

Accurate Molds list some also.

[RickinTN]

I have had good luck with several Louverin designs in 30 caliber. I would be tempted to try such a bullet. I don't think I noticed such a bullet in the Accurate catalog but I've found the best way to get a mold when you need it is to have a sample and have Tom add it to the catalog.
Thanks, and Merry Christmas!
Rick

[rintinglen]

Do not waste your money on the 350-447. At least in my 1950, 24" Model 71, it is much less accurate than either the RCBS or the Accurate 35-220B. For my money, the 35-220 is the boolit of choice. There are 3 versions, IIRC, varying slightly in the length of the nose. It shoots much better than the Lyman mold I had and is somewhat better than the RCBS, though not by more than 1/2 of an inch. I have shot 1 1/8," 50 yard groups on several occasions with the Accurate boolit.

I regret not buying the Browning Carbine that was for sale a while back, but at that moment, money and I were a little estranged.

Another load that works very well, despite shooting very low, is the 358-429 sized .350 and loaded over 13 grains of Red Dot or 15 grains of Unique. Recoil is mild, and for plinking and just plain fun, it is ideal. The first pic shows a pair of the Keith boolits downsized and loaded while the second shows several loaded rounds.

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[Alstep]

I'll be watching this thread closely. I've had a Model 71 for years but just never got around to playing with it till this past year. Had only mediocre results with the Lyman 350447 and 3031. Got Tom's mold but haven't tried it yet. Got some Gator checks a while ago too. Been buying up brass through the years when it shows up, so I'm ok with that for the foreseeable future.
It's the ultimate lever gun to me. I can see why you gotta have one. It's just got class!
Merry Christmas.

[glaciers]

I’ve owned model 71’s in the past, never really warmed up to the rifle. I like just about all Winchester levers but only some 86’s so I’m going to chalk it up to a personal flaw. I’ve owned 2 standard 24” rifles and inherited my Father’s deluxe rifle with a bolt peep. Beautiful rifles, but something just was off between the 71’s and myself. While I like the 1886 levergun I’m not a fan of the full rifle. To heavy, to long, just doesn’t carry right for me. YMMV and probably does.
My favorite 86’s are the extra light weight models made in 45-70 and 33 Winchester, especially in takedown. Sadly I currently don’t have one of these 86’s and with current financial conditions I suspect that won’t change unless I can work a trade.
But, that’s changed as I found here in the swap and sell a modified 71 and a LEE 6 cavity 350 225 group buy mold new in the box. The 71 came along 6 or 7 years ago, pretty nice condition with a Lyman 56 steel receiver sight, not positive about the Lyman model number, but other modifications that were of interest to me were a 20” barrel and a full length magazine with a flat barrel band! On the down side the butt stock was not original and short at 12.5” pull in addition to having a Monte Carlo style stock. That would need to be changed as I like 14” or slightly longer pull. Kept my eye on eBay for a couple of years, then one day an original 71 short tang stock came up for “buy it now” for $20. I think it was up for sale for a total of 12 minutes. The stock fit perfectly and as I like longish pull on a rifle had a Decelerator recoil pad installed. The used Winchester stock from eBay did not have a butt plate so putting, a recoil pad on was a no brainer. This modified 71 carries like a 94 or 92 which just naturally carry, and points and shoots very well. 2” at 100 with Winchester Silvertip 200 grain from my bench, which is better then any of my other levers, go figure.
It was an easy purchase as the seller was here in Alaska as I am, and a reasonable price sealed the deal.
I’ve got a couple of pictures I’ll post as you can see it’s a Winchester barrel, but has been cut down, it’s doesn’t appear to be a original 20” carbine barrel but a cut down rifle barrel. As you can see the front sight is right up to the barrel end. That’s not standard, but nicely done.
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[glaciers]

I’ll be watching this thread as well. I haven’t done much with cast yet, with just a few with the LEE mold which drops at about 230 powder coated. Picked up a 2 cavity LBT mold # 350 250 which might not work, will need to play with it. Another I want to try is a mold from Accurate #35-300B, this is listed as a 348 design. But little short on money at this time..

https://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=35-300B

It’s a big bullet going 300 grains, but I like heavy for caliber bullets, but ordered in the right diameter probably plain base and intended to be powder coated, maybe 12 - 14 BHN. Might work pretty good.

[indian joe]

If you like classic rifles and want a model 71 get one. I doubt you'll regret buying it. Brass and bullets can be scarce but can be found. I like my circa 1940 model 71 deluxe. It's built the way I like: You know blued steel and walnut. I don't really care for plastic and stainless rifles they're just not my thing. Given a chance a model 71 will start a deer's freezer training with class. I've tried a few cast loads but haven't really put any effort in to it. I do plan on working up more cast loads for it when the weather breaks next spring.

308337

I have a Browning 71 from the 1990's - williams peep sight - bought plenty brass when I got it - Cast Bullet Engineering 225 grain GC mold - hornady gas checks - winchester 760 powder - tried some hornady 200grain SP but they a bit fragile up close I like the cast boolit better (hogs) dont shoot it a lot but like it.

[rintinglen]

+1 on the 760 powder advice--my best groups were shot with the Hornady 200 grain bullets and a grain under max using Hodgdon's data. It worked better than IMR 4350, 3031 and h4895 in my testing. One of these days, I am going to give Varget a go, if I can find any for sale when i have some money!

22.0 grains of 2400 works pretty well with the Accurate 35-220B, though it hits well below point of aim, if sighted in with full power loads. Indeed, that is my major gripe with the otherwise fine cartridge, reduced loads tend to shoot way low.

[doccash]

I have 5 Model 71s, standards, deluxe, and 2 deluxe carbines, ?I'm a collector/shooter of old Winchesters. sometimes its irrational to just 'want' one but the best fix is to get one or even more. There is no way to justify a want but the fix is obvious. Dr. C

[missionary5155]

Did anyone bother to look at Starline Brass ? They have .348 Brass for sale. I bought a box.

[bigbear]

I have 5 Model 71s, standards, deluxe, and 2 deluxe carbines, ?I'm a collector/shooter of old Winchesters. sometimes its irrational to just 'want' one but the best fix is to get one or even more. There is no way to justify a want but the fix is obvious. Dr. C

I would love to see a picture of these. I have Standard and DeLuxe Winchester 71's, all short tangs, one with bolt peep. Also a Browning71 carbine,plus a set of Browning71 rifle and carbine high grade. Seems I have the same affliction as you.:D
I hunt bears in the spring with my "beater" 71https://i.imgur.com/IX5HAB0.jpg

[RickinTN]

Nice bear and rifle there Bigbear! Good to see you put yours to good use. Mine remains unfired but I need to remedy that soon.
Take care!
Rick

[jwhite]

I have owned and hunted with Browning 71 with a 20" barrel for the last 27 years, my advice is buy it! You will be able to track down brass and to be realistic how much brass does one really need? Light loads, the case will last for ever with proper sizing and once you get a good hunting load worked up how of those do you really plink with? Mine carries so well the weight is not even noticed, proper balance makes a huge difference. I made a chamber impression upon getting the rifle and Veral @LBT made a 220gr molds that will shoot 1" groups with a receiver sight, what more can you ask for.

Jerry

[quilbilly]

It was a wonderful elk rifle for me.