Solar Panels charging an electric hunting buggy.. above my pay grade !

[Brokenbear]

Well do we have any knowledgeable folks on here who know the ins and outs of solar panel charging/maintaining a 4WD all electric UTV 48 volt / 2080AH capacity ( 4 each Discover Dry Cell technology batteries) I am looking for something quieter than my Yamaha 450 Rhino obviously

Here is the deal ..my farm in the boonies has no electricity available (where I hunt of course has lots of hills n log trails) .. and age, knees and back need to ditch packing into the stands in the dark and ice and snow and mud

I have looked at electric trail bikes but shoulders as well as railroad rail like places covered/camouflaged with hardwood leaves ankle+ deep (in case you have never ridden a motorcycle if you try crossing a rail at no angle to speak of you have a 50/50 chance of busting your keester) have me luke warm on an electric bike ..

I have looked at quad/atv's but the only thing even slightly interesting is a Daymac Beast 4X4 ($5999.99 +$600 shipping and no supporting dealers stateside) they have no US presence (Canada only)

Then there WAS the Polaris EV UTV which basically (never seen one ..just read about) used a battery n motor system about like a golf cart including a lead acid deep cycle battery that even in the best energy management conditions of constant battery watering charging etc will degrade very badly and battery reliability starts becoming an issue in three years and that long only if it doesn't sit unattended all winter or summer

Polaris does seem committed to electric for they have come out with a replacement for the EV model but it's price is that of a new automobile !

Enter the Hisun Motors Sector E1.. 4X4 ..Yes it is Chinese built and yes the jury is still out as to how strong it is now as well as to it's future with regards to reliability,performance, parts etc etc HOWEVER ..

The dealer 40 Min from me says Hisun Motors has a 300,000 square foot headquarters in McKinney Texas ..so at least this company seems intent to have a presence

Plus things I believe are really going to heat up as far as EV electric off road models AND technology offered by the major US atv/utv marketers ..but I stll have the need to solar charge/maintain one whether it be now or in two years

Heads up for anyone thinking EV hunting rigs ..study study study ..especially energy source (batteries) location of motor and type of motor and make you own decisions ..for example Lithium batteries are the cats meow ..most of the time ..and with present technology ..did you know a Lithium battery will not take a charge if the temperature is below 32 degrees ?? ( so I read ) ..there is a work around assuming the battery has some life to turn on head lights or whatever to create internal battery heat enough to start taking a charge ..NOT good if you rig is in an unheated area ..further a Lithium battery in cold weather (I read) gives up a smaller amount of it's total energy than other traditional storage batteries

Gents and ladies every thing I am discussing is from reading ,reviews, forums, feedbacks Etc ..I am inviting you all to input from you knowledge or hands on experience as I'll bet I'm not the only bunged up old fart looking for a way to stay in the field ..safely.

Bear

[Froogal]

Age, knees, and back. I'm in the same boat and if I was to venture out into the boonies I would want a vehicle that I could rely on. NOT electric.

[farmbif]

the only off-road vehicles I have are tractors, very reliable if cared for, but after reading and looking at a whole lot of off road vehicles I keep eyeballing Yamaha kodiak 4x4's.
most good reliable used off-road vehicles that are found advertised for sale seem to be priced at just about what a new one costs. unless you just happen to come across one of those few and far between deals or get one given to you in a will or something like that. I'm pretty sure you can get really good mufflers for a lot of them that are used for hunting and not screaming around dirt trails. but I'm not expert.
as far as engine noise scaring off deer. I guess sometimes they do. but just last month I was down in the field with my 65hp tractor running and two bucks and a doe came within less than 50 yards away from me. they came walking up turned and gave me a good eyeballing and wandered back off into the forest.

[jim 44-40]

Do you know if you can use a solar charge controller for gel,AGM type batteries with the Dry cell battery?

[rancher1913]

go over to the "diy solar power forum" and do a lot of reading and studying, you need to fully understand the bad as well as the good to solar power use before you buy anything solar.

[jim 44-40]

100% what Rancher1913 told you. There are so many things you need to look at like how many hours of good sun light your location will provide.

[MrWolf]

Solar and the woods combo just doesn't work for me. I have a Polaris Ranger 570-4 crew. Way bigger than what you probably want as his has two rows of seats and a tilting cargo box. I finally learned to keep the battery up with one of those smart chargers hooked up to solar in my utility shed (no power). I have been using four panels and two car batteries. Over the last few years the system will not hold a charge overnight. I know the batteries are not the fancy ones, UT they should at least be able to handle the minimal load I have on them. Anyway, the smart charger has been working great. I would not trust solar anything going into the woods and bringing my busted butt back along with a deer, etc. Why not gas powered? Are you concerned about the noise? Critters are used to engine sounds in my limited experience and electric crunching along would probably scare them more. Good luck.
Ron

[elk hunter]

If I were looking to solar charge anything of consequence I would talk to a solar energy company. A local solar company is going to set up a battery maintenance system, a simple task for them, for the road grader I operate at the local shooting range as we don't have electrical power available. I just put $500.00 worth of new battery's in it and don't want them setting for long periods and discharging.

Not to be critical of ATV/4X4 users but, my Jeep is my off road vehicle. It will take me anywhere I could or would drive a 4X4/ATV type of vehicle. With a heater and air conditioning it's comfortable year round, gets decent mileage and I can drive it to my hunting area at highway speed. 4X4 's and such are not legal on the public roads here because they're not licensed and insured. And in many local areas vehicles of any type are not allowed to drive off road. I see lots of people driving them in the woods and try to envision what advantage they might have and then I think to myself "I'll just stick with my Jeep".

[GhostHawk]

I was an early adopter of 2 wheel sit down electric scooters.

First 2 were sealed lead acid battery's, which were ok.

Last one was Lithiom Ion which doubled the number of charge cycles before it started degrading. Added about 50% range over the lead Acid. Take up less space/weight.

Now these are designed and govenered to not exceed 18mph (for sidewalk use) So no change there.

What I really noticed was that I only charged the new one once after the initial charge. Lead acid required 2 or 3 charges per summer to stay up and snappy.

That being said there is a lot of work being done on battery's right now. They are coming out with new types with better effeciency, lower cost.
Mine was mostly used to give my PomChi some exercise. Once around the full block. First 2 blocks were pretty much full bore as fast as he could go with tree watering stops.
Third block was kind of a mid level coast. Last block was generally kind of a cooling trot. But that was due to the dog not the scooter.

Hope this helps.

[Good Cheer]

Gave all my solar power texts to younguns setting up their homestead in Arizona so nope, can't help yah.
:-(

[Soundguy]

you may need a charge controller for each battery / cell bank.. but should be doable.

[jim 44-40]

Footprinthero.com
Solar panel charge time calculator,

[popper]

HiSun has a warehouse or 2 there, probably assy area also as all are made in China. IIRC Coleman is HiSun, being sold by Lowes. a Solar needs a large array, it's own battery storage to charge the ATV. Figure only 5 hrs actual use when doing anything in the woods. Electric motors draw a LOT of current when actually doing any hard work. Fine for the golf course. Just not practical!! The noise from a 1000cc gator is minimal to animals. I rode my Suzuki 500 ATV out to the pasture one nite, with the headlite on, saw 2 deer across a small (4 acre) pond - they looked at me and then went on browsing. And it will pull an extra 500# easy.

[country gent]

Hmm may have to look at a solar panel on my all terrain chair to extend the range between charges.

[tja6435]

You can find lithium batteries that are self heating but I wouldn’t trust them to maintain when it’s -20° or worse.

What I would do is find a good, reliable 4 stroke ATV and take it to a muffler shop and have them install a muffler that makes the engine exhaust as quiet as possible. If a muffler can make a V8 engine pretty much silent, I’d think it’s doable for a single or twin cylinder ATV engine.

I also like elk hunter’s recommendation for a jeep, a 1997-2001 Cherokee can be had for less than a used ATV, easy to get parts for and an enclosed cab with heat would be nice during the winters. Avoid Jeeps before 1997, they have ODB 1 ecm and are not as easy to get trouble codes from vs the 1997+ with ODB2 ecm’s

[jim 44-40]

That UTV has a 1200 watt/on board charger,that takes 6-10 hours to full charge
2080 amp/hr battery with a range of 48 miles
And only a 2 year warranty

[blackthorn]

My kid (he is 62) sold his ATV and bought an old 4 door Chev tracker. He loves it. He can use it around town or on the highway, it has a cab and heater. He says Suzuki parts are interchangeable and, best of all he gets real good mileage and he stays warm and dry!

[MaryB]

That UTV has a 1200 watt/on board charger,that takes 6-10 hours to full charge
2080 amp/hr battery with a range of 48 miles
And only a 2 year warranty

Then all you need is a Solar panel/charge controller/battery/inverter setup to handle however much current the onboard charger takes. If you tell me how many amps it is I can get you a rough estimate of cost. Having a little battery power for other stuff is handy, like charging power tools, a couple led lights... won't need a huge battery but it has to be there to even out the power to the inverter. Only way around that is a hybrid grid tie/off grid inverter with built in charge controller and they are big bucks and designed to run a house.

[jim 44-40]

If I had to charge a EV out in the boonies,I would use a inverter generator so all I would have to do is plug my EV in and let the onboard charger do it's job. If you feel safe about leaving all your solar equipment out in the boonies that is one thing to think about.sorry for getting off track of your goals with solar power,

[jmorris]

…48 volt / 2080AH capacity…


That is going to be one heck of a solar charging system, if you use it much at all. Out of curiosity I went here.

https://footprinthero.com/solar-panel-size-calculator

And used 48 volt, 2080 AH, dry, 50% discharge, PWM, 5.06 hours peak sunlight (for ideal St. Louis average @ 30.9 deg tilt, 1.8deg W azimuth), assuming you would want it charged in a day, that would take a 31,030 watt solar panel.

Looks like 30kW panels are around $45,000.

https://sunwatts.com/30-kw-solar-kits/

That’s a non starter for me. I have ATV’s and UTV’s my family and friends have used for decades that don’t have that much invested in them. They just don’t drink the gas, we actually use non ethanol gas because the regular stuff will gum up the carburetors as they are not used quickly enough.

[NyFirefighter357]

If I had to charge a EV out in the boonies,I would use a inverter generator so all I would have to do is plug my EV in and let the onboard charger do it's job. If you feel safe about leaving all your solar equipment out in the boonies that is one thing to think about.sorry for getting off track of your goals with solar power,

I agree a small generator would work cheaper & less complicated.
HF Predator 2000 Watt Super Quiet Inverter Generator with CO SECURE™ Technology Sale $550
HF Predator 1400 Watt Super Quiet Inverter Generator with CO SECURE™ Technology $470

[jmorris]

It would take 4.375 days (105.4378 hours) to charge the battery in the OP with 1400 watts (at a 10% efficiency loss)

So it would probably work if he wanted to use it one day a week and was around to keep gas in the generator to charge the 2080 Ah battery, the other days. As it would have to be running around the clock.

https://www.meracalculator.com/physics/classical/batteries-charge-time.php

It probably wouldn’t take long for him to learn a $470 Chinese generator won’t last long being used 24 hours a day, days on end at 100% output.

[jim 44-40]

The Hisun has a 1200watt onboard charger the must be plugged into a 120 volt outlet, it takes 6-10 hours to fully charge.A 2000 watt inverter generator has 120volt outlet and it would take 6-10 to charge.Hisun will void warranty if you try and bypass onboard charger

[MaryB]

So you need a 2kw inverter($1k give or take for a good one), go with a 24 volt system for better efficiency(can use 24 to 12 volt converters for 12 volt loads), 2 100 amp hour deep cycle batteries($700ish), and 4kw of solar panels(so you have charge power as the sun rises/sets $4-6k) and a clear view of the sky sun up to sundown. This time of year I see 4 hours peak charge then an hour each side of tapering charge. And a charge controller that can handle the panels, MPPT is the way to go($1k ish)

VS a 4kw generator...

[Brokenbear]

Do you know if you can use a solar charge controller for gel,AGM type batteries with the Dry cell battery?

well the batteries you mentioned are all rechargeable and the solar chargers are programmable and I believe the voltage and amperage are attainable ..from what I am reading but honestly your question will have to be solidly answered by someone more knowledgeable than me ..I to have the same questions to be answered

Bear

[Brokenbear]

To all who have contributed I thank you ..each has had good thoughts and contributions ..I think it would take a local guy who has the solar electrical base already in his/her's knowledge base to pick up the "challenge" this would present with the current state of the available technology and available equipment ..
No doubt one could throw enough $$$ at the problem of solar charging an EV vehicle but in truth ..I see it presently to not be a viable proposition ..
On top of that the current safety record of EV and fire hazards associated with charging high capacity batteries that seem to plague E vehicles is a consideration..and especially leaving a live electrical system running 24/7 in a 100 year old log and lap board wood barn looses it's appeal once one considers the "what ifs" of an unattended charging system..
I have a Yamaha Rhino 450 that I do farm work with that stays on the farm and it is fine transport but the sucker is loud loud loud ..especially pulling hills ..like mentioned the deer ignore my big tractor and even my combine but they just do not like that Yamaha in the dark .. there is a solution to more silently move thru the logging roads in the dark ..but I have not found it or it has not been built yet ..
A couple more years of Boomers and such wanting quiet transport will have the ATV/UTV builders figuring a reliable way to tap the market ..

Bear

[jmorris]

The Hisun has a 1200watt onboard charger the must be plugged into a 120 volt outlet, it takes 6-10 hours to fully charge.

That is mathematically impossible or the specifications are wrong. You would need 208 amps to fully charge a fully discharged 2080 Ah battery in 10 hours.

At 120 VAC and 15 amps (1,800 watts), your going to get less than 42 amps at 48 volts. Even with 600 more watts than claimed, there is simply not enough amperage.

https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/dc-to-ac-amperage-conversion-run-through-an-inverter.html

[MaryB]

Solar has its place... BUT you will have a hard time ever breaking even on a grid tie system these days. Not with fees going up every 3 months to cover fuel costs, fees to cover the fees(joking but that is what it seems like!) and regulatory climate changing to not favor grid tie solar(it drives up the utilities costs)...

The ONLY reason I have solar is I got tired of fighting with a generator when it was -20f... it gives me power for heat and lights and a little entertainment and I don't have to hurt myself trying to start a generator with oil that is like cold molasses... and no going out in the cold fueling it in the middle of the night! I thought about a standby generator but the gas company wants a ridiculous fee to have one on the meter. My gas bill would have quadrupled in summer and 25% higher in winter. Standby fuel surcharge stupidity fee!

[ebb]

Batteries and chest deep water won't work well together. Maybe where you live but not in South Florida especially after 2 November hurricanes.

[SSGOldfart]

Maybe have a look at ECO-Flow Delta solar generators. kinda looks good to me. I'm going to try it as a back up here on the house, it should carry everything but the heat, you can couple two together to increase output.(if needed)
Light weight so you can charge it before going to the farm, then just set up the solar panels before going to the woods, they are very light weight and fold out. only takes two or three hours to charge the batteries(fast charge system. I'm wheelchair bound and can charge my track chair it holds a charge for over a year. even after the storm of the century a couple years ago. the sealed batteries in that chair have lasted almost 10 years now 1st set was changed after 3 years just in case. Also a LA company used to make Bad Boy Buggy a Electric UTV that was very quite. I'm planning to add a silent muffler to my ATV. I hear they work very good and cost less then $200.[smilie=1:

[MaryB]

Maybe have a look at ECO-Flow Delta solar generators. kinda looks good to me. I'm going to try it as a back up here on the house, it should carry everything but the heat, you can couple two together to increase output.(if needed)
Light weight so you can charge it before going to the farm, then just set up the solar panels before going to the woods, they are very light weight and fold out. only takes two or three hours to charge the batteries(fast charge system. I'm wheelchair bound and can charge my track chair it holds a charge for over a year. even after the storm of the century a couple years ago. the sealed batteries in that chair have lasted almost 10 years now 1st set was changed after 3 years just in case. Also a LA company used to make Bad Boy Buggy a Electric UTV that was very quite. I'm planning to add a silent muffler to my ATV. I hear they work very good and cost less then $200.[smilie=1:

That may run everything for 15 minutes... 250 amp hour battery with the 2 add on batteries... Your fridge needs ~4amps at 120 volts, that is 40 amps at 12 volts from the battery to the inverter, with losses call it 50 amps. 4 hours use... fridge is intermittent use so that would run JUST the fridge for a day... My house battery is 932 amp hours... almost 4 times the size. It runs 2 freezers, the fridge, the pellet stove, and limited computer/TV use...

[JSnover]

How cold does it get in S.E.Mo?
There's a couple of stories circulating right now about EVs (cars, not ATVs) not charging well or not charging at all in extremely cold weather. I don't know if that would be an issue or not, if the ATV will be parked in an unheated shed for charging.

[Alex_4x4]

Tell me, colleagues, do you know about the existence of a wood-burning stove with a device that converts heat into electricity?

https://kibor.ru/mini-electrical-wood

[MaryB]

Not going to run much with that electricity... maybe charge phones and a single LED light... solid state heat to electric conversion is VERY inefficient

[akajun]

Saw a setup on a lifted modified 48v golf cart. The roof was fabbed from aluminum and has several small solar panels on it which the owner said kept it charged enough throughout the week to use on the weekend. Perhaps something like that and a small generator to back you up or give a good solid charge every now and then.
Have you tried installing a silencer muffler on your rhino? they're not golf cart quiet but they knock the sound level down noticeably. My brother has one on his atv, They really quiet the exhaust, but not the engine noise so much. Its way more noticeable how quiet it is when it a ways off, I can hear the gravel and dirt grinding under the tires but not the engine

[Brokenbear]

Jmorris I think you are correct is sying the specs are given wrongly ..not by me but on the factory web page ...I have looked back over my "tracks" as I ran down EV's and one of the first reviews of the Hisun I read ..the reviewer made a casual comment that "of course the 2080 AH is by one kind of rating" ..then went on to say converted to standard BIA ratings it's another number ..I have looked and looked and cannot find the article and my knowledge of the stated electrical capacity being in it's infancy at the time did not register it's importance
from memory the reviewer's "new number" was half = 1040AH but even that I cannot abide by as the now discontinued discontinued Polaris EV 1 which was successful in it's 8 year rein has only 540AH ..and reading a guys blog in the UK who does change overs from gas to electric states "the smaller Hisun which he has started (Hisun makes gas also) converting is smaller than the polaris he converts and the Hisun battery area will not fit anywhere near what a Polaris will hold"
So I have more facts to to discover ..sorry my bad ..
Guess it is like some crossbow makers advertise 450 FPS ..but not with the light factory arrow you would wish to stick a deer with!

Bear

[Brokenbear]

How cold does it get in S.E.Mo?
There's a couple of stories circulating right now about EVs (cars, not ATVs) not charging well or not charging at all in extremely cold weather. I don't know if that would be an issue or not, if the ATV will be parked in an unheated shed for charging.

Yes ..I have already read where LI batteries will not take a charge under 32 degree but then another poster says some lithium will self heat then take a charge ...then others say turn on the head lights to heat the cells then charge (Not good for a remote barn!)

But your comments and the knowledge they make available to all is important.. and why the Discovery Drycell system in this Hisun SXS pricked my intrest

Bear

[Ajactonbson]

Hey there, I love the idea of using solar panels for charging electric hunting buggies! The ECO-Flow Delta solar generators sound like a great option, especially with their fast charging system and lightweight design.

[eastbank]

at close to 80 years old, i,ll keep my gas atv,s. don,t drive like a idoit and just poke along in second gear. i,ve done that for the last 30 years of hunting and could have fill my deer tags if i wanted to.my one honda atv sits from dec to may for spring turkey and then sits untill summer for joy riding and then untill oct for the fall-winter hunting seasons. with nothing done in between other than haveing a cover over them.

[jim 44-40]

Only 2 year warranty for a $13,500 investment, come on Hisun step that up a bit!Found a site called UTV Board, great info about Hisun battery configuration

[Brokenbear]

I will check that out thanks

[elmacgyver0]

If I had a farm in the boonies, my hunting buggy would be a horse.