My first PC job is looking like a disaster

[technojock]

While I was getting ready to coat the boolits, I preheated the oven. I put about 2 layers deep of BB's and a tablespoon of the gray powder I have in the bowl with about 50 405g .457 boolits. After swirling and shaking them for a minute or so nothing was looking coated, so I added more powder and shook them some more. They still weren't very coated so I added a bit more powder and now I'm sure I had more than I needed.

The boolits still aren't very coated but the BB's are. I went ahead and baked them anyway but I'm sure they're look just as bad coming out of the oven as they did going it.

So far do you guys think I have bad powder or is it likely something else? I only handled the boolits after casting while wearing rubber gloves. I also cleaned the measuring spoon and my forceps with acetone before starting...

Tony

[mehavey]

What (brand) powder ?
What's the bowl made of ?
Were these bullets of your own casting ?

sidenote:
Fifty 405's is a lot of mass first time out.
Have you tried just a half-dozen in a plain old 2-cup/1-quartTupperware (polypropylene) container with those same BBs? -- shaken/swirled all Up&About like a macarena?

PPS: gloves, acetone are not normally even close to being required unless one has been bathing in Italian dressing :kidding:
.

[Charlie Horse]

For some reason your powder is not sticking. I use a yogurt container and a double spoonful of bb's then just enough powder to coat everything. When I pick the boolits out of the container with a gloved hand the powder stays on nicely.

Can you post some pics of your set-up? Maybe someone could see something. Once I got my temperature right I cannot make a bad batch. I use Smoke's Traffic Purple. The color has grown on me.
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[technojock]

I don't know the brand of powder. It was given to me and the only label says to bake it at 375 for 25 minutes. I'm using a plastic mixing bowl that I got off Amazon. I think it's ABS but I'll have to find the package. I'll take and post some pix later today. Te strange thing is the BB's are perfectly coated the way I was hoping the boolits would be.

Tony

[technojock]

The friend of mine that gave me the powder is out of town for a couple weeks so it'll be best if I don't bug him about the brand until he gets back. The first pic is of the bowl with BB's after I tried coating boolits. I dumped in more BB's to see if they would coat up like the ones I started with and they seem to be getting that way. The bowl is an 8.25" cheap covered mixing bowl from Amazon. I got the whole set half price because the supposedly been used but the factory packing looked untouched.

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This pic is of the tray of boolits after I baked them for 35 minutes.
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This is a few 292g boolits from a Lyman mold I cast the same day. I tried coating a few of them to see if the problem was the boolit. I baked them at the same time but I removed them from the tray before I took the picture.
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I cast all the boolits the same day from the same alloy. The 405g boolits were cast in a Lee mold that drops them fast and easy but at .456" rather than .458 so I'm really hoping I can get this powder coating figured out...

And by the way when I sorted them I was wearing Harbor Freight blue work gloves and I only handled them enough to sort out the bad ones...

Tony

[Walter Laich]

look on the bottom of your bowl and see if there is a "5" inside a triangle. It may/may not have the PP under it

If that's not there you need to find a bowl that has it

I would also suggest using Smoke's powder--they all are proved winners. once you get rolling you can mix some of your current powder in with it--I do this all the time. that way it won't go to waste

https://grainger-prod.adobecqms.net/content/dam/grainger/gus/en/public/digital-tactics/know-how/artcl/SS-KH_recycling-symbols-what-they-mean-ART7.jpg

[technojock]

Nothing like that but it does say BPH Free nontoxic plastic. I'll be out and about on Friday and I'll look for another bowl with a lid... I'm still PO'ed at wallyworld so it might take me longer to find one.

Tony

[mehavey]

Just standard "tupperware"-like food containers
These from Safeway ($6) are perfect:
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https://www.safeway.com/shop/product-details.960458534.html

I'll run 5-15 big 405s at a time in the 2-cup size-- 45-second shake&swirl does it.



.

[charlie b]

1. If that BPH plastic is the clear kind like used in water bottles (Nalgene) it might not work. Get the cheap Ziploc or Glad containers for food. I like the ones with the blue screw on lid. That way it won't come off when I am 'tumbling' the container.

2. 50 large bullets is too many for a quart container. I limit myself to about 30 bullets per batch in that size container (with BB's). For 400gn bullets I'd probably do no more than 20 at a time. Of course, if you are using a large bowl, like for a vibrating or rotary tumbler, then yes you can put in more bullets at a time.

3. You should see the powder covering the bullet. If there is no powder then you aren't getting the static charge needed for PC.

[technojock]

I'm thinking the boolits and powder were also too cold too. So I'm going to try a small batch hopefully later today with the boolits preheated to see if that makes a difference. The bowl I'm using is at least 2 quarts, maybe 3 and there was more than enough room for the 50 .457 boolits I was trying to coat. I've gone though the sticky threads on PC'ing since then and it's something I should have done before. Anyway if I don't have better luck, I do have some cheap rectangular plastic containers but I wanted something circular. So many variables...

Tony

[405grain]

Has the friend that gave you that powder actually used it to coat bullets? Not all powders work good. I'd highly recommend that you either get some powder from Smoke (he's in the vendors section), or you use the tried and true "Ford light blue" from Eastwood. Both Smoke's powders and the one from Eastwood have been proven to work. Some powders, like the black from Harbor Freight, do not work good at all.

You're not getting any static electricity build up because the bowl your using is the wrong type. You need a plastic tub with the "recyclable" emblem on the bottom. Most of the standard store bought containers will have this emblem. You want a container with a lid that won't come flying off as your shaking it, so it won't create a huge mess. It sounds like you are also using too much powder, and too many bullets. Try tumbling around 25 of those bigger bullets in only 1 tablespoon of powder. The amount of airsoft BB's looks OK, but you could add more of them if you want and it won't hurt anything. Baking at 375 to 400 degrees for at least 20 minutes sounds about right. I cook my bullets at 400 degrees for half an hour. That allows the polymers in the powder coating to fully cure and bond to the bullet. Don't try to do a new coating over the failed coatings in your picture - toss those bullets back in the pot and cast them new again. When you throw PC coated bullets back in the pot they stink like melting carpet, but the PC residue can just be skimmed off with the dross when fluxing.

[remy3424]

If you have a Dollar General near you, they have some nice round #5 containers, snap-on lids and 2 clips to hold the lid on. Silicone gasket, keeps them air tight...they were $1 a couple years ago, I bought 6 or 8, so I could have one for any color I had or blended. The strange thing is that the BBs are coated nicely but nothing on the boolits.....

I do very little shaking (it will crack/break your containers), just swirl like crazy for a minute or so....I only PC when the humidity is low for my area. If nothing works, then try a batch of Smokes powder, not all powders working using the S&B method. Good luck, you will get it.

[mehavey]

The bowl I'm using.....
Before you do anything/waste any more time & effort, re-read
Post#8 (https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?449508-My-first-PC-job-is-looking-like-a-disaster&p=5484595&viewfull=1#post5484595) and go to local Safeway.

Swirl and shake a half-dozen for 45 seconds...
Don't worry about breaking anything
Tell us how it goes

Don't bother w/ "warming" the bullets.
Just make sure they're clean.

If concerned...
You can actually "wash" a 1/2-dozen in your hands using dish soap for 10-15 sec
Rinse thoroughly under hot water.
Throw them into a 225 oven for 10 minutes while the PC oven is warming up
Pull out/cool 30-40 seconds
Shake & swirl 45 sec
Place on matt
Bake.

[technojock]

My friend doesn't reload and he used it for car parts. While he bought it fairly recently, he no longer needed gray PC. I only touched these boolits while wearing nitrile gloves. I cleaned my work tools with acetone just to make sure I was eliminating them as a negative variable. Like I said it was cold as hell in the shop that day and I'm willing to sacrifice 6 more to see if that was the problem. The good news is I don't have to bake them if they don't look properly covered...

I'll be out and about tomorrow and if I need a different container to coat them, I'll not be wasting any more gas at 16mpg...

Tony

[414gates]

The color black doesn't powder coat well for me at all. The black PC powder I had [ threw it in the trash ] did not stick to the bullets, no matter what.

Try red, green or yellow.

[Smoke4320]

Your Bowl is the wrong plastic to generate static and I will bet the powder will also be the wrong formulation for dry tumbling
it will probably ES spray just fine

[mehavey]

The Smoke has spoken..... :bigsmyl2:

`Strongly recommend the OP not waste further time & aggravation until

1) Visit to the closest Giant/Safeway/Kroger/(WHU) and at least get the right food container.

2) Only then can you determine if the powder will cooperate

[technojock]

And I have to agree. I rushed into this project when I got a killer deal on a like new toaster oven. The powder is wrong for sure but I'm only half convinced about the bowl but I'm going to replace it anyway. It'll be a little while before I can put any more money into this project but as soon as I can, I'll be back at it and reporting my success or failure...

Just a few minutes ago I washed and dried a couple hundred boolits from my Lee .311 93g mold or actually .310 and 86g when I cast them. I also preheated them to about 75 degrees to get rid of one more variable. I shook the crap out of them and there was hardly any coating sticking to them. I dusted them off and put them aside for a future attempt...

I have some rectangular containers of the right type plastic but I'm skeptical it'll help much. Since there's little to loose, I could give it a go...

Tony

[remy3424]

Look in the refrigerator, check all the old crap for a suitable container, sour cream, chip dip, cool whip, there is likely something that is #5. It might be smaller than you want, but it might tell you that the powder is the issue. Those rectangular shaped containers must work, but if you swirl, round would be much more effective.

[technojock]

Actually I was getting ready to toss a yogurt container when I found it had the right symbol on the bottom. I washed it out and I plan to try again with a small batch later tonight. I'm not too hopeful but you never know...

Tony

[Iwsbull]

Get the right type of plastic and don’t cheap out on the powder and you will be amazed at how easy it is. I think it is these cheap containers from DG and would recommend not putting more than 50 or so big bullets in them as the weight will cause the powder to seep out when inverted or do like I do and hold it closed and fill it up. 306707

[technojock]

Well Smoke was right it was a 2 part problem using the yogurt container I was able to get a light coating on 15 boolits but after baking them the finish is thin and gritty.

The next step is some better powder. Like I said before when I have a few extra bucks running up hill, I'll order some... For now this project is once again on hold.

Tony

[mehavey]

Any of the Eastwood's "Mirror" powders work superbly, as does their Ford Light Blue and (newly-discovered) Chrome Single Stage (https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-single-stage-reflective-chrome.html?wickedsource=google&wickedid=Cj0KCQiAgribBhDkARIsAASA5bs2obamuHYrtjYmr Jyo5S9RrlP8s3NTO4bQThKm0vtSDTFUkfJMEucaAi1AEALw_wc B&wickedid=629946432907&wcid=18669317472&wv=4&wickedsource=google&wickedid=Cj0KCQiAgribBhDkARIsAASA5bs2obamuHYrtjYmr Jyo5S9RrlP8s3NTO4bQThKm0vtSDTFUkfJMEucaAi1AEALw_wc B&wickedid=629946432907&wcid=18669317472&wv=4&gclid=Cj0KCQiAgribBhDkARIsAASA5bs2obamuHYrtjYmrJyo 5S9RrlP8s3NTO4bQThKm0vtSDTFUkfJMEucaAi1AEALw_wcB)

Smokes' remains -- of course -- the default cat's meow. :popcorn:

[414gates]

Well Smoke was right it was a 2 part problem using the yogurt container I was able to get a light coating on 15 boolits but after baking them the finish is thin and gritty.

The next step is some better powder. Like I said before when I have a few extra bucks running up hill, I'll order some... For now this project is once again on hold.

Tony

Once you get the right powder, any plastic is the right plastic.

Mine is a mini barrel with a screw on lid. I've used the white plastic tubs as well, no difference. I prefer the clear one so I can see how much more shaking it needs.

[technojock]

That chrome looks really good. Anyway it'll be a week or 2 before I can get back to this project...

I like the yogurt containers for now. The lid is clear, seals tight and my hand is large enough to have my fingers on the bottom and my thumb on the top so it won't pop open while shaking. The best part is I used to throw them away so they're pretty much free...

Tony

[mehavey]

Just did a few 400-grainers (pre-sized to 454 for later final 452 --> the Bushmaster.

Used the S&B setup in Post#8, and that Chrome Single-Stage in Post #23:

https://i.postimg.cc/x1tFrgp4/ACC-46-390-H-2-Chrome-SS.jpg
(Note the "KICKOIL BBQ Grill Mat" arrived from Amazon yesterday)


.

[charlie b]

GET POWDER FROM SMOKE!!!!

There are only a few others I would recommend (like Eastwood Ford Light Blue), but, if Smoke sells it you should be good. He will also tell you the 'easier' ones to use. You can even try different ones with his 3 bag deal.

I have migrated to clear for almost all of mine. I also made a mix of the Ford Lt Blue and Smoke's Red.

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[BJung]

Are you trying to PC your bullets wet? If not and you are trying to create a static charge for Powder Coating your cast bullets, this is my method. First, I got rid of the #5 tub. It took too much working shaking the tube for - I think - 3-4 minutes. Instead, I use my tumbler and wash it out with soap and water when finished. Second, I don't use the bb's. I use styrofoam cup pieces. Paint that I had problems sticking to my cast bullets did so after using the tumbler. Last, use stick free aluminum on your pan. I use a mini-spring operated needle nose to pick up and set my bullets.

[mehavey]

got rid of the #5 tub. It took too much working shaking the tube for - I think - 3-4 minutes.
Read Post 26 (https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?449508-My-first-PC-job-is-looking-like-a-disaster&p=5485427&viewfull=1#post5485427) again
30 seconds...

[BJung]

Using the tumbler is way easier..

[technojock]

BTW, I have some of those grill mats but they were a gift from my old lady so I could grill veggies and I'd rather not her know I was using them for boolits. She might get PO'ed and I wouldn't want that. On the other hand I have still have most of a roll of non-stick aluminum foil and a Costco roll of parchment paper. I use the parchment paper in my business because the epoxy I use won't stick to it and I can pilfer some for my personal use...

BTW, I've seen some pix of guy using mesh steel baskets for baking boolits. Where do you guys get those?

Tony

[hc18flyer]

Mesh steel baskets? I think mine was ment for an air fryer? Came from Goodwill and fits my toaster oven perfectly! I have read of people making their own out of hardware cloth or finding them at an office supply store.
hc18flyer