12 gauge slug/round ball loads

[Dusty_Traveler]

Greetings! This is my first post here on CastBoolits! I came over from The Muzzleloading Forum, and see quite a few familiar folks already. I had to create an account to post my "Unmentionable" questions 😂.

I recently purchased a really sweet little custom flintlock canoe gun (25.75" barrel, .729" dia) from a fellow on the MLF, and I'm wanting to shoot some of the Lyman 525 grain shuttlecock type slugs and some 469 gr .678 round balls using plastic wads. My plan is to put a nitro card down over the powder, then the payload goes down the tube in a standard 1 1/8 oz cushioned 4 petal wad. The slug fits perfectly, but I'm pretty sure I will need to use some filler with the round ball. Q1: How close to the top of the petals should the round ball be?

About the powder charge... I will be using 2 or 3f Holy Black. Q2: What do y'all think would be a good solid hunting charge for each projectile? I won't be "plinking" with this one. Costs too much to feed!


Looking forward to the forum!

Bryan

[megasupermagnum]

Since they won't be going through a shell or a forcing cone, where the ball sits in the wad is completely irrelevant. You will probably want to cut the tail section of the wads off, and only load with the cup as a sabot. I would then use a couple hard card wads under them for a seal. A standard lead shot wad just has too much give and will distort around the slug. That's why I say to cut the tail off. Personally I think you are wasting your time on the .678" ball. Lee sells a .690" mold which is a great choice for a cloth patch in 12 gauge. You will get much more consistent results with cloth than plastic. I'm unsure how the Lyman 525 will go. You will need the plastic wad for that to shoot. For sure you will want to swab between every single shot with the Lyman. Use pure lead only with the Lyman. If all that fails, get yourself a .730" mold from JT ball moulds and embrace the bare ball. Cloth patch is usually quite good, but a full bore non patched ball is one of my favorites in a smooth bore.

As for powder charge, that depends. For the patched ball, 80-90gr FFg or 70-80gr FFFg will give you most of the velocity you will normally want. I would start there, but sometimes you have to go up or down in powder charge to get them to shoot to the sight. For the Lyman 525 I'm unsure. Based on my testing in shotshells, you are probably going to want to go pretty hot with these. Whatever is safe in your gun, say 120gr FFFg.

[LAGS]

On my .75 cal smoothbore Blunderbuss , which is really more of a Musketoon.
I shoot .735 or .730 lead balls with a .015 patch , over a lubed fiber wad.
I shoot 70 grains of 2f.
Mine is a flintlock and a 20" barrel.
I have shot buckshot loaded and Birdshot loads out of the gun.
In fact,
Last year I took it Dove hunting on opening day.
I only got 7 doves out of 30 shots.
But I think that is good for the first time taking that rifle hunting.
I have thought about buying some 11 ga.
Shotgun plastic wads.
But I don't shoot it that much so why buy a bunch of stuff that will just sit around.
The fiber wads I use for over powder wads are 11 ga. That I bought from a shotgun supply company.
Oh , I forgot.
I also use a cardboard over shot wads to keep the buckshot or Birdshot on the barrel.
Or just a ball of lubed fabric like T Shirt material.

[GregLaROCHE]

I would go with a patched round ball. It’s been proven for hundreds of years. Maybe plastic can work, but at first thought, I wouldn’t think it will mix well with BP.

[Jackrabbit1957]

Plastic wads ain't gonna hurt a thing, I use them in my 12 gauge muzzleloader constantly. Best advise I can give is to square your shot loads, equal powder, by volume, to equal shot by volume. I have to agree with the others on getting a closer to bore size on the ball and or slugs.

[waksupi]

I would stick with a round ball. I don't think it will take you long to fall out of love with shooting slugs from a 12 bore.

[725]

I love my round ball load for the 12 ga. Super accurate and unquestionable performance on game. Besides, the cost of factory slugs, etc. make it very desirable. I ended up with a custom mold from Tanner which makes just a near perfect ball.

[Super Sneaky Steve]

Have you guys tried using a cloth patched round ball in a full brass case? I'm using a break action single shot 12 gauge and I'm having trouble getting an accurate round ball load.

[megasupermagnum]

Have you guys tried using a cloth patched round ball in a full brass case? I'm using a break action single shot 12 gauge and I'm having trouble getting an accurate round ball load.

No, but I have tried it in a plastic case. It does not seem to survive the forcing cone as well as plastic does. Neither is very good, a full bore ball is far superior in a shotshell.

[LAGS]

Since my .75" Blunderbuss / Musketoon is a smooth bore , I intend on trying a .750 lead ball in it with no patch and just an over powder wad.
I may even powder coat the balls just to reduce the lead contact with the bore.

[megasupermagnum]

Since my .75" Blunderbuss / Musketoon is a smooth bore , I intend on trying a .750 lead ball in it with no patch and just an over powder wad.
I may even powder coat the balls just to reduce the lead contact with the bore.

If you try a hard wad such as nitro card, you will likely find that the seal fails. You will find recovered wads that appear dished as they wrap around the ball. I find this to be the case with both round ball, and with large buckshot such as 000 that stacks in 2's. You can get around this by using some cushion between, such as felt wad. Another option is a scoop of something like cream of wheat. I've even heard reports of good accuracy with no wads at all, just a ball seated on the powder, which I have not tried myself yet. My favorite so far has been felt wads only as my over powder wads, two 1/4" wads over the powder, and a ball seated on that. I do need to use a card for an overshot to hold the ball in.

[LAGS]

The overpower Wad that I use is a fiber wad that is 1/2" thick.
So I don't have to worry about the wad curving to fit the ball and loosing the seal.
I soak the fiber wads in a lube so they stay mushy and lube the barrel to help with keeping the fouling down.
And if I am walking around with that gun , I will use a over shot wads to keep the ball from coming loose and rolling forward.
But most times at the range , I don't need an over shot wads since I fire off the round so quickly.

[longbow]

I'm with the guys that say to use a larger ball! Not sure the bore diameter you have but I'd go with a ball that just fits a clean bore or use a patched round ball. In a standard 12 ga. bore ~0.730" a 0.715" RB with 0.011" cloth patch fits pretty well for me. I haven't shot these as I am shooting cartridge gun. My normal round ball loads are either 0.662" RB in shotcup or 0.678" RB in shotcup, or a 0.735" RB naked over hard card wad column. As long as fit to bore is good all three shoot very well to 50 yards or a bit better giving groups of about 4" at 50 yards. Groups tend to open up rapindly much beyond about 60 to 70 yards.

What I found is that plastic trap wads want to wrap around the ball as msm says. I use a 1/8" nitro card wad in the bottom of the shotcup then a scoop of Cream 'O Wheat then the ball. That provides support and a cushion for the RB and keeps the shotcup intact.

I'm with msm if you go with a 0.678" RB... cut the cushion leg off the shotcup and use that with a nitro card wad or two over the powder.

I have used plastic wads with BP in cartridges but my experience was bad! It didn't take many shots before I had a mess in the bore and when I went to clean it there was lots of plastic. Not sure if it melted or was stripped off on hard BP fouling but it was in the bore and lots of it! After that I used a lube with BP to keep powder fouling soft.

Good loads from a cartridge gun should run 4"+/- at 50 yards using round balls. I'd expect you should do as well or better with a cloth patched ball in a muzzleloader if you have good fit. waksupi shpould be able to provide some experience there.

Longbow