Portable generator--proactive replacement

[Ickisrulz]

I have a Porter Cable 5500 watt generator than is coming up on its 20th birthday. It starts with the first pull every time and has never given me any problems. It uses a 10hp B&S engine. We use it to power our house (via transfer switch) in the rare event of a power outage, usually lasting less than a few days, worst case. I am happy with the power output. It probably has less than 500 hours on it and has been maintained and stored fairly well.

I am concerned that I am on borrowed time with this unit and wondering if I should replace it with a new generator (Generac 6500). I would, of course, sell the old one for a few hundred dollars since if runs and performs fine at this point.

What would you do?

[BLAHUT]

I would get a new one? If that is your gut feeling? Only I would get one that runs on propane. Less upkeep and fuel does not go bad. Keep a couple, three, full 100 lb. LP tanks handy, unless your house runs on propane, then tap into your big tank ? I would not use one that runs on natural gas, There natural gas valves have auto shutoffs. Refill as you use propane and when the trouble ends. They can sit for years, with no problem. Forgot to mention with the new electronics, you will need a generator with an INVERTER type otherwise may mess up all your electronic stuff.

[megasupermagnum]

Why would you think you are on borrowed time? 20 years ago should be before B&S became breaks and scrap 'em with plastic engine internal garbage. As long as you are starting it up once in a while and putting a load on the generator, it should be just fine.

I would just keep on running it. Even if you bought another, I don't see any reason to sell it.

[Ickisrulz]

Why would you think you are on borrowed time? 20 years ago should be before B&S became breaks and scrap 'em with plastic engine internal garbage. As long as you are starting it up once in a while and putting a load on the generator, it should be just fine.

I would just keep on running it. Even if you bought another, I don't see any reason to sell it.

While I have a rudimentary idea on how a generator works, I don't know what can go wrong with the power head over time that's why I am asking. I have confidence in the engine.

[Winger Ed.]

If it starts right up, and will idle down pretty slot- that tells you the engine is healthy.
Modern generation fuels don't foul plugs like the old days, so its probably fine.

Depending on how long & hard you run it-- I'd change the oil every year or two, and call it good.

With the money you saved, you can buy a good 1911 with a clear conscience too.:bigsmyl2:

[Shawlerbrook]

We just had a propane whole house generator installed.

[DougGuy]

I gave my son a rather expensive Generac new in the box because the furl consumption was high (to me) per hour of running, and I instead bought a lesser wattage, lesser engine, dual fuel unit from Home Depot for $200 and laid in a stash of propane.

All I want to run off it is my deep freezers and fridge, interchanging with coffee pot and microwave.

The only trick to saving money with a generator is buying one that pretty much matches the load you want to put on it, as opposed to one that has a lot of headroom, because you pay for that unused headroom with fuel usage.

This should be common knowledge, but use ONLY ethanol free gas if you use gasoline. Rubber parts in the carb and fuel system will degrade quickly with ethanol gas, and the worst thing you can do to a generator or a mower is let it sit with ethanol gas in the system. Install a cutoff valve in the fuel line of a riding mower, turn it off and run the fuel out of the carb each time you shut it off. Generator same thing, shut the fuel off and run it dry. Your carburetor will last a LOT longer this way.

[rancher1913]

given the supply chain problems, i would buy a new one, make sure it works, then put it in storage and run your old one until it dies.

[megasupermagnum]

While I have a rudimentary idea on how a generator works, I don't know what can go wrong with the power head over time that's why I am asking. I have confidence in the engine.

There's really nothing you have to worry about with the engine. The only thing time does is dry out seals. A slight oil leak is the worst case scenario. If you let old gas sit in the carburetor, that can gunk up, but just running it now and again is all that is needed to prevent that. I'm not familiar with what happens to generators that sit, I just know that when you run them you want a mild load on them. I don't know if it is to keep your windings active, or keeps the brushes seated or what.

[lancem]

Why would you think you are on borrowed time? 20 years ago should be before B&S became breaks and scrap 'em with plastic engine internal garbage. As long as you are starting it up once in a while and putting a load on the generator, it should be just fine.

I would just keep on running it. Even if you bought another, I don't see any reason to sell it.

With that low of hours it has a lifetime ahead of it. I run generators on our off grid work sites running compressors, mig welders, and plasma cutters. 500 hours is a baby, if you would have said 20 years and 2000 hours I would be thinking well maybe.

[dverna]

No one right answer.

Things to consider...

Can your wife or girlfriend hook things up, start it and keep it running if you are not there?

How bad is the weather when you are most likely to need it? It can get below zero where I live.

Unless money is a huge concern, having two is not a bad way to go.

Propane lasts years in storage and does not gum up carbs.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Myself, I would sit tight, until there is a problem.
> But, it's always nice to have new equipment. I know this fella that has a tree trimming business. He buys a new chainsaw every Spring. He sells the old one every fall. He claims to get near the new price for his six month old saw and He doesn't have to winterize and store the saw. I bet there is some tax advantages there as well.

[Brokenbear]

I live on the Mississippi half way between St Louis and Memphis ..We have the New Madrid fault zone which had the big river flowing backwards for 3 days long ago ..And we live in a 50/60 mile wide north south belt that winter delivers ice ice ice ..snow north rain south
So with wife's medical equipment in mind and winter outages not every year but a few times measured in days & sometimes week +
We added a 8750 electric start (I'm not into rope starting an engine at 25 degrees) and have solar battery maintenance and it is run 2 hours the 15th of every month
Natural gas which we have is immediately shut down for any seismic activity ..that's a no go
Propane is good if you have a large tank like 250/500 gallon size ..remember a gallon of propane has less energy than a gallon of gas .. It would take a 30lb tank of propane to run the night thru (obviously gen size and load means everything) for a 5000W and my 8750W will run 11 hours on a gallon of gas
5 gallon gas cans are $15 ..100 pound not gallons propane tank is $170 each
If you have any modern appliances or hope to have some be sure buy an INVERTER type vs the old school because today washers, driers, furnaces, microwaves, televisions, computers, cpap machines etc etc all have computer chips that cannot stand dirty or surging electricity
Gasoline shelf life is the is the only booger but that fixes it's self to a point with readily available non methanol gas and Stabil fuel stabilizer which boosts the shelf life of the gas to 2 to 3 years for my climate
The other thing is a loping 8750W inverter gen set will burn less fuel be it gas or propane versus a 5 or 6000w running hard to keep up
I date the fuel and burn it in the mowers and cars at the 2 year mark no problems at all
The generator sits in it's own(Lowes plastic) shed (size of 2 large curbside trash cans) 50' away from house with the hookup cord mounted on a hose reel to play it out and roll it in ..the 10 5 gallon cans sit in the other half of the shed and are removed when the gen set is in operation ..a 12"X12" air intake on one end and a 12X12 louvered powered exhaust fan on the other ..lock in wall plug on wall in house which is wired to a standard generator interface circuit box.
The wife has a 123 card with pictures to plug in .. start up and throw the switch over box

Bear

[Ford SD]

this older generator could be one of the good ones

if it is very heavy it COULD have Copper windings ...... Could.. maybe ??? who knows Copper is good

the newer ones I have been told have Aluminum Windings ... Aluminum is still good but lighter in weight


I have a Small 120v Inverter generator ... 3300 Watts . it is plenty for what I have to run ( 2 fridges plus some lights )

It is safer for electronics

I did not run a well pump or any bigger power users .. in the cool part of the summer

It will not run the house , but what it will do is run on econo mode and when the compressor need more power it will rev up to produce the power the fridge needs ...... So It uses less power

2 fridges Lights my computer plus a few other things in rotation as needed .... need the kettle to boil some water ... unplug one fridge and make some coffee

24 hours of run time on less than 5 gallons of gas


if you have a conventional generator or too big of a generator you will use lots of fuel

[Moleman-]

We have a well, so no power means no water unless the generator is making some 220V power. I have a 15 ish year old chinese diesel generator. Since getting it used in 2010 on average it gets run 75-200 hours every year. We're in a low population density area so getting our power back on isn't a priority to the power company. I have a new set of brushes for it and a new AVR (voltage regulator) for it. Besides oil changes only had maintenace done to it twice. Once from someone not following the directions to shut off the hot tub and AC unit before trying to switch the house to the genset and burning out a breaker by repeatedly resetting it and when that didn't work they held it on until the magic smoke came out. And a wire off of the brush commutator broke 3 years ago during a winter storm when power was out for five days. Took a while to diagnose the issue, even longer to get the genhead apart, wire break was easy to find (right next to solder pad) and fix. Ran it for a couple more days that time after fixing it and likely 400-500hrs since then. I've been thinking about getting a new one since then. Wife wants a whole house NG unit, and I want another diesel unit.

[jimlj]

New doesn’t necessarily mean trouble free. About 20 years ago I bought a new generator for a livestock water pump. The generator stopped making power before the first tank of gasoline had been used. Took about three weeks to get a warranty replacement.

[MrWolf]

We just had a propane whole house generator installed.

Congrats. I had one put in about four years ago along with a 500 gallon propane tank that I bought just for the generator. Only one hiccup so far when stink bugs and those Asian lady bugs caused a short in the transfer switch. Other than that it is really nice having it. We get a lot of power outages and several scheduled outages for "upgrades to the system". We have a lot of beef/venison in a commercial freezer in the garage along with another stand alone freezer in the house. Peace of mind worth having.

[Jsm180]

I have 2 older generators, 5.5kw Coleman and a 7.5kw Generac, neither will hold a constant voltage, they fluctuate between 114 and 126 volts regardless of load. The Coleman started acting up several years ago and was put aside for a backup. The Generac had been fine until this year during Ian's visit. Both engines run fine. I had to use 2 Honda 2000's to keep the electronics happy.

Propane is fine for short duration but will get expensive long term. The fuel burn is much higher than gasoline.

I am looking very serious at a 21kw diesel powerplant for the whole house, similar price to the whole house Generac units but much better fuel economy.

[jonp]

I have a Porter Cable 5500 watt generator than is coming up on its 20th birthday. It starts with the first pull every time and has never given me any problems. It uses a 10hp B&S engine. We use it to power our house (via transfer switch) in the rare event of a power outage, usually lasting less than a few days, worst case. I am happy with the power output. It probably has less than 500 hours on it and has been maintained and stored fairly well.

I am concerned that I am on borrowed time with this unit and wondering if I should replace it with a new generator (Generac 6500). I would, of course, sell the old one for a few hundred dollars since if runs and performs fine at this point.

What would you do?

You could buy a replacement engine from HF for less than $400 and have it on hand to replace the B&S when it finally gives up the ghost.

We have a small 2200W generator that runs the fridge and freezers if the power goes out. Propane for everything else. Worse comes to worse and we can go sleep in my semi which has an aux heater in it.

[Finster101]

I have a 22kw Generac with a 500 gal. propane tank buried. Ran the house on it, including AC for 10 days after Irma and 8 days after Ian. I'm happy with my investment.

[jonp]

I have a 22kw Generac with a 500 gal. propane tank buried. Ran the house on it, including AC for 10 days after Irma and 8 days after Ian. I'm happy with my investment.

Next door neighbor has a similar setup. Very happy with it.

[funnyjim014]

If it bothers you, buy a new one. Keep the old one handy and serviced tho. Seems the newer equipment just don't last like the older stuff

[Ickisrulz]

I appreciate the replies, but I still don't have any idea of what can go wrong with the actual power head. Like I said, I know the engine runs and runs well. It's just the electronics that I wonder about.

I also have a Predator 3500 that I purchased for use with our travel trailer. This inverter generator is a serviceable backup, but cannot power circuits through our transfer switch as it only makes 120 volts.

I doubt we will ever put in a whole house system as we just don't lose power that often or for that long.

I have no interest in a dual fuel generator as we are not hooked up to natural gas and I don't want to mess around with propane tanks (especially during power outages). Non-ethanol gasoline is plentiful here and I can handle adding fuel stabilizer and rotating the gas.

I will just stay with what I have right now and see what happens.

[Kosh75287]

Giving credit where due, I think Don Verna's idea of getting a separate generator that can run on other fuel (assuming no current availability problems) is worth considering. Obviously, it's a major monetary investment, but the consequences of NOT having this kind of flexibility may be costly beyond merely monetary concerns.

[uscra112]

There's no wear parts in the generator (actually alternator) head. Nothing to worry about there. I'd have a carb rebuild kit for the engine in stock. Use Stabil in the gas, and try like the dickens to avoid gas adulterated with ethanol. Change the oil once a year regardless. (Short "test" runs tend to build up water in the crankcase.) Have a couple of spare spark plugs on hand, and the correct wrench for them. Use a tiny dab of Nevr-Seize on the threads so they will extract easily when the time comes (and it will - if the engine is hard starting at some point, pulling the plug will be your most valuable diagnostic.)

FWIW I've got a rototiller with a B&S engine on it that's over 50 years old. Starts easily and runs fine.

A little secret about modern small engines: even Honda generators have plastic camshafts in them.

[MrWolf]

Giving credit where due, I think Don Verna's idea of getting a separate generator that can run on other fuel (assuming no current availability problems) is worth considering. Obviously, it's a major monetary investment, but the consequences of NOT having this kind of flexibility may be costly beyond merely monetary concerns.

They sell the tri fuel carburetor kits for the generators and they are not that expensive. Just a thought. I havecone but never got around to installing it as I had put in the whole house generator.

[sukivel]

I appreciate the replies, but I still don't have any idea of what can go wrong with the actual power head. Like I said, I know the engine runs and runs well. It's just the electronics that I wonder about.

I also have a Predator 3500 that I purchased for use with our travel trailer. This inverter generator is a serviceable backup, but cannot power circuits through our transfer switch as it only makes 120 volts.

I doubt we will ever put in a whole house system as we just don't lose power that often or for that long.

I have no interest in a dual fuel generator as we are not hooked up to natural gas and I don't want to mess around with propane tanks (especially during power outages). Non-ethanol gasoline is plentiful here and I can handle adding fuel stabilizer and rotating the gas.

I will just stay with what I have right now and see what happens.

You won’t know anything about the alternator until you test the windings with a Megger. I would not be concerned about that at all. The older models are usually stronger than the newer models and if it has lasted this long the insulation on the windings is probably good.

In that older model the electronics should be minimal, which is good. Generators really don’t need much electronics at all, just extra for the bells and whistles.

Again, if it works good now, just take good care of it. What I do with mine is run it every once in a while and shut it off by closing the pet cock and running the carb dry on fuel. A couple times a year I transfer my house load onto it for 5-10 minutes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[uscra112]

In that old B&S generator there aren't any electronics at all. Only possible failure mode would be insulation breakdown in the windings, the probability of which is vanishingly small.

Unlike these new "inverter" generators which generate AC, then rectify it to DC to charge a battery, then reconvert the DC back to AC via an inverter. Which may or may not put out a waveform that complex electronics like TVs and computers can digest.

The only advantage being that the engine can idle down when there's not much load, reducing noise and saving gas. OK until a transistor fails. May not happen often, but it it does you're toast.

Always run your engine long enough for it to reach full operating temperature and stay there long enough to evaporate any moisture in the crankcase. Half an hour at least.

[Messy bear]

In that old B&S generator there aren't any electronics at all. Only possible failure mode would be insulation breakdown in the windings, the probability of which is vanishingly small.

Unlike these new "inverter" generators which generate AC, then rectify it to DC to charge a battery, then reconvert the DC back to AC via an inverter. Which may or may not put out a waveform that complex electronics like TVs and computers can digest.

The only advantage being that the engine can idle down when there's not much load, reducing noise and saving gas. OK until a transistor fails. May not happen often, but it it does you're toast.

Always run your engine long enough for it to reach full operating temperature and stay there long enough to evaporate any moisture in the crankcase. Half an hour at least.

Good advice about run time. Does no good to run something briefly and shut off. More wear and damage done there than if you wouldn’t run it. Unless it gets hot, it just puts water and acid into crankcase and cylinder. Drain carb as was mentioned but loosen plug or bowl nut if possible so you get all gas out. Carb stays clean that way and will start with fresh gas from tank. Gas stays in better condition in larger reservoir than small carb bowl.

[uscra112]

When I was running a Honda shop in Boston in the '70s, we saw the damage guys would do over the winter by starting their bikes and then shutting them off too soon. I even wrote a handbook about storing bikes thru the winter, and it helped a little, but we still did a land-office business in April and May fixing the winter's damage.

It sometimes got ferociously expensive. The water accumulation in the mufflers of a year-old 750 Four would rot them out so that you'd have to replace them all by midsummer. It's not so bad now, but back then there was often a fair amount of sulphur in gas, and that combined with the water made H2SO4 - battery acid. Acid would also accumulate in the crankcase oil.

[Moleman-]

While I have a rudimentary idea on how a generator works, I don't know what can go wrong with the power head over time that's why I am asking. I have confidence in the engine.

Look up your model online to see what if any brushes and AVR (voltage regulator) it takes. Those are two of the common things that crap out on them.

[15meter]

My portable generator was purchased during the Big East Coast Blackout in the early 2000's. Total run time is probably under 300 hours.

I rarely go with out power, I can go for a year or two without even hooking it up to run the house. Longest I've ran it was about 72 hours and that was a dozen years ago.

Every year I pull it out and run it for about a 1/2 a gallon worth of runtime. Put in a half a gallon, fire it up and let it run dry. Never worried about the ethanol, any engine designed in the last 40 years was designed for ethanol.

Change oil every other year. Time to start putting a tag on it with date of last oil change, can't remember from one year to the next if I changed the oil anymore. Geezerville ain't for the faint of heart.

Time to do it before the snow flies around here. Pretty sure this generator will out last me.

But it does stay in my heated work shop. It sits under my bench, it takes me more time to clean off the dust once a year than anything else.

If what you have was mine, I keep it and spend the money on more important things, wife, daughter, nephews and their kids, guns, ammo, reloading and casting stuff, iceboats, motorcycles and maybe a beer or two:drinks:

[uscra112]

........any engine designed in the last 40 years was designed for ethanol.

Tell that one to the army of Stihl chainsaw and string trimmer owners! :popcorn:

[15meter]

Tell that one to the army of Stihl chainsaw and string trimmer owners! :popcorn:

I've got a 10 year old Stihl chainsaw that fires up and runs fine, I run it out of gas before snow sets in because I don't typically use it in the winter. Mooched a buddy's for years before, that ran unleaded gas for years only thing that stopped it from running for Kevin was the lowlife that stole it.

Is there an issue that I'm unaware of? Or am I just lucky and my chainsaw is living on borrowed time?

[farmbif]

I'm not sure about automobiles but none of the generator, lawn mower or other small engine manufacturers have designed products for ethanol gas. let any power equipment sit for extended period like 6 months or more and your going to find crud in the carburetor, usually white chunks of goo and water damage if it was put up with ethanol gas in it.
any and all small engine powered equipment is best off if you run it dry of gas with ethanol in it and then run it with pure gas or even that canned VP gas though it before storing it for unknown periods of time.
they may have put piton rings and gas lines that ethanol won't turn into goo but the ethanol pulls in moisture and corrodes aluminum and steel carburetors. ive seen ethanol gas damage in just about everything from antique cast iron tractor carburetors to new Honda gx series engines and everything in-between.

[uscra112]

I've got a 10 year old Stihl chainsaw that fires up and runs fine, I run it out of gas before snow sets in because I don't typically use it in the winter. Mooched a buddy's for years before, that ran unleaded gas for years only thing that stopped it from running for Kevin was the lowlife that stole it.
Is there an issue that I'm unaware of? Or am I just lucky and my chainsaw is living on borrowed time?
You're taking the proper prophylactic measures. Stihl fuel hoses start to rot when exposed to ethanol, and shed little particles which plug up the carb jets. Due to my developing handicap, one of my strimmers didn't get run dry for the 2018/19 winter, and the carb diaphragm went bad almost as soon as it was fired up in the spring. Stihl's price for a rebuild kit so closely approached the price of a new trimmer that now I have two complete trimmers. (Found out later that you can buy a complete carb assembly on Amazon for under $20. Friend in Idaho who owns the same model just changes out the carb for a new one every spring. I'm told that some Stihl owners replace the rubber fuel line with vinyl, which also doesn't last but doesn't shed muck into the carb.

[megasupermagnum]

Forget Vinyl. Get Tygon line, which is a type of PVC. It holds up to ethanol welll enough. Any parts store that isn't worthless has Tygon.

[uscra112]

Tygon is actually what I meant. Brain fade.