1885-1900 Era .45-70 Boolits for Long Range Target Shooting

[Demonical]

As the title says, what type of boolits woulda been used back in 1885-1900 era, .45-70 for Long Range Target Shooting?

Just curiosity... a fellow on another forum was asking about *ahem* modern boolits to shoot in a new .45-70, for long range.

I know back in the day (and I suppose currently) that impressive long range accuracy can be achieved in the .45-70, using good old cast lead.
Seems like blasphemy to use modern jacketed bullets, but that's what this guy is talking about.

[36g]

405 grain is kind of a standard but a 500 grain would fit the bill possibly a bit better for long range.

[Demonical]

What bullet shapes? Like is there historical pictures somewhere a guy could see those vintage boolits?

[M-Tecs]

You may find some answers here

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/news/creedmoor-1874

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/marksmanship/creedmoor

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/firearms/ammunition

[BLAHUT]

As the title says, what type of boolits woulda been used back in 1885-1900 era, .45-70 for Long Range Target Shooting?

Just curiosity... a fellow on another forum was asking about *ahem* modern boolits to shoot in a new .45-70, for long range.

I know back in the day (and I suppose currently) that impressive long range accuracy can be achieved in the .45-70, using good old cast lead.
Seems like blasphemy to use modern jacketed bullets, but that's what this guy is talking about.

From what I have seen they were a round nose Minni ball type, but I don't remember the weight. Buffalo arms.com has talked about these in the past? You want a modern 500+ gr long range bullet? Lee has a 3R .459 X 500gr+ pointed mold for long range work. I know it is accurate out to 1000 meters.

[Bent Ramrod]

The Army rifle and carbine bullet was like the Ideal 457124, of nominal 405-gr weight, with a slight dish in the base. The later loading for the rifle is similarly approximated by the Ideal 457125, nominally 500 gr.

Long-range target shooting was done with the Postell bullet, Ideal 457132.

The shooting back then was with the Trapdoor Springfield.

I don’t have a a Trapdoor, just Highwalls and Sharps replicas. I’ve found the 405-gr good to 400 yds or so. The 500-gr is good to at least 600. The Postell was supposed to be good out to 1000, but I’ve not tried it past 600, where it did very well.

[mehavey]

Agree w/ the heavy Postell bullet variants, but believe people were using falling/rolling blocks for competition.
http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/firearms/long-range/record-long-range-score

[Stopsign32v]

That's a lot of lead per shot!

[1Hawkeye]

That's a lot of lead per shot!

Well when you care enough to send the very best. Actually I thought the postell design was from the 1890's

[bedbugbilly]

Try googling "original 45-70 Trapdoor Cartridge Photos" - should bring up some decent photos of original cartridges.

I' just getting ready to load for my 1884 trapdoor - finally! I'm going to use the 405 gr. hollow base - cast from a Lee mold - which is supposed to be pretty traditional.

You might post this in the BP Cartridge area here as well as there are plenty of fellows there with good experience with the TD that could probably give you some answers to questions you might have.

[Alstep]

Those sites provide some fascinating reading!

[BLAHUT]

Agree w/ the heavy Postell bullet variants, but believe people were using falling/rolling blocks for competition.
http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/firearms/long-range/record-long-range-score

I use a rolling block with a Lee 459-500 3R for competition, out to and beyond 1000 yds. at about 1200 fps. If I do my part will hold the X ring. Very accurate in my gun.

[M-Tecs]

For the Sandy hook trials of 1879 they used Trapdoor Springfields out to two miles.

http://researchpress.co.uk/index.php/firearms/long-range/sandy-hook-1879

https://usarmorment.com/pdf/4570a.pdf

https://freerepublic.com/focus/news/843705/posts

https://scducks.com/forum/showthread.php?14735-45-70-At-2-Miles-Sandy-Hook-Test-1879

[Brimstone]

The 45-2.1" cartridge was loaded many ways, probably too many to ever know. 45-70-405 and 45-70-500 Government loads.

45-2.1" with charges between 70 and 85gr with paper patched bullets ranging from 400gr to 550gr there about was commercially available.
Component like Pre-patched bullets were available, powder by the keg, brass, primers and tools were readily available by 1895.

Various long and short nose grease groove bullets, molds and even options to have your own design cut were as available in 1880s as they are today.

Then as now, with proper tools one can get 85gr of powder in the cartridge and have just enough case mouth to seat a patched bullet maybe 1/8 to 1/10" and crimp.

[HWooldridge]

IIRC, the 45-70 was designed for grease lubed boolits - some civilians took to loading paper-patched pills, but the original government loads were not patched.

[Demonical]

For the Sandy hook trials of 1879 they used Trapdoor Springfields out to two miles.

http://researchpress.co.uk/index.php/firearms/long-range/sandy-hook-1879

https://usarmorment.com/pdf/4570a.pdf

https://freerepublic.com/focus/news/843705/posts

https://scducks.com/forum/showthread.php?14735-45-70-At-2-Miles-Sandy-Hook-Test-1879

Holy crap, that would be a rainbow trajectory!!

[BLAHUT]

Holy crap, that would be a rainbow trajectory!!

YES and some very interesting reading, along with a lot of the tests they did back then ?? Springfield Armory accounts have a lot of great reading stuff.

[sse]

I have tried to get the Lee 500 gr. pointy boolit to shoot but my 2 trapdoors nor my sharps like it. After trying many loads and wasting a lot of lead, I gave up on that one.