Shipping a muzzle loader.

[fastdadio]

Curious how folks are shipping muzzle loaders these days. Seems USPO, Fed Ex, and UPS aren't shipping any more without FFL or dealer to dealer. DHL restrictions list describes 'complete firearms' as prohibited. So maybe parts are OK?
I would like to list my Hawken here, but I have to know how to ship it before I do. What are other folks doing?

[Handloader109]

Muzzle loader, black powder weapons are legal to ship, not modern 'firearm", same reason there no nics check needed

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[bedbugbilly]

+1 ^^^

Muzzleloaders are "Antiques"

[NSB]

UPS stores won’t take them, but UPS shipping centers will. They aren’t like modern firearms, you can just ship them without an FFL.

[Handloader109]

Like I've said elsewhere, stay out of the UPS stores. They should just go out of business...
But if it were me, I'd NEVER tell one of them what is in the box. If they ask, it is a wood and metal artwork.

[Tripplebeards]

Fed ex is your safest and cheapest bet. Also the fastest for me. No FFL needed.

Your shipping Golf clubs, tools, “gun parts” or torque wrenches. If you box it it as tight as a drum there will be zero worries.

[Wayne Smith]

One piece of experience - I had my flintlock made and shipped from the maker and I paid for a wood box. I got the gun with a hole punched through the plywood and another about 1/2" into a 3/4" end piece! Other than the front sight being knocked about there was no damage to the gun. My advice; don't trust cardboard and styrofoam!

[Rapier]

Muzzle Loaders and BP guns in general are not classed as firearms under federal regulations. NY City has some dumb law about BP Revolvers, but otherwise. If you want to call it something else, take it apart so it is shorter and call it lawnmower axles. What ARP does to cut down on theft while shipping.

[gwpercle]

+1 ^^^

Muzzleloaders are "Antiques"

Technically Not Considered "Firearm" as per their definitions .
I ordered a 1851 Navy Colt reproduction from Dixie Gun Works and it arrived at my house , don't remember the carrier, but the package was simply left inside our screened in porch like any / all the other packages that get delivered .

I would break it down , to make a smaller package , pad and wrap securely and call it antique tool or car parts or whatever .... I wouldn't use the term Rifle or Weapon or Gun or Firearm ... no sense waving red flags at dumb bulls ... all that does is get them all hot and bothered !
Gary

[trebor44]

Research the law for the state you are shipping to. Some require FFL transfers. Break done the rife into stock and barrel to shorten the overall configuration. Insure it for what it is worth and don't prevaricate. Do use LOTS of 'padding' in whatever box material you choose to use. I have shipped through USPS but they do have dimensional and weight limits.

[Electrod47]

Anymore when I'm sending a black powder rifle or pistol I break them down and send them as parts in multiple packages. Less opportunity for damage or theft also.

[Tripplebeards]

I have put them in extra plastic cases and then shipped with cardboard over them. My latest ones I wrap in foam sheets and bubble wrap extremely tight and tape them. I then find used factory cardboard gun boxes with styrofoam cut outs where the gun and or barrel goes. Then I tape the tightly wrapped foam gun into place. I then tape the box completely shut. Litterally looks like I sealed it in clear plastic tape. Never had one damaged or cone loose. The KEY is to make it SO tight you almost can’t get the gun in and the box bulges a little. It the gun wiggles or moves it will end up getting damaged or braking out of the cardboard containers. I always put the factory wrapped cardboard box inside another cardboard box and tape up the same. I use about half or more of a roll of packing tape completely sealing the box shut. I also put several layers of tape over each other. $5 worth of tape is good assurance it’s not coming out of the box or getting damaged.

[schutzen-jager]

Muzzle Loaders and BP guns in general are not classed as firearms under federal regulations. NY City has some dumb law about BP Revolvers, but otherwise. If you want to call it something else, take it apart so it is shorter and call it lawnmower axles. What ARP does to cut down on theft while shipping.
not only a New York thing felony to receive in other states also - here in New Jersy even BB guns are classified as firearms -

[MrWolf]

Research the law for the state you are shipping to. Some require FFL transfers. Break done the rife into stock and barrel to shorten the overall configuration. Insure it for what it is worth and don't prevaricate. Do use LOTS of 'padding' in whatever box material you choose to use. I have shipped through USPS but they do have dimensional and weight limits.

This. States like NJ consider them firearms.

[fastdadio]

Anymore when I'm sending a black powder rifle or pistol I break them down and send them as parts in multiple packages. Less opportunity for damage or theft also.

I considered doing this. DHL is the only carrier that doesn't prohibit parts of firearms. They only forbid complete firearms. The other top 3 carriers specifically state they will not ship firearms or parts of firearms except ffl dealer to dealer.

[Bloodman14]

Ran into this problem shipping a '51 Navy Colt replica to a member here. I had to actually EXPLAIN their regulations to them, and the postmaster actually called a local dealer (who is a friend of mine!) about it. The dealer/friend explained to the postmaster (again) what the rules were. In short, any "firearm" that was made before 1898. http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/browse/collectionUScode.action?collectionCode=USCODE&searchPath=Title+18%2FPart+I%2FCHAPTER+44&oldPath=Title+18%2FPART+I&isCollapsed=true&selectedYearFrom=2012&ycord=1738

Sorry for the link mishmash. Title 18 USC Chapter 44 Section 921 (A) (16).
Sorry, didn't finish. Any arm made before 1898 or ANY replica thereof is not considered a firearm, but an antique which is not subject to ATF or USPS regulations. Ship at will.

[elmacgyver0]

I have put them in extra plastic cases and then shipped with cardboard over them. My latest ones I wrap in foam sheets and bubble wrap extremely tight and tape them. I then find used factory cardboard gun boxes with styrofoam cut outs where the gun and or barrel goes. Then I tape the tightly wrapped foam gun into place. I then tape the box completely shut. Litterally looks like I sealed it in clear plastic tape. Never had one damaged or cone loose. The KEY is to make it SO tight you almost can’t get the gun in and the box bulges a little. It the gun wiggles or moves it will end up getting damaged or braking out of the cardboard containers. I always put the factory wrapped cardboard box inside another cardboard box and tape up the same. I use about half or more of a roll of packing tape completely sealing the box shut. I also put several layers of tape over each other. $5 worth of tape is good assurance it’s not coming out of the box or getting damaged.

He is not kidding!
I took me about a half hour to get the Murdock out of the packing material.
Awesome packaging.

[fastdadio]

Ran into this problem shipping a '51 Navy Colt replica to a member here. I had to actually EXPLAIN their regulations to them, and the postmaster actually called a local dealer (who is a friend of mine!) about it. The dealer/friend explained to the postmaster (again) what the rules were. In short, any "firearm" that was made before 1898. http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/browse/collectionUScode.action?collectionCode=USCODE&searchPath=Title+18%2FPart+I%2FCHAPTER+44&oldPath=Title+18%2FPART+I&isCollapsed=true&selectedYearFrom=2012&ycord=1738

Sorry for the link mishmash. Title 18 USC Chapter 44 Section 921 (A) (16).
Sorry, didn't finish. Any arm made before 1898 or ANY replica thereof is not considered a firearm, but an antique which is not subject to ATF or USPS regulations. Ship at will.

This is the scenario I want to avoid. I can see myself standing at the counter trying to explain to Bozo that a muzzle loading rifle is not considered a firearm. I want to list a Hawken here, but after I take someone's money, I want to have a smooth transaction, and have it shipped and arrive undamaged.

[Handloader109]

I might break down into shorter package, But I hesitate shipping in multiple packages. If you ship 2 or 3 and one is lost, you don't have a working gun. you only have parts and some parts. Put it all in one package.... Just my opinion.

[NSB]

The post office doesn’t ask you what’s in the box. They only ask if it’s hazardous material. The answer is NO, IT’S NOT. It’s legal to ship a black powder gun through the post office. I prefer FedX because they don’t damage many guns. The post office will ship over sized boxes, they just charge you more to do it. You can visit the USPS web site and calculate how much it will cost you to ship the gun (weight, box dimensions, destination). It’s only the UPS stores that give you a hard time and they aren’t owned by UPS. They just use the name and pay for that use.